Climate Change Denier Patrick Michaels: ‘It’s Doubtful Irene Will Even Cough Up 8 Bodies’

Climate change deniers and libertarians rush to capitalize on imperfect predictions
Wingnuts • Views: 33,423

The libertarians are really distinguishing themselves this week with their comments on Hurricane Irene.

First we had Ron Paul pining for that bygone year of 1900 when there was no FEMA and tens of thousands were left to rot where they died. Good times!

And now we have Patrick Michaels (a senior fellow at the Cato Institute, associated with more than 11 climate change denial groups funded by Exxonmobil), writing a piece for Forbes magazine to attack the National Weather Service because their predictions weren’t perfect: Get Real: Hurricane Irene Should Be Renamed ‘Hurricane Hype’.

The collision between the real world and hard-line libertarian ideology is very evident in this piece, as Michaels mocks NWS predictions by writing, with remarkable callousness, “It is doubtful that Irene will even cough up eight bodies.”

A day later, the smart money is still riding a very Gloria-like track, but with a cyclone that will be weaker than projected. It is doubtful that Irene will even cough up eight bodies (the number killed by Gloria), though power outages east of where the center makes landfall (probably on Long Island) may be extensive.

As I complete this, there’s another tropical depression out in the Atlantic, and a couple more on the way in the very near future. Suppose one of these takes a similar path, except that it improbably threads the needle of the Mid-Atlantic Bight and makes landfall immediately to the west of New York City as a Category 3 storm. How many people will the hyping of Irene have killed?

That’s how Hurricane Hype followed by Hurricane Insanity leads to hurricane death.

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443 comments
1 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:08:34pm

Note to Michaels, predictions are just that. What a dickhead of hte highest order though. I am glad the hurricane wasn't as bad as some expected but that shouldn't mean that we should ignore forecasts and shrug off global warming either.

2 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:08:49pm

Just like all those people who died from the government's over-inflated "heat index" figures...

/

3 Kragar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:09:08pm

How many people would have died if they hadn't been notified, made preparations, and had emergency procedures in place?

4 Charleston Chew  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:10:18pm

Death toll currently at 15, for what it's worth.

5 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:11:15pm

The hurricane was weakened by a cold front and because it made an early landfall. If it had gone out to sea and then swung back, it would have been a lot worse.

6 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:11:48pm

Oh, and this is why anyone quoting from Cato can usually fuck right off. Guys like this are bigwigs there. AGW-denying, callous hacks.

7 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:11:56pm

re #4:

Goes to show that even the best conservative pundit estimate can be off by nearly 100%, therefore we should cancel the Tea Party and join the American Gay Illegal Immigrant Socialist Islamist Party...

/

8 Kronocide  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:12:12pm

Climate Scientist beat down!

Video: Ben Santer eviscerates Pat Michaels

9 FreedomMoon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:13:12pm

Basically his argument is reduced to as follows: God controls the weather, and there is nothing we can do to predict it. It's pretty consistent with the climate change argument, if the earth does gets warmer it's because God wants it that way.

These people are hopeless, you can't argue with children.

10 ProGunLiberal  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:13:38pm
11 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:13:48pm

re: #9 tacuba14

Basically his argument is reduced to as follows: God controls the weather, and there is nothing we can do to predict it. It's pretty consistent with the climate change argument, if the earth does gets warmer it's because God wants it that way.

These people are hopeless, you can't argue with children.

Children at least in some cases are eager learners. Guys like Pat here though, no dice.

12 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:14:05pm

We had 8 dead with the first 12 hours, including 2 children. Fuckheads like this one give the rest a bad name.

13 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:14:47pm

Mr. Michaels? How many deaths does it take to make a successful hurricane?

14 Ben G. Hazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:16:08pm

Pat Michaels and Ron Paul: Major-league assholes.

15 ProGunLiberal  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:16:13pm

re: #13 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Hurricane Elena would like a word with this clown.

16 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:16:15pm

re: #13 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Mr. Michaels? How many deaths does it take to make a successful hurricane?

A successful hurricane is any that makes Obama look like a poor leader and presents more reasons to cut government science funding.

17 Amory Blaine  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:16:37pm

Keep it classy conservatives!!

18 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:16:42pm

re: #13 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Mr. Michaels? How many deaths does it take to make a successful hurricane?

8,000 or more, obviously. Need yo go back to them halcyon days of old, when you did't know a hurricane was coming until your roof came down on your head. Then you prayed to God that he'd see fit to spare you.

///

19 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:18:38pm

and so it begins...what is the federal role in weather crisis management?...like we have nothing more important to consider

20 Hal_10000  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:20:16pm

For the record, Michaels doesn't deny the existence of global warming. He disputes the severity of it, for which he was subjected to a Cucinelli-type witch-hunt. He has, however, opposed the investigate of Michael Mann.

I think there's a legitimate point somewhere in there: a concern that the relatively mild impact of Irene will cause people to take the next and possibly deadlier storm less seriously. There may be some concern there but the point is rubbish when you invest more thought into it. Had Irene suddenly strengthened a day before impact -- a real possibility -- it would have been too late to evacuate everyone. The governors and agencies learned one of the lessons of Katrina -- better to over-react than under-react.

21 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:20:27pm

re: #19 albusteve

and so it begins...what is the federal role in weather crisis management?...like we have nothing more important to consider

The Federal role is to send in soldiers shoot looters and "Kodak fiends" taking photos of nude female corpses just like in 1910.

22 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:21:04pm

re: #19 albusteve

and so it begins...what is the federal role in weather crisis management?...like we have nothing more important to consider

This is the logical extension of your "I hate the feds" mentality.

23 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:22:02pm

re: #20 Hal_10000

I agree, but he didn't have to turn the asshole up to 11; which he did.

24 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:22:27pm

re: #20 Hal_10000

If you dig a bit deeper into his argument (over-reaction this time will cause people to be less responsive to warnings next time) you see that it is posited on the notion that people are ignorant, panic-prone masses incapable of rational decisions...

25 Amory Blaine  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:23:02pm

re: #19 albusteve

and so it begins...what is the federal role in weather crisis management?...like we have nothing more important to consider

With Tea Party republicans in charge at the state level of many of the hurricane prone states, I hope a larger role. There are alot of military bases in these states and I don't want any assets put at risk by those nutjobs. Not to mention the fellow Americans we are supposed to care about.

26 Hal_10000  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:24:04pm

re: #24 ralphieboy

Which is the opposite, of course, of what most Libertarians think. It really is a dumb statement. Even the most ardent small-government person will admit that natural disaster is one of the things we have government for.

27 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:25:11pm

re: #22 goddamnedfrank

This is the logical extension of your "I hate the feds" mentality.

not all...it seems to me that FEMA is fundamentally sound and that a federal role is obvious....it's not a matter of money to these people, it's a matter of misguided ideology..they suck...I hate the fed legislators and their legions of bitches, not the Coast Guard....didn't you know that?

28 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:25:25pm

The weatherman said there was an 80% chance of rain today, but it was sunny. And these people want us to believe in anthropomorphic* global warming!!!1111one

*intentional misspelling

29 bratwurst  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:25:34pm

16 reported deaths and an estimated 4 billion dollars worth of damage so far. Anyone here or elsewhere expressing "disappointment" over the storm has a screw lose. If you think it was "overhyped", turn off your TV and crack a book or something.

30 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:26:48pm

Have you ever been inside a building such as an office building or an apartment and then heard the fire alarm go off only to watch most people sit in place asking themselves "is that a false alarm?" My experience has been that most people don't even take fire alarms seriously and react slowly to such alarms if at all unless they see fire or smoke killing precious time.

31 Charleston Chew  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:28:41pm

Maybe I'm a minority in this, but I like being warned about potential hurricanes that don't pan out. I consider it a good thing. It means life turned out to suck a little less than it could have.

To be blunt - people who get "warning fatigue" are stupid.

32 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:28:48pm

If it had been worse, people like Michaels and others would be upset that the government didn't do more to prepare. And yeah the cavalier attitude about it being over-hyped is stupid when people died from this.

33 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:28:54pm

re: #30 Gus 802

My sister was laughing about a guy at her office that jumped under his desk when the earthquake hit last week. Everyone just stared at him.

I told her, "Sounds to me like he was the smartest guy in the room."

34 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:32:10pm

re: #26 Hal_10000

Which is the opposite, of course, of what most Libertarians think. It really is a dumb statement. Even the most ardent small-government person will admit that natural disaster is one of the things we have government for.

Then Ron Paul is no libertarian as he does not agree, he sees aid as lessening the "moral risk" if we build houses in hurricane, tornado, flood, earthquake or fire-prone areas.

He seems to think the government is there to send troops to shoot the looters and nothing else

35 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:32:38pm

re: #33 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

My sister was laughing about a guy at her office that jumped under his desk when the earthquake hit last week. Everyone just stared at him.

I told her, "Sounds to me like he was the smartest guy in the room."

Exactly. There's no telling whether it will be a serious quake or a minor one. Same thing with a fire which could be either a serious fire, minor fire, or a false alarm. Erring on the side of caution can grant you a continuing life.

36 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:32:47pm

Over-hyped is when you're unscathed/unaffected by a disaster. A tragedy is when you are. The problem is there exists a very self-absorbed mindset in many people.

37 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:33:07pm
38 Kragar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:33:24pm

For those of you playing at home;

Damages < estimates = The government overhyped the risks
Damages > estimates = The government failed to prepare

39 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:33:33pm

re: #31 Charleston Chew

To be blunt - people who get "warning fatigue" are stupid.

this was not Chicken Little, it was quite clear that there was going to be damage and prbably fatalities, they just erred on the extent.

40 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:33:57pm

debating whether such and such an activity is a 'proper' role of federal or state governments is another one of those red herring arguments that start out with made-up proposition as the grounds chosen for the argument to take place on

the fact is that any government is merely a tool that societies use to accomplish things. in a democratic society we have a say in what the activities of government are, and when most of us agree that the government should do such and such a thing, then it is a 'proper' role of government

it's the 'proper' role of government because we agreed that we wanted to use government to do it, that's why

41 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:34:31pm

re: #38 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

For those of you playing at home;

Damages < estimates = The government overhyped the risks
Damages > estimates = The government failed to prepare

pretty much...another club to beat the next guy with

42 Stanghazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:35:16pm

Growing up in Florida, yeah, you get a little cavalier about the storms as many move away from your path. But then they hit. And hit hard. Ask my Aunt who was alone in her closet with her cat when Charlie hit. Tornado on her street.

People can be so stupid.

43 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:35:24pm

Re-posting from previous thread:

re: #124 RadicalModerate

One question for these "libertarian" idiots.

How many people would have likely died if there was no federal infrastructure (NOAA, FEMA, ACoE, among other fed agencies) in place to warn and coordinate evacuation, and reduce damage levels of high-risk areas?

Actually, according to Pat Michaels, the question should be how many bodies would have been "coughed up."

From experience in dealing regularly with these folks on the Interwebs, I can tell you what the most common responses I've encountered are:

(1) Local response is more effective (they seem to ignore the notion that thousands of local municipalities trying to predict storms and coordinate response would be incredibly redundant and inefficient). Evidence for that lunatic believe was provided by Charles at the head of this post.

(2) Unintended consequences and moral hazzard. For these folks, apparently the only possible unintended consequences and outcomes from an act motivated by a moral intent, are negative. For example, the unintended consequence of a federal agency saving someone's life is that the will then re-locate in a risk prone area. The thought never occurs to these folks that maybe an "unintended consequence" could be that economic development in risk prone areas might, oh, I don't know, stimulate economic activity.

(3) All phenomena are either all good or all bad. The logic is that any inefficiencies or redundancies in any federal agency proves that the federal agency, in fact all federal agencies, are completely worthless.

Just to rephrase a bit - I think that almost uniformly, libertarians base their outlook on a binary mindset: Because there are things about the federal government that are sub-optimal, therefore government should be drowned in a bathtub.

This is why I view libertarianism as a belief based in a valid skeptical outlook on federal overreach - but that those beliefs are almost always held by people who stopped developing cognitively when they reached jr. high school.

44 Amory Blaine  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:35:58pm

re: #38 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

For those of you playing at home;

Damages < estimates = The government overhyped the risks
Damages > estimates = The government failed to prepare

Damages = Estimates = OBAMAS FAULT!!!!11!!!!1ty

45 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:37:44pm

re: #38 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

For those of you playing at home;

Damages < estimates = The government overhyped the risks
Damages > estimates = The government failed to prepare

Politically it's always been akin to "damned if you do and damned if you don't." It's better "to do" in most cases. The population traditionally has complained if it turns out to be either a "false alarm" or a best case scenario where the disaster preparations exceeded the final outcome.

46 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:37:50pm

re: #13 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Mr. Michaels? How many deaths does it take to make a successful hurricane?

In that world, the more the merrier.

47 lawhawk  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:37:53pm

If you live in NJ, there's nothing moderate about this storm. It's a huge flooding event, and record flood levels are likely along major rivers around the state, including the Raritan, Passaic, Ramapo, Millstone, and Saddle River/Brook. Some of those rivers wont even crest until midweek, and remain above flood stage until the end fo the week.

Was this storm a category killer? No.

It most certainly is a wakeup call for folks around here who haven't experienced a hurricane in more than a decade. Storm prep did its job - reducing the amount of damage and loss of life. The very metric that he claims suggests hype (the body count) is also an indicator that the warnings and preparations by emergency services did their job.

Oh, and I'm sure if you live along the NY barrier islands, you've got a similar story, such as in Long Branch, where the ocean met the inshore bay during high tide.

August 2011 will also go down as the rainiest month ever at NYC Central Park.

But thankfully the storm surge fell in the low range for high tide, and Lower Manhattan wasn't swamped. It was bad enough to rate the 6th highest level ever recorded.

A bullet was dodged, it could have been worse, and scientists will learn from the data collected here to adjust their models for East Coast storms to account for interactions between land and sea, coastal topography, front interactions, and future models will be improved as a result.

As it was, those models were pretty good at predicting a NYC area landfall and the storm surge (which put the surge at between 3-8 feet at the Battery, and it crested at around 4.5 feet). Where it fell short was on top sustained wind speeds, but which were more than sufficient to take down trees all over the region and cause widespread flooding.

So, to anyone trying to claim that the models are somehow dispositive on hype, try again. If you're trying to claim the models disprove other models? Try again. The facts simply don't support your claims.

48 Sol Berdinowitz  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:37:56pm

re: #40 engineer dog

it's the 'proper' role of government because we agreed that we wanted to use government to do it, that's why

and if we elect this government fairly and democratically, then it is behaving "properly" (in the sense of its political legitimacy at least) even if it screws up massively.

and as far as I know, the curent US government was elected fairly and democratically. any attempts to paint our government otherwise is political posturing.

Although I can appreciate the fact that even fairly and democratically elected governments can turn into a tyranny- there are enough examples in history - I do not see this as having happened in the USA, despite the imagery and tone of the Tey Party

49 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:38:12pm

Oh - and BTW:

Michaels scrubbed his original post.

Michaels later changed it to “and hopefully kill fewer than the eight people who died in Gloria,” but the original text at Yahoo.com remains the same.

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

50 Kronocide  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:38:18pm

re: #20 Hal_10000

I think there's a legitimate point somewhere in there: a concern that the relatively mild impact of Irene will cause people to take the next and possibly deadlier storm less seriously.

He strongly denies the severity of it and that humans are the cause of it or that we can do much about it (or that we should just go on with business as usual and technology will just pull itself up by it's bootstraps and save civilization).

There is a legitimate skeptical concern that over reaction to Irene will cause a false reaction next time, and that should always be considered. But Pat Micheals is not the person to have that skeptical conversation because he used that concern to launch his other agendas.

51 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:38:56pm

re: #49 Talking Point Detective

Oh - and BTW:

Michaels scrubbed his original post.

[Link: thinkprogress.org...]

Busted for being a dick.

52 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:39:25pm

re: #37 Gus 802

Hurricane Irene leads to 18 deaths

Yeah but most of those were probably chai latte drinking liberal muslim atheist vegetarian secular humanist plants.

53 Kragar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:39:33pm

New evidence of atrocities by Gaddafi's forces

Human Rights Watch says it has uncovered dozens of arbitrary executions of civilians. Just outside Tripoli, the BBC has filmed the aftermath of an apparent massacre in a military base with testimony from men who escaped - forced to leave relatives behind.

Orla Guerin's report contains graphic and distressing images.

54 Batman  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:40:02pm

re: #44 Amory Blaine

Damages = Estimates = OBAMAS FAULT!!!11!!!1ty

Damages = Estimates = The government created the hurricane to make it look like global warming.

55 RadicalModerate  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:41:18pm

re: #30 Gus 802

Have you ever been inside a building such as an office building or an apartment and then heard the fire alarm go off only to watch most people sit in place asking themselves "is that a false alarm"? My experience has been that most people don't even take fire alarms seriously and react slowly to such alarms if at all unless they see fire or smoke killing precious time.

I've had to deal with worse. One company I worked for a few years back had a mid-upper management type who forbade people to leave their desks on a particularly busy day when fire alarms went off. It wasn't a drill - there actually was a kitchen fire in the in-house grill, and people didn't evacuate until after the fire department arrived and told everyone to get out of the building. Whats even more amazing is that he didn't lose his job over it when the CEO caught wind of what had happened, either.

56 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:42:03pm

re: #20 Hal_10000

For the record, Michaels doesn't deny the existence of global warming. He disputes the severity of it, for which he was subjected to a Cucinelli-type witch-hunt. He has, however, opposed the investigate of Michael Mann.

In case anyone's interested in reading the full story about Pat Michaels:

[Link: www.skepticalscience.com...]

And here's a nice clickable database on a whole bevy of "skeptic."

[Link: www.skepticalscience.com...]

57 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:43:30pm

re: #55 RadicalModerate

I've had to deal with worse. One company I worked for a few years back had a mid-upper management type who forbade people to leave their desks on a particularly busy day when fire alarms went off. It wasn't a drill - there actually was a kitchen fire in the in-house grill, and people didn't evacuate until after the fire department arrived and told everyone to get out of the building. Whats even more amazing is that he didn't lose his job over it when the CEO caught wind of what had happened, either.

Ugh. That reminds me of the people who were told to report back to work on 9/11 at the World Trade Center.

58 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:43:34pm

I usually react pretty much on instinct to alarms. Shit, if only to get outside to get the damn noise out of my ears. There was one time last semester when the alarm went off when I was in the shower. As I recall, that turned out to be the real deal. It wasn't at my building but at the one closest.

59 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:45:43pm

re: #55 RadicalModerate

I've had to deal with worse. One company I worked for a few years back had a mid-upper management type who forbade people to leave their desks on a particularly busy day when fire alarms went off. It wasn't a drill - there actually was a kitchen fire in the in-house grill, and people didn't evacuate until after the fire department arrived and told everyone to get out of the building. Whats even more amazing is that he didn't lose his job over it when the CEO caught wind of what had happened, either.

no CEO ever told me what to do...you choose your future and your lifesyle

60 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:46:06pm

re: #58 HappyWarrior

I usually react pretty much on instinct to alarms. Shit, if only to get outside to get the damn noise out of my ears. There was one time last semester when the alarm went off when I was in the shower. As I recall, that turned out to be the real deal. It wasn't at my building but at the one closest.

This is probably girl-stuff, but every time I'm in the salon, the thought runs through my mind...with my luck, this is the minute The Big One will hit.

61 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:46:51pm

re: #50 BigPapa

There is a legitimate skeptical concern that over reaction to Irene will cause a false reaction next time, and that should always be considered. But Pat Micheals is not the person to have that skeptical conversation because he used that concern to launch his other agendas.

As I see it, the problem with that legitimate "concern" is that these folks offer no legitimate alternative - because there actually isn't any. What's the alternative to "over-hyping" a potential category 3 landfall on NYC?

These people are the "concern trolls" of life. Again - it's all about binary thinking. Because there are some problems with hyping massive natural disasters, therefore we should dismantle all federal agencies that predict and respond to natural disasters.

I'm really, really sick of this shit.

62 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:48:03pm

re: #43 Talking Point Detective

Because there are things about the federal government that are sub-optimal, therefore government should be drowned in a bathtub.

this is a pretty common debate tactic, e.g.: health care in canada or europe is less than 100% perfect, therefore it has failed and we need to "get gummint outta health care"

63 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:49:30pm

re: #59 albusteve

no CEO ever told me what to do...you choose your future and your lifesyle

You do if you're fortunate or unencumbered enough. I've also walked off of abusive work situations and moved on to the next thing. But I've also made deliberate choices that ensure my ability to do that (many which also cost in other areas.) I would say most people are not in that boat, though.

64 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:49:33pm

re: #62 engineer dog

this is a pretty common debate tactic, e.g.: health care in canada or europe is less than 100% perfect, therefore it has failed and we need to "get gummint outta health care"

Yep, and to expand on this- "Federal funded public schools aren't perfect, so let's gut education funds." Now, I'll be the first to acknowledge that money/funding isn't a solve all but the opposite approach is equally if not more ignorant.

65 Kronocide  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:50:15pm

I had a Saturday scheduled at a jobsite about 200 yds from the ocean at 18' ASL. The Chile earthquake happened and a projected tsunami event, if it happened, would have happened late morning/noon. We were under watch (unsure if tsunami), vs alert (confidence of a tsunami).

Guys call me at 8 and say 'there's a tsunami alert.' I told them go there anyway, it won't arrive till before lunch, just clean up materials and work for a few hours and get out of there before hand.

I got so much shit for it, evolved into 'fookin boss wanted us to work through the tsunami' and stuff. They loved ribbing me for it, it was sorta stupid on my part. But I did think of them going there a few hours before (like 5) and grabbing materials and tools so they were not lost.

Problem was that they had no access, the site was shut down way early, and traffic got really congested, so if they did go it would have been within 2-3 hours of the arrival. They got stuck in traffic in town and turned back, probably saying my name in vain the whole way.

But I learned my lesson, LOL.

66 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:51:19pm

re: #62 engineer dog

this is a pretty common debate tactic, e.g.: health care in canada or europe is less than 100% perfect, therefore it has failed and we need to "get gummint outta health care"

It's ubiquitous. From what I've seen, almost all libertarians can't get beyond a binary mindset. Skepticism about the role of government is a dangerous concept when binary-thinking libertarians get a hold of it.

67 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:51:22pm

re: #57 Gus 802

Ugh. That reminds me of the people who were told to report back to work on 9/11 at the World Trade Center.

Yeah, that would definitely have been a walk-off situation. Hell if some boss is going to force me into a life-threatening environment just because they need to fill out some stupid productivity spreadsheet, f' that.

68 Kronocide  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:51:53pm

I need a gut check. Racist or not?

69 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:53:22pm

re: #68 BigPapa

I need a gut check. Racist or not?

what is that?...sounds like what you here in a saloon

70 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:54:48pm

re: #64 HappyWarrior

Yep, and to expand on this- "Federal funded public schools aren't perfect, so let's gut education funds." Now, I'll be the first to acknowledge that money/funding isn't a solve all but the opposite approach is equally if not more ignorant.

That's the one that gets me the most furious.

Schools in this country with a lower than 20% poverty rate stack up against schools in any other country worldwide.

We attempt to educate a full spectrum of students, from all degrees of sociodemographic categories.

There is plenty wrong with our schools, but taking those problems that exist as evidence that we'd be better off without any kind of public education is just ridiculous. No serious thinker could think that our country would have reached economic preeminence without public education. Only people stuck in a binary mindset could come up with such a conclusion.

71 Kronocide  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:55:02pm

re: #69 albusteve

what is that?...sounds like what you here in a saloon

that would be a gut shot Steve. Minor difference.

72 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:55:10pm

re: #47 lawhawk

If you live in NJ, there's nothing moderate about this storm. It's a huge flooding event, and record flood levels are likely along major rivers around the state, including the Raritan, Passaic, Ramapo, Millstone, and Saddle River/Brook. Some of those rivers wont even crest until midweek, and remain above flood stage until the end fo the week.

Was this storm a category killer? No.

It most certainly is a wakeup call for folks around here who haven't experienced a hurricane in more than a decade. Storm prep did its job - reducing the amount of damage and loss of life. The very metric that he claims suggests hype (the body count) is also an indicator that the warnings and preparations by emergency services did their job.

Oh, and I'm sure if you live along the NY barrier islands, you've got a similar story, such as in Long Branch, where the ocean met the inshore bay during high tide.

August 2011 will also go down as the rainiest month ever at NYC Central Park.

But thankfully the storm surge fell in the low range for high tide, and Lower Manhattan wasn't swamped. It was bad enough to rate the 6th highest level ever recorded.

A bullet was dodged, it could have been worse, and scientists will learn from the data collected here to adjust their models for East Coast storms to account for interactions between land and sea, coastal topography, front interactions, and future models will be improved as a result.

As it was, those models were pretty good at predicting a NYC area landfall and the storm surge (which put the surge at between 3-8 feet at the Battery, and it crested at around 4.5 feet). Where it fell short was on top sustained wind speeds, but which were more than sufficient to take down trees all over the region and cause widespread flooding.

So, to anyone trying to claim that the models are somehow dispositive on hype, try again. If you're trying to claim the models disprove other models? Try again. The facts simply don't support your claims.

The financial impact on the Jersey Shore is going to be rather large considering that this occurred on the last weekend before the grande finale for the summer season of the Labor Day weekend.

73 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:55:29pm

re: #66 Talking Point Detective

It's ubiquitous. From what I've seen, almost all libertarians can't get beyond a binary mindset. Skepticism about the role of government is a dangerous concept when binary-thinking libertarians get a hold of it.

that's why they are irrelevant

74 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:56:55pm

re: #70 Talking Point Detective

That's the one that gets me the most furious.

Schools in this country with a lower than 20% poverty rate stack up against schools in any other country worldwide.

We attempt to educate a full spectrum of students, from all degrees of sociodemographic categories.

There is plenty wrong with our schools, but taking those problems that exist as evidence that we'd be better off without any kind of public education is just ridiculous. No serious thinker could think that our country would have reached economic preeminence without public education. Only people stuck in a binary mindset could come up with such a conclusion.

Tell me about it. I heard a GOP rep from Montana recently compare Pell Grants to welfare. That was maddening from a college student's pov.

75 Kragar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 1:58:13pm

Rick Perry ignores the disavowal of his previous statements

Fresh off affirming the positions outlined in his book, including that Social Security is unconstitutional, Texas Gov. Rick Perry (R) was quoted by the Houston Chronicle today calling Social Security a “monstrous lie” in Iowa:

Asked by a woman in the crowd about Social Security being viewed as an entitlement program, Perry reiterated the suggestion in his anti-Washington book, Fed Up!, that the program amounts to a Ponzi scheme.

“It is a Ponzi scheme for these young people. The idea that they’re working and paying into Social Security today, that the current program is going to be there for them, is a lie,” Perry said. “It is a monstrous lie on this generation, and we can’t do that to them.”

76 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:01:07pm

re: #70 Talking Point Detective

Schools in this country with a lower than 20% poverty rate stack up against schools in any other country worldwide.

We attempt to educate a full spectrum of students, from all degrees of sociodemographic categories.

Lol why do you think they despise public schools so much?

"Public" is supposed to mean one group of people, only: theirs. When public means something else, then they start squawking like caged parrots. Brown vs Board of Ed rubbed their noses in it. And after we seculars went and snatched school prayer out from under them, they've never been the same, since. /Schadenfreude

77 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:01:46pm

President is making statement live to Nation now. Wingnut response in 3...2...

78 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:01:48pm

“It is a Ponzi scheme for these young people. The idea that they’re working and paying into Social Security today, that the current program is going to be there for them, is a lie,” Perry said. “It is a monstrous lie on this generation, and we can’t do that to them.”

then let him take the social security trustees to court and prove it

put up or shut up, drugstore cowboy

79 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:02:26pm

Obama is on...

[Link: talkingpointsmemo.com...]

80 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:02:40pm

re: #73 albusteve

Unfortunately, I don't think they're politically relevant. Not in the least. Ron Paul may not get traction, but the underlying mentality of his libertarianism is gaining much political strength in this country.

And a lot of people are dealing with the negative consequences on a daily basis.

81 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:02:57pm

re: #77 blueraven

President is making statement live to Nation now. Wingnut response in 3...2...

he's going to use the hurricane as an excuse to impose a socialist dictatorship, naturally

82 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:03:19pm

re: #79 Gus 802

Obama is on...

[Link: talkingpointsmemo.com...]

[Link: www.whitehouse.gov...]

83 Kragar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:03:55pm

re: #81 engineer dog

he's going to use the hurricane as an excuse to impose a socialist dictatorship, naturally

THIS IS IT! HE'S GOING FOR OUR GUNS!

84 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:04:18pm

White House site is continuing.

[Link: www.whitehouse.gov...]

85 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:04:27pm

re: #82 Gus 802

[Link: www.whitehouse.gov...]

good grief....go back to Mass

86 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:04:51pm

re: #80 Talking Point Detective

Sorry - that should read that I don't think they're "irrelevant."

It was a long night. Up until 6:00 am pumping water out of my basement.

87 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:05:20pm

re: #86 Talking Point Detective

Sorry - that should read that I don't think they're "irrelevant."

It was a long night. Up until 6:00 am pumping water out of my basement.

I knew that....I don't pick stuff apart

88 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:07:18pm

re: #85 albusteve

good grief...go back to Mass

What do you mean? Republican governors Christie of New Jersey and McDonnell of Virginia pleaded for the Federal government to declare a state of emergency before Irene even hit shore. That included numerous Republicans from Virginia.

Yeah, what a bummer. A 2 minute speech is interrupting Americans from getting drunk again and sitting on their fat fucking asses watching TV. What a bummer.

89 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:09:32pm

re: #88 Gus 802

What do you mean? Republican governors Christie of New Jersey and McDonnell of Virginia pleaded for the Federal government to declare a state of emergency before Irene even hit shore. That included numerous Republicans from Virginia.

Yeah, what a bummer. A 2 minute speech is interrupting Americans from getting drunk again and sitting on their fat fucking asses watching TV. What a bummer.

Yes, how dare he speak to the country! It's like he thinks he is the President or something!

90 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:10:26pm

re: #88 Gus 802

What do you mean? Republican governors Christie of New Jersey and McDonnell of Virginia pleaded for the Federal government to declare a state of emergency before Irene even hit shore. That included numerous Republicans from Virginia.

Yeah, what a bummer. A 2 minute speech is interrupting Americans from getting drunk again and sitting on their fat fucking asses watching TV. What a bummer.

I don't consider it a bummer...I consider it grandstanding...did BO speak out about the fires down here this season?...did FEMA come rescue the sheepherders, replace homes, or even have his pic taken on the fireline?....gimme a break....what they just said amounted to zero

91 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:10:31pm

re: #86 Talking Point Detective

Sorry - that should read that I don't think they're "irrelevant."

It was a long night. Up until 6:00 am pumping water out of my basement.

Ugh, sorry to hear that about the basement. What a pain in the bohunkus.

I don't think they're politically irrelevant, either. On the left, they made some inroads in the '00s, first through those confederates at antiwar.com, and now via Glenn Greenwald, the new living saint of the anti-Obama progressibaggers. Doesn't matter that you tell them he's directly out of Cato, they hang on every word he says.

Every now and then I can spout a libertarian-style idea, such as yesterday's talk regarding abused children, adoption/fostering, and the government. Those views are definitely influenced by libertarianism.

Otherwise? Feh, they can go jump in the lake.

92 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:11:38pm

re: #89 blueraven

Yes, how dare he speak to the country! It's like he thinks he is the President or something!

...

Why for goodness sake Cletus that kneegro is on TV again!

93 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:12:28pm

re: #90 albusteve

I don't consider it a bummer...I consider it grandstanding...did BO speak out about the fires down here this season?...did FEMA come rescue the sheepherders, replace homes, or even have his pic taken on the fireline?...gimme a break...what they just said amounted to zero

Whatever.

94 Meitantei  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:13:04pm

re: #90 albusteve

Wait. What fires?

95 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:14:02pm

re: #93 Gus 802

Whatever.

yeah, whatever is exactly my point

96 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:14:09pm

re: #92 Gus 802

...

That's pretty much the reaction. Hot Air Commenter.....

And Nappy tells us that we’re part of the team.

I’m blushing.

Drained Brain on August 28, 2011 at 5:05 PM

....

White House Press Sec’y Carney bemoans Irenes’ comments as “racist and not helpful to political discourse”.

PappyD61 on August 28, 2011 at 5:12 PM

97 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:19:34pm

re: #96 Killgore Trout

That's pretty much the reaction. Hot Air Commenter...

...

Hot Air showing its class yet again. What a cesspool.

98 lawhawk  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:19:45pm

re: #86 Talking Point Detective

Sorry to hear that ... that sucks royally, a flooded basement was number 2 on my worry list - right behind the 80 foot pine that is like the sword of Damocles hanging over my house and could take our my house - the neighbors next door and across the street - and take out power for the entire block.

That tree is intact, but the tree I wasn't worried about dropped a 15 foot major branch.. lots of dead weight.

Neighbors had some minor leaks in their basement, but nothing too bad, and we're far enough from the rivers to worry about that flooding...

We did okay - but I know others in town weren't so lucky.

99 Talking Point Detective  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:20:12pm

re: #91 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yeah - I was not particularly happy last night watching the water line creep up on two hot water heaters, two furnaces, and a washer and dryer. I think I was able to keep the water low enough to save most of everything - need to wait for one hot water heater pilot to dry out to find out.

As for your post regarding children and the government - sure, I've heard many horror stories and worked with kids who suffered from inept government agencies. These problems can't/shouldn't be ignored. Simple reliance on government intervention does not solve these types of complex problems. But binary thinking doesn't work in either direction, and I find the mindset that government will just fix anything is absent except in straw man arguments made by conservatives. No one who is at all familiar with government child services thinks that they are problem-free.

100 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:20:18pm

re: #97 Gus 802

Hot Air showing its class yet again. What a cesspool.

Conservatives.

101 HappyWarrior  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:20:57pm

re: #96 Killgore Trout

That's pretty much the reaction. Hot Air Commenter...

...

Stay classy, hot airholes.

102 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:21:33pm

re: #100 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Conservatives.

Hot Air can probably sell their mailing list to the KKK.

103 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:21:59pm

I'd like to know, just so I can be sure I'm making the official approved response, what is there in life that is not just a 'whatever'. Is there anything important enough for me to get my skivvies in a knot? If so, how do I proceed?

104 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:23:20pm

Update on the Lockerbie Bomber....
CNN Exclusive: Lockerbie bomber comatose, near death, family says

Lockerbie bomber Abdel Basset al-Megrahi is comatose, near death and likely to take secrets of the attack on Pan Am Flight 103 to his grave.

CNN found al-Megrahi under the care of his family in his palatial Tripoli villa Sunday, surviving on oxygen and an intravenous drip. The cancer-stricken former Libyan intelligence officer may be the last man alive who knows precisely who in the Libya government authorized the bombing, which killed 270 people.

"We just give him oxygen. Nobody gives us any advice," his son, Khaled Elmegarhi, told CNN.

105 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:24:04pm

re: #99 Talking Point Detective

Yeah - I was not particularly happy last night watching the water line creep up on two hot water heaters, two furnaces, and a washer and dryer. I think I was able to keep the water low enough to save most of everything - need to wait for one hot water heater pilot to dry out to find out.

As for your post regarding children and the government - sure, I've heard many horror stories and worked with kids who suffered from inept government agencies. These problems can't/shouldn't be ignored. Simple reliance on government intervention does not solve these types of complex problems. But binary thinking doesn't work in either direction, and I find the mindset that government will just fix anything is absent except in straw man arguments made by conservatives. No one who is at all familiar with government child services thinks that they are problem-free.

Yeah, in my view, my libberconnism ends early because I'm also equally as critical of the public/private "partnership" as re: adoption, which the cons think is some solution or godsend. That topic is a side issue, but it's just mainly to say it's not just inept govt agencies, which is that binary, simple-minded focus, harped on by conservatives, libertarians, and other confederates.

To them, the issue is just having another club to beat the idea of "government". Totally ideological, and pie-in-the-sky.

106 bratwurst  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:24:06pm

re: #93 Gus 802

Whatever.

Remember, if the president can't address EVERYTHING with a short speech, he shouldn't address ANYTHING...according to some people.

Nevermind the fact the we are talking about the difference between a situation that affected thousands of people and one that affected millions of people.

107 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:24:42pm

re: #102 Gus 802

Hot Air can probably sell their mailing list to the KKK.

Lol they probably bought the kkk mailing list.

108 Stanghazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:26:19pm

re: #68 BigPapa

Yes. Why the derogatory comments? Especially the stealing of your wife's diamonds.

109 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:26:28pm

re: #107 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Lol they probably bought the kkk mailing list.

The KKK asks HA for advice.

110 lostlakehiker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:26:31pm

Meanwhile, a vindication of sorts in the "drowning polar bears" dustup. Federal agency lifts AK scientist's suspensionIf the guy did anything wrong, it had to do with handling contracts, an administrative matter rather than one bearing on the integrity of the science itself.

He's back on the job after investigators concluded there wasn't much to it, if there was anything at all.

There's no reason to think his reports of drowned polar bears was false.

111 BongCrodny  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:27:56pm

re: #9 tacuba14

Basically his argument is reduced to as follows: God controls the weather, and there is nothing we can do to predict it. It's pretty consistent with the climate change argument, if the earth does gets warmer it's because God wants it that way.

These people are hopeless, you can't argue with children.

So if there was a big fucking asteroid heading directly at us that would wipe out the human race, we shouldn't try to destroy or divert it because the asteroid was put on its path by God?

There really needs to be a new name for these guys, something like "Moron Plus" or "Ignoramus par excellence."

112 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:29:09pm

re: #108 Stanley Sea

Yes. Why the derogatory comments? Especially the stealing of your wife's diamonds.

It isn't a natural line from poor quality work to being thieves. However, if you are a bigot, there is a 'natural' line from being a member of a poorly viewed minority and being thieves.

113 Achilles Tang  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:29:47pm

re: #75 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Rick Perry ignores the disavowal of his previous statements

I heard that all it takes to fix (future) possible problems with SS is to increase the maximum income contribution from the current $100k or so to $200k.

Done.

114 Kronocide  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:30:05pm

re: #108 Stanley Sea

Yes. Why the derogatory comments? Especially the stealing of your wife's diamonds.

The responses don't hold water. I may see some of those guys in person at a convention: probabilities of me walking away immediately upon meeting them are pretty high.

115 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:30:41pm

re: #111 BongCrodny

So if there was a big fucking asteroid heading directly at us that would wipe out the human race, we shouldn't try to destroy or divert it because the asteroid was put on its path by God?

There really needs to be a new name for these guys, something like "Moron Plus" or "Ignoramus par excellence."

How about 'actively stupid?' Or 'proudly ignorant.'

116 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:31:43pm

re: #111 BongCrodny

So if there was a big fucking asteroid heading directly at us that would wipe out the human race, we shouldn't try to destroy or divert it because the asteroid was put on its path by God?

Close...

I think there’s a good case to be made that taxing people to protect the Earth from an asteroid... is an illegitimate function of government from a moral perspective.... [I]t’s O.K. to violate people’s rights (e.g. through taxation) if the result is that you protect people’s rights to some greater extent (e.g. through police, courts, the military). But it’s not obvious to me that the Earth being hit by an asteroid (or, say, someone being hit by lightning or a falling tree) violates anyone’s rights....

117 Stanghazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:31:53pm

re: #112 b_sharp

It isn't a natural line from poor quality work to being thieves. However, if you are a bigot, there is a 'natural' line from being a member of a poorly viewed minority and being thieves.

Dudes are just trying to get work. i.e. the American way. Sick and shitty that that blog found that post, posted it, and commented on it. Imagine if the workers saw it.

118 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:32:20pm

re: #90 albusteve

I don't consider it a bummer...I consider it grandstanding...did BO speak out about the fires down here this season?...did FEMA come rescue the sheepherders, replace homes, or even have his pic taken on the fireline?...gimme a break...what they just said amounted to zero

FEMA Funding Made Available to Help Arizona Fight Monument Fire

Following a request from the state of Arizona, FEMA approved a Fire Management Assistance Grant (FMAG) within hours. At the time of the request, the fire was threatening residences, infrastructure, and utilities in and around southeast Sierra Vista, Ariz. The blaze has burned in excess of 3,000 acres of land and triggered evacuations for approximately 300 people.

[Link: www.fema.gov...]

If the state needed any further assistance from FEMA they were free to request it, just like always.

119 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:32:25pm

re: #114 BigPapa

The responses don't hold water. I may see some of those guys in person at a convention: probabilities of me walking away immediately upon meeting them are pretty high.

Try to temper the desire for an uppercut, or a back kick to the nuts.
Those could get you in trouble.

120 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:33:01pm

re: #118 blueraven

FEMA Funding Made Available to Help Arizona Fight Monument Fire

[Link: www.fema.gov...]

If the state needed any further assistance from FEMA they were free to request it, just like always.

thanks

121 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:33:03pm

Looks at the flooding here.

21 People Trapped In Upstate Motel
Updated: Sunday, 28 Aug 2011, 4:11 PM EDT
Published : Sunday, 28 Aug 2011, 3:29 PM EDT

MYFOXNY.COM - A massive effort was underway Sunday to rescue 21-people, including several children, trapped in a Catskills motel as fast rising storm waters surrounded the building.

122 Stanghazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:33:03pm

Back to my Project Runway marathon. Sooo much more relaxing than the idiots in this country. blah

123 Kronocide  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:33:48pm

re: #112 b_sharp

It isn't a natural line from poor quality work to being thieves. However, if you are a bigot, there is a 'natural' line from being a member of a poorly viewed minority and being thieves.

The work was not really that poor a quality. They were trying, even if not doing things the best way, and doing it for cheap.

It's hanging a freaking TV on a wall fer chrissakes and cleaning up the wiring. Not exactly an art or science.

124 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:34:24pm

re: #117 Stanley Sea

Dudes are just trying to get work. i.e. the American way. Sick and shitty that that blog found that post, posted it, and commented on it. Imagine if the workers saw it.

You mean they aren't using the job as a way to case the joint before pulling a major heist?

I'm shocked!

125 Ben G. Hazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:34:49pm

re: #90 albusteve

I don't consider it a bummer...I consider it grandstanding...did BO speak out about the fires down here this season?...did FEMA come rescue the sheepherders, replace homes, or even have his pic taken on the fireline?...gimme a break...what they just said amounted to zero

I think you know the answer...with the exception of the fires near Santa Fe and Los Alamos, the fires out in AZ, NM, and TX, while being natural disasters that affected hundreds/thousands of people in very large and mostly sparsely populated areas over a matter of several days and weeks, just weren't on the same scale or immediacy as a hurricane that could conceivably affect a large chunk of the nation's population and some of its largest cities.

That's not to discount the damage those fires have done, because I've seen the aftermath of what wildfires can do the last couple of times I've been to Philmont, but we expect the President to comment on preparations for and the postmortem of a hurricane like this, not so much for Western wildfires that happen multiple times every summer. Maybe he should, I don't know, but I doubt the media would even give it anywhere near the same sort of attention.

126 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:36:23pm

re: #68 BigPapa

I need a gut check. Racist or not?

He admitted it was racist, before denying it, so, yeah, racist.

127 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:36:43pm

re: #116 publicityStunted

Oooh, look who downdinged my comment. What's the matter, Bucky, you're in favor of letting an asteroid hit the Earth? :P

128 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:36:43pm

re: #123 BigPapa

The work was not really that poor a quality. They were trying, even if not doing things the best way, and doing it for cheap.

It's hanging a freaking TV on a wall fer chrissakes and cleaning up the wiring. Not exactly an art or science.

I use cable covers when I do network installs all the time. If you want it perfectly neat, call me before the gyproc goes up.

129 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:37:10pm

re: #112 b_sharp

It isn't a natural line from poor quality work to being thieves. However, if you are a bigot, there is a 'natural' line from being a member of a poorly viewed minority and being thieves.

Well, there is no line. The two categories are interchangeable.

These are the same people, who will point and cry that any business we get, we steal. From them, of course. 9_9

130 Ben G. Hazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:37:28pm

re: #104 Killgore Trout

Update on the Lockerbie Bomber...
CNN Exclusive: Lockerbie bomber comatose, near death, family says

If true, the bastard can fucking rot, although I wish he would have met his end at the end of a rope.

131 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:38:32pm

re: #127 publicityStunted

Oooh, look who downdinged my comment. What's the matter, Bucky, you're in favor of letting an asteroid hit the Earth? :P

He's going through every thread, serial down-dinging you regardless of how innocuous your comments are.

132 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:39:21pm

re: #131 CuriousLurker

He's going through every thread, serial down-dinging you regardless of how innocuous your comments are.

YOU HAVE ANGERED THE SHILL

AND NOW YOU...WILLL...ATONE

133 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:41:12pm

re: #117 Stanley Sea

Dudes are just trying to get work. i.e. the American way. Sick and shitty that that blog found that post, posted it, and commented on it. Imagine if the workers saw it.

There are the types who will also say it straight out to their faces, one-on-one. Lol ask me how I know.

134 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:41:20pm

re: #131 CuriousLurker

Wow. You're right. Even a comment changing 'Eleven' to 'Eleventy'.

Downdinging that is some seriously petty shit.

135 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:41:37pm

re: #132 WindUpBird
I think it left the thread.

136 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:42:35pm

re: #132 WindUpBird

YOU HAVE ANGERED THE SHILL

AND NOW YOU...WILLL...ATONE

Image: s14e11_480.jpg

137 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:42:44pm

re: #135 PhillyPretzel

I think it left the thread.

He was doing it on several threads. Maybe he thought no one would notice.

138 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:43:28pm

re: #137 CuriousLurker

He was doing it on several threads. Maybe he thought no one would notice.

Lord. Can it get any more petty?

139 Idle Drifter  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:43:32pm

re: #131 CuriousLurker

He's going through every thread, serial down-dinging you regardless of how innocuous your comments are.

In chess that's called a "dick" move.

140 lostlakehiker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:43:41pm

re: #78 engineer dog

“It is a Ponzi scheme for these young people. The idea that they’re working and paying into Social Security today, that the current program is going to be there for them, is a lie,” Perry said. “It is a monstrous lie on this generation, and we can’t do that to them.”

then let him take the social security trustees to court and prove it

put up or shut up, drugstore cowboy

The social security trustees haven't broken any laws. The claim is arithmetical. Barring dramatic changes in the economy's trend line, changes nobody really expects, benefits will have to be scaled back at some point.

People are living longer. The distribution of income is becoming more uneven, with relatively fewer people earning incomes near the approximately 100K cutoff. Both these trends make it tougher for social security to collect enough to pay benefits at the currently scheduled rate.

With no change in either the law or the trends, the program reaches a point at which it cannot make ends meet.

This isn't really any secret, so it's hard to make the case that the younger generation is being lied to. Lying implies an attempt to get the other guy to actually believe what you're saying. Who believes that benefits will not be curtailed? They don't have to be halved to keep social security solvent, and the poorest recipients can count on the little they get now to keep coming.

The middle class knows it has to make other arrangements for the top 25% of its currently scheduled benefit. Give or take.

141 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:44:07pm

This was my alternate.

Image: professor-chaos.jpg

142 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:44:08pm

I feel like I earn my downdongs...I'm comfortable with that

143 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:44:23pm

re: #134 Obdicut

Wow. You're right. Even a comment changing 'Eleven' to 'Eleventy'.

Downdinging that is some seriously petty shit.

Yeah, he should be reported if he starts that crap again.

144 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:44:43pm

re: #138 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Lord. Can it get any more petty?

yes, he could do it at 3am
doh!

145 webevintage  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:44:57pm

re: #90 albusteve

I don't consider it a bummer...I consider it grandstanding...did BO speak out about the fires down here this season?...did FEMA come rescue the sheepherders, replace homes, or even have his pic taken on the fireline?...gimme a break...what they just said amounted to zero

are you is TX?
Then yes they did....for the 25 fires that Perry asked help for.
The Feds cannot step in unless the Gov of a state asks for help.

146 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:46:37pm

re: #143 CuriousLurker

Yeah, he should be reported if he starts that crap again.

This is the second time he's done it. Lots of now-banned types used to do this to Iceweasel, as well.

Perhaps I should take that as I sign I'm doing something right :P

147 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:46:50pm

re: #140 lostlakehiker

But the baby boomers are a bolus in social security, something you ignore every time you write about it.

148 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:48:27pm

re: #145 webevintage

are you is TX?
Then yes they did...for the 25 fires that Perry asked help for.
The Feds cannot step in unless the Gov of a state asks for help.

I know how it works thanks....these disasters are becoming less about people than about political advantage...of course nobody in DC gives a shit about New Mexico or Arizona...the wheels turn and I find it distasteful to use a hurricane for a photo op

149 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:48:27pm

re: #129 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Well, there is no line. The two categories are interchangeable.

These are the same people, who will point and cry that any business we get, we steal. From them, of course. 9_9

My point was that the line is an imaginary line, born of gross stupidity.

150 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:48:57pm

re: #146 publicityStunted

This is the second time he's done it. Lots of now-banned types used to do this to Iceweasel, as well.

Perhaps I should take that as I sign I'm doing something right :P

Heh, indeed.

I know the dings are meaningless in the larger scheme of things, but it's the principle of the thing, y'know? It's like chicken-shit stealth bullying. Anyway, I think I counteracted most of them.

151 Stanghazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:49:08pm

re: #134 Obdicut

Wow. You're right. Even a comment changing 'Eleven' to 'Eleventy'.

Downdinging that is some seriously petty shit.

Bucky's in a bad bad mood today.

152 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:49:09pm

re: #142 albusteve

I feel like I earn my downdongs...I'm comfortable with that

I agree! upding for honesty. Not that you care...

153 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:49:24pm

re: #146 publicityStunted

I think he got angry at you laughing at the idea that shale oil could provide all America's energy needs. Or something. Who knows. He doesn't really stick to reality.

154 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:49:32pm

re: #135 PhillyPretzel

I think it left the thread.

There are times when the doggy door should be bolted so it doesn't get in.

155 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:49:51pm

re: #48 ralphieboy

and as far as I know, the curent US government was elected fairly and democratically.

Eeeeee birth certificate! Eligibility! Mao Mau Luo tribal muslims in the govt, eeeee!

156 BongCrodny  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:50:46pm

re: #131 CuriousLurker

He's going through every thread, serial down-dinging you regardless of how innocuous your comments are.

"Look, mommy! Bucky find new toy!"

157 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:51:28pm

re: #156 BongCrodny

"Look, mommy! Bucky find new toy!"

at least it's not purple

158 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:52:11pm

re: #157 albusteve

at least it's not purple

It will be after he plays with it all day.

159 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:52:43pm

re: #158 b_sharp

It will be after he plays with it all day.

LOL!
good one

160 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:53:00pm

"Look, mommy! Bucky find new toy!"

161 Idle Drifter  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:53:10pm

re: #146 publicityStunted

This is the second time he's done it. Lots of now-banned types used to do this to Iceweasel, as well.

Perhaps I should take that as I sign I'm doing something right :P

At least it's a sign that you won the debate. Only the down right ignorant and/or hostile of posters receive my down ding. I don't even down ding people I'm debating on LGF because it's not very sporting or honorable. The debate between two or more posters should be done with words not down dings. Down dinging opponents is as petty as a rage quit.

162 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:53:54pm

re: #149 b_sharp

My point was that the line is an imaginary line, born of gross stupidity.

Yeah but they think of all of us as innately criminal, based solely on looks. They will also tell you they got where they are on merit. Imaginary or not, they treat it as real and will take it out on real individuals in a hot second.

163 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:54:17pm

re: #98 lawhawk

I mentioned "Sword of Damocles" the other day here. It was in today's Sunday crossword puzzle, and you mention it again. Hadn't heard it once in years.

Cool when that happens.

Oh. Watch out for that tree.

164 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:54:36pm

re: #161 Idle Drifter

Downdings are no big deal, and I don't care if I get one when I've said something heated, but to downding a post that is just changing "Eleven" to "Eleventy"-- that's creepy-weird.

165 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:55:45pm

101 in ABQ again...
that's it...I'm closing up and putting on the swamp cooler...this mountain man shit gets old...

166 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:56:19pm

re: #165 albusteve

101 in ABQ again...
that's it...I'm closing up and putting on the swamp cooler...this mountain man shit gets old...

LOL!

167 austin_blue  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:59:00pm

re: #165 albusteve

101 in ABQ again...
that's it...I'm closing up and putting on the swamp cooler...this mountain man shit gets old...

We were at 111 at 4 o'clock. The hottest temperature ever recorded in Austin was a 112 on Labor Day Weekend in 2000. What the hell, let's break the record!

At this point, you've just got to shake your head and laugh.

168 Idle Drifter  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:59:41pm

re: #164 Obdicut

True. Updings and DownDings are by themselves meaningless at times. Though their patterns can show some insight to some people's behavior.

169 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 2:59:49pm

re: #164 Obdicut

Downdings are no big deal, and I don't care if I get one when I've said something heated, but to downding a post that is just changing "Eleven" to "Eleventy"-- that's creepy-weird.

he needs a nice bowl of quality hash...just an obsessive geek

170 BishopX  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:00:30pm

So talking about this hurricane...NYtimes is reporting that something like 3 million people are without power because of it....That's roughly one out of every hundred people in America. More than one out of every thousand has been evacuated.

How many people did the wildfires this year effect?

171 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:01:02pm

Tip for the foodies....
If you google "Curry Recipe" (or other recipes) there's a nifty tool on the left sidebar to sort/search by ingredients.

172 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:01:32pm

re: #165 albusteve

101 in ABQ again...
that's it...I'm closing up and putting on the swamp cooler...this mountain man shit gets old...

My local weather reporting station is currently showing 109.2

173 Digital Display  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:01:39pm

re: #167 austin_blue

We were at 111 at 4 o'clock. The hottest temperature ever recorded in Austin was a 112 on Labor Day Weekend in 2000. What the hell, let's break the record!

At this point, you've just got to shake your head and laugh.

It's stupid hot every single day..I'm pretty much over it

174 lostlakehiker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:01:49pm

re: #113 Naso Tang

I heard that all it takes to fix (future) possible problems with SS is to increase the maximum income contribution from the current $100k or so to $200k.

Done.

There's other maws that need that same revenue. We do, still, have that pesky trillion dollar deficit. Perhaps the extra 12K would be better used to defray that deficit? Tax policy is fraught with consequences and many a promising tax law has backfired.

175 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:02:25pm

re: #161 Idle Drifter

At least it's a sign that you won the debate. Only the down right ignorant and/or hostile of posters receive my down ding. I don't even down ding people I'm debating on LGF because it's not very sporting or honorable. The debate between two or more posters should be done with words not down dings. Down dinging opponents is as petty as a rage quit.

Agreed. I'll downding egregious personal attacks or loathsome con stupidity, but those are rare here. I've noticed a couple people trying to use downdinging as a form of social control. That to me is a hilarious act of futility, as their targets are typically just the kinds of people who aren't controlled by the mere disapproval of others.

176 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:02:44pm

re: #167 austin_blue

We were at 111 at 4 o'clock. The hottest temperature ever recorded in Austin was a 112 on Labor Day Weekend in 2000. What the hell, let's break the record!

At this point, you've just got to shake your head and laugh.

I so don't miss Texas for exactly that reason.

177 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:03:00pm

re: #148 albusteve

I know how it works thanks...these disasters are becoming less about people than about political advantage...of course nobody in DC gives a shit about New Mexico or Arizona...the wheels turn and I find it distasteful to use a hurricane for a photo op

Uh. Steve. New Mexico still gets the most Federal money per capita in the whole union.

178 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:03:14pm

re: #167 austin_blue

We were at 111 at 4 o'clock. The hottest temperature ever recorded in Austin was a 112 on Labor Day Weekend in 2000. What the hell, let's break the record!

At this point, you've just got to shake your head and laugh.

I walked out of a casino in Vegas at like 1am years ago...the temp was 114....at that same time I spent a month in Yuma....June...it was so fucking hot, everyday, that you knew you were in danger out in the sun....I'm from the midwest and could not believe it

179 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:04:00pm

re: #167 austin_blue

We were at 111 at 4 o'clock. The hottest temperature ever recorded in Austin was a 112 on Labor Day Weekend in 2000. What the hell, let's break the record!

At this point, you've just got to shake your head and laugh.

Oh man, I remember that weekend. We had gone to lake conroe to visit my uncle...had a flat tire on the way home. It was awful!

180 austin_blue  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:04:17pm

re: #172 blueraven

My local weather reporting station is currently showing 109.2

We tied the record of 112 at Mabry today.

Winning!

181 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:04:19pm

re: #172 blueraven

My local weather reporting station is currently showing 109.2

neener
neener

182 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:04:48pm

re: #171 Killgore Trout

Tip for the foodies...
If you google "Curry Recipe" (or other recipes) there's a nifty tool on the left sidebar to sort/search by ingredients.

That is way cool. Very helpful. Thanks!

183 lostlakehiker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:05:36pm

re: #147 Obdicut

But the baby boomers are a bolus in social security, something you ignore every time you write about it.

No. The long term trend is toward ever higher recipient/contributor ratios. The baby boom can pass all the way through the python, and the long term trends in birth rates and lifespan will still make itself felt.

I ignore this blip because it's irrelevant to the basic situation. It makes it come to a head a bit sooner, is all.

184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:06:05pm

re: #169 albusteve

he needs a nice bowl of quality hash...just an obsessive geek

There is a trend here lately, of these taco trucks with really high-end, pretentious gourmet food. I saw one yesterday that had "pork belly hash with fingerling potatoes". Pork belly is really all the rage here, right now. Used to be ghetto/minority/"weird Asian" food the yuppies looked down on.

Now, it's all they eat. Absurd, and hilarious.

185 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:06:17pm

re: #177 Gus 802

Uh. Steve. New Mexico still gets the most Federal money per capita in the whole union.

not the point...why isn't BO down here talking about it and having his picture taken?....these disasters are getting pimped

186 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:07:40pm

re: #173 HoosierHoops

It's stupid hot every single day..I'm pretty much over it

in a few months you'll be covered in ice and freezing to death

187 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:08:09pm

re: #185 albusteve

not the point...why isn't BO down here talking about it and having his picture taken?...these disasters are getting pimped

I heard it's because he hates the white culture, and is, I believe, a racist.

188 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:08:33pm

re: #180 austin_blue

We tied the record of 112 at Mabry today.

Winning!

83 here. Humidity 30%

189 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:08:41pm

Another problem from Irene: hinky internet connection. That is why I keep going in and out.

190 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:08:54pm

re: #181 albusteve

neener
neener

I have squirrels, birds, deer and even the usually skittish roadrunner, brazenly coming up and drinking from my fish pond...and I have two dogs!

Of course, they are too spoiled to go outside until evening (not that I blame them)

191 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:10:18pm

re: #184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

There is a trend here lately, of these taco trucks with really high-end, pretentious gourmet food. I saw one yesterday that had "pork belly hash with fingerling potatoes". Pork belly is really all the rage here, right now. Used to be ghetto/minority/"weird Asian" food the yuppies looked down on.

Now, it's all they eat. Absurd, and hilarious.

if they tried that in Albu, they'd go broke...we ain't Palm Beach down here...hahaha!

192 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:11:14pm

re: #188 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

83 here. Humidity 30%

We're at 74 with 55% humidity.

No more rain at present, but it's gloomy & kinda windy.

193 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:11:21pm

2500 Residents of Hatteras Island cut off by hurricane Irene damage to roadway (with excellent aerial photos).

[Link: photoblog.msnbc.msn.com...]


:( Going to be a while before that road is usable again...

194 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:11:41pm

re: #187 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

I heard it's because he hates the white culture, and is, I believe, a racist.

I don't hold something so petty against him...just making comparisons...
I WANT A DISASTER!

195 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:13:03pm

re: #190 blueraven

I have squirrels, birds, deer and even the usually skittish roadrunner, brazenly coming up and drinking from my fish pond...and I have two dogs!

Of course, they are to spoiled to go outside until evening (not that I blame them)

good for you...a simple generosity for the animal kingdom...nice

196 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:13:35pm

re: #171 Killgore Trout

Tip for the foodies...
If you google "Curry Recipe" (or other recipes) there's a nifty tool on the left sidebar to sort/search by ingredients.

re: #184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Pork belly is really all the rage here, right now. Used to be ghetto/minority/"weird Asian" food the yuppies looked down on.

Wow, thanks for that link. I just put in "pork belly" and sure enough - mostly Asian ingredients, and ... white wine. Interesting. Haven't seen this on Google before.

197 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:13:44pm

re: #188 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

83 here. Humidity 30%

Same here, more or less. 29C @ 35%

198 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:14:33pm

re: #194 albusteve

I WANT A DISASTER!

Don't tempt fate.

199 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:14:41pm

re: #184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

There is a trend here lately, of these taco trucks with really high-end, pretentious gourmet food. I saw one yesterday that had "pork belly hash with fingerling potatoes". Pork belly is really all the rage here, right now. Used to be ghetto/minority/"weird Asian" food the yuppies looked down on.

Now, it's all they eat. Absurd, and hilarious.

Now in St. Petersburg too, I do have to admit they make some pretty good chow, but for that kind of money I'd rather go to a sit down eatery.

200 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:15:46pm

re: #194 albusteve

I don't hold something so petty against him...just making comparisons...
I WANT A DISASTER!

Stay put for 15 minutes, I'm sure something will come up.

201 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:15:55pm

re: #197 b_sharp

Same here, more or less. 29C @ 35%

we don't do C on this blog...no millis, centis, meters or Canadian nickles

202 sagehen  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:16:19pm

re: #104 Killgore Trout

Update on the Lockerbie Bomber...
CNN Exclusive: Lockerbie bomber comatose, near death, family says

The timing's rather convenient, wouldn't you say?

Did CNN send Sanjay Gupta to check him out, or was it just some war correspondent who "thought he looked comatose from across the room, he definitely had tubes and stuff going under the blanket...."

203 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:16:44pm

OT- Anyone wanna help me combat teh stoopid here? Guy was a bully with a classic case of "little man syndrome" as a sportscaster and writer, and continues to be one as a washed-up blogger. High-hanging fruit he is not, but I love the idea of him angrily punching his keyboard (no doubt sitting atop a stack of magazines) in response to my comments.

204 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:17:35pm

re: #198 CuriousLurker

Don't tempt fate.

one where nobody gets hurt but I end up on CNN schooling that Shemp pimp

205 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:17:39pm

re: #201 albusteve

we don't do C on this blog...no millis, centis, meters or Canadian nickles

Bah, humbug.

206 sagehen  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:18:07pm

re: #106 bratwurst

Remember, if the president can't address EVERYTHING with a short speech, he shouldn't address ANYTHING...according to some people.

Nevermind the fact the we are talking about the difference between a situation that affected thousands of people and one that affected millions of people 65 million people, more than 20% of the entire US population. .

ftfy

207 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:18:48pm

re: #204 albusteve

one where nobody gets hurt but I end up on CNN schooling that Shemp pimp

Oh, well in that case, okay.

208 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:20:19pm

re: #190 blueraven

I have squirrels, birds, deer and even the usually skittish roadrunner, brazenly coming up and drinking from my fish pond...and I have two dogs!

What with the Texas drought, that must be the only water they can find :(

Southern Ontario went through a "mini-drought" in July, and I saw a raccoon family drinking from the bottom trays of some plants I'd watered. Gave me just a tiny hint of what your state's going though...I think drought is the natural disaster that scares me more than any other. It's a slow-motion death.

209 William of Orange  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:21:15pm

Boy, does he have egg on his face cause the death toll is now 15....

210 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:22:20pm

re: #196 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

re: #184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Wow, thanks for that link. I just put in "pork belly" and sure enough - mostly Asian ingredients, and ... white wine. Interesting. Haven't seen this on Google before.

It's probably been there for a long time but most of us don't notice it.

211 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:23:06pm

re: #185 albusteve

not the point...why isn't BO down here talking about it and having his picture taken?...these disasters are getting pimped

Maybe because he's not using every disaster as a photo op?

212 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:23:26pm

re: #209 William of Orange

Boy, does he have egg on his face cause the death toll is now 15...

Dickhead.

200% margin of error...no big deal, eh?

213 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:24:29pm

re: #140 lostlakehiker

The social security trustees haven't broken any laws. The claim is arithmetical. Barring dramatic changes in the economy's trend line, changes nobody really expects, benefits will have to be scaled back at some point.

People are living longer. The distribution of income is becoming more uneven, with relatively fewer people earning incomes near the approximately 100K cutoff. Both these trends make it tougher for social security to collect enough to pay benefits at the currently scheduled rate.

With no change in either the law or the trends, the program reaches a point at which it cannot make ends meet.

This isn't really any secret, so it's hard to make the case that the younger generation is being lied to. Lying implies an attempt to get the other guy to actually believe what you're saying. Who believes that benefits will not be curtailed? They don't have to be halved to keep social security solvent, and the poorest recipients can count on the little they get now to keep coming.

The middle class knows it has to make other arrangements for the top 25% of its currently scheduled benefit. Give or take.

no, perry is lying. social security is not a ponzi scheme, and the social security trustees estimate that even under its current configuration it will be able to pay full benefits until about 2035, and 75% of full benefits afterwards for some years - eventually we baby boomers will die, you know, and the demographics will then ease off pressure on the trust fund. and, the configuration of ss was of course changed in the mid 80s under reagan in the same way that it needs to be changed now

now, look again at what perry said:

“It is a Ponzi scheme for these young people. The idea that they’re working and paying into Social Security today, that the current program is going to be there for them, is a lie,” Perry said. “It is a monstrous lie on this generation, and we can’t do that to them.”

he's literally accusing the social security trustees of running a criminal scheme, and lying to the american people about its solvency

i say let perry put his money where his big fat mouth is and take them to court if he believes what he's saying

214 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:25:03pm

re: #184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

There is a trend here lately, of these taco trucks with really high-end, pretentious gourmet food. I saw one yesterday that had "pork belly hash with fingerling potatoes". Pork belly is really all the rage here, right now. Used to be ghetto/minority/"weird Asian" food the yuppies looked down on.

Now, it's all they eat. Absurd, and hilarious.

But are temple balls on the menu?

215 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:25:03pm

re: #191 albusteve

if they tried that in Albu, they'd go broke...we ain't Palm Beach down here...hahaha!

Yeah a decade ago, it wouldn't have gone well, either.

Speaking of money/going broke, fwiu it's really a recession-era venture for the exec chefs. I kind of like the trend for them because it allows the more entrepreneurial among them to branch out instead of having to rely on getting static jobs at fancy restaurants.

Also, no tables, chairs, brick/mortar, waitstaff to worry about...just tweet where you are and rake in the bucks for the day. One association: [Link: roaminghunger.com...]

But some of the pretentious stuff they come up with...lol osso bucco tacos, duck breast with grilled squash blossom tacos, sweet po-tater tots with sea salt, fresh basil and mint...lhm 9_9

216 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:25:03pm

re: #211 prononymous

Maybe because he's not using every disaster as a photo op?

too rugged down here for such a soft guy....there is no Ritz for 500 miles in any direction

217 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:25:25pm

Knew my luck was too good to be true. Just knew it. Ugh.

218 sagehen  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:25:36pm

re: #177 Gus 802

Uh. Steve. New Mexico still gets the most Federal money per capita in the whole union.

no it doesnt.

Alaska.

219 SteelGHAZI  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:26:13pm

BOOTSTRAPSES!!11ty

220 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:26:30pm

re: #216 albusteve

too rugged down here for such a soft guy...there is no Ritz for 500 miles in any direction

Steve, you are a master baiter.

221 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:26:56pm

re: #203 Atlas Fails

OT- Anyone wanna help me combat teh stoopid here? Guy was a bully with a classic case of "little man syndrome" as a sportscaster and writer, and continues to be one as a washed-up blogger. High-hanging fruit he is not, but I love the idea of him angrily punching his keyboard (no doubt sitting atop a stack of magazines) in response to my comments.

Pretty funny thread.

222 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:27:03pm

Climate change denialists in this part of the country are having a hard time in spite of the favorable political atmosphere. With the old record for 100+ days already doubled and rainfall at 22% of normal, they have been reduced to bleating pathetically that "we have had heat and drought before." Sure, and it has probably been this bad before, just not since 1892, when record keeping began, and probably not for several thousand years.

223 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:28:25pm

re: #183 lostlakehiker

No. The long term trend is toward ever higher recipient/contributor ratios.

No, this is not true. They will go down again after the baby boomer bolus. That is because, and see if you can follow me here, the baby boomers represent a baby boom, a period where a very large number of children were born in one generation. The numbers following them are less, therefore, when those children are in their retirement, the ratios will be quite different than when the baby boomers retire.

That people are living longer is, indeed, going to decrease the ratio slowly, but not at all in the way that the baby boomers are going to.

224 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:28:51pm

re: #217 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Knew my luck was too good to be true. Just knew it. Ugh.

What up?

225 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:29:02pm

re: #208 publicityStunted

What with the Texas drought, that must be the only water they can find :(

Southern Ontario went through a "mini-drought" in July, and I saw a raccoon family drinking from the bottom trays of some plants I'd watered. Gave me just a tiny hint of what your state's going though...I think drought is the natural disaster that scares me more than any other. It's a slow-motion death.

Yeah, it breaks my heart. I do have bird baths and some feeders as well. I do not feed the deer on any regular basis, we are not supposed to here, but when I have old fruit and veggies that are about to go bad, I do toss it out to them. And I try to keep a few buckets of water scattered about.

226 sagehen  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:29:31pm

re: #184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

There is a trend here lately, of these taco trucks with really high-end, pretentious gourmet food. I saw one yesterday that had "pork belly hash with fingerling potatoes". Pork belly is really all the rage here, right now. Used to be ghetto/minority/"weird Asian" food the yuppies looked down on.

Now, it's all they eat. Absurd, and hilarious.

Here, it's the push-cart food vendors who are protesting the food trucks -- they take up a lot of space, they zip in for an hour to grab all the business and then move to another block, they don't have to pay the same license fee, etc etc etc.

227 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:29:57pm

re: #199 ausador

Now in St. Petersburg too, I do have to admit they make some pretty good chow, but for that kind of money I'd rather go to a sit down eatery.

Yeah, that's the thing. Great food, but unless you buy on a weekday and can take it back to the office, there's nowhere to eat it.

Another interesting trend in SF -- because of budget cuts over the years, a lot of bus lines have been cut. The city has started to turn some of those former bus stops into these little walk-up parklets with benches, tables, bike parking, etc. So the food trucks will pull up to those places and sell their wares.

It's not as politically correct as it may sound - people are walking, biking, on public transportation, and starting these food trucks because they are broke.

The whole model is interesting, but I'm not one for eating outside. We've also got this idiotic sit/lie law which I think might complicate it, dunno.

228 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:30:27pm

re: #140 lostlakehiker

The social security trustees haven't broken any laws. The claim is arithmetical. Barring dramatic changes in the economy's trend line, changes nobody really expects, benefits will have to be scaled back at some point.

People are living longer. The distribution of income is becoming more uneven, with relatively fewer people earning incomes near the approximately 100K cutoff. Both these trends make it tougher for social security to collect enough to pay benefits at the currently scheduled rate.

With no change in either the law or the trends, the program reaches a point at which it cannot make ends meet.

This isn't really any secret, so it's hard to make the case that the younger generation is being lied to. Lying implies an attempt to get the other guy to actually believe what you're saying. Who believes that benefits will not be curtailed? They don't have to be halved to keep social security solvent, and the poorest recipients can count on the little they get now to keep coming.

The middle class knows it has to make other arrangements for the top 25% of its currently scheduled benefit. Give or take.

you see, the way you have had the argument put to you is fuzzy and squishy enough to fudge reality:

With no change in either the law or the trends, the program reaches a point at which it cannot make ends meet.

the reality is that "cannot make ends meet" is estimated by the social security trustees as being fully able to make payments until about 2035 and 75% thereafter unless something is changed

the progressive position is to fix this problem by accelerating the rate at which the income cut-off is raised for ss contributions, in the same way that this was adjusted under ronald reagan in the mid 80s

it is estimated that this is all that will be necessary in order to solve the problem of ss funding

let perry agree to this simple fix if he is so concerned about ss

229 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:30:51pm

re: #221 b_sharp

Pretty funny thread.

The pathetic thing is, Steigerwald is one of the smarter people on that sad, sad thread.

230 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:30:53pm

This is what is left of my neighbor's apple tree. [Link: www.flickr.com...]

231 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:31:31pm

re: #3 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

How many people would have died if they hadn't been notified, made preparations, and had emergency procedures in place?

BUT WE WERE PROMISED ARMAGEDDON!

Or to quote myself from the last thread "Irene did not actually tear off the Eastern Seaboard, and therefore no further government moneys should ever be spent tracking storms and preparing for them."

232 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:31:42pm

Obama responds to Kanye
Image: 7z5ol.jpg

233 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:32:42pm

John Cusack must be the greatest Limo/Winebago earthquake out-runner in history.

234 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:32:43pm

re: #223 Obdicut

No, this is not true. They will go down again after the baby boomer bolus. That is because, and see if you can follow me here, the baby boomers represent a baby boom, a period where a very large number of children were born in one generation. The numbers following them are less, therefore, when those children are in their retirement, the ratios will be quite different than when the baby boomers retire.

That people are living longer is, indeed, going to decrease the ratio slowly, but not at all in the way that the baby boomers are going to.

exactly. the demographic argument is usually made using the assumption that baby boomers will live forever

235 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:33:19pm

re: #224 Obdicut

What up?

We lost power for a couple hours on Friday, just as I was shutting down my computer. So, what happens? A boot file gets corrupted, meaning I have to haul out the restore discs and basically return my computer to factory condition. Spent the better part of last night and today getting it something resembling working condition.

236 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:33:21pm

re: #9 tacuba14

Basically his argument is reduced to as follows: God controls the weather, and there is nothing we can do to predict it. It's pretty consistent with the climate change argument, if the earth does gets warmer it's because God wants it that way.

These people are hopeless, you can't argue with children.

1. I don't know if God controls the weather, or merely invented the weather process, or what, but I will admit that there is a distinct lack of human control over it.

2. Nonetheless, we seem to be taking a hand it in at the moment, and not in a good way. Perhaps we should stop.

3. For centuries, people have made good decisions to protect themselves from violent or dangerous weather. We should keep doing that.

237 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:33:22pm

re: #214 prononymous

But are temple balls on the menu?

Not likely, but hey, don't laugh. Yesterday I saw fried lamb brains with artichokes and avocado on a menu on what used to be a normal pizza place, now turned into yuppie bridge/tunnel restaurant.

238 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:33:52pm

re: #232 Killgore Trout

Obama responds to Kanye
Image: 7z5ol.jpg

blacks gave us the Blues....for that alone there should be a monument on the Mall in DC

239 Shiplord Kirel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:34:22pm

re: #184 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

There is a trend here lately, of these taco trucks with really high-end, pretentious gourmet food. I saw one yesterday that had "pork belly hash with fingerling potatoes". Pork belly is really all the rage here, right now. Used to be ghetto/minority/"weird Asian" food the yuppies looked down on.

Now, it's all they eat. Absurd, and hilarious.

Their susceptibility to food fads is yet another reason I think the yuppie infestation is self-limiting. Their tender arteries won't take a lot of this pork belly stuff. Just wait till a fad develops for French home-cooking. Fried potatoes with cream-cheese sauce anyone? They'll be grabbing their chests and falling over dead at watering holes and trendy boutiques from coast-to-coast.

240 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:34:32pm

re: #229 Atlas Fails

The sad thing is, Steigerwald is one of the smarter people on that sad, sad thread.

He's been blinded by Palin's down home appley goodness and beauty queen looks.

I've been around some highly intelligent people during my life and Palin does not fit in that group in any way.

241 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:34:39pm

re: #238 albusteve

blacks gave us the Blues...for that alone there should be a monument on the Mall in DC

We gave you the blues because we were given the blues.

242 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:34:55pm

re: #235 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Now that's a nightmare. I hate boot file corruption. I'm making my next build dual-boot just to avoid that specter.

243 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:35:36pm

re: #232 Killgore Trout
Heh. I do wish the derangement syndromes would ease up and be held up for the counterproductive impact.

BTW
Did you see that little incident where Maxine Waters made a racially tinged statement to an Obama aide?

244 CuriousLurker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:35:38pm

re: #235 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Ouch.

245 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:35:39pm

re: #242 Obdicut

Now that's a nightmare. I hate boot file corruption. I'm making my next build dual-boot just to avoid that specter.

Yeah, it's been a living nightmare for me. More than a few four-letter words have been uttered or screamed in the last 24 hours.

246 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:36:02pm

re: #234 engineer dog

exactly. the demographic argument is usually made using the assumption that baby boomers will live forever

We will.
The younger generations are there just to supply us with bodies.

247 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:36:22pm

re: #245 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Now you get the fun of updating all your drivers.

What OS?

248 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:36:33pm

re: #235 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

We lost power for a couple hours on Friday, just as I was shutting down my computer. So, what happens? A boot file gets corrupted, meaning I have to haul out the restore discs and basically return my computer to factory condition. Spent the better part of last night and today getting it something resembling working condition.

Oh that sucks.

249 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:36:39pm

re: #241 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

We gave you the blues because we were given the blues.

yes, it's just one hell of a story nobody knows or cares about...nothing new

250 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:37:21pm

re: #44 Amory Blaine

Damages = Estimates = OBAMAS FAULT!!!11!!!1ty

God should forbid it for other reasons, but seriously, imagine the response of some folks out there these days to a Katrina-grade situation on Barack Obama's watch.

251 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:37:41pm

re: #240 b_sharp

He's been blinded by Palin's down home appley goodness and beauty queen looks.

I've been around some highly intelligent people during my life and Palin does not fit in that group in any way.

What he doesn't get is that intelligence isn't measured in political accomplishments. The smartest guy I ever knew was an Ivy league grad who is now an artist and writer in addition to working for his parents to make ends meet.

252 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:37:44pm

re: #236 SanFranciscoZionist

1. I don't know if God controls the weather, or merely invented the weather process, or what, but I will admit that there is a distinct lack of human control over it.

2. Nonetheless, we seem to be taking a hand it in at the moment, and not in a good way. Perhaps we should stop.

3. For centuries, people have made good decisions to protect themselves from violent or dangerous weather. We should keep doing that.

"Perhaps we should stop."

Those are some powerful words.

253 makeitstop  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:37:56pm

re: #91 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Glenn Greenwald, the new living saint of the anti-Obama progressibaggers.

I quite like that. I may end up stealing it, with your permission, of course.

254 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:38:28pm

re: #250 SanFranciscoZionist

God should forbid it for other reasons, but seriously, imagine the response of some folks out there these days to a Katrina-grade situation on Barack Obama's watch.

people were drooling for it

255 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:38:33pm

re: #247 Obdicut

Now you get the fun of updating all your drivers.

What OS?

XP. And I've still got to install SP3, which has been acting like a bitch every time I try. Figure I'll be spending tomorrow finishing up any remaining updates (that will work) and then engaging in a few hours of Xbox play to relieve the resulting stress.

256 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:38:35pm

re: #242 Obdicut

Now that's a nightmare. I hate boot file corruption. I'm making my next build dual-boot just to avoid that specter.

Monday I pick the first dual OS PC tower for work. XP and Win7. We have legacy database software that may not run on 7, and its a transition machine to teach the staff how do use 7. Should be interesting.

257 Prononymous, rogue demon hunter  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:39:22pm

re: #216 albusteve

too rugged down here for such a soft guy...there is no Ritz for 500 miles in any direction

Get a grip. Presidents don't even have to leave the whitehouse to make a political speech about a disaster.

258 ProGunLiberal  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:39:26pm

I need to vent again:

What started as a great weekend has turned miserable. I literally feel depressed.

259 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:39:34pm

re: #239 Shiplord Kirel

Their susceptibility to food fads is yet another reason I think the yuppie infestation is self-limiting. Their tender arteries won't take a lot of this pork belly stuff. Just wait till a fad develops for French home-cooking. Fried potatoes with cream-cheese sauce anyone? They'll be grabbing their chests and falling over dead at watering holes and trendy boutiques from coast-to-coast.

You are giving my Birkenstocks an inferiority complex.

260 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:40:08pm

re: #255 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds
I have system restore with my XP computer. Did you try that?

261 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:40:20pm

re: #257 prononymous

Get a grip. Presidents don't even have to leave the whitehouse to make a political speech about a disaster.

me get a grip?...LOL!

262 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:40:33pm

re: #258 ProLifeLiberal

I need to vent again:

What started as a great weekend has turned miserable. I literally feel depressed.

Feel like sharing? Either way, best wishes.

263 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:40:44pm

re: #239 Shiplord Kirel

Their susceptibility to food fads is yet another reason I think the yuppie infestation is self-limiting. Their tender arteries won't take a lot of this pork belly stuff. Just wait till a fad develops for French home-cooking. Fried potatoes with cream-cheese sauce anyone? They'll be grabbing their chests and falling over dead at watering holes and trendy boutiques from coast-to-coast.

Yeah, it's just imitative. If Momofuku hadn't started the trend, they would still be sniffing down their noses at all the people who have been eating pork belly for what, 7 thousand years?

And you're right, these are also the people shrieking about other people's children eating Happy Meals, while their little Zoe or Beatrix or Aiden is too good for McDonalds. e_e

Can't stand em.

264 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:40:49pm

re: #256 Rightwingconspirator

The only things I've found that don't work on 7 (32bit) are things that depend on registry hooks, since for whatever goddamn reason they didn't remove, but did change, the registry for Windows 7.

But there are plenty of things that do use registry hooks-- checking for installed versions-- and if those don't have a 7 version, you'll be glad to have the XP.

Overall, I like 7. I haven't liked any other build of Windows.

265 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:41:05pm

re: #243 Rightwingconspirator

Heh. I do wish the derangement syndromes would ease up and be held up for the counterproductive impact.

BTW
Did you see that little incident where Maxine Waters made a racially tinged statement to an Obama aide?

What do you think she said that was "racially tinged"?

266 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:41:50pm

I knew karma was gonna bite my ass. Avoided losing power all day and night yesterday, with no damage to our house or the local neighborhood. Figure my life's good...then I try to boot my computer.

So add another casualty to the list./

267 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:41:53pm

re: #243 Rightwingconspirator

BTW
Did you see that little incident where Maxine Waters made a racially tinged statement to an Obama aide?

I don't know if I'd call that "racially tinged" but she's an idiot if she thinks Obama or his advisers are going to start creating jobs specifically for blacks. That's why Jesse Jackson or David Duke will never be President.

268 sagehen  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:42:20pm

re: #223 Obdicut

Also, the baby boomers' kids, who have some clever demographic name I can't remember (significantly larger group than gen-x post-boomers), are just now entering their prime earning years -- so SS revenues will pick up a bit.

269 austin_blue  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:42:29pm

re: #203 Atlas Fails

OT- Anyone wanna help me combat teh stoopid here? Guy was a bully with a classic case of "little man syndrome" as a sportscaster and writer, and continues to be one as a washed-up blogger. High-hanging fruit he is not, but I love the idea of him angrily punching his keyboard (no doubt sitting atop a stack of magazines) in response to my comments.

You'll never get at a guy like that. He is absolutely convinced of his righteousness.

270 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:43:14pm

re: #243 Rightwingconspirator

Heh. I do wish the derangement syndromes would ease up and be held up for the counterproductive impact.

BTW
Did you see that little incident where Maxine Waters made a racially tinged statement to an Obama aide?

Eh, the name "Maxine Waters" is just another Two Minutes Hate for cons. I'm glad everything she says enrages them...same reaction whether she said "say black" or read the poetry of St. Teresa of Avila all day.

271 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:43:22pm

re: #260 PhillyPretzel

I have system restore with my XP computer. Did you try that?

System restore works if you can boot the OS. Because a boot file was corrupted, and the OS disk is...somewhere, my only option was to use the restore disks that came with the computer to return the drive to factory condition.

272 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:43:52pm

re: #265 blueraven

What do you think she said that was "racially tinged"?

It came out of the mouth of Maxine Waters. By default, it's "racially tinged".

273 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:44:17pm

re: #256 Rightwingconspirator

Monday I pick the first dual OS PC tower for work. XP and Win7. We have legacy database software that may not run on 7, and its a transition machine to teach the staff how do use 7. Should be interesting.

Why not just use an XP VM?

274 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:44:32pm

re: #255 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Awesome. SP3 and all the driver goodness. Fun fun fun.

275 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:45:15pm

re: #273 b_sharp

Why not just use an XP VM?

XP VM does not work with things that depend on registry hooks-- verifying installation through checking registry options-- and a hell of a lot else, besides.

276 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:45:55pm

re: #258 ProLifeLiberal

I need to vent again:

What started as a great weekend has turned miserable. I literally feel depressed.

I felt depressed yesterday until I cracked my head against my desk putting in some LEDs. Now I don't feel anything.

277 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:46:02pm

re: #274 Obdicut

Awesome. SP3 and all the driver goodness. Fun fun fun.

Yeah, I've got enough functionality right now that I'm just going to take the rest of the night off and try to tackle the problem tomorrow.

Or commit seppuku, I haven't quite decided yet./

278 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:47:06pm

re: #263 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yeah, it's just imitative. If Momofuku hadn't started the trend, they would still be sniffing down their noses at all the people who have been eating pork belly for what, 7 thousand years?

And you're right, these are also the people shrieking about other people's children eating Happy Meals, while their little Zoe or Beatrix or Aiden is too good for McDonalds. e_e

Can't stand em.

[Video]

Great. Now I want a Big Mac.

279 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:47:19pm

re: #267 Killgore Trout

I don't know if I'd call that "racially tinged" but she's an idiot if she thinks Obama or his advisers are going to start creating jobs specifically for blacks. That's why Jesse Jackson or David Duke will never be President.

Although I dont think he can do that specifically, I do wish there was a way to target the hardest hit areas, without it appearing to be racially motivated. The truth is, these are areas that weren't doing well before the recession hit, and they really need help.

280 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:48:51pm

re: #268 sagehen

Also, the baby boomers' kids, who have some clever demographic name I can't remember (significantly larger group than gen-x post-boomers), are just now entering their prime earning years -- so SS revenues will pick up a bit.

They used to call us the "baby busters", since things were so traumatic the years we were born, there were really low birthrates.

281 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:49:08pm

re: #279 blueraven

Although I dont think he can do that specifically, I do wish there was a way to target the hardest hit areas, without it appearing to be racially motivated. The truth is, these are areas that weren't doing well before the recession hit, and they really need help.

BO is more worried about his job than yours...
bada boom!

282 ProGunLiberal  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:49:58pm

re: #262 Atlas Fails

I have two very close friends (both women) in Colorado. Both broke of their respective relationships in the past 36 hours. I'm frustrated that I can't support them. In addition, everyone here seems to be busy so I can't talk to my friends here. And those in CO are the ones who I usually call in tough situations, but this time that isn't possible.

In addition, for reasons stated earlier during LGF conversations, I can't talk to family. Which means my mood is in a downward spiral. For example, I now feel queasy.

283 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:51:16pm

re: #282 ProLifeLiberal

I have two very close friends (both women) in Colorado. Both broke of their respective relationships in the past 36 hours. I'm frustrated that I can't support them. In addition, everyone here seems to be busy so I can't talk to my friends here. And those in CO are the ones who I usually call in tough situations, but this time that isn't possible.

In addition, for reasons stated earlier during LGF conversations, I can't talk to family. Which means my mood is in a downward spiral. For example, I now feel queasy.

no sense in worrying about events you cannot control...stress is a killer

284 Ben G. Hazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:51:41pm

re: #263 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yeah, it's just imitative. If Momofuku hadn't started the trend, they would still be sniffing down their noses at all the people who have been eating pork belly for what, 7 thousand years?

And you're right, these are also the people shrieking about other people's children eating Happy Meals, while their little Zoe or Beatrix or Aiden is too good for McDonalds. e_e

Can't stand em.

[Video]

Psssttt....I wonder if those people realize that pork bellies are where bacon comes from?

285 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:51:44pm

re: #275 Obdicut

XP VM does not work with things that depend on registry hooks-- verifying installation through checking registry options-- and a hell of a lot else, besides.

The software gets installed in the VM, which has an XP registry file. I don't know what your concern is, every XP VM I've used has run XP software without problem. Maybe I just don't understand what you're saying?

286 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:52:22pm

re: #281 albusteve

BO is more worried about his job than yours...
bada boom!

You could write an ad for the GOP. /

287 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:54:16pm

re: #259 b_sharp

You are giving my Birkenstocks an inferiority complex.

Yeah, where I live, we are having a (predictable, I suppose) demographic crossover between the granolas and the yuppies, now that the granolas are reverting to the suburban lives they escaped from undergrad to the present.

Median income class anxiety coupled with foodie pretensions, ugh.

288 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:56:04pm

re: #285 b_sharp

The software gets installed in the VM, which has an XP registry file. I don't know what your concern is, every XP VM I've used has run XP software without problem. Maybe I just don't understand what you're saying?

No, it's that every program I've used which depends on an XP registry hook hasn't worked, in XP VM. I'm glad you've had a better experience than me.

289 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:56:24pm

re: #285 b_sharp

The software gets installed in the VM, which has an XP registry file. I don't know what your concern is, every XP VM I've used has run XP software without problem. Maybe I just don't understand what you're saying?

fucking operating systems, how do they work???

290 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:58:05pm

re: #287 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yeah, where I live, we are having a (predictable, I suppose) demographic crossover between the granolas and the yuppies, now that the granolas are reverting to the suburban lives they escaped from undergrad to the present.

Median income class anxiety coupled with foodie pretensions, ugh.

I have only two distinct groups that I can identify...
me and everybody else...you have more pigeonholes than the Albert Hall...but I may steal granola, whoever that is

291 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 3:59:45pm

re: #284 talon_262

Psssttt...I wonder if those people realize that pork bellies are where bacon comes from?

The foodies do, definitely.

Ironically, their purity/contamination anxiety gets the best of them, every time. Pork belly is now viewed as some kind of pure form of bacon 9_9. They prefer it because it's not over processed (so they think/claim), is a healthier kind of fat, etc.

Of course, you will never, EVER see them shopping for pork belly in the Asian food markets where I get my meats; the ones that have been selling it for umpteen years. Only their fancy-people stores.

There is also a big bacon trend, though. They're not averse to it at all - you see chocolate covered bacon....of all different types....here in Whole Foods, not even the specialty stores. Bacon-wrapped this, Bacon-infused that, blah blah.

292 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:01:07pm

re: #290 albusteve

you have more pigeonholes than the Albert Hall

Well maybe I just have a more varied life experience than you, and have lived in more diverse places than you. That's also possible. No one is requiring you to see the world in any other way but your own.

293 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:01:47pm

re: #288 Obdicut

No, it's that every program I've used which depends on an XP registry hook hasn't worked, in XP VM. I'm glad you've had a better experience than me.

Really? Weird.

Are these proprietary apps? One off databases and such?

294 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:01:57pm

Here is some great footage of Micheals getting his ass handed to him in front of congress by Dr. Ben Santer.

Climate Scientist Beat Down!!

Micheals presented a partial effect (and partial part of the data) as total effect (and the whole story) in a deliberate attempt to mislead the comittee. In short, he was caught lying, and Santer let his lying ass have it.

295 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:02:11pm

so I'm at the Greyhound depot and some granola approaches me to invest in her nonprofit 'FREE THE HENS!'...went on about fascist egg growers, cholesterol, and steroids

296 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:02:58pm

re: #289 engineer dog

fucking operating systems, how do they work???

They don't. They just throw pretty pictures on the screen to 'hypmatize' you into believing they work.

297 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:03:16pm

re: #294 LudwigVanQuixote

Here is some great footage of Micheals getting his ass handed to him in front of congress by Dr. Ben Santer.

Climate Scientist Beat Down!!

Micheals presented a partial effect (and partial part of the data) as total effect (and the whole story) in a deliberate attempt to mislead the comittee. In short, he was caught lying, and Santer let his lying ass have it.

Hello, Ludwig! Good to see you.

298 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:03:47pm

re: #295 albusteve

so I'm at the Greyhound depot and some granola approaches me to invest in her nonprofit 'FREE THE HENS!'...went on about fascist egg growers, cholesterol, and steroids

Did you mock him or just walk on by?

299 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:04:59pm

re: #294 LudwigVanQuixote

Here is some great footage of Micheals getting his ass handed to him in front of congress by Dr. Ben Santer.

Climate Scientist Beat Down!!

Micheals presented a partial effect (and partial part of the data) as total effect (and the whole story) in a deliberate attempt to mislead the comittee. In short, he was caught lying, and Santer let his lying ass have it.

I watched it this morning. I have no idea how Santer didn't punch Michaels in his lying mouth.

300 Daniel Ballard  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:05:29pm

re: #273 b_sharp

Why not just use an XP VM?

Untested in the circumstance is all. We were replacing the station anyway, and so I chose this option. It is a test/transition case. We have some really old dbase software that we depend on at work. Hopefully that will be replaced with a MS Access or something similar before we need another workstation.

301 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:05:31pm
302 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:06:10pm

re: #292 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Well maybe I just have a more varied life experience than you, and have lived in a more diverse places than you. That's also possible. No one is requiring you to see the world in any other way but your own.

LOL!...I've been around plenty...it's how you look at people...once your life is rich enough the pretense matters less....people are just people to me...I don't define them by their thoughts or where they eat...but I'm amused, and not judging your judment

303 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:06:20pm

re: #295 albusteve

so I'm at the Greyhound depot and some granola approaches me to invest in her nonprofit 'FREE THE HENS!'...went on about fascist egg growers, cholesterol, and steroids

I don't do steroids but I do do cholesterol... and sometimes hens.

304 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:06:21pm

re: #299 b_sharp

I watched it this morning. I have no idea how Santer didn't punch Michaels in his lying mouth.

He did not wish to be arrested by the Capitol Police. Assault charges can get you jail time.

305 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:07:37pm

re: #290 albusteve

I may steal granola, whoever that is

re: #295 albusteve

so I'm at the Greyhound depot and some granola approaches me to invest in her nonprofit 'FREE THE HENS!'...went on about fascist egg growers, cholesterol, and steroids

It wouldn't really be stealing, since the term has been around for about 20 years, initiated by the people calling themselves that.

306 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:07:49pm

re: #301 Gus 802
I am not impressed. I expected a bit more from Cadillac.

307 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:07:58pm

re: #293 b_sharp

Really? Weird.

Are these proprietary apps? One off databases and such?

Yeah, all proprietary stuff.

308 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:08:00pm

re: #300 Rightwingconspirator

Untested in the circumstance is all. We were replacing the station anyway, and so I chose this option. It is a test/transition case. We have some really old dbase software that we depend on at work. Hopefully that will be replaced with a MS Access or something similar before we need another workstation.

Gotcha.

I do tend to get a little VMy when discussing Windoze's foibles.

309 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:08:20pm

IN other news, power is almost completely out in my area (since yesterday) and is not likey to be resored for a little while.

One might be able to argue that hey hurricanes happen, its just weather. Sure. However, hurricanes do not usually make it all the way up the east coast. They certainly don't usually do this, this early in the season and while we are at it, this early in the season we are already up to H.

If you couple that with the blizzards that kicked off this year, the droughts across the south that have still not abated, the massive droughts in China, Russia and Africa, the flooding of the Mississipi, the tornadoes and the massive heatwave - making this, a neutral year for el nino and la nina, on track to be the hottest year on record, can you begin to say that the prediction of more extreme weather events is coming true?

I should hope you can... Of course if you doubt that you can look at teh droughts and storms of last year and the year before that...

coming soon is the next el nino cycle - that will make this year look tame.

310 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:09:00pm

re: #297 Dark_Falcon

Hello, Ludwig! Good to see you.

Great to see you.

311 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:09:40pm

re: #301 Gus 802

Disgusting.

really, what an awful color....have they no sense of propriety?

312 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:09:41pm

re: #304 Dark_Falcon

He did not wish to be arrested by the Capitol Police. Assault charges can get you jail time.

He's also a scientist. Most scientists I know are fairly controlled when it comes to science, they just back everything they say up with evidence.

313 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:10:50pm

re: #299 b_sharp

I watched it this morning. I have no idea how Santer didn't punch Michaels in his lying mouth.

Yeah, Micheals is a particularly odious little douche.

314 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:11:25pm

re: #302 albusteve

people are just people to me...I don't define them by their thoughts or where they eat...but I'm amused, and not judging your judment

Judge what I say or don't; doesn't matter. I'm going by their own self definitions, penchants for self-pigeonholing, and their own terms, which is just as interesting to me as any.

Every so often the people in question affect the politics in my city, such as the Happy Meal ban, so it's worth talking about, imo. Sorry if the way I talk about it troubles you.

315 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:12:07pm

re: #258 ProLifeLiberal

I need to vent again:

What started as a great weekend has turned miserable. I literally feel depressed.

Sorry to hear it. You want to tell us all about it, or be distracted?

I know many glorious lies of battle!!

316 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:12:30pm

re: #301 Gus 802

Disgusting.

Is that from Proxima Centauri Prime?

317 SanFranciscoZionist  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:12:39pm

re: #263 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Yeah, it's just imitative. If Momofuku hadn't started the trend, they would still be sniffing down their noses at all the people who have been eating pork belly for what, 7 thousand years?

And you're right, these are also the people shrieking about other people's children eating Happy Meals, while their little Zoe or Beatrix or Aiden is too good for McDonalds. e_e

Can't stand em.

[Video]

It does keep them out of the McDonalds. Which is something.

318 austin_blue  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:12:40pm

re: #284 talon_262

Psssttt...I wonder if those people realize that pork bellies are where bacon comes from?

BACON!!!

319 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:13:08pm

re: #301 Gus 802

Disgusting.

With the Ciel, Cadillac designers summon the brand's rich heritage flush the brand down the toilet as they begin to define the shape of a future flagship by the numbers fuckup that proves GM still hasn't learned its lessons.

Promo quote fixed.

320 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:13:11pm

re: #314 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Judge what I say or don't; doesn't matter. I'm going by their own self definitions, penchants for self-pigeonholing, and their own terms, which is just as interesting to me as any.

Every so often the people in question affect the politics in my city, such as the Happy Meal ban, so it's worth talking about, imo. Sorry if the way I talk about it troubles you.

does not trouble me...nothing here troubles me...why would it?

321 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:14:19pm

re: #319 Dark_Falcon

Promo quote fixed.

The front end looks like the rear end. Just another retro American car. You ever notice how BMW, Audi, Ferrari, and the rest of the best car manufacturers around the world never do retro models. They're always moving forward.

322 austin_blue  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:14:37pm

re: #301 Gus 802

Disgusting.

The return of the Land Yacht!

323 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:15:28pm

re: #311 albusteve

really, what an awful color...have they no sense of propriety?

If they had a sense of propriety they would have made the car a turbo-electric hybrid. We need cars like that, not this 'crash the old into the new and then make a car out of the salvageable pieces' abortion.

324 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:15:56pm

re: #320 albusteve

does not trouble me...nothing here troubles me...why would it?

Repeating: you see the world your way; not everyone else does, including me. Not everyone sees the world my way; bfd.

325 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:16:29pm

re: #309 LudwigVanQuixote

IN other news, power is almost completely out in my area (since yesterday) and is not likey to be resored for a little while.

One might be able to argue that hey hurricanes happen, its just weather. Sure. However, hurricanes do not usually make it all the way up the east coast. They certainly don't usually do this, this early in the season and while we are at it, this early in the season we are already up to H.

If you couple that with the blizzards that kicked off this year, the droughts across the south that have still not abated, the massive droughts in China, Russia and Africa, the flooding of the Mississipi, the tornadoes and the massive heatwave - making this, a neutral year for el nino and la nina, on track to be the hottest year on record, can you begin to say that the prediction of more extreme weather events is coming true?

I should hope you can... Of course if you doubt that you can look at teh droughts and storms of last year and the year before that...

coming soon is the next el nino cycle - that will make this year look tame.

We're in a neutral ENSO phase after coming off a rather powerful La Nina phase and look to be heading into another bit of a La Nina. If this is what we get from a freakin' La Nina, I do not want to experience a full blown El Nino, which is what Hansen is predicting for 2012/2013.

326 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:16:32pm

re: #323 Dark_Falcon

If they had a sense of propriety they would have made the car a turbo-electric hybrid. We need cars like that, not this 'crash the old into the new and then make a car out of the salvageable pieces' abortion.

It's actually a hybrid. Or going to be.

327 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:16:42pm

re: #321 Gus 802

The front end looks like the rear end. Just another retro American car. You ever notice how BMW, Audi, Ferrari, and the rest of the best car manufacturers around the world never do retro models. They're always moving forward.

I'm fine with retro, but this thing isn't retro-cool, it's anachronism-fugly.

328 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:16:47pm

Ohh and please mark this up so CJ sees it and can use it as an update:

At least 19 people were killed in various storm-related accidents from Florida to Connecticut, and the death toll was expected to rise.

[Link: latimesblogs.latimes.com...]

And the storm isn't over yet.

Micheal's predictions aren't so hot either.

329 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:17:03pm

re: #317 SanFranciscoZionist

It does keep them out of the McDonalds. Which is something.

Lol true. Though they would not be caught dead at McDonalds. Not when they thought anyone was looking, anyway.

330 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:17:13pm

re: #326 Gus 802

It's actually a hybrid. Or going to be.

Oops.

331 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:17:30pm

re: #321 Gus 802

The front end looks like the rear end. Just another retro American car. You ever notice how BMW, Audi, Ferrari, and the rest of the best car manufacturers around the world never do retro models. They're always moving forward.

Retro Racer: Slick BMW 328 Hommage Pays Homage to Famed 328

332 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:17:34pm

re: #301 Gus 802

Disgusting.

I prefer this model Image: wallpaper_C70_exterior_12.jpg

333 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:17:44pm

re: #325 b_sharp

We're in a neutral ENSO phase after coming off a rather powerful La Nina phase and look to be heading into another bit of a La Nina. If this is what we get from a freakin' La Nina, I do not want to experience a full blown El Nino, which is what Hansen is predicting for 2012/2013.

More than just Hansen are predicting a full blown el nino in 2012/13.

It really will make this year look tame.

334 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:18:10pm

re: #321 Gus 802

The front end looks like the rear end. Just another retro American car. You ever notice how BMW, Audi, Ferrari, and the rest of the best car manufacturers around the world never do retro models. They're always moving forward.

In that sense, the American car industry is becoming like the American movie industry: no originality to speak of, just retreads and rehashes of what's been done before.

Difference being that formula seems to work much better for the latter than the former.

335 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:18:25pm

re: #331 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Retro Racer: Slick BMW 328 Hommage Pays Homage to Famed 328

Thwack!

How many are they making? 12? ;)

336 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:18:39pm

re: #313 LudwigVanQuixote

Yeah, Micheals is a particularly odious little douche.

He works for Cato doesn't he? I think that says it all.

337 Ben G. Hazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:19:15pm

re: #322 austin_blue

The return of the Land Yacht!

I dunno...I kind of like that look. It looks a lot like the Eldorados used to look.

338 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:19:21pm

re: #334 publicityStunted

In that sense, the American car industry is becoming like the American movie industry: no originality to speak of, just retreads and rehashes of what was done before.

Difference being that formula seems to work much better for the latter than the former.

Exactly. They have nothing to go on other than their past.

339 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:19:22pm

re: #323 Dark_Falcon

If they had a sense of propriety they would have made the car a turbo-electric hybrid. We need cars like that, not this 'crash the old into the new and then make a car out of the salvageable pieces' abortion.

Why can't all conservatives be like this? ;)

340 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:20:48pm

re: #328 LudwigVanQuixote

Ohh and please mark this up so CJ sees it and can use it as an update:

At least 19 people were killed in various storm-related accidents from Florida to Connecticut, and the death toll was expected to rise.

Shit.

341 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:21:36pm

re: #338 Gus 802

Exactly. They have nothing to go on other than their past.

Some of their "retro" cars are pretty good looking. Personally, I like the new Mustang and Challenger models. Comparing them to the ungodly monstrosity you linked to is a bit unfair.

342 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:21:46pm

re: #334 publicityStunted

In that sense, the American car industry is becoming like the American movie industry: no originality to speak of, just retreads and rehashes of what's been done before.

Difference being that formula seems to work much better for the latter than the former.

The auto industry faces a lot more competition than the movie industry.

343 Ben G. Hazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:22:13pm

re: #331 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Retro Racer: Slick BMW 328 Hommage Pays Homage to Famed 328

That looks badass...

344 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:22:31pm

re: #341 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Some of their "retro" cars are pretty good looking. Personally, I like the new Mustang and Challenger models. Comparing them to the ungodly monstrosity you linked to is a bit unfair.

Yep. That's the kind of forward thinking we need to mitigate climate change. ;)

345 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:23:02pm

re: #333 LudwigVanQuixote

More than just Hansen are predicting a full blown el nino in 2012/13.

It really will make this year look tame.

Did you see this?

Global Warming Behind Somali Drought

"The present drought in the Horn of Africa has been provoked by El Niño and La Niña phenomena in the Pacific Ocean, which unsettle the normal circulation of warm and cold water and air, and dislocate the humidity conditions across the southern hemisphere," Friedrich-Wilhelm Gerstengarbe, senior scientist at the German Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (PIK, after its German name), told IPS.
...
Gerstengarbe says climate change and the rising global temperatures caused by it have intensified both El Niño and La Niña, leading to severe floods in Pakistan and Australia, and drought in the Horn of Africa.

346 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:23:24pm

re: #321 Gus 802

The front end looks like the rear end. Just another retro American car. You ever notice how BMW, Audi, Ferrari, and the rest of the best car manufacturers around the world never do retro models. They're always moving forward.

meanwhile, retro Mustangs, Challengers and Camaros are hugely popular...and btw Caddy is dumping it's DTS and STS lines

347 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:23:31pm

And Detroit Free Press has the number at 20

[Link: www.freep.com...]

Hurricane Irene had led to the deaths of at least 20 people in eight states as of Sunday evening

348 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:23:57pm

grrr. I really do not like when weather interferes with my internet.

349 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:24:01pm

Really? Is this true?
Image: H5I6J.png

350 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:24:19pm

re: #323 Dark_Falcon

If they had a sense of propriety they would have made the car a turbo-electric hybrid. We need cars like that, not this 'crash the old into the new and then make a car out of the salvageable pieces' abortion.

nobody buys them....what about jobs?

351 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:24:29pm

re: #344 Gus 802

Yep. That's the kind of forward thinking we need to mitigate climate change. ;)

re: #344 Gus 802

Yep. That's the kind of forward thinking we need to mitigate climate change. ;)

Here is my dream car.

Racer!

352 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:24:41pm

re: #337 talon_262

I dunno...I kind of like that look. It looks a lot like the Eldorados used to look.

it's a very bad ass car

353 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:24:57pm

re: #349 Killgore Trout

Really? Is this true?
Image: H5I6J.png

Yep.

354 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:25:20pm

re: #324 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

Repeating: you see the world your way; not everyone else does, including me. Not everyone sees the world my way; bfd.

really?

355 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:25:32pm

re: #345 publicityStunted

Did you see this?

Global Warming Behind Somali Drought

I know people who work directly on studying the African climate. The situation there is very grim and of course those people will be among the first and hardest hit as things get progrssively worse.

We are seeing the first millions out of billions who will die from AGW right now in this decade.

356 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:25:39pm

re: #346 albusteve

meanwhile, retro Mustangs, Challengers and Camaros are hugely popular...and btw Caddy is dumping it's DTS and STS lines

The linked pic looks like a continuation of the DTS/STS line. I ended up renting a DTS once. It was ok. Didn't make me want to own one.

357 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:25:51pm

re: #339 Atlas Fails

Why can't all conservatives be like this? ;)

I don't know. I firmly believe in capitalism and a strong national defense, but I've always been of the belief that you also need to make sure America remains a country I'd want to live in. And I see decreasing auto emissions as part of keeping the USA as such a nation.

This is not a new thing for me. I've felt this way since grade school.

358 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:26:15pm

re: #354 albusteve

really?

Believe it!

It's true!

359 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:26:30pm

re: #353 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yep.

I'll be damned.

360 Honorary Consul General  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:26:31pm

re: #353 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Yep.

Someone posted something here years ago about lantern batteries being about 22-24 AA batteries. A way to save money.

361 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:26:33pm

re: #344 Gus 802

Yep. That's the kind of forward thinking we need to mitigate climate change. ;)

Climate change is a hoax! The scientists are in it for the money! Do you really believe the oil companies would do anything that wasn't in our best interest?! The free market wouldn't allow it!

362 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:27:23pm

re: #355 LudwigVanQuixote

I know people who work directly on studying the African climate. The situation there is very grim and of course those people will be among the first and hardest hit as things get progrssively worse.

We are seeing the first millions out of billions who will die from AGW right now in this decade.

No wonder the deniers hate any talk about it, then.

363 goddamnedfrank  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:27:43pm

re: #342 Dark_Falcon

The auto industry faces a lot more competition than the movie industry.

Moving cars to market is a lot more expensive than movies, especially now that they've gone digital. We're also not at the point where robots can replace script writers, though CGI has done a number on the gaffers and set designers / carpenters / builders / etc.

364 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:27:48pm

re: #344 Gus 802

Yep. That's the kind of forward thinking we need to mitigate climate change. ;)

hint...AGW is dead

365 Honorary Consul General  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:27:52pm

re: #360 Cannadian Club Akbar

Someone posted something here years ago about lantern batteries being about 22-24 AA batteries. A way to save money.

Nope. Looked it up. False.

366 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:28:00pm

re: #360 Cannadian Club Akbar

Someone posted something here years ago about lantern batteries being about 22-24 AA batteries. A way to save money.

Now that I have no clue about. But it wouldn't surprise me.

367 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:29:09pm

re: #356 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

The linked pic looks like a continuation of the DTS/STS line. I ended up renting a DTS once. It was ok. Didn't make me want to own one.

couple of years out
[Link: dfweliteautorental.com...]

368 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:29:52pm

re: #362 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

No wonder the deniers hate any talk about it, then.

Well that and the fact, the simple and tragic fact, that dead poor brown poeple don't make the radar of the typical conservative int his country as anything to be counted in the first place.

369 engineer cat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:29:59pm

Irene charges into New England; NYC escapes worst

OK THAT DOESN MEAN THAT GOD DOESN HATE U ELITIST SINNERS

370 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:30:00pm

re: #361 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Climate change is a hoax! The scientists are in it for the money! Do you really believe the oil companies would do anything that wasn't in our best interest?! The free market wouldn't allow it!

.

Global warming is just the commies using gubbment to shake us down for more money!

Why CAN'T I drill in my own front yard for oil, how dare Uhhbama and Eric Holder X tell me I can't!

371 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:30:22pm

re: #301 Gus 802

Disgusting.

Looks like you should be wearing a Batman outfit to drive that thing, not horribly ugly Per Se but the lines are just...off somehow...

372 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:31:11pm

re: #355 LudwigVanQuixote

I know people who work directly on studying the African climate. The situation there is very grim and of course those people will be among the first and hardest hit as things get progrssively worse.

We are seeing the first millions out of billions who will die from AGW right now in this decade.

BILLIONS WILL DIE!!1 Lewdwig is lying as usual. All of those deaths in Somalia can be explained by those people's adherence to Sharia!!11 They'd have bountiful fields if they were Christian!!!11

/Stalker Blog (Just thought I'd save the blockheads who always try to "refudiate" Ludwig the trouble and just skip straight to mocking their stupidity).

373 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:31:42pm

re: #368 LudwigVanQuixote

Well that and the fact, the simple and tragic fact, that dead poor brown poeple don't make the radar of the typical conservative int his country as anything to be counted in the first place.

Yeah, that's what I meant. The more dead people of any stripe on the other side of the world, the better!

Less competition for them. /

374 Mad Prophet Ludwig  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:33:21pm

Anyway... got to run... and I don't have power at home. Someone bug Charles about the Micheals beat down vid and the fact that teh death count is 20 and counting...

375 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:35:19pm

re: #370 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

.

lol, something about Holder (and Elizabeth Warren, for that matter) really seems to strike a nerve with the wingnuts. I'll be the first to admit that his Justice Dept. has made some head-scratching mistakes, but he doesn't come off as incompetent to me, at least not any less competent than any other AG of the past 40ish years.

376 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:36:06pm

re: #363 goddamnedfrank

Moving cars to market is a lot more expensive than movies, especially now that they've gone digital. We're also not at the point where robots can replace script writers

We're not?

377 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:37:24pm

re: #376 publicityStunted

We're not?

Not for nothing was that movie nicknamed "Dances With Smurfs".

378 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:39:02pm
379 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:39:35pm

re: #349 Killgore Trout

Really? Is this true?
Image: H5I6J.png

Yes, but that is an A23 12volt battery, not a AA.

380 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:41:00pm

re: #375 Atlas Fails

.

lol, something about Holder (and Elizabeth Warren, for that matter) really seems to strike a nerve with the wingnuts.

They do. Though, can't help but observe that it never takes much to set off wingnuts. Even basic, general nonconformity will do that trick.

So yeah the ones who really rub their noses in it with appointments to jobs better than theirs...24/7 continuous jerking knees abound.

I'll be the first to admit that his Justice Dept. has made some head-scratching mistakes, but he doesn't come off as incompetent to me, at least not any less competent than any other AG of the past 40ish years.

I think they're just mad because he doesn't write his own praise and worship songs.

/

381 b_Snark  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:41:24pm

BBL

382 Honorary Consul General  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:41:26pm

re: #378 Gus 802

Hurricane Irene leads to at least 20 deaths

I posted this morning about the 2 Florida deaths. Dudes went into the water during a TS/hurricane. Not smart.

383 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:43:26pm

Alright, must do prep for tomorrow. ttyas

384 Four More Tears  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:48:27pm

re: #382 Cannadian Club Akbar

I posted this morning about the 2 Florida deaths. Dudes went into the water during a TS/hurricane. Not smart.

I hear they're working overtime crafting Darwin Awards for this year's ceremonies.

385 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:53:27pm
386 Idle Drifter  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:56:42pm

re: #377 Dark_Falcon

Not for nothing was that movie nicknamed "Dances With Smurfs".

Hell, I'm still waiting for a proper Starship Troopers movie complete with Powered Armor, Bug Ships, and the 30 sec bomb. Not going to happen.

387 Ben G. Hazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:57:46pm

re: #385 Gus 802

Serious flooding in NY.

Holy shit...

388 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:58:44pm

re: #387 talon_262

Holy shit...

Yeah. They're getting or got whacked in Vermont too.

389 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 4:59:13pm

re: #382 Cannadian Club Akbar

I posted this morning about the 2 Florida deaths. Dudes went into the water during a TS/hurricane. Not smart.

Yeah, saw more than a few of those on the local news yesterday. And the Weather Channel got their very own streaker, live on TV. Yes, all of us in Virginia Beach are very proud. *rolls eyes*

390 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:00:38pm

Vermont

392 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:04:06pm

Getting a bunch of stuff from this guy...

[Link: twitter.com...]

393 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:05:32pm

re: #384 JasonA

I am sure that the families of the surfers are very sad; and I am guessing that they are also pretty fucking embarrassed.

394 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:05:45pm

Well yes, Gus, it's all rather shocking. But have any bodies been coughed up? Seriously, why worry about Irene, it wasn't all that dangerous.

///

395 WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.]  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:06:10pm

re: #356 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin

The linked pic looks like a continuation of the DTS/STS line. I ended up renting a DTS once. It was ok. Didn't make me want to own one.

CTS-V wagon plz

396 Gus  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:07:59pm
397 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:10:47pm

re: #396 Gus 802

Image: 9943100-standard.jpg

Ever notice how flood waters always manage to be really gross and scary colors? In Japan, they were inky black, and in the pics you've posted, they're either diluted blood-red or sludge-brown.

398 PhillyPretzel  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:11:33pm

Any storm is dangerous, especially hurricanes.

399 darthstar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:14:51pm

"cough up"? And last I heard, 13 people had died in the storm...not that body count should be a scorecard people use to judge storms by as that's kind of sick.

400 theheat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:19:00pm

This isn't about how many were killed, it's about people becoming too touchy feely and relying on the nanny state to tell them if it's too hot, too cold, too wet, too windy. Bootstraps!

401 Varek Raith  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:19:53pm
402 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:21:11pm

re: #401 Varek Raith

Republicans To Oppose Tax Cut For Working People

Come now, don't you know how the real world works? The rich get all the tax cuts, credits, and deductions because they're "job-creators." The people who actually work the jobs that they create, the poor and working class? They get to pick up the tab.

403 prairiefire  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:21:20pm

re: #396 Gus 802

Image: 9943100-standard.jpg

That looks awful.

404 Atlas Fails  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:22:16pm

re: #401 Varek Raith

Republicans To Oppose Tax Cut For Working People

Just like their opposition to the stimulus was essentially opposition to a middle class tax cut.

405 darthstar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:22:18pm
406 darthstar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:23:51pm

re: #396 Gus 802

Image: 9943100-standard.jpg

Not a good time for fly fishing.

407 theheat  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:23:55pm

re: #402 Targetpractice, Worst of Both Worlds

Come now, don't you know how the real world works? The rich get all the tax cuts, credits, and deductions because they're "job-creators."

Yeah, that job creating has worked out swimmingly so far.
//

Maybe they just need "more time" to create.

408 Targetpractice  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:27:55pm

re: #407 theheat

Yeah, that's job creating has worked out swimmingly so far.
//

Maybe they just need "more time" to create.

Nah, the problem now is two-fold, namely "uncertainty" that those tax cuts will remain and too many "job-killing" regulations. And the only way to solve both, of course, is with a Republican in the White House!

//

409 Idle Drifter  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:35:01pm

re: #401 Varek Raith

Republicans To Oppose Tax Cut For Working People

Because a tax cut to those who might need it is too much to ask.

410 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:35:20pm

Sorry I ducked out for a bit. I found a relevant point regarding our old annoyance, the Stalkers. But since some here have asked me not to put stuff about them on the main thread, I made a Page about my findings.

Fair warning: It's got lots of hate.

411 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:35:33pm

re: #385 Gus 802

Serious flooding in NY.

wow

412 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:37:15pm

re: #410 Dark_Falcon

Sorry I ducked out for a bit. I found a relevant point regarding our old annoyance, the Stalkers. But since some here have asked me not to put stuff about them on the main thread, I made a Page about my findings.

Fair warning: It's got lots of hate.

Ugh. It's nice to not have them around here anymore.

413 Killgore Trout  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:38:29pm

re: #401 Varek Raith

Republicans To Oppose Tax Cut For Working People

Fiscal conservatism is a hoax.

414 darthstar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:39:07pm

re: #410 Dark_Falcon

Sorry I ducked out for a bit. I found a relevant point regarding our old annoyance, the Stalkers. But since some here have asked me not to put stuff about them on the main thread, I made a Page about my findings.

Fair warning: It's got lots of hate.

I hope you remembered to wash your hands.

415 Varek Raith  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:40:25pm

re: #414 darthstar

I hope you remembered to wash your hands soul.

;)

416 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:41:35pm

re: #401 Varek Raith

Republicans To Oppose Tax Cut For Working People

To be clear, this is a view based on supply-side economics, whereas Obama's payroll-tax holiday relies on demand-side economics. So its a legitimate debate. It's not the asshole play they make it out to be.

417 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:42:23pm

re: #415 Varek Raith

;)

I can't wash my soul with you around; you'd try to steal it!

418 Varek Raith  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:44:45pm

re: #417 Dark_Falcon

I can't wash my soul with you around; you'd try to steal it!

Busted.

419 watching you tiny alien kittens are  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:45:33pm

Ahh Bachmann, you can always count on her for some utterly moronic and simplistic solution to any perceived problem...

(POINCIANA, Fla. (AP) - Republican presidential candidate Michele Bachmann claims the U.S. has more energy resources than any other country but isn't exploiting them because of radical environmentalists.

Bachmann says with shale oil, natural gas and coal, the United States shouldn't be "begging" others for oil and energy supplies.

She said "we are the king daddy dogs when it comes to energy." But she says environmentalists are preventing resources from being tapped.

As president, Bachmann said she would unlock those resources and eliminate the Environmental Protection Agency.

Sure, lets build tons more coal fired plants and bring back the acid rain! Why? I don't know, to create excess electricity that there isn't any demand for I guess? Or maybe we need to start building coal fired boiler driven cars or something? Oil shale processing is not going to deliver that $2 a gallon gas she is promising her supporters either. What it will do is create an awful lot of pollution for a negligible output as compared to total U.S. demand.

I really don't know if she is as simple minded as she seems or just pandering to her "simple" supporters.

420 darthstar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:47:34pm

re: #419 ausador

Michele Bachmann is $2 a gallon ass.

421 Varek Raith  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:47:36pm

I want a modern version of the Ford Nucleon.

422 blueraven  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:48:39pm

re: #416 Dark_Falcon

To be clear, this is a view based on supply-side economics, whereas Obama's payroll-tax holiday relies on demand-side economics. So its a legitimate debate. It's not the asshole play they make it out to be.

No, I am pretty sure it is an asshole move. After all, the Bush tax cuts are still in place. Still trickling down...//

423 albusteve  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:49:22pm

re: #397 publicityStunted

Ever notice how flood waters always manage to be really gross and scary colors? In Japan, they were inky black, and in the pics you've posted, they're either diluted blood-red or sludge-brown.

the Rio Grande turned black for a couple days, here in ABQ, from ash....forest fire soot from runoff....you look at that and go Holy Shit!

424 darthstar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:50:37pm

re: #422 blueraven

No, I am pretty sure it is an asshole move. After all, the Bush tax cuts are still in place. Still trickling down...//

trickling down like urine in an old man's Depends.

425 Varek Raith  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 5:56:12pm

re: #416 Dark_Falcon

To be clear, this is a view based on supply-side economics, whereas Obama's payroll-tax holiday relies on demand-side economics. So its a legitimate debate. It's not the asshole play they make it out to be.

I never liked supply side economics.
What good is the ability to make stuff if there is no one who can buy it?

426 darthstar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 6:00:11pm

re: #425 Varek Raith

I never liked supply side economics.
What good is the ability to make stuff if there is no one who can buy it?

If you build it, they will come. (apparently only works for midwest baseball fields and porn movies)

427 Dark_Falcon  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 6:03:40pm

re: #425 Varek Raith

I never liked supply side economics.
What good is the ability to make stuff if there is no one who can buy it?

The argument is that you have to employ people to make the stuff, and then those people consume the goods thus produced.

428 darthstar  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 6:04:21pm

re: #427 Dark_Falcon

The argument is that you have to employ people to make the stuff, and then those people consume the goods thus produced.

No, you buy my shit first, and then I'll give you a job so you can pay for it.

429 Stanghazi  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 6:10:10pm

re: #422 blueraven

No, I am pretty sure it is an asshole move. After all, the Bush tax cuts are still in place. Still trickling down...//

drip drip drip. Not.

430 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 6:59:57pm

re: #427 Dark_Falcon

The argument is that you have to employ people to make the stuff, and then those people consume the goods thus produced.

Doesn't work when the people you employ are in China or conscript laborers in India.

431 lostlakehiker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 8:25:40pm

re: #1 HappyWarrior

Note to Michaels, predictions are just that. What a dickhead of hte highest order though. I am glad the hurricane wasn't as bad as some expected but that shouldn't mean that we should ignore forecasts and shrug off global warming either.

It was about 3 times as many fatalities as Michaels predicted.

I suppose it's been studied very carefully and we really do have to expect more, or more severe, hurricanes. It's a bit counterintuitive, I must confess. More heat waves, obvious. Higher sea levels, obvious. Crop failures, obvious. More droughts? Sort of obvious, your evaporation outruns even slightly higher rainfall, let alone reduced rainfall.

But storms feed off temperature differentials, and the biggest temperature rise is expected at or near the poles. So on the face of it, you'd not expect this hurricane consequence.


This prediction had better be right, or its failure will become the premier denialist talking point.

432 Obdicut  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 8:28:01pm

re: #431 lostlakehiker

More energy in the system means more hurricanes.

433 Interesting Times  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 8:36:19pm

re: #431 lostlakehiker

How Does Global Warming Make Hurricanes Like Irene More Destructive?

Climate science suggests that global warming will make hurricanes like Irene more destructive in three ways (all things being equal):

1. Sea level rise makes storm surges more destructive.

2. “Owing to higher SSTs [sea surface temperatures] from human activities, the increased water vapor in the atmosphere leads to 5 to 10% more rainfall and increases the risk of flooding,” as NCAR Senior Scientist Kevin Trenberth put it in an email to me today.

3.“However, because water vapor and higher ocean temperatures help fuel the storm, it is likely to be more intense and bigger as well,” as Trenberth writes
...
Also, hurricanes tend to be self-limiting, in that they churn up deeper (usually cooler) water, that can stop them from gaining strength and also weaken them. So since global warming also warms the deeper ocean, it further helps hurricanes stay stronger longer.

434 freetoken  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 8:40:13pm

re: #432 Obdicut

More energy in the system means more hurricanes.

It's not that straightforward.

The genesis of tropical storms depends on many factors. While increased energy in the combined ocean/atmosphere system will drive the system to create more "events", so to speak, it is not clear if that will manifest as more tropical storms. While overall precipitation on the globe's surface will increase (because of more precipitable water vapor in the atmosphere), there are many different large scale meteorological phenomenon - extratropical storms, bow fronts of thunderstorms, monsoonal rains, snow, hail, and so forth.

From what I've read, there is an expectation that the percentage of all tropical storms that form will develop into the more severe categories (because the average storm will have more available energy at it's sea surface), it is unclear if that actual number of North Atlantic tropical storms ("hurricanes") will increase.

435 lostlakehiker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 9:03:31pm

re: #432 Obdicut

More energy in the system means more hurricanes.

It's not that simple. If all the air were at the same temperature, however high that temperature might be, there would be no winds.

Temperature differentials drive storms. Evaporation and condensation play a part too, and that, we'll have more of. But now we're balancing off effects. That's always difficult, to get the cancellation right when enormous effects are on both sides of the ledger.

436 lostlakehiker  Sun, Aug 28, 2011 10:13:34pm

re: #30 Gus 802

Have you ever been inside a building such as an office building or an apartment and then heard the fire alarm go off only to watch most people sit in place asking themselves "is that a false alarm?" My experience has been that most people don't even take fire alarms seriously and react slowly to such alarms if at all unless they see fire or smoke killing precious time.

No, actually. In my experience, people may take ten or twenty seconds to pack up the stuff they'll want on their person, but then they're on the march. Everyone knows it's almost certainly a drill, but drills are not jokes. We can't just laugh them off and sit them out, somebody is tasked to go around and check that the evacuation has been accomplished.

437 Obdicut  Mon, Aug 29, 2011 1:41:58am

re: #434 freetoken

It's not that straightforward.

Well, it is if you take 'hurricane' to mean the more severe storm. But anyway, what you said is perfectly true.

438 Obdicut  Mon, Aug 29, 2011 1:42:22am

re: #435 lostlakehiker

It's not that simple. If all the air were at the same temperature, however high that temperature might be, there would be no winds.

But that's not the system we have, so who cares?

439 Timmeh  Mon, Aug 29, 2011 2:50:49am

At least 21 dead so far.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

440 docproto48  Mon, Aug 29, 2011 4:39:16am

re: #439 Timmeh

At least 21 dead so far.

[Link: littlegreenfootballs.com...]

Had Patrick had his way and the storm planned with 8 deaths in mind or worse yet Ron Paul totally ignored it there would have been far more than 21 deaths. Grrr

441 jayzee  Mon, Aug 29, 2011 9:54:04am

Talk of hype is pissing me off. Did the media hype the storm like they usually do? of course, but so what. They saved lives, as did the governors and local authorities (regardless of political affiliation) of the storm hit states. I live in NJ. Christie did a great job as did the local authorities. The forced evacuations did save lives. I feel lucky to have gotten through this with some down tree limbs, loss of power for 18 hours, and a hyper-extended elbow.

Here's what I learned from the "hype". If a weak cat 1 can do the damage Irene did, I will NEVER take for granted a larger storm, nor a storm of similar magnitude. I also learned what I need in case of a larger emergency (G-d forbid) and will be taking additional precautions next time around. I bet the states/local governments and feds are learning the same lessons. Which is also very important.

BTW-rivers continue to flood entire towns and dams are breaking all over the state.

442 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Aug 29, 2011 11:55:22am

re: #249 albusteve

yes, it's just one hell of a story nobody knows or cares about...nothing new

Maybe among the people you know, nobody knows or cares. In my circles, everyone knows the basic story about the blues, and cares, because the story is still current. There is always more new stuff to be learned about it, too. I have a feeling that's why you like it.

443 OhCrapIHaveACrushOnSarahPalin  Mon, Aug 29, 2011 11:58:49am

re: #441 jayzee

Here's what I learned from the "hype". If a weak cat 1 can do the damage Irene did, I will NEVER take for granted a larger storm, nor a storm of similar magnitude. I also learned what I need in case of a larger emergency (G-d forbid) and will be taking additional precautions next time around. I bet the states/local governments and feds are learning the same lessons. Which is also very important.

BTW-rivers continue to flood entire towns and dams are breaking all over the state.

Very true, that first para. Sorry to hear about that injury, too.

That infrastructure issue, though, I hope these states with budget-slashing governments pay attention.


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