A Classic: The Daily Show’s Samantha Bee Learns What Republicans Mean by ‘Individual Liberties’
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1 | Bulworth Thu, Aug 30, 2012 11:54:58am |
Individual Liberties - Corporate pollution OK. Sex not OK. OK?
//
4 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:00:04pm |
they believe that Liberty means that americans are free to do anything they want as long as republicans approve of it
6 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:00:37pm |
re: #2 Gus
RNC Ratings Night Two: Networks Lose 17 Million Viewers Compared To Night Two Of 2008 RNC
it's a kind of small looking convention
a little bit bigger than a game show
7 | Charles Johnson Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:01:17pm |
Quite amazing. Not one of these people seemed to understand her point until she beat them over the head with it.
8 | simoom Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:02:12pm |
According to the candidate's mythology, Romney took leave of his duties at the private equity firm Bain Capital in 1990 and rode in on a white horse to lead a swift restructuring of Bain & Company, preventing the collapse of the consulting firm where his career began. When The Boston Globe reported on the rescue at the time of his Senate run against Ted Kennedy, campaign aides spun Romney as the wizard behind a "long-shot miracle," bragging that he had "saved bank depositors all over the country $30 million when he saved Bain & Company."
In fact, government documents on the bailout obtained by Rolling Stone show that the legend crafted by Romney is basically a lie. The federal records, obtained under the Freedom of Information Act, reveal that Romney's initial rescue attempt at Bain & Company was actually a disaster – leaving the firm so financially strapped that it had "no value as a going concern." Even worse, the federal bailout ultimately engineered by Romney screwed the FDIC – the bank insurance system backed by taxpayers – out of at least $10 million. And in an added insult, Romney rewarded top executives at Bain with hefty bonuses at the very moment that he was demanding his handout from the feds.
...
Almost as soon as the FDIC agreed to the loan restructuring, however, Romney's rescue plan began to fall apart. "The company realized early on that it would be unable to hit its revenue targets or manage the debt structure," the documents reveal. By the spring of 1992, Bain's decline was perilous: "If Bain goes into default," one analyst warned the FDIC, "the bank group will need to decide whether to force Bain into bankruptcy."
With his rescue plan a bust, Romney was forced to slink back to the banks to negotiate a new round of debt relief. There was only one catch: Even though Bain & Company was deep in debt and sinking fast, the firm was actually flush with cash – most of it from the looted money that Bill Bain and other partners had given back. "Liquidity is strong based on the significant cash balance which Bain is carrying," one federal document reads.
Under normal circumstances, such ample reserves would have made liquidating Bain an attractive option: Creditors could simply divvy up the stockpiled cash and be done with the troubled firm. But Bain had inserted a poison pill in its loan agreement with the banks: Instead of being required to use its cash to pay back the firm's creditors, the money could be pocketed by Bain executives in the form of fat bonuses – starting with VPs making $200,000 and up. "The company can deplete its cash balances by making officer-bonus payments," the FDIC lamented, "and still be in compliance with the loan documents."
What's more, the bonus loophole gave Romney a perverse form of leverage: If the banks and the FDIC didn't give in to his demands and forgive much of Bain's debts, Romney would raid the firm's coffers, pushing it into the very bankruptcy that the loan agreement had been intended to avert. The losers in this game would not only be Bain's creditors – including the federal government – but the firm's nearly 1,000 employees worldwide.
In March 1992, according to the FDIC documents, Romney approached the banks and played the bonus card. Allow Bain to pay off its debt at a deep discount, he demanded – just 35 cents on the dollar. Otherwise, the "majority" of the firm's "excess cash" would "be available for the bonus pool to its officers at a vice president level and above."
I like how he blackmailed his creditors, including the federal gov't... 'Personal Responsibility!' ///
9 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:02:48pm |
re: #7 Charles Johnson
Quite amazing. Not one of these people seemed to understand her point until she beat them over the head with it.
thinking is elitist
10 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:02:57pm |
re: #8 simoom
I like how he blackmailed his creditors, including the federal gov't... 'Personal Responsibility!' ///
I built that.
11 | jaunte Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:05:12pm |
"But we're talking about freedom, not ladyparts!"
12 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:08:26pm |
Personal liberties do not apply to ladybits.
13 | wrenchwench Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:09:12pm |
It's up to each individual to decide who they're going to oppress. Because we are a free people.
14 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:11:22pm |
Last vehicle off the Janesville line -- banner reads "Dec 23, 2008" maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2012/08/...— Maddow Blog (@MaddowBlog) August 30, 2012
15 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:12:21pm |
re: #14 darthstar
BUT 0BUMMER HAD ALREADY BEEN ELECTED, CLEARLY GM WAS RESPONDING TO FORTHCOMING MARKET PRESSURE DUE TO THE ECONOMY THAT WOULD NOW CRASH BECAUSE THE DEMOCRAT PARTY WAS ABOUT TO DECONSTRUCT 'MURRICA!!!!1
16 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:12:46pm |
I gotta play Devil's advocate at this point and explain that to these people, foetuses have as many rights as the mother, even if that foetus is the result of rape or incest. That is so self-evident to them that they see no need to argue details and modalities.
Please note that I do not support this point of view, I am just pointing out the aspect of the argument that Ms Bee left out.
17 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:13:29pm |
re: #16 Expand Your Ground
I gotta play Devil's advodate at this point and explain that to these people, foetuses have as many rights as the mother
Absolutely false. To these people, a fetus has rights far in excess of those of the mother.
18 | Bulworth Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:14:27pm |
Also too gay people not allowed to be gay or marry or anything like that. Freedom=Slavery. /
19 | wrenchwench Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:14:36pm |
re: #16 Expand Your Ground
I gotta play Devil's advodate at this point and explain that to these people, foetuses have
as manymore rightsasthan the mother, even if that foetus is the result of rape or incest. That is so self-evident to them that they see no need to argue details and modalities.Please note that I do not support this point of view, I am just pointing out the aspect of the argument that Ms Bee left out.
You missed the essential point.
20 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:15:08pm |
re: #8 simoom
So Romney started the company with money from El Salvadorian families who funded death squads, and then he got a government bailout after he'd gotten the company into an unrecoverable position. Fucking awesome.
Make this guy president!
21 | dragonath Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:15:11pm |
That was one of the most depressing things I've seen on the Daily Show. The GOP lives on the critical mass of indifferent and morally ambiguous voters out there.
22 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:15:25pm |
Bush Administration Praised Closure Of Auto Plant That Ryan Now Blames On Obama
Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI) claimed during his convention speech Wednesday that President Obama is responsible for the closure of a GM plant in Janesville, Wisconsin. However, as many media outlets have noted, GM announced plans to close the plant in June ’08 — long before Obama was even elected — and it ceased major operations in December of that year.
For proof, just ask one of the more prominent supporters of the Janesville plant shutdown — the George W. Bush Administration. After all, the closure was part of a broader GM restructuring initiative that the then-President supported. White House Press Secretary Dana Perino even praised it as evidence of GM “adapting well:”
23 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:15:29pm |
re: #16 Expand Your Ground
I gotta play Devil's advodate at this point and explain that to these people, foetuses have as many rights as the mother, even if that foetus is the result of rape or incest. That is so self-evident to them that they see no need to argue details and modalities.
Please note that I do not support this point of view, I am just pointing out the aspect of the argument that Ms Bee left out.
That's pretty much mainstream Catholic doctrine. Once you understand that, all the other crap makes sense.
24 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:17:14pm |
re: #22 Kragar
As I tried to point out last night, this whole Janesville thing is even more ironic when one realizes that the head of the ticket, Mitt Romney, is praised for doing things exactly like what happened to that plant.
25 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:17:35pm |
Update on the Chris Mathews clip featured here a few days ago: Brzezinski: ‘Somewhere over the years, the news media got lost and forgot what news was’
“Morning Joe” got some negative publicity this week after guest Chris Matthews started a shouting match with Republican National Committee Chair Reince Priebus during a roundtable discussion on Monday’s show.
....
Brzezinksi and Scarborough said that Monday’s show “hit a pothole.”“Our strategy for discourse on the show is to have a civil one. … I think things went off the rails a little bit, and it wasn’t our best show. It’s live, it’s three hours a day, and sometimes we have a good show and sometimes we don’t have such a good show,” Brzezinksi said. “It’s very unpredictable, obviously, because we don’t use scripts and because everybody is speaking from the heart and off the top of their heads and there are obvious pitfalls with that.”
Scarborough said he was upset that “Morning Joe” “wasted five minutes of the audience’s time” during Matthews’ outburst by doing “absolutely nothing to illuminate the conversation.”
26 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:17:35pm |
GM slashes truck, SUV production as gasoline prices spike (3 Jun 2008)
CHICAGO (AFP) — General Motors predicted Tuesday that the era of the gasoline guzzlers is ending as it announced plans to close four North American truck and sports utility vehicle plants and ramp up production of new fuel-efficient vehicles.
...
The White House called the announcement a sign that the auto giant was "adapting well" to market shifts. "It's a sign that Detroit continues to adapt and evolve and address the change in consumer tastes and attitudes. And I think that they're adapting well," spokeswoman Dana Perino said.
...
GM plans to shutter production at its Toluca, Mexico, pickup truck at the end of the year and its Oshawa, Canada plant will be closed in 2009. Plants in Moraine, Ohio and Janesville, Wisconsin, are slated for closure in 2010 "or sooner if market demand dictates," GM said.
Why does George Bush's administration hate Paul Ryan's hometown!?
28 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:18:54pm |
re: #16 Expand Your Ground
It's not exactly playing "devil's advocate", as that is indeed the moral question. That's why, for all the humor, the Bee piece begs the actual moral question with an assumption of the non-rights of a fetus.
29 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:19:08pm |
re: #25 Killgore Trout
Yeah, it's the shouting that's the problem with the media, not that they don't actually call the lies lies.
That's the ticket. It's the shouting.
30 | aagcobb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:19:43pm |
re: #22 Kragar
Bush Administration Praised Closure Of Auto Plant That Ryan Now Blames On Obama
So I guess Ryan's problem with Obama is that he didn't fully nationalize GM and order them to keep the plant open? How else can you interpret his criticism?
31 | ShaunP Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:19:56pm |
re: #22 Kragar
Bush Administration Praised Closure Of Auto Plant That Ryan Now Blames On Obama
re: #26 erik_t
GM slashes truck, SUV production as gasoline prices spike (3 Jun 2008)
Why does George Bush's administration hate Paul Ryan's hometown!?
Stop it guys, seriously. You keep mentioning "he who must not be named" and people will be reminded when the recession actually started!
32 | Gus Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:20:15pm |
re: #22 Kragar
Bush Administration Praised Closure Of Auto Plant That Ryan Now Blames On Obama
Hahahaha!
33 | lawhawk Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:21:05pm |
re: #22 Kragar
The closure - a decision made by Rick Wagoner and GM honchos - was part of a plan designed to keep GM out of bankruptcy and following a first round of bailout funds authorized under the Bush Administration. It was meant to tide the company over until it could get on better financial terms. Eliminate excess capacity, cut costs, etc.
Wagoner failed, and the losses kept piling up.
Those cost-cutting efforts were insufficient, requiring a second round of bailout funds under Obama, which were also insufficient, forcing an expedited bankruptcy reorganization. Under that plan, it meant that some factories and dealerships would be shut down but the company would continue to function and hundreds of thousands of jobs down the supply chain would be preserved.
34 | HappyBenghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:21:19pm |
re: #22 Kragar
Bush Administration Praised Closure Of Auto Plant That Ryan Now Blames On Obama
STOP BLAMING BUSH!!
Oh wait. Haha.
35 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:21:20pm |
re: #25 Killgore Trout
Update on the Chris Mathews clip featured here a few days ago: Brzezinski: ‘Somewhere over the years, the news media got lost and forgot what news was’
That segment was the only worthwhile thing to come out of Morning Joe since, well, maybe ever.
36 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:22:19pm |
re: #29 Obdicut
Yeah, it's the shouting that's the problem with the media, not that they don't actually call the lies lies.
That's the ticket. It's the shouting.
I didn't watch the clip because I find Mathews to be an embarrassing buffoon but the shows' hosts didn't seem to appreciate his outburst. It was a big hit with the moonbats though.
37 | jaunte Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:22:27pm |
New York Times: Fact Checkers Run out of Words Trying to Describe All of Paul Ryan's Liesnyti.ms/Ue9cNh #LyinRyan #GOP2012
— Christopher Marlowe (@MarlowesFaustus) August 30, 2012
38 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:22:35pm |
re: #16 Expand Your Ground
I gotta play Devil's advocate at this point and explain that to these people, foetuses have as many rights as the mother, even if that foetus is the result of rape or incest. That is so self-evident to them that they see no need to argue details and modalities.
Please note that I do not support this point of view, I am just pointing out the aspect of the argument that Ms Bee left out.
Bunch of hypocritical assholes. They think a fetus has more rights than the mother, but they want to cut any kind of assistance for that child to be fed and housed and educated once he/she is born. I don't give a rat's ass what they "think" about fetuses because they have clearly shown that they are hypocritical idiots of the highest magnitude and therefore should be shunned.
39 | Interesting Times in Benghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:22:54pm |
Breath of Fresh Air break:
Looking forward to joining Jon Stewart on @thedailyshow from #DNC2012 in #Charlotte next Weds. Hope you'll watch!— Kirsten Gillibrand (@SenGillibrand) August 30, 2012
Doesn't look like she has a direct speaking role at the DNC, which is too bad. She's probably one of the most productive, under-rated Senators in power today.
40 | mr.fusion Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:23:03pm |
Health Care Reform based on existing structure of private insurers = bureaucrat getting between me and my doctor
Government forcing women to carry their rapists child to term regardless of what she or her doctor says = freedom
41 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:24:31pm |
Matthews’ outburst
guilty of attempting to call a liar to account
42 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:24:34pm |
Romney Campaign Chair: Same-Sex Marriage Too ‘Complicated’ To Discuss
Smarmy Romney campaign chair John Sununu sat down for a radio interview with Michelangelo Signorile yesterday, but was apparently unprepared to discuss the Republican Party’s platform. When he was informed that it called for a constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriage — which Mitt Romney supports — Sununu was at a loss for words, explaining the issue is “much more complicated” than a “two-sentence” answer could encompass. Instead, he offered to share two cases of beer and talk about it in a different setting, presumably not while being recorded.
Apparently everything in the Romney campaign is too complicated to discuss.
43 | jaunte Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:24:37pm |
re: #36 Killgore Trout
It should have been embarrassing to the Morning Joe hosts that someone else had to point out the obvious race-baiting.
44 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:25:26pm |
re: #14 darthstar
Last vehicle off the Janesville line -- banner reads "Dec 23, 2008" maddowblog.msnbc.com/_news/2012/08/…
[Embedded content]
My heat map has detected layers all over that banner.
45 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:25:46pm |
re: #36 Killgore Trout
I didn't watch the clip because I find Mathews to be an embarrassing buffoon but the shows' hosts didn't seem to appreciate his outburst. It was a big hit with the moonbats though.
I don't like Chris Matthews at all, but he was right on the money with skewering Priebus. You really should watch the clip.
46 | Interesting Times in Benghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:26:07pm |
RNC Drinking Game:1. Hear "Job Creator," take a shot.2. Get drunk.3. Throw remote at TV.4. Buy replacement TV.5. Economy stimulated.— Joel Ingersoll (@FlyoverJoel) August 30, 2012
47 | HappyBenghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:26:19pm |
re: #42 Kragar
Romney Campaign Chair: Same-Sex Marriage Too ‘Complicated’ To Discuss
Apparently everything in the Romney campaign is too complicated to discuss.
Too complicated? At least the segregationists made their bigoted intentions clear.
48 | A Mom Anon Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:27:02pm |
re: #25 Killgore Trout
Yep,that horrible liberal show Morning Joe(on that horrible evil liberal MSNBC) did nothing at all to lift the public discourse. Sigh. There's not a damned thing wrong with calling a liar a liar or a race-baiting ass a race-baiting ass. Sometimes those discussions aren't nice,polite and pretty,in fact,neither is Democracy. Bullies and liars don't stop because you ask nice. Good Lord.
49 | dragonath Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:27:04pm |
re: #25 Killgore Trout
Update on the Chris Mathews clip featured here a few days ago: Brzezinski: ‘Somewhere over the years, the news media got lost and forgot what news was’
You're so concerned about the media, you linked to Breitbart a couple of days ago.
50 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:28:08pm |
re: #45 Sionainn
I don't like Chris Matthews at all, but he was right on the money with skewering Priebus. You really should watch the clip.
I watched a video of Mathews eating a sandwich at the convention so I'm already over my quota of Mathews videos this week. He was really enjoying that sandwich.
51 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:28:28pm |
re: #42 Kragar
Romney Campaign Chair: Same-Sex Marriage Too ‘Complicated’ To Discuss
Apparently everything in the Romney campaign is too complicated to discuss.
Of all the goddamned things. You cowards. This is literally a yes-or-no question.
52 | wrenchwench Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:29:04pm |
re: #42 Kragar
Romney Campaign Chair: Same-Sex Marriage Too ‘Complicated’ To Discuss
Apparently everything in the Romney campaign is too complicated to discuss.
Wasn't too complicated for Dick Cheney. He did it in one sentence:
Freedom is for everyone.
53 | Mattand Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:29:21pm |
re: #36 Killgore Trout
I didn't watch the clip because I find Mathews to be an embarrassing buffoon but the shows' hosts didn't seem to appreciate his outburst. It was a big hit with the moonbats though.
I'm beginning to see the genesis of your "birthers aren't racists" theory from yesterday.
54 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:30:11pm |
re: #25 Killgore Trout
Update on the Chris Mathews clip featured here a few days ago: Brzezinski: ‘Somewhere over the years, the news media got lost and forgot what news was’
If you didn't watch the clip, why are you so concerned about it now?
55 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:30:19pm |
re: #49 dragonath
You're so concerned about the media, you linked to Breitbart a couple of days ago.
Yes, and what you and the rest of the brain damaged idiots downdinged it to hell. It was an article seething butthurt about the fact checkers for actually checking facts.
56 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:31:02pm |
#RNC slogan should be We Killed It.— helen(@liberalchik) August 30, 2012
57 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:31:51pm |
58 | wrenchwench Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:32:06pm |
re: #55 Killgore Trout
Yes, and what you and the rest of the brain damaged idiots downdinged it to hell. It was an article seething butthurt about the fact checkers for actually checking facts.
I'm already over my quota for Killgore comments for this week.
59 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:32:41pm |
re: #53 Mattand
I'm beginning to see the genesis of your "birthers aren't racists" theory from yesterday.
Yeah, people like Chris Mathews have just overused the racism accusation to the point of absurdity. Birtherism is stupid on its own and gilding the lilly with the accusation of racism just clouds the issue. There's plenty of real racism and overusing the accusation only provides cover for the racists.
60 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:33:17pm |
re: #54 Sionainn
If you didn't watch the clip, why are you so concerned about it now?
It was featured here, I thought people might want to see the update.
62 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:34:00pm |
re: #58 wrenchwench
I'm already over my quota for Killgore comments for this week.
Did someone say something about "seething butthurt"?
63 | jaunte Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:34:26pm |
re: #59 Killgore Trout
You have that backward. Birtherism is the superficial manifestation; it's racism at the core.
64 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:34:34pm |
re: #60 Killgore Trout
It was featured here, I thought people might want to see the update.
Update? Puhlease.
65 | Big Steve Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:34:45pm |
re: #49 dragonath
You're so concerned about the media, you linked to Breitbart a couple of days ago.
I have noticed people here readily link to the Daily Kos......which some of us oldsters around here just find surreal.
66 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:34:51pm |
re: #36 Killgore Trout
I didn't watch the clip because I find Mathews to be an embarrassing buffoon but the shows' hosts didn't seem to appreciate his outburst. It was a big hit with the moonbats though.
I don't think you responded to what I said in my post, but kind of made up something else to respond to.
I'm pointing out that complaining about Matthew's outburst is rather weird and finicky when the massive problems with the mainstream media are so overwhelming. The media does barely any real investigation, pretends that facts are something to be judged in a scale, engage in the really fundamentally stupid position that the truth usually lies somewhere in the middle, allowing extremists to create a false sense of reality.
There are many things going on in the US these days that are worth shouting about. Matthews is getting it right on this point, even if he's delivering it in a less-than-classy manner. Concern with form over function is foolish.
67 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:35:37pm |
re: #60 Killgore Trout
It was featured here, I thought people might want to see the update.
Thank you for your concern.
68 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:35:45pm |
re: #65 Big Steve
I have noticed people here readily link to the Daily Kos......which some of us oldsters around here just find surreal.
We've evolved.
69 | Interesting Times in Benghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:35:58pm |
Reposting because some people could really benefit from the reminder:
"Trolling is a form of mental illness." Why doesn't that surprise me? bit.ly/PrMuxU— Roger Ebert (@ebertchicago) August 29, 2012
70 | gwangung Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:36:18pm |
re: #55 Killgore Trout
Yes, and what you and the rest of the brain damaged idiots downdinged it to hell. It was an article seething butthurt about the fact checkers for actually checking facts.
This is rich, coming from someone who thinks CEO/Managing Director doesn't mean what it says it does.
71 | wrenchwench Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:36:19pm |
re: #65 Big Steve
I have noticed people here readily link to the Daily Kos......which some of us oldsters around here just find surreal.
Others of us, not so much.
72 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:36:32pm |
re: #59 Killgore Trout
Yeah, people like Chris Mathews have just overused the racism accusation to the point of absurdity. Birtherism is stupid on its own and gilding the lilly with the accusation of racism just clouds the issue. There's plenty of real racism and overusing the accusation only provides cover for the racists.
Curiously, no other presidential candidate in my lifetime has been subjected to inane citizenship questions and accusations for literally years after he provided proof of legitimacy.
I wonder, just wonder, why the fuck that might be.
73 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:36:39pm |
re: #59 Killgore Trout
Yeah, people like Chris Mathews have just overused the racism accusation to the point of absurdity. Birtherism is stupid on its own and gilding the lilly with the accusation of racism just clouds the issue.
Can you explain the thought process that leads you to believe that birtherism-- the belief that the Kenyan-fathered, half-black half-white Barack Obama was not really born in Hawaii (despite no reason, indication, or evidence that he was born elsewhere)-- is not rooted in racism?
Specifically, why has this never come up with any other US-born Democratic candidate before?
74 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:36:51pm |
re: #65 Big Steve
I have noticed people here readily link to the Daily Kos......which some of us oldsters around here just find surreal.
I don't see a lot of that. Many more links these days go to TPM from what I can tell.
75 | allegro Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:37:08pm |
re: #66 Obdicut
There are many things going on in the US these days that are worth shouting about. Matthews is getting it right on this point, even if he's delivering it in a less-than-classy manner. Concern with form over function is foolish.
Maybe it's just me, but I find the blatant lies and reprehensible racism to be distinctly uncivil. Raising one's voice when pointing that out is considerably less so.
76 | dragonath Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:37:12pm |
re: #55 Killgore Trout
Yes, and what you and the rest of the brain damaged idiots downdinged it to hell. It was an article seething butthurt about the fact checkers for actually checking facts.
Huh what? I didn't personally ding it but are you seriously calling Charles a "brain damaged idiot"?
Feel free to indulge in your false equivalencies between honest criticism and Breitbartian fantasy though.
77 | Gus Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:37:12pm |
Angry white guy bemoans lack of angry white guys in Republican Party bit.ly/Ov8XLh— Daily Kos (@dailykos) August 30, 2012
78 | Big Steve Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:38:25pm |
79 | wrenchwench Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:39:31pm |
re: #75 allegro
Maybe it's just me, but I find the blatant lies and reprehensible racism to be distinctly uncivil. Raising one's voice when pointing that out is considerably less so.
This. A million times.
80 | Mattand Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:39:33pm |
re: #59 Killgore Trout
Yeah, people like Chris Mathews have just overused the racism accusation to the point of absurdity. Birtherism is stupid on its own and gilding the lilly with the accusation of racism just clouds the issue. There's plenty of real racism and overusing the accusation only provides cover for the racists.
Wrong.
Birthers are driven by the fact a black guy with a Muslim sounding name is President of the US. To deny that is to deny reality.
How can you seriously sit there and pretend the President's race has nothing to do with people accusing him of not being born here? It's absurd.
Your reasoning sounds like "Chris Matthews was mean to Reince Preibus, therefore birtherism has nothing to do with racism."
81 | gwangung Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:39:47pm |
re: #59 Killgore Trout
Yeah, people like Chris Mathews have just overused the racism accusation to the point of absurdity. Birtherism is stupid on its own and gilding the lilly with the accusation of racism just clouds the issue. There's plenty of real racism and overusing the accusation only provides cover for the racists.
This is an intellectually lazy argument that ignores the clear links between birtherism and racism.
And I note that you've never clearly articulated why you think birtherism has no link to racism.
And from someone who is a target of racism, I find your use of "real" racism to be insulting. YOU DO NOT GET TO DEFINE WHAT'S REAL RACISM.
82 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:40:44pm |
re: #26 erik_t
GM slashes truck, SUV production as gasoline prices spike (3 Jun 2008)
Why does George Bush's administration hate Paul Ryan's hometown!?
Blame it on high gas prices that GM made bad decisions about what sort of vehicles to produce in the first place. And blame it on the President that gas prices are so high...
People will still buy these arguments, you know, they see cheap gas as some sort of birthright.
83 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:40:48pm |
well i'll point out that charles has linked directly to fox news:
Deceiving
On the other hand, to anyone paying the slightest bit of attention to facts, Ryan’s speech was an apparent attempt to set the world record for the greatest number of blatant lies and misrepresentations slipped into a single political speech. On this measure, while it was Romney who ran the Olympics, Ryan earned the gold.
The good news is that the Romney-Ryan campaign has likely created dozens of new jobs among the legions of additional fact checkers that media outlets are rushing to hire to sift through the mountain of cow dung that flowed from Ryan’s mouth. Said fact checkers have already condemned certain arguments that Ryan still irresponsibly repeated.
Fact: While Ryan tried to pin the downgrade of the United States’ credit rating on spending under President Obama, the credit rating was actually downgraded because Republicans threatened not to raise the debt ceiling.
Fact: While Ryan blamed President Obama for the shut down of a GM plant in Janesville, Wisconsin, the plant was actually closed under President George W. Bush. Ryan actually asked for federal spending to save the plant, while Romney has criticized the auto industry bailout that President Obama ultimately enacted to prevent other plants from closing.
Fact: Though Ryan insisted that President Obama wants to give all the credit for private sector success to government, that isn't what the president said. Period.
Fact: Though Paul Ryan accused President Obama of taking $716 billion out of Medicare, the fact is that that amount was savings in Medicare reimbursement rates (which, incidentally, save Medicare recipients out-of-pocket costs, too) and Ryan himself embraced these savings in his budget plan.
Elections should be about competing based on your record in the past and your vision for the future, not competing to see who can get away with the most lies and distortions without voters noticing or bother to care. Both parties should hold themselves to that standard. Republicans should be ashamed that there was even one misrepresentation in Ryan’s speech but sadly, there were many.
Read more: [Link: www.foxnews.com...]
fair and balanced!
84 | allegro Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:42:06pm |
re: #81 gwangung
YOU DO NOT GET TO DEFINE WHAT'S REAL RACISM.
Kinda like legitimate rape? I'm seeing a trend here...
85 | aagcobb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:42:17pm |
re: #73 Obdicut
Can you explain the thought process that leads you to believe that birtherism-- the belief that the Kenyan-fathered, half-black half-white Barack Obama was not really born in Hawaii (despite no reason, indication, or evidence that he was born elsewhere)-- is not rooted in racism?
Specifically, why has this never come up with any other US-born Democratic candidate before?
Heck why didn't birthers get bent out of shape about the GOP candidate in 2008 WHO REALLY WAS BORN OUTSIDE THE U.S.?
86 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:43:52pm |
birtherism without racism is like racism without racism
87 | HappyBenghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:44:11pm |
re: #85 aagcobb
Heck why didn't birthers get bent out of shape about the GOP candidate in 2008 WHO REALLY WAS BORN OUTSIDE THE U.S.?
Because his father wasn't Kenyan. And I remember Obama as Senator sponsoring a bill that would allow children of parents born on military bases outside the US like McCain to be guaranteed the same birth right citizenship rights as a child born in the US. OF course the wing-nuts I knew claimed he was doing that to detract attention from his own nationality. Guy can't win with them.
88 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:44:22pm |
@mittromney sees this as an acquisition, not an election.His goal is to attain the office of the presidency.Not win an election. #p2— Sean McCabe (@darthstar99) August 30, 2012
89 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:44:26pm |
...also I think Joe Scarborough is being a hypocrite. To have someone like Mathews on and then complain that he does something embarrassing is disingenuous. It's what he does. Also Scarborough is talking like he wants to do some sort of serious intellectual show but he's on the left wing version of Fox. If he wants to do a serious show he can go to PBS and accept the smaller PBS audience that more serious news provides along the the smaller paycheck.
90 | Vicious Babushka Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:45:34pm |
re: #87 HappyWarrior
Because his father wasn't A BLACK, BLACKY BLACKETY BLACK Kenyan.
91 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:45:45pm |
re: #89 Killgore Trout
It is fucking amazing to me that you use Joe Scarborough, a conservative, former Republican with a significant time slot on MSNBC, in an example and then can blithely go on to refer to it as the lefty version of Fox.
You have got a really sad addiction to false equivalence. It's really embarrassing.
92 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:45:52pm |
re: #88 darthstar
Then he can start selling off parts to keep his investors happy.
93 | allegro Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:45:56pm |
re: #89 Killgore Trout
...also I think Joe Scarborough is being a hypocrite. To have someone like Mathews on and then complain that he does something embarrassing is disingenuous. It's what he does. Also Scarborough is talking like he wants to do some sort of serious intellectual show but he's on the left wing version of Fox. If he wants to do a serious show he can go to PBS and accept the smaller PBS audience that more serious news provides along the the smaller paycheck.
If MSNBC was a left wing version of Fox, Scarborough wouldn't have a three hour show, 5 days a week there.
94 | leftynyc Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:46:01pm |
re: #55 Killgore Trout
Didn't downding you for that but will for this. You argue just like your pals on the right. Matthews was calling out racism and was right on the money - sometimes the truth hurts.
95 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:47:14pm |
Joe Scarborough had a dead woman found in his office when he was in congress. Just sayin'...
96 | Mattand Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:47:38pm |
re: #89 Killgore Trout
...also I think Joe Scarborough is being a hypocrite. To have someone like Mathews on and then complain that he does something embarrassing is disingenuous. It's what he does. Also Scarborough is talking like he wants to do some sort of serious intellectual show but he's on the left wing version of Fox. If he wants to do a serious show he can go to PBS and accept the smaller PBS audience that more serious news provides along the the smaller paycheck.
97 | ShaunP Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:48:17pm |
re: #59 Killgore Trout
Yeah, people like Chris Mathews have just overused the racism accusation to the point of absurdity. Birtherism is stupid on its own and gilding the lilly with the accusation of racism just clouds the issue. There's plenty of real racism and overusing the accusation only provides cover for the racists.
I don’t believe that there is any word that needs to be suppressed. There is no scientific or realistic reason why you should keep people from hearing certain words.
98 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:48:55pm |
re: #95 darthstar
Joe Scarborough had a dead woman found in his office when he was in congress. Just sayin'...
As I recall it was within a day or two of 9-11 which totally bumped it out of the news.
99 | bratwurst Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:48:58pm |
re: #94 leftynyc
Didn't downding you for that but will for this.
So you are not a "brain damaged idiot"!
Um, unless downdinging him for this ALSO makes you a "brain damaged idiot", of course.
100 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:50:24pm |
Pretty cool. Brick machine rolls out roads like carpet.
101 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:50:36pm |
re: #98 Killgore Trout
On July 20, 2001, one of Scarborough's aides died after hitting her head on a desk when she fainted while alone in Scarborough's Fort Walton Beach, Florida, office.[23] According to Scarborough, soon after her death, allegations "spread all over the Internet" that he had been involved,[23][24] although there was no evidence of foul play. In 2003, he joked about the incident with Don Imus on Imus's radio program.[25] In 2004, it was the subject of a public spat between Scarborough and filmmaker Michael Moore.[26]
102 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:52:24pm |
re: #98 Killgore Trout
As I recall is was within a day or two of 9-11 which totally bumped it out of the news.
Friday, July 20th"FORT WALTON BEACH, FL. - Lori Klausutis, a 28-year-old office worker for Rep. Joe Scarborough (R-Fl), was found dead in the congressman's district office. Police said preliminary findings from the medical examiner's office showed no foul play or any outward indication of suicide."
103 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:52:25pm |
re: #86 engineer cat
birtherism without racism is like racism without racism
Can agree about 95% on that, but I can also envision people so cynical, so devoted to their interests, class and cause that they will just use it because it's there. I have no proof that Limbaugh, for instance, is a racist or even a conservative. He might be much worse.
104 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:52:58pm |
Kurt Vonnnegut's domestic contract...fun read.
[Link: www.openculture.com...]
105 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:53:39pm |
UAW says Ryan repeatedly voted against extending unemployment benefits to laid off Janesville GM workers bit.ly/RuWoSX #1u— Mike Elk (@MikeElk) August 30, 2012
106 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:53:43pm |
A well-known Catholic priest who hosts a weekly religious television show said in an interview this week that child sex abusers are often seduced by teenage boys and should not go to jail on a first offense.
...
The Rev. Benedict Groeschel: "At this point, (when) any priest, any clergyman, any social worker, any teacher, any responsible person in society would become involved in a single sexual act -- not necessarily intercourse -- they're done. And I'm inclined to think, on their first offense, they should not go to jail because their intention was not committing a crime."
Of course the guy also defends Sandusky, because obviously.
Keep digging, Rome.
107 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:53:43pm |
108 | leftynyc Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:53:59pm |
re: #99 bratwurst
So you are not a "brain damaged idiot"!
Um, unless downdinging him for this ALSO makes you a "brain damaged idiot", of course.
Wish I had downdinged him then - I would have been in excellent company.
109 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:54:44pm |
re: #103 Decatur Deb
Can agree about 95% on that, but I can also envision people so cynical, so devoted to their interests, class and cause that they will just use it because it's there. I have no proof that Limbaugh, for instance, is a racist or even a conservative. He might be much worse.
Attacking people for their race, whether you believe in your heart that they're inferior or believe in your brain that you stand to gain for it, is racism.
111 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:55:45pm |
re: #104 darthstar
Kurt Vonnnegut's domestic contract...fun read.
[Link: www.openculture.com...]
Why do you hate union bricklayers!?!?
/
WRONG POST!!
112 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:56:20pm |
re: #106 erik_t
Of course the guy also defends Sandusky, because obviously.
Keep digging, Rome.
I hope that investigators are looking very closely at him.
113 | allegro Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:56:20pm |
re: #106 erik_t
A well-known Catholic priest who hosts a weekly religious television show said in an interview this week that child sex abusers are often seduced by teenage boys and should not go to jail on a first offense.
Yeah, those pimple-faced pubescent cuties with their seductive ways are a danger to priests everywhere. What the actual fuck, indeed. These guys are some pieces of work.
114 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:56:21pm |
re: #103 Decatur Deb
Can agree about 95% on that, but I can also envision people so cynical, so devoted to their interests, class and cause that they will just use it because it's there. I have no proof that Limbaugh, for instance, is a racist or even a conservative. He might be much worse.
Yeah. But the reason it started, and caught on, and spread, is entirely rooted in racism and xenophobia.
The reason it's cossetted along by Romney et al. is because it's politically useful in appealing to the white GOP base-- in other words, their usage of it is also racist. So, it's a nice double-racist whammy.
115 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:57:12pm |
116 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:57:33pm |
re: #100 darthstar
Pretty cool. Brick machine rolls out roads like carpet.
Why do you hate union bricklayers!?!?
(I need a nap)
117 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:57:59pm |
re: #116 sattv4u2
Why do you hate union bricklayers!?!?
(I need a nap)
I was waiting for you to catch that.
118 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:58:19pm |
re: #109 erik_t
Attacking people for their race, whether you believe in your heart that they're inferior or believe in your brain that you stand to gain for it, is racism.
You are too forgiving. In my book it's a kind of treason. I can find a few invincibly ignorant racists on a five minute walk.
119 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:58:52pm |
re: #117 darthstar
I was waiting for you to catch that.
heh
I blame the dogs,,, it's 3 minutes before dinner and,, well, ,THEY KNOW!!!
120 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 12:59:45pm |
re: #73 Obdicut
Can you explain the thought process that leads you to believe that birtherism-- the belief that the Kenyan-fathered, half-black half-white Barack Obama was not really born in Hawaii (despite no reason, indication, or evidence that he was born elsewhere)-- is not rooted in racism?
Specifically, why has this never come up with any other US-born Democratic candidate before?
I simply see them as arising from the same wellspring of ignorance and bigotry that leads to racism.
121 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:00:12pm |
I hope Clint Eastwood talks about gay marriage and the GM bailout, though it would actually help the GOP if he changed the tone of their convention by calling on them to pull their heads out of their asses and stop being so ignorant.
122 | Gus Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:00:12pm |
re: #59 Killgore Trout
Yeah, people like Chris Mathews have just overused the racism accusation to the point of absurdity. Birtherism is stupid on its own and gilding the lilly with the accusation of racism just clouds the issue. There's plenty of real racism and overusing the accusation only provides cover for the racists.
Hey KT. Why don't you go make your case to ABL.
I cried the day PBO released his birth certificate. I know other black ppl did too. So I cordially invite Mitt Romney to go fuck himself.— Imani ABL (@AngryBlackLady) August 24, 2012
123 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:00:30pm |
124 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:01:26pm |
re: #106 erik_t
Of course the guy also defends Sandusky, because obviously.
Keep digging, Rome.
I think this falls under "legitimate statutory rape"....
125 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:01:27pm |
re: #119 sattv4u2
heh
I blame the dogs,,, it's 3 minutes before dinner and,, well, ,THEY KNOW!!!
Dogs...I've got two extras today (babysitting for my brother)...about pulled my shoulder out on the way to the beach this morning.
Image: 557362_10151152731058024_1157070420_n.jpg
Image: 260544_10151152847608024_1921274816_n.jpg
126 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:01:39pm |
re: #122 Gus
Hey KT. Why don't you go make your case to ABL.
[Embedded content]
She's perfectly entitled to her own opinion.
127 | lawhawk Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:02:17pm |
Heh - 7 things that are inarguably true in Ryan's speech.
"There she is — my Mom, Betty."
Fact-check: True. Paul Ryan's mom was there.
"My Dad, a small-town lawyer, was also named Paul."
Fact-check: True. Paul Ryan's father was named Paul.
"I live on the same block where I grew up."
Fact-check: True. Ryan still lives on the same block where he grew up.
"President Barack Obama came to office during an economic crisis."
Fact-check: True. President Obama came to office during an economic crisis.
"My home state voted for President Obama."
Fact-check: True. Obama carried Wisconsin in 2008.
"My wonderful grandma, Janet, had Alzheimer's and moved in with Mom and me."
Fact-check: True. Ryan's grandmother moved in with him and his mother.
"[President Obama] created a bipartisan debt commission."
Fact-check: True. President Obama created a bipartisan debt commission.
"Mom was 50 when my Dad died."
Fact-check: True. Ryan's mother was 50 years old when his father died.
"Mitt and I also go to different churches."
Fact-check: True. Ryan is Catholic, while Romney is a Mormon.
You see, a much shorter list of stuff he didn't lie, misrepresent, obfuscate, or exaggerate about.
128 | Vicious Babushka Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:02:23pm |
During Clint Eastwood's #RNC speech tonight, remember how mad the right-wing was at him for the Halftime in America commercial. #p2— Bachmann's Brain (@BachmannsBrain) August 30, 2012
129 | Gus Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:02:34pm |
re: #126 Killgore Trout
She's perfectly entitled to her own opinion.
Yes, and you're entitled to your privilege.
130 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:02:34pm |
re: #126 Killgore Trout
She's perfectly entitled to her own opinion.
as long as she keeps it to herself.
131 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:02:48pm |
re: #126 Killgore Trout
She's perfectly entitled to her own opinion.
You haven't actually explained your position, though. You haven't explained the thought process that leads you to believe that birtherism-- the belief that the Kenyan-fathered, half-black half-white Barack Obama was not really born in Hawaii (despite no reason, indication, or evidence that he was born elsewhere)-- is not rooted in racism.
Could you explain?
132 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:02:51pm |
re: #125 darthstar
Dogs...I've got two extras today (babysitting for my brother)...about pulled my shoulder out on the way to the beach this morning.
Image: 557362_10151152731058024_1157070420_n.jpg
Image: 260544_10151152847608024_1921274816_n.jpg
Looks as if thats officially "his" frisbee, huh?
133 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:03:07pm |
re: #126 Killgore Trout
She's perfectly entitled to her own opinion.
So why is Obama the only presidential candidate in modern times to face substantial doubt about his citizenship, if not racism?
I mean, I'm concerned you don't have a backup theory here.
134 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:03:46pm |
re: #130 darthstar
and I won;'t get downdinged as long as I agree with it!
135 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:04:20pm |
re: #132 sattv4u2
Looks as if thats officially "his" frisbee, huh?
Yep...nobody plays with Banjo's frisbee but Banjo.
Here's a good shot of my brother's dogs running through the water...not bad for a phone pic.
136 | Gus Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:04:26pm |
Black people crying because people were demanding to see Obama's birth certificate is an "opinion."
That just cracks me up.
137 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:04:41pm |
re: #135 darthstar
Yep...nobody plays with Banjo's frisbee but Banjo.
Here's a good shot of my brother's dogs running through the water...not bad for a phone pic.
nice!
138 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:05:13pm |
re: #127 lawhawk
Heh - 7 things that are inarguably true in Ryan's speech.
You see, a much shorter list of stuff he didn't lie, misrepresent, obfuscate, or exaggerate about.
Gives him a lifetime score of "mostly true' on Politifact.
139 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:05:37pm |
Wasserman Schultz Responds To Huckabee's Zinger: 'He's Irrelevant'livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/wasserma... via @tomkludt— Josh Marshall (@joshtpm) August 30, 2012
140 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:05:39pm |
I still haven't seen Mitt's birth certificate. How can we really be sure he's a natural born citizen and not actually from Mexico?
141 | Mattand Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:05:50pm |
re: #120 Expand Your Ground
I simply see them as arising from the same wellspring of ignorance and bigotry that leads to racism.
I really don't get why people are taking this stance.
Birthers are working to somehow get Obama out of office because of his skin color. Not because of his preference of socks, or favorite baseball team, or what toothpaste he uses.
Pretending it's not racism just digs the race relations hole this country has been standing in for two plus centuries that much deeper.
142 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:06:11pm |
re: #140 Kragar
I still haven't seen Mitt's birth certificate. How can we really be sure he's a natural born citizen and not actually from Mexico?
I can tell from the high-RGB-valued pixels.
143 | gwangung Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:07:53pm |
re: #126 Killgore Trout
She's perfectly entitled to her own opinion.
And you're entitled to yours.
And we're entitled to mock your lame defense of it.
144 | Gus Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:08:48pm |
I tell you what. When Imani posted that Tweet it made me cry. To consider that just an "opinion" is beyond absurd.
145 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:09:05pm |
re: #143 gwangung
And you're entitled to yours.
And we're entitled to mock your defense of it.
"mocking" is always such a useful debate technique!
(damn!!)
146 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:10:14pm |
re: #145 sattv4u2
"mocking" is always such a useful debate technique!
Almost as good as passive-aggressiveness!
147 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:10:33pm |
re: #144 Gus
The amount of patriotism that black Americans have is amazing, given the history and the continuing legal and social racism directed at them.
148 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:10:51pm |
re: #140 Kragar
I still haven't seen Mitt's birth certificate. How can we really be sure he's a natural born citizen and not actually from Mexico?
Anti-Mormonist!
149 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:11:08pm |
Excuse me while I bash my head into a wall;
Yahoo's online poll of the day
Whose campaign seems to be fudging more facts?
Barack Obama's 56%
Mitt Romney's 44%
150 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:11:10pm |
re: #141 Mattand
I really don't get why people are taking this stance.
Birthers are working to somehow get Obama out of office because of his skin color. Not because of his preference of socks, or favorite baseball team, or what toothpaste he uses.
Pretending it's not racism just digs the race relations hole this country has been standing in for two plus centuries that much deeper.
There are people on Dick Morris' bus route who don't give a shit about Obama's race. They despise a white garbage tipper as much as they despise a black schoolteacher. The President is their enemy and they want him gone, and will use any tool to do it.
151 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:11:17pm |
152 | Gus Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:11:50pm |
re: #149 Kragar
Excuse me while I bash my head into a wall;
Yahoo's online poll of the day
Whose campaign seems to be fudging more facts?
Barack Obama's 56%
Mitt Romney's 44%
Yahoo. Online poll. Meh.
153 | aagcobb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:12:05pm |
re: #113 allegro
Yeah, those pimple-faced pubescent cuties with their seductive ways are a danger to priests everywhere. What the actual fuck, indeed. These guys are some pieces of work.
That could be an Onion article. In fact, it was an Onion article (not this one specifically, but a story expressing the same sentiment).
154 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:12:09pm |
re: #151 sattv4u2
Or stealth downdinging!!
I downding stupid comments. I can't help the fact that many of yours happen to qualify for that distinction.
155 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:12:23pm |
156 | HappyBenghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:12:34pm |
re: #149 Kragar
Excuse me while I bash my head into a wall;
Yahoo's online poll of the day
Whose campaign seems to be fudging more facts?
Barack Obama's 56%
Mitt Romney's 44%
online polls are pretty much whoever side gets to it first.
157 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:13:01pm |
re: #148 Killgore Trout
Anti-Mormonist!
Yep. If Birtherism had begun as a conspiracy theory about Mitt Romney's birth location given his Mormon family's history in Mexico, it'd probably be rooted in anti-Mormonism.
Just as the real Birtherism, the conspiracy theory about Barack Obama's birth location, is rooted in anti-black prejudice.
158 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:13:35pm |
Romney on TV right now making sure the teleprompters are the right height.
159 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:14:41pm |
re: #156 HappyWarrior
online polls are pretty much whoever side gets to it first.
Trying to take anything out of Yahoo stories/polls is an exercise in futility. One day, the popular comments will be full of outright racists. The next day, it will be Ron Paul fanatics, the day after that left-wing nuts.
160 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:14:48pm |
Not unrelated to the whole racism and birtherism issues:
Scientists reconstruct genetic makeup of 50,000-year-old girl
Scientists have reconstructed the entire genetic makeup of a girl who lived and died in a Siberian cave more than 50,000 years ago. The young woman belonged to an ancient and long extinct group of humans called Denisovans, their existence known only from meagre fossil remains uncovered at the Denisova cave in the Altai mountains in 2008. These ancient relatives are thought to have occupied much of Asia tens of thousands of years ago. Previous tests on the remains found they were more closely related to Neanderthals than modern humans.
Writing in the journal Science, researchers in the US and Germany describe how they sequenced the girl's genome with an accuracy that was once considered impossible with such ancient specimens. The final sequence matched the quality of modern genetic tests on living people.
[...]
Paper is here:
A High-Coverage Genome Sequence from an Archaic Denisovan Individual
We present a DNA library preparation method that has allowed us to reconstruct a high-coverage (30X) genome sequence of a Denisovan, an extinct relative of Neandertals. The quality of this genome allows a direct estimation of Denisovan heterozygosity, indicating that genetic diversity in these archaic hominins was extremely low. It also allows tentative dating of the specimen on the basis of “missing evolution” in its genome, detailed measurements of Denisovan and Neandertal admixture into present-day human populations, and the generation of a near-complete catalog of genetic changes that swept to high frequency in modern humans since their divergence from Denisovans.
Some important observations:
Archaic Human DNA Reveals its Secrets
[...]
Among the study results, the researchers found that the Denisovans share more genes with individuals from Papua New Guinea than any other population, and that more Denisovan alleles were common with those of Asian and South American populations than European populations. The study authors suggest that the latter reflects interbreeding between modern humans and the Neandertals, who are also related to Neanderthals, rather than direct gene flow from the Denisovans. In addition, the study reports several other findings: One, that the Denisovan genome contained alleles that correspond to alleles in present-day humans that are associated with dark skin, brown hair and brown eyes; two, that there were a number of genetic changes in modern humans that occurred after the split from the Denisovans; and three, that Denisovan genetic diversity was extremely low, due, they suggest, to a small initial population that grew quickly, without time for genetic diversity to increase to any substantial degree. Along this vain [sic], the authors suggest that if further research shows that the Neanderthal population size changed over time in a similar way, it could mean that a single population expanding out of Africa gave rise to both the Denisovans and Neandertals.
[...]
From the CBS website write-up there is a discussion on the genetic changes that have happened to us versus the Denisovan split, including most importantly changes to brain and nerve genes.
[continued]
161 | HappyBenghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:14:51pm |
We've had presidents that had foreign born parents before so why does Obama get the most scrutiny? Plus the constant referring to him with disgust as "THE KENYAN" or as "AN ARAB" which McCain had to call out that crazy woman on. I think birtherism is more about xenophobia than racial prejudice but it's about bigotry none the less and that's why it's disgusting.
162 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:14:53pm |
Not unrelated to the whole racism and birtherism issues:
Scientists reconstruct genetic makeup of 50,000-year-old girl
Scientists have reconstructed the entire genetic makeup of a girl who lived and died in a Siberian cave more than 50,000 years ago. The young woman belonged to an ancient and long extinct group of humans called Denisovans, their existence known only from meagre fossil remains uncovered at the Denisova cave in the Altai mountains in 2008. These ancient relatives are thought to have occupied much of Asia tens of thousands of years ago. Previous tests on the remains found they were more closely related to Neanderthals than modern humans.
Writing in the journal Science, researchers in the US and Germany describe how they sequenced the girl's genome with an accuracy that was once considered impossible with such ancient specimens. The final sequence matched the quality of modern genetic tests on living people.
[...]
Paper is here:
A High-Coverage Genome Sequence from an Archaic Denisovan Individual
We present a DNA library preparation method that has allowed us to reconstruct a high-coverage (30X) genome sequence of a Denisovan, an extinct relative of Neandertals. The quality of this genome allows a direct estimation of Denisovan heterozygosity, indicating that genetic diversity in these archaic hominins was extremely low. It also allows tentative dating of the specimen on the basis of “missing evolution” in its genome, detailed measurements of Denisovan and Neandertal admixture into present-day human populations, and the generation of a near-complete catalog of genetic changes that swept to high frequency in modern humans since their divergence from Denisovans.
Some important observations:
Archaic Human DNA Reveals its Secrets
[...]
Among the study results, the researchers found that the Denisovans share more genes with individuals from Papua New Guinea than any other population, and that more Denisovan alleles were common with those of Asian and South American populations than European populations. The study authors suggest that the latter reflects interbreeding between modern humans and the Neandertals, who are also related to Neanderthals, rather than direct gene flow from the Denisovans. In addition, the study reports several other findings: One, that the Denisovan genome contained alleles that correspond to alleles in present-day humans that are associated with dark skin, brown hair and brown eyes; two, that there were a number of genetic changes in modern humans that occurred after the split from the Denisovans; and three, that Denisovan genetic diversity was extremely low, due, they suggest, to a small initial population that grew quickly, without time for genetic diversity to increase to any substantial degree. Along this vain [sic], the authors suggest that if further research shows that the Neanderthal population size changed over time in a similar way, it could mean that a single population expanding out of Africa gave rise to both the Denisovans and Neandertals.
[...]
From the CBS website write-up there is a discussion on the genetic changes that have happened to us versus the Denisovan split, including most importantly changes to brain and nerve genes.
[continued]
163 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:15:02pm |
[continued]
Ok, here is where we start getting into strange and difficult things - from the Guardian article:
Chris Stringer, head of human origins at the Natural History Museum in London, said further genetic studies might shed light on the biological differences between homo sapiens and the Neanderthal and Denisovan populations they replaced after they left Africa around 60,000 years ago. "Perhaps some of the skin and eye-related ones reflect resistance to diseases in the African homeland of modern humans, but the brain-related ones hint at possible enhancements in brain structure and function in our species," he said.
He said the low genetic diversity of the Denisovans may indicate that they only expanded into regions like the Altai mountains in southern Siberia in small numbers and during warm spells.
There are two bombshells waiting to be exploded, and one of them has to do with racism.
Stringer is a convert to the Recent Out Of Africa (ROOA) theory, which posits that sapiens left Africa (probably East Africa) 60 to 70 thousand years ago. He has also recently begun to accept that at the beginning of this migration there might have been a few interbreeding episodes between Neanderthals and sapiens in SW Asia.
The other dominant, and older, theory is one of multiregionalism, that is, we modern humans developed from many groups of Homo spread out over Eurasia and Africa, though there was an "out of Africa" migration long ago, very long ago (perhaps hundreds of thousands of years), and that gene flow occurred here and there over many, many years. There may have been a particular group in East Africa or SW Asia which now dominates our ancestry (we see via DNA), but that has to do with population bottlenecks, and later migration.
Racists have found ways to exploit both ideas to propagate their biases.
That's one bombshell.
The other bombshell has to with those mutations that these latest Denisovan articles discuss. The anti-vaxxers are not only on the wrong path, but the very nature of autism itself, when it is discovered that there are indeed several recent genetic changes having to do with brain and nerve development, gives us insight into what it means to be human.
There does appear to have been genetic changes recently that have made us who we are as "modern humans". Now, this wasn't 6000 years ago a la Genesis genealogy, but over roughly the past 50,000 years.
This is just one more example of how we have a rapidly diversifying genome - from a bottleneck somewhere around the last interglacial to a huge population today.
IOW, we have changed dramatically the past 100,000 years or so, at least in some fundamental mental capacity. If you had a time machine to go back 100,000 years yes, you could interbreed with the humans of the time, but you wouldn't be able to have a "relationship" with them.
Anyway, more stuff to think about.
164 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:15:11pm |
re: #154 JamesWI
I downding stupid comments. I can't help the fact that many of yours happen to qualify for that distinction.
Point them out and we'll debate them
OR
Just continue to downding me after the fact and feel good!
165 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:15:27pm |
re: #149 Kragar
Excuse me while I bash my head into a wall;
Yahoo's online poll of the day
Whose campaign seems to be fudging more facts?
Barack Obama's 56%
Mitt Romney's 44%
Those things can be easily spammed. I would be interested to see a real world poll on that. I still suspect public opinion would be fairly evenly divided. More people are paying attention to fact checkers recently and the Obama campaign has made some dishonest Bain/tax claims so neither side has a monopoly on factual accuracy.
166 | HappyBenghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:15:28pm |
re: #159 JamesWI
Trying to take anything out of Yahoo stories/polls is an exercise in futility. One day, the popular comments will be full of outright racists. The next day, it will be Ron Paul fanatics, the day after that left-wing nuts.
Yeah pretty much. In other words, online polls are all about which side has more time on their side today.
167 | Vicious Babushka Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:16:40pm |
re: #163 freetoken
You should page this.
168 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:17:19pm |
re: #163 freetoken
(scrolls)
(scrolls)
(scrolls)
(scrolls)
Might be a good page topic. I'm just sayin'...
169 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:17:39pm |
re: #141 Mattand
I really don't get why people are taking this stance.
Birthers are working to somehow get Obama out of office because of his skin color. Not because of his preference of socks, or favorite baseball team, or what toothpaste he uses.
Pretending it's not racism just digs the race relations hole this country has been standing in for two plus centuries that much deeper.
I agree with you 99.44%, but I am just very hesitant to use the term racism unless it is clear-cut and consistent. I still think it is bigoted and stupid and that most birthers are probably racists, but a lot of them are just cynical assholes who are trying to use it to their advantage.
Fortunately, most of them are too dumb to see how badly they are failing at doing anything other than preaching to the converted and putting off anyone with half a brain. Heck, even Karl Rove tried to warn his fellow conservatives tht it might be a "trap".
170 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:18:37pm |
re: #168 erik_t
(scrolls)
(scrolls)
(scrolls)
(scrolls)Might be a good page topic. I'm just sayin'...
You may want to re-think that
Tomorrow is Friday
There's ALWAYS a pop quiz on Fridays!!
//
171 | Obdicut Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:19:01pm |
re: #169 Expand Your Ground
I think the cynical exploitation of racism is still a racist action. The person may not hold racist views, but they are still doing something racist.
172 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:19:19pm |
re: #149 Kragar
Excuse me while I bash my head into a wall;
Yahoo's online poll of the day
Whose campaign seems to be fudging more facts?
Barack Obama's 56%
Mitt Romney's 44%
There is some incredible notion that there is some objective and incontovertible standard of "100% truth" against which all statements can be judged.
That is one of the countless smoke bombs being tossed out there in order to let the Big Lies sneak through undetected.
173 | Interesting Times in Benghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:19:19pm |
Oh look, we got our very first Twitchy troll!
174 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:19:21pm |
re: #169 Expand Your Ground
I agree with you 99.44%, but I am just very hesitant to use the term racism unless it is clear-cut and consistent. I still think it is bigoted and stupid and that most birthers are probably racists, but a lot of them are just cynical assholes who are trying to use it to their advantage.
I repeat myself: If you're attacking someone's race for your own advantage, you are a racist. That is racism.
175 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:19:28pm |
re: #169 Expand Your Ground
but I am just very hesitant to use the term racism unless it is clear-cut and consistent. I still think it is bigoted and stupid and that most birthers are probably racists, but a lot of them are just cynical assholes who are trying to use it to their advantage.
repeated because, well, it should be
176 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:19:41pm |
re: #164 sattv4u2
Point them out and we'll debate them
OR
Just continue to downding me after the fact and feel good!
Your style of commenting doesn't really lend itself to "debate," considering most of them are in the passive aggressive/sarcastic/whiny stylings of your comments on this thread: i.e. re: #134 sattv4u2
and I won;'t get downdinged as long as I agree with it!
re: #145 sattv4u2
"mocking" is always such a useful debate technique!
Debating concern trolls isn't worth anyone's time.
177 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:19:51pm |
RT @pattonoswalt: Clint Eastwood is a hero. But if he comes out tonight, drops trou,farts "Every Which Way But Loose" & then exits? A LEGEND— helen(@liberalchik) August 30, 2012
178 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:20:16pm |
re: #173 Interesting Times
Oh look, we got our very first Twitchy troll!
BRB. I gotta go grab my special Downdingin' Mouse.
179 | HappyBenghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:21:30pm |
re: #177 darthstar
[Embedded content]
I find the Eastwood choice kind of interesting after he got some of the right wing's ire for the Super Bowl ad and he recently said who gives a shit if gays want to get married.
180 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:21:38pm |
re: #176 JamesWI
Debating concern trolls isn't worth anyone's time.
Yet here you are talking to me,, AND take time out to stealth downding me
Odd, that
181 | Charles Johnson Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:22:08pm |
Are all Birthers racists? Maybe not all, but it's a conspiracy theory that springs from racism, and the fact that it's often accompanied by good old-fashioned "go back to Africa" rhetoric ought to be your first clue.
It's one of those right wing hate memes that has a thin facade of deniability.
182 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:22:15pm |
re: #180 sattv4u2
Debating concern trolls isn't worth anyone's time.Yet here you are talking to me,, AND take time out to stealth downding me
Odd, that
Funny that I haven't downdinged a single one of your comments on this thread, or probably for the past few weeks, and you're still whining about it.
183 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:22:52pm |
re: #182 JamesWI
Funny that I haven't downdinged a single one of your comments on this thread, or probably for the past few weeks
Not that we see. Because stealth.
Don't you even know how stealth works!?
184 | Interesting Times in Benghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:23:14pm |
Romney's task tonight? Convince us he's not a robot sent back from the future to destroy us.— LOLGOP (@LOLGOP) August 30, 2012
185 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:23:32pm |
re: #182 JamesWI
Funny that I haven't downdinged a single one of your comments on this thread, or probably for the past few weeks, and you're still whining about it.
Not "still"
1st time, actually. Due to it being the 1st time you've actually engaged me in convo
So as far as "whining",,, after all the stealth ones you have given me ,, not so much
186 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:23:48pm |
Well, there is something good that can be said of Condi...
The biggest cheers at the GOP convention have still gone to the pro-choice woman who believes in global climate change and doesn't hate gays— Markos Moulitsas (@markos) August 30, 2012
187 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:24:17pm |
re: #185 sattv4u2
Not "still"
1st time, actually. Due to it being the 1st time you've actually engaged me in convo
So as far as "whining",,, after all the stealth ones you have given me ,, not so much
How can you see them if they're 'stealth'?
188 | bratwurst Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:24:32pm |
Clint Eastwood speaking at RNC tonight. GOP really likes actors who work with monkeys.— pourmecoffee (@pourmecoffee) August 30, 2012
189 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:24:36pm |
re: #185 sattv4u2
Not "still"
1st time, actually. Due to it being the 1st time you've actually engaged me in convo
So as far as "whining",,, after all the stealth ones you have given me ,, not so much
Any whining about something as useless as "downdings" is pathetic, and a sign that you put way too much stock into imaginary ratings on a blog.
190 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:24:56pm |
re: #183 erik_t
Not that we see. Because stealth.
Don't you even know how stealth works!?
The cloaking device is broken!
191 | HappyBenghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:25:06pm |
re: #188 bratwurst
[Embedded content]
Does that mean Rene Russo will also be speaking? or Matt LeBlanc?
192 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:25:12pm |
re: #174 erik_t
I repeat myself: If you're attacking someone's race for your own advantage, you are a racist. That is racism.
that's just the 0.66% difference between your definition of "racism" and mine.
193 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:25:15pm |
re: #189 JamesWI
Any whining about something as useless as "downdings" is pathetic, and a sign that you put way too much stock into imaginary ratings on a blog.
Yet you use them!
Odd, huh!
194 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:25:42pm |
re: #193 sattv4u2
Yet you use them!
Odd, huh!
And I don't cry about it if somebody gives me one!
Odd, huh!
195 | makeitstopghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:26:02pm |
re: #185 sattv4u2
Not "still"
1st time, actually. Due to it being the 1st time you've actually engaged me in convo
So as far as "whining",,, after all the stealth ones you have given me ,, not so much
Wait. You're pissy about getting down-dinged on a blog? Really?
196 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:26:07pm |
re: #192 Expand Your Ground
that's just the 0.66% difference between your definition of "racism" and mine.
If 'attacking someone based on their race' isn't the definition of racism, well, I've got to confess to being just a little bit stumped.
197 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:26:37pm |
re: #194 JamesWI
And I don't cry about it if somebody gives me one!
Odd, huh!
Making an observation is not crying
But you know that. It's just WHO is making the observation that seems to be the bone of contention!
198 | gwangung Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:26:42pm |
re: #192 Expand Your Ground
that's just the 0.66% difference between your definition of "racism" and mine.
From the view of the person who's the object of racism, there isn't a functional difference between the two.
And a difference that makes no difference IS no difference.
199 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:27:01pm |
re: #167 Learned Mother of Zion
re: #168 erik_t
There have been several Pages about this posted as news links in the last year by various people, and I suspect we'll see more over time as news items about anthropology pop up regularly.
At this time my concern, if I may use that word, is more than just my curiosity about evolution. It's about racism, that it is more fundamental to us as humans than we like to admit, that this is a very deep and old problem, and because of its ubiquity it is always there for the right demagogues at the right time.
Our invention we call "morality" exists, I propose, in part to deal with this problem. Civilization and moral codes are quite young (from a geologic perspective), and no doubt were first created to deal with family issues (say, of mates and offspring.) Yet along the way this whole issue of the "other", the one from outside not just our family or clan but the truly other - different color, different hair, different size, different language - certainly drove some of the ideas of morality and how to treat "people".
200 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:27:22pm |
re: #195 makeitstop
Wait. You're pissy about getting down-dinged on a blog? Really?
I'm about to throw out some e-threats and get e-macho if people don't get e-along.
201 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:27:23pm |
re: #195 makeitstop
Wait. You're pissy about getting down-dinged on a blog? Really?
Can we see our historical downding record? That's more interesting than our updings.
202 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:27:28pm |
re: #186 darthstar
Well, there is something good that can be said of Condi...
[Embedded content]
Condi's speech is the only RNC speech I've watched. She was surprisingly passionate, she usually much more reserved. The content was decent but the occasional statements praising Mitt and Ryan seemed like they were just randomly inserted into a pre-existing speech.
203 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:27:43pm |
After a morning of reading pieces about Paul Ryan’s Lies and Paul Ryan’s Distortions and Paul Ryan’s Distorted Lies, I am impressed and alarmed at the depth of scrutiny and vigorous insistence on literal truth in every phrase. I wish these fact-checkers had been around for history’s great speeches, when we could have gotten some really prime commentary.
For instance.
Franklin Roosevelt: “The only thing we have to fear is fear itself.”
FACT: False! We have many things to fear, including ebola, Spanish influenza and the rise of Hitler.
Martin Luther King Jr.: “I have a dream that the brotherhood of man will become a reality in this age!”
FACT: False! Is that a dream, Dr. King? Isn’t it more of an aspiration that you have? If you are dreaming, why aren’t you in REM sleep now?
204 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:27:48pm |
re: #183 erik_t
Not that we see. Because stealth.
Don't you even know how stealth works!?
What the hell is "stealth downdinging" anyway?
205 | makeitstopghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:28:30pm |
re: #201 Decatur Deb
Can we see our historical downding record? That's more interesting than our updings.
I've never even checked mine. Maybe someday I will.
206 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:28:57pm |
re: #204 Sionainn
What the hell is "stealth downdinging" anyway?
Not responding to whatever one finds so onerous
Waiting till the thread is dead or the poster leaves
then hitting the button
207 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:28:58pm |
re: #198 gwangung
From the view of the person who's the object of racism, there isn't a functional difference between the two.
And a difference that makes no difference IS no difference.
From the point of view of preventing it there is a difference. Racists can be slowly educated away from it. Cynics are a different problem.
208 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:28:59pm |
re: #197 sattv4u2
Making an observation is not crying
But you know that. It's just WHO is making the observation that seems to be the bone of contention!
You definitely sound whiny. Just bringing up the fact that someone *GASP* downdings you!!!! is pathetic enough, and your need to try to make it sound less pathetic than it is only makes it more so.
209 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:29:04pm |
re: #186 darthstar
I thought the biggest cheer went to "357 Magnum".
210 | Charles Johnson Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:30:08pm |
re: #209 freetoken
I thought the biggest cheer went to "357 Magnum".
Definitely - Susana Martinez really got the crowd going by bragging about her big gun.
211 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:30:17pm |
re: #208 JamesWI
You definitely sound whiny. Just bringing up the fact that someone *GASP* downdings you!!!! is pathetic enough, and your need to try to make it sound less pathetic than it is only makes it more so.
I wear them as a badge of honor!
(how's that!!)
212 | Mattand Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:30:24pm |
re: #169 Expand Your Ground
I agree with you 99.44%, but I am just very hesitant to use the term racism unless it is clear-cut and consistent. I still think it is bigoted and stupid and that most birthers are probably racists, but a lot of them are just cynical assholes who are trying to use it to their advantage.
Fortunately, most of them are too dumb to see how badly they are failing at doing anything other than preaching to the converted and putting off anyone with half a brain. Heck, even Karl Rove tried to warn his fellow conservatives tht it might be a "trap".
I'm honestly trying to give you the benefit of the doubt, but your line of reasoning is just serving to give cover to the inherent bigotry in birtherism.
This "movement" starts and ends with the color in the President's skin. If someone is cynically exploiting the racism of others, they're racists. You can't intellectually separate the two.
214 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:30:41pm |
re: #206 sattv4u2
Not responding to whatever one finds so onerous
Waiting till the thread is dead or the poster leavesthen hitting the button
Sorry if I don't hang out on here all day to see your stupid comments as you make them. Sometimes I only see your stupidity later in the day!
215 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:31:03pm |
re: #214 JamesWI
Sorry if I don't hang out on here all day to see your stupid comments as you make them. Sometimes I only see your stupidity later in the day!
Well, thanks for stalking me!!
216 | Charles Johnson Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:31:24pm |
Mitt Romney could probably bring the house down if he came onstage brandishing an M16.
217 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:32:09pm |
re: #106 erik_t
Of course the guy also defends Sandusky, because obviously.
Keep digging, Rome.
"People have this picture in their minds of a person planning to - a psychopath. But that's not the case. Suppose you have a man having a nervous breakdown, and a youngster comes after him. A lot of the cases, the youngster -- 14, 16, 18 -- is the seducer," Groeschel is quoted as saying in the interview, which is no longer available on the paper's website.
The interview, billed as a reflection on the 25 years since Groeschel founded the Franciscan Friars of the Renewal order, covered many topics, but has gained attention for Groeschel's comments on child sex abuse.
"Well, it's not so hard to see. A kid looking for a father and didn't have his own -- and they won't be planning to get into heavy-duty sex, but almost romantic, embracing, kissing, perhaps sleeping, but not having intercourse or anything like that. I's an understandable thing, and you know where you find it, among other clergy or important people; you look at teachers, attorneys, judges, social workers," he said.
I'm pretty sure I already know what everyone is thinking on this so since I do no want to get myself banned, I'm just going to let this speak for itself.
218 | JamesWI Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:32:12pm |
re: #215 sattv4u2
Well, thanks for stalking me!!
Ah yes...."stalking" = reading through a post's comments and noticing that you say stupid shit.
Keep on crying! It makes you look so cool!
219 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:32:30pm |
Have we found out who the big mystery speaker is yet?
220 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:32:39pm |
re: #196 erik_t
If 'attacking someone based on their race' isn't the definition of racism, well, I've got to confess to being just a little bit stumped.
It's as close as dammit, just a thinly veiled attempt at hiding it. I just will not use the word unless it is a clear-cut case. You can, I won't take you to task over it, I just won't use it myself.
221 | Mattand Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:32:45pm |
re: #216 Charles Johnson
Mitt Romney could probably bring the house down if he came onstage brandishing an M16.
Shit, all he has to do is ask to borrow one from the audience. They could probably throw them onstage like panties and hotel keys at a Tom Jones concert.
222 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:32:56pm |
re: #216 Charles Johnson
Mitt Romney could probably bring the house down if he came onstage brandishing an M16.
He could carry it at port arms, just like they taught him in basic...oh...
223 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:32:59pm |
224 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:33:00pm |
re: #216 Charles Johnson
Mitt Romney could probably bring the house down if he came onstage brandishing an M16.
Too Ted Nugenty.
225 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:34:10pm |
re: #207 Decatur Deb
From the point of view of preventing it there is a difference. Racists can be slowly educated away from it. Cynics are a different problem.
This is so; however I might propose that separating the people is a bit different from separating the action.
226 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:34:14pm |
re: #222 Decatur Deb
He could carry it at port arms, just like they taught him in basic...oh...
He could come on stage with a check and ask if anyone around here would be able to cash it.
227 | Brother Holy Cruise Missile of Mild Acceptance Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:34:25pm |
re: #216 Charles Johnson
then again they may mistake him for a T1000.
228 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:34:32pm |
re: #216 Charles Johnson
Mitt Romney could probably bring the house down if he came onstage brandishing an M16.
He's bringing out Clint Eastwood to keep people from taking early flights home.
229 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:34:57pm |
re: #206 sattv4u2
Not responding to whatever one finds so onerous
Waiting till the thread is dead or the poster leavesthen hitting the button
Well, I may be guilty of doing that. If I see what I consider a particularly appalling post, I'll downding it. I don't check to see if the poster is still on the page or not. I may have even done it when a new page comes up and I'm still on the old one.
230 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:36:29pm |
re: #210 Charles Johnson
Definitely - Susana Martinez really got the crowd going by bragging about her big gun.
The very same Susana Martinez who dissed Custer?
//
231 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:37:04pm |
Ok, I'm well over my Chris Mathews video quota for the month. Wingnuts are excited today over Mathews claiming mentions of "Chicago" style politics is racist. Meh, maybe but probably not. The "chicago" accusations are stupid enough on their own and there's really no need to counter with accusations of racism.
232 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:38:11pm |
re: #216 Charles Johnson
Mitt Romney could probably bring the house down if he came onstage brandishing an M16.
It's a good thing the RNC had the foresight to allow firearms into the convention!
/
233 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:38:18pm |
234 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:39:10pm |
re: #231 Killgore Trout
Ok, I'm well over my Chris Mathews video quota for the month. Wingnuts are excited today over Mathews claiming mentions of "Chicago" style politics is racist. Meh, maybe but probably not. The "chicago" accusations are stupid enough on their own and there's really no need to counter with accusations of racism.
...and this is why Mathews and the over use of racism claims is counter productive. The wingnuts love it and it provides cover for more serious problems of racism and ethnic nationalism. Mathews is not helpful.
235 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:39:39pm |
re: #233 Sionainn
Clint Eastwood
But is it the Eastwood who did Dirty Harry, or the Eastwood who did Bird?
236 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:40:03pm |
re: #233 Sionainn
Clint Eastwood
That's rather unfortunate. Mr. Eastwood has a great presence about him. I'm sure Mitt will seem rather wooden and disconnected compared to his "opening act".
237 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:40:18pm |
re: #235 Decatur Deb
But is it the Eastwood who did Dirty Harry, or the Eastwood who did Bird?
Probably the Eastwood who was in Gran Torino.
238 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:40:37pm |
re: #234 Killgore Trout
...and this is why Mathews and the over use of racism claims is counter productive. The wingnuts love it and it provides cover for more serious problems of racism and ethnic nationalism. Mathews is not helpful.
We are groping towards a definition of "legitimate racism".
239 | Charles Johnson Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:40:53pm |
No racism here.
240 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:41:13pm |
re: #235 Decatur Deb
But is it the Eastwood who did Dirty Harry, or the Eastwood who did Bird?
Would you believe I've never seen either of those?
241 | freetoken Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:41:22pm |
re: #234 Killgore Trout
Mathews is not helpful.
He may not be, but (1) given the viewership numbers it probably doesn't matter one way or another as far as American on the whole, and (2) it's still a fallacy to claim that any assertion is true or false simply because of Mathews' own competence or lack thereof.
242 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:41:23pm |
re: #234 Killgore Trout
...and this is why Mathews and the over use of racism claims is counter productive. The wingnuts love it and it provides cover for more serious problems of racism and ethnic nationalism. Mathews is not helpful.
And here we're back to Argument By Repetition.
Over-use, blah blah, whatever. I'm still deeply curious to hear the theory of how birtherism is not a veneer slapped on top of racism.
243 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:42:29pm |
re: #236 dragonfire1981
That's rather unfortunate. Mr. Eastwood has a great presence about him. I'm sure Mitt will seem rather wooden and disconnected compared to his "opening act".
I find it amusing since the RWNJs are always sneering about actors opening their mouths about politics, and then they do something like this.
244 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:42:54pm |
245 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:45:07pm |
246 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:45:19pm |
Paul Ryan got just over 20 million viewers for his speech last night. Sarah Palin had 37.2 million four years ago... pwire.at/UeEWln— Taegan Goddard (@politicalwire) August 30, 2012
247 | abolitionist Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:45:34pm |
re: #216 Charles Johnson
Mitt Romney could probably bring the house down if he came onstage brandishing an M16.
The US President in Idiocracy did something like that (sprayed a few rounds iirc), altho he seemed to have more reverence for science and experimental methods than many of our politicians.
248 | gwangung Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:45:57pm |
re: #241 freetoken
He may not be, but (1) given the viewership numbers it probably doesn't matter one way or another as far as American on the whole, and (2) it's still a fallacy to claim that any assertion is true or false simply because of Mathews' own competence or lack thereof.
Isn't that following into an ad hominen argument?
249 | allegro Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:46:00pm |
Perhaps someone can clear this up... it isn't that there are too many racists or too many glaring examples of racism... it's that there's too much talk about it?
250 | Ben G. Hazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:46:24pm |
re: #36 Killgore Trout
I didn't watch the clip because I find Mathews to be an embarrassing buffoon but the shows' hosts didn't seem to appreciate his outburst. It was a big hit with the moonbats though.
Oh, spare me with that tired, jaded routine, of yours, KT.
I'm not even going to give you the negative ding that you apparently crave as of late.
251 | palomino Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:47:00pm |
re: #36 Killgore Trout
I didn't watch the clip because I find Mathews to be an embarrassing buffoon but the shows' hosts didn't seem to appreciate his outburst. It was a big hit with the moonbats though.
No race baiting in the GOP. Nothing to see here. Just move along, right?
Delusional. But, ooh, you're so edgy with your contrarian cut and paste. And your trenchant one sentence defenses thereof are so illuminating. A shell of one's former self. Weak shit all around.
252 | Sionainn Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:48:13pm |
re: #245 Decatur Deb
That's shocking--they used the right spelling of "its".
Clearly a sign that this is the work of a librul trying to make conservatives look bad.
253 | Ben G. Hazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:49:43pm |
255 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:51:05pm |
re: #254 Gus
Limbaugh Trashes MSNBC: ‘You Know What We Call People Obsessed With Race? Racists’
This is why I am very careful about using the term, do not wanna let assholes like this even have an opening.
256 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:51:09pm |
re: #254 Gus
Limbaugh Trashes MSNBC: ‘You Know What We Call People Obsessed With Race? Racists’
What say you, Mr. Trump?
/
257 | gwangung Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:51:30pm |
re: #254 Gus
Limbaugh Trashes MSNBC: ‘You Know What We Call People Obsessed With Race? Racists’
Heard that in the South, during the 60s.
258 | Eventual Carrion Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:51:44pm |
re: #247 abolitionist
The US President in Idiocracy did something like that (sprayed a few rounds iirc), altho he seemed to have more reverence for science and experimental methods than many of our politicians.
"You mean put toilet water on them?"
259 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:51:47pm |
re: #255 Expand Your Ground
This is why I am very careful about using the term, do not wanna let assholes like this even have an opening.
This would imply that you also prefer to keep marriages heterosexual and offer only civil unions to gays.
260 | gwangung Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:52:33pm |
re: #255 Expand Your Ground
This is why I am very careful about using the term, do not wanna let assholes like this even have an opening.
Not sure the targets of racism have that kind of luxury, though.
261 | Mattand Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:53:16pm |
re: #254 Gus
Limbaugh Trashes MSNBC: ‘You Know What We Call People Obsessed With Race? Racists’
If you had told me when I was a kid that in the future, adults would make millions from by using the "I know you are but what am I?" insult, I'd have laughed in your face.
If you had told me that bullies rarely get their comeuppance, and sometimes become rich in the process, I'd have been depressed well into my 20's.
262 | allegro Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:53:29pm |
re: #255 Expand Your Ground
This is why I am very careful about using the term, do not wanna let assholes like this even have an opening.
I'm of the walk + quack = duck school. Trying to parse what may be in someone's head seems entirely beside the point. It's the words and actions that have meaning.
264 | Eventual Carrion Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:54:12pm |
re: #254 Gus
Limbaugh Trashes MSNBC: ‘You Know What We Call People Obsessed With Race? Racists’
Hey Rush, know what we call people that use multiple doctors to get illegal scripts? Criminal and drug addicts.
265 | wrenchwench Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:54:36pm |
re: #255 Expand Your Ground
This is why I am very careful about using the term, do not wanna let assholes like this even have an opening.
Did Sandra Fluke give him an opening? He makes his own.
Don't worry about him. Just call it racism when you see it.
266 | Mattand Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:54:41pm |
re: #255 Expand Your Ground
This is why I am very careful about using the term, do not wanna let assholes like this even have an opening.
Yeah, being afraid of Rush Limbaugh and his questionable grip on logic and reality really isn't a reason to be silent on racism.
267 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:55:54pm |
re: #265 wrenchwench
Did Sandra Fluke give him an opening? He makes his own.
Don't worry about him. Just call it racism when you see it.
You can call it racism, I will just call it fucking stupid. The two overlap to a great extent, especially in the person of Rush Limbaugh.
268 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:56:26pm |
re: #264 RayFerd
Hey Rush, know what we call people that use multiple doctors to get illegal scripts? Criminal and drug addicts.
You know what we call people who get viagra prescriptions under false names before vacationing in a country known for its child prostitution? Sexual predators
269 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:57:58pm |
I'm sure this will go over well.
Miners charged in deaths of 34 killed by police
About 270 miners were charged Thursday with the murders of 34 striking colleagues who were shot by South African police officers, authorities said, a development that could further infuriate South Africans already shocked and angered by the police action.
The decision to charge the miners comes under an arcane Roman-Dutch common purpose law, and it suggests President Jacob Zuma's government wants to shift blame for the killings from police to the striking miners.
Firebrand politician Julius Malema, who has seized on the shootings to score political points, told supporters of miners outside the courthouse that the charges were "madness."
"The policemen who killed those people are not in custody, not even one of them. This is madness," said Malema, who was expelled from the governing African National Congress in April. "The whole world saw the policemen kill those people."
National Prosecuting Authority spokesman Frank Lesenyego told The Associated Press that "It's the police who were shooting, but they were under attack by the protesters, who were armed, so today the 270 accused are charged with the murders" of those who were shot.
270 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:59:12pm |
re: #262 allegro
I'm of the walk + quack = duck school. Trying to parse what may be in someone's head seems entirely beside the point. It's the words and actions that have meaning.
When someone coughs on you, it's useful to know whether they have the flu or tuberculosis.
271 | palomino Thu, Aug 30, 2012 1:59:30pm |
re: #254 Gus
Limbaugh Trashes MSNBC: ‘You Know What We Call People Obsessed With Race? Racists’
Of course there is a big difference between calling out racism (something Limbaugh sees as racist) and actually being racist. But this may be Limbaugh's most lasting and profoundly disturbing contribution to the discourse: he's essentially spent the last two decades telling conservative middle aged and older whites that it's OK to be racist, since the "real racists" are on the other side anyway. As far as race obsession, I don't know of many commentators, regardless of political slant, who inject race into their daily discourse more often than Rush.
272 | erik_t Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:00:04pm |
re: #270 Decatur Deb
When someone coughs on you, it's useful to know whether they have the flu or tuberculosis.
The more appropriate analogy in this case would be 'did that asshole just cough on me!?'
273 | AK-47% Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:00:07pm |
re: #269 Kragar
I'm sure this will go over well.
Miners charged in deaths of 34 killed by police
Straight out of fucking Kafka.
Offka to bed now...
275 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:03:19pm |
Et tu, Amish folks?
Amish woman testifies bishop on trial forced sex
An Amish bishop accused of orchestrating hair-cutting attacks in Ohio forced women at his settlement to have sex with him so he could turn them into better wives, one of the women testified Thursday.
The woman said what started out as hugs turned into kisses and then sex. She said she resisted at first.
"He would say things like 'I can't understand why you won't obey me, the other ladies can,'" the woman testified. "I always gave up. I was afraid not to."
Prosecutors say the alleged sexual "counseling" of married women shows the control Samuel Mullet Sr. had over followers at the Amish settlement he founded two decades ago. The 16 people accused of carrying out the hair-cutting attacks last fall all lived on Mullet's settlement in eastern Ohio near the West Virginia panhandle.
276 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:04:01pm |
Limbaugh Trashes MSNBC: ‘You Know What We Call P
dya know what i call you? a notorious moron
277 | Amory Blaine Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:05:22pm |
I haven't watched any of the freak fest this week. Just limited snippets online. I told a friend I'd rather watch baby unicorns burn alive. There was an awkward pause.
278 | palomino Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:07:00pm |
re: #264 RayFerd
Hey Rush, know what we call people that use multiple doctors to get illegal scripts? Criminal and drug addicts.
One of the real ironies of Limbaugh. By most accounts, he lives his life with no more moral rectitude than the average "liberal Hollywood star" who lives in the fast lane. Multiple wives, drug addiction, illegal purchase of said drugs, self-indulgent excessive smoking and eating, trips to the Caribbean for sex tourism (remember the Viagra in his bags found by airport screeners a few years back).
And yet good God fearing real Americans overlook all that and see him not only as a force for good but an example to be followed. Other than loudly blasting the things his audience hates, of what is he an exemplar?
279 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:08:08pm |
re: #278 palomino
One of the real ironies of Limbaugh. By most accounts, he lives his life with no more moral rectitude than the average "liberal Hollywood star" who lives in the fast lane. Multiple wives, drug addiction, illegal purchase of said drugs, self-indulgent excessive smoking and eating, trips to the Caribbean for sex tourism (remember the Viagra in his bags found by airport screeners a few years back).
And yet good God fearing real Americans overlook all that and see him not only as a force for good but an example to be followed. Other than loudly blasting the things his audience hates, of what is he an exemplar?
That a sucker is born every minute.
280 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:08:23pm |
Limbaugh Trashes MSNBC: ‘You Know What We Call People Obsessed With Race?
come to think of it, why don't you just supply us with the whole newspeak dictionary, and while you're at it throw in a tour guide to your alternate reality
and a few more eruptions onto my computer machine screen and i'm cutting off all transmissions from your universe
281 | Only The Lurker Knows Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:08:33pm |
This is not good.
Isaac weakens but drenches La., Miss. as possible dam failure threatens thousands
(CBS/AP) NEW ORLEANS - Tropical Storm Isaac continued to pound Louisiana and Mississippi Thursday as a dam in a sparsely populated area near the Louisiana-Mississippi border threatened to break, prompting officials to order a mandatory evacuation for as many as 60,000 people.
282 | bratwurst Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:08:34pm |
re: #256 erik_t
What say you, Mr. Trump?
/
Hey come on...did he not select Arsenio Hall as the last Celebrity Apprentice? /
283 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:10:00pm |
Clint Eastwood! Imagine how you feel if you're Jon Voight— Frank Rich (@frankrichny) August 30, 2012
284 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:11:32pm |
re: #281 Bubblehead II
And from what I gather, there has been only one storm related death
Sad that there's any, but thankful there's not more
285 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:12:29pm |
The first time I saw a trailer for this movie I thought it was a joke trailer. It is a real movie and this trailer is much better but it still seems...odd to me.
Branded (2012)
287 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:13:33pm |
re: #284 sattv4u2
And from what I gather, there has been only one storm related death
Sad that there's any, but thankful there's not more
There was a man in my area who died when a tree limb fell on his vehicle while he was trying to rescue someone else. :(
288 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:14:19pm |
re: #278 palomino
One of the real ironies of Limbaugh. By most accounts, he lives his life with no more moral rectitude than the average "liberal Hollywood star" who lives in the fast lane. Multiple wives, drug addiction, illegal purchase of said drugs, self-indulgent excessive smoking and eating, trips to the Caribbean for sex tourism (remember the Viagra in his bags found by airport screeners a few years back).
And yet good God fearing real Americans overlook all that and see him not only as a force for good but an example to be followed. Other than loudly blasting the things his audience hates, of what is he an exemplar?
A lot of the "Family values" politicians/pundits do not practice what they preach.
289 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:14:56pm |
re: #287 dragonfire1981
There was a man in my area who died when a tree limb fell on his vehicle while he was trying to rescue someone else. :(
The way I read it, he fell FROM the tree (about 18 feet) Authorities didn't know why he was in the tree
a 36-year-old man had gone to help two friends move a vehicle from under a tree to prepare for Isaac on Tuesday evening, and fell to his death after climbing 18 feet up a tree. Deputies don't know why the man climbed the tree.
Read more: [Link: www.myfoxchicago.com...]
290 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:15:04pm |
#ClintEastwoodMovies "The Good, The Bad, and The Romney" #p2 @kcgibbons— Sean McCabe (@darthstar99) August 30, 2012
291 | Kragarghazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:15:39pm |
re: #290 darthstar
[Embedded content]
"White Hunter Black Heart"
Don't really need to change that one.
292 | boredtechindenver Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:15:51pm |
293 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:16:41pm |
294 | Only The Lurker Knows Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:16:44pm |
re: #284 sattv4u2
"And from what I gather, there has been only one storm related death
Sad that there's any, but thankful there's not more"
Unfortunately it is now up to two.
In the second reported death tied to Isaac, a tow truck driver was killed Thursday morning when a tree fell on his truck in Picayune, Miss., just across the state line from Louisiana. (Second death reported in link below.)
And they have started a controlled release of water from the dam. Hope it works.
295 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:17:19pm |
re: #294 Bubblehead II
Unfortunately it is now up to two.
In the second reported death tied to Isaac, a tow truck driver was killed Thursday morning when a tree fell on his truck in Picayune, Miss., just across the state line from Louisiana. (Second death reported in link below.
And they have started a controlled release of water from the dam. Hope it works.
damn
296 | boredtechindenver Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:17:40pm |
re: #59 Killgore Trout
NOM, NOM, NOM, FAP, FAP, FAP, NOM, NOM, NOM,
remember to wash your hands between noms and faps.
297 | sagehen Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:17:42pm |
re: #235 Decatur Deb
But is it the Eastwood who did Dirty Harry, or the Eastwood who did Bird?
I give odds it's the Eastwood who did "Flags of Our Fathers"/"Letters From Iwo Jima"
298 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:17:57pm |
299 | gwangung Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:19:13pm |
re: #297 sagehen
I give odds it's the Eastwood who did "Flags of Our Fathers"/"Letters From Iwo Jima"
That Eastwood is far too progressive and sympathetic to non-US soldiers to be welcome in the current Republican party.
300 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:19:20pm |
#ClintEastwoodMovies "Every Which Way But True"— Sean McCabe (@darthstar99) August 30, 2012
301 | Killgore Trout Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:19:53pm |
302 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:20:38pm |
re: #294 Bubblehead II
Unfortunately it is now up to two.
In the second reported death tied to Isaac, a tow truck driver was killed Thursday morning when a tree fell on his truck in Picayune, Miss., just across the state line from Louisiana. (Second death reported in link below.
And they have started a controlled release of water from the dam. Hope it works.
That's the death I was talking about. The Picayune man.
303 | Ben G. Hazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:21:24pm |
re: #216 Charles Johnson
Mitt Romney could probably bring the house down if he came onstage brandishing an M16.
Pffft, M16s are so outdated...M4/M4A1s are where it's at with the Black Rifle crowd these days.
///
304 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:21:48pm |
re: #297 sagehen
I give odds it's the Eastwood who did "Flags of Our Fathers"/"Letters From Iwo Jima"
I think that one would give the RNC some trouble.
305 | Only The Lurker Knows Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:23:07pm |
re: #302 dragonfire1981
You anywhere near that dam?
306 | dragonfire1981 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:23:57pm |
re: #305 Bubblehead II
You anywhere near that dam?
No the dam is on the far western edge of the state, I'm to the east of Biloxi. No threat to me.
307 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:24:53pm |
i'm perplexed that the man who made the bio film of charlie parker - the genius who virtually invented modern jazz - could possibly endorse this republican ticket
308 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:24:54pm |
@owillis It won't be a complete failure until Romney puts the cherry on top with his speech tonight.— Sean McCabe (@darthstar99) August 30, 2012
309 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:25:45pm |
re: #306 dragonfire1981
No the dam is on the far western edge of the state, I'm to the east of Biloxi. No threat to me.
Well, get over there! Don't you want to be famous and have your name on TV?
//
310 | Only The Lurker Knows Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:26:10pm |
re: #306 dragonfire1981
No the dam is on the far western edge of the state, I'm to the east of Biloxi. No threat to me.
Glad to hear.
312 | engineer cat Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:27:51pm |
313 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:28:17pm |
re: #311 Bubblehead II
bbiaw, meat word things to do.
??
We have a secret daily meat word??
umm,,, FILET MIGNON!!
what do I win!?!?!
315 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:29:07pm |
re: #309 darthstar
Well, get over there! Don't you want to be famous and have your name on TV?
Olympic Roof Top Sitting!
316 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:29:12pm |
re: #313 sattv4u2
??
We have a secret daily meat word??
umm,,, FILET MIGNON!!
what do I win!?!?!
The word is always 'bacon'.
317 | Ben G. Hazi Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:29:41pm |
318 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:30:21pm |
re: #316 Decatur Deb
The word is always 'bacon'.
Filets wrapped in bacon!!
works for me
(btw ,,,, had scallops wrapped in prosciutto last night
To Die For
319 | danarchy Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:31:15pm |
I wonder if this commercial was already in the can before Ryan's speech last night or if they are just getting really good at whipping these things out in a remarkably short time frame.
320 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:31:31pm |
Time to walk the dog and burn something--wife has left me alone for a week and I'm out of microwaveables. BBfor the RNC.
321 | palomino Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:32:10pm |
Shocked to hear Sen. Graham speak so candidly about his own party's problems, and to essentially admit the monochromatic weakness of his party's overall appeal.
“The demographics race we’re losing badly,” said Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (S.C.). “We’re not generating enough angry white guys to stay in business for the long term.”
322 | sattv4u2 Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:32:33pm |
323 | darthstar Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:33:29pm |
re: #320 Decatur Deb
Time to walk the dog and burn something--wife has left me alone for a week and I'm out of microwaveables. BBfor the RNC.
324 | Decatur Deb Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:35:45pm |
325 | Amory Blaine Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:43:49pm |
Okay, That’s the Stupidest Thing I Ever Heard
I like Chuck Todd. He’s one of the more knowledgable and sensible people in political journalism. But this has to rank as one of the stupidest things I’ve ever heard anyone say. From this morning on Morning Joe, Todd explains that Democrats wish they had as deep a bench of non-white office-holders as the GOP. “Democrats wish they had the diversity of speakers and deep bench [of the GOP] to show America …”
326 | Only The Lurker Knows Thu, Aug 30, 2012 2:48:16pm |
327 | Amory Blaine Thu, Aug 30, 2012 3:06:10pm |
Local Milwaukee news is tongue bathing Paul Ryan for his speech. Completely whitewashing the lies he told.