Deconstructing Abba: Caroline Shaw & Sō Percussion, “Lay All Your Love on Me”

So amazing
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Caroline Shaw & Sō Percussion perform ABBA’s “Lay All Your Love on Me,” from their new album, ‘Let the Soil Play Its Simple Part,’ out now on Nonesuch Records: http://smarturl.it/letthesoil​. Filmed at Bok in Philadelphia.

Director: Maureen Towey
Producer: Justus McLarty
Director of Photography / Editor: Evan Chapman (Four/Ten Media)

Additional vocals: Beth Meyers and Yeji Cha-Beach

#carolineshaw #sopercussion #abba

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252 comments
1
Charles Johnson  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:12:43pm

I’m still amazed on a daily basis by VScode. Absolutely amazing tool for web dev. I can’t believe I resisted switching to it from BBEdit for so long.

2
Charles Johnson  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:14:51pm

To get the best use out of VScode you have to design all your projects in a Git-friendly way. I understand why that’s necessary but it’s not easy to bring older projects up to that standard.

3
First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:17:55pm

I’m glad I don’t need to work on anything more complex than can be handled by Notepad++ and vim.

4
Dopamine Fish  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:18:43pm

re: #3 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

I’m glad I don’t need to work on anything more complex than can be handled by Notepad++ and vim.

I use those a lot in my day job, but mostly because I can work across projects faster than opening VSCode. VSCode is an amazing tool for those who are working in a single project all day long.

5
Charles Johnson  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:20:22pm
6
JOE 🥓  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:20:57pm

In today’s episode of Pulpit Pimp Theater!

‘A Man Sent From Heaven’: Hank Kunneman Likens Mike Lindell to John the Baptist

Hank Kunneman Likens Mike Lindell to John the Baptist

7
First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:23:29pm

re: #5 Charles Johnson

I am genuinely disappointed that Robert Tilton hasn’t surfaced lately. I would love to hear his doubtless deranged take on Trump as GOD’S CHOSEN.

8
Jay C  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:28:36pm

re: #5 Charles Johnson

He sounds scared.

What he sounds like to me is some antique White Citizens Council type c. 1960 mumping away about “The Coloreds”…

9
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:28:42pm

re: #2 Charles Johnson

To get the best use out of VScode you have to design all your projects in a Git-friendly way. I understand why that’s necessary but it’s not easy to bring older projects up to that standard.

Sometime, in the next year, we have to convert our projects to GIT. Projects and a release system that he been on Svn for nearly a decade.

10
Dopamine Fish  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:29:23pm

re: #9 Belafon

Sometime, in the next year, we have to convert our projects to GIT. Projects and a release system that he been on Svn for nearly a decade.

SVN to Git isn’t actually all that bad. Even if you want to preserve history, I’m sure there’s a graceful migration path.

11
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:29:34pm

re: #4 Dopamine Fish

I use those a lot in my day job, but mostly because I can work across projects faster than opening VSCode. VSCode is an amazing tool for those who are working in a single project all day long.

Support for Python debugging alone was enough for me.

12
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:31:59pm

re: #10 Dopamine Fish

SVN to Git isn’t actually all that bad. Even if you want to preserve history, I’m sure there’s a graceful migration path.

The putting in GIT may not be that hard. We’re using Gradle to control our builds and we just have to go find all the places to change.

The group next to ours, when they converted to GIT, had numerous problems with check-ins wiping out some of their code.

13
JOE 🥓  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:32:02pm
14
First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:33:52pm

“If Microsoft ever does applications for Linux it means I’ve won.” — Linus Torvalds, author of git and grandpappy of Linux

15
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:35:33pm

My son and his friends get online and are doing their voiceovers on scenes from video games. My son is really good at it and does a great Shaggy and Patrick Star. For some reason, they all broke into singing the intro to Cowboy Bebop.

Tank! - Cowboy Bebop Opening [HD]

16
Dopamine Fish  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:35:54pm

re: #12 Belafon

The putting in GIT may not be that hard. We’re using Grable to control our builds and we just have to go find all the places to change.

The group next to ours, when they converted to GIT, had numerous problems with check-ins wiping out some of their code.

That’s a Git workflow problem. I’ve had to train a few new teams into new Git workflows. Just gotta remind people to merge from master frequently and to push to the central repo often.

17
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:36:51pm

re: #14 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

“Finally, Linux will be made simple enough for the non-super user.”

18
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:37:01pm

You know the so-called liberal media is going to cover this.

19
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:39:09pm

re: #16 Dopamine Fish

That’s a Git workflow problem. I’ve had to train a few new teams into new Git workflows. Just gotta remind people to merge from master frequently and to push to the central repo often.

Personally, I miss SourceSafe’s file locking mechanism. It was way less of a headache when, if you were going to modify a file that someone else was working on, that you either had to wait or negotiate with the other person to release their file.

20
Dopamine Fish  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:40:16pm

re: #19 Belafon

Personally, I miss SourceSafe’s file locking mechanism. It was way less of a headache when, if you were going to modify a file that someone else was working on, that you either had to wait or negotiate with the other person to release their file.

Speaking personally, that was a royal pain in the ass. Merge conflicts are nasty and annoying, but it’s easier for me to work through a merge conflict than to have to spend 15 minutes arguing with an entire team of people to get them to release the locks on half a repo’s worth of files so I can push my changes.

21
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:40:17pm

re: #18 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

“Which vaccine did you take?”
“Hydroxy-chlorine.”

22
I Would Prefer Not To  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:43:57pm

re: #18 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

You know the so-called liberal media is going to cover this.

[Embedded content]

I really want to see a reporter ask Sen Johnson where he is going to be spending his 4 of July vacation.

23
jaunte  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:44:13pm
24
First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:44:31pm

re: #17 Belafon

I work with more than zero people who have a PhD in education yet can’t grasp that the left mouse button and the right mouse button are meant to do two different things. IN THE YEAR 2021.

All the “simplicity” in the world can’t compensate for user incompetence.

25
lawhawk  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:53:51pm

re: #18 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

I was checking VAERS this morning. They got 384,000 reports total, with something like 1+ million symptoms claimed.

There’s a lot of people claiming headaches, pain, fever, and the like, but very few serious symptoms requiring hospitalization.

VAERS still has to go through and verify findings.

Someone could claim that they had a fever and chills or fever and headache, but that isn’t compensable. Heck, I had a headache and fever after the second shot. I had arm pain after both (more pronounced after first). That’s not rising to level of compensable damage IMO.

So, VAERS will separate out the real injuries from those side effects that are nuisances.

Even still.. we’re talking about 384,000 claims filed out of +300 million shots administered. Less than 0.1% of shots

26
jaunte  Jun 25, 2021 • 6:56:19pm

Ron Johnson, laser-focused on rabble-rousing over 0.1% of a problem.

27
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:19:52pm

re: #44 Jay C

“Excessive Heat Warning” for above the Arctic Circle?
But there’s snow up there in the winter, so global warming has to be a hoax….
//

re: #45 PhillyPretzel

This is Philly’s Forecast for the week.
forecast.weather.gov

The excessive heat moved out of the High Plains. Here it will be much colder.

28
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:21:44pm

For graduating from occupational therapy, my wife bought a new pair of dulcimer hammers to mark the occasion. They should be here in a few days.

29
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:24:18pm

re: #25 lawhawk

VAERS is pretty quick about it though. It didn’t take them long at all to note my wife had left out the lot number of the first Moderna shot she got and ask her for that (when she noted the vaccine restored her sense of smell which has been lost for decades).

She sent that yesterday, and today they responded back with a thank you.

30
sagehen  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:27:22pm

Quentin Tarantino is on Bill Maher tonight. I didn’t know he lives in Tel Aviv. (no, he didn’t convert. I’m sure they’d have let someone of his stature immigrate under any circumstances, but he got there as the Israeli wife’s +1.).

31
JOE 🥓  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:29:02pm
32
A Mom Anon  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:29:19pm

re: #30 sagehen

Maher is unwatchable, for me at least. He’s such a dick.

33
plansbandc  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:41:05pm

re: #32 A Mom Anon

I despise him.

34
jaunte  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:41:30pm
35
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:43:39pm
36
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:44:21pm

re: #34 jaunte

[Embedded content]

Which vaccines has Israel been using?

37
Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:44:23pm

re: #34 jaunte

I saw that WSJ story this morning but it’s a Murdoch rag so I’m a bit…skeptical.

38
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:47:13pm
39
Michele: Out of the closet, Into the fire  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:49:09pm

And zing. I missed the bullet. This time.

Thursday, July 1st

#840 next month if you haven’t payed attention.

But this kinda stinks.*

* AND individual numbers 144, 159, 626, 745 appear Thursday, July 1st at 8:45 a.m. (June selection)

I am a assuming this is a case in progress where the Jury has already been selected and the trail trial has lasted longer than expected. Sucks to be them. I hope it doesn’t happen to me.
* Yeah, edited. Sue nme

Trail, trial. What there is a difference? ///

40
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:50:45pm

re: #37 Eclectic Cyborg

I saw that WSJ story this morning but it’s a Murdoch rag so I’m a bit…skeptical.

Explained: Is Israel Facing Another COVID-19 Wave as the Delta Variant Spreads? (Haaretz, yesterday)

Research findings, including those by British health authorities published in the medical journal Lancet, show that two weeks after the second dose is administered, the Pfizer-BioNTech coronavirus vaccine is 88 percent effective against the delta variant. That is only slightly less than the 93 percent for the alpha variant.

As far as preventing the need for hospitalization for COVID carriers, data published last week by British health authorities, based on an analysis of about 14,000 cases, shows 96 percent efficacy following two doses of the Pfizer vaccine.

(more about the variant and the outbreak at the link)

41
No Malarkey!  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:54:26pm

I have mentioned before that we should forget about sending people to Mars for the time being, and just send robots. For the same reason UFOs aren’t extraterrestrials; space travel is incredibly difficult and dangerous.

42
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:55:07pm

re: #36 Belafon

Which vaccines has Israel been using?

Israel is using Pfizer and Moderna.

They are also developing their own at the Israel Institute of Biological Research, but it has not entered Phase I trials yet. That vaccine is a viral vector vaccine.

en.wikipedia.org

43
Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:55:15pm

re: #40 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

Much appreciated, thanks.

44
Dangerman  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:56:45pm

And Texas and Florida vote for these asshats

45
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:57:26pm

For whinging wingnuts.

A waterbear playing a tiny violin
46
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Jun 25, 2021 • 7:58:51pm

re: #27 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

The GFS temp anomaly output showed an extended heat wave in many places in the northern hemisphere, the last time I viewed it (a couple of days ago.)

47
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:00:23pm

re: #46 Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus

The GFS temp anomaly output showed an extended heat wave in many places in the northern hemisphere, the last time I viewed it (a couple of days ago.)

But there can’t be global warming because it’s cool here. /s

Speaking of which, I need to close up my house. It’s getting cold inside.

48
Dangerman  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:00:28pm

49
JOE 🥓  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:01:21pm

Do it, McCarthy! Pack the committee with Cawthorn, Gohmert, Gym Neighbors, Boobert and this asshole!

DO IT!

Kevin McCarthy may appoint Marjorie Taylor Greene to select committee on Trump’s Jan. 6 insurrection

rawstory.com

50
jaunte  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:05:07pm

re: #49 JOE 🥓

When all the tools you have are a dumb bag of hammers.

51
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:05:07pm

re: #44 Dangerman

Exclusive: Hacker reveals smart meters are spilling secrets about the Texas snowstorm (Daily Dot, June 24, 2021)

Power companies across Texas have refused to disclose which areas of the state were exempt from controlled blackouts after a devastating snowstorm crippled the power grid in February—but one hacker has found that smart meters, the electrical devices on the sides of homes and businesses that monitor energy consumption, are quietly broadcasting data that could be used to determine what infrastructure may have been protected.

Austin Energy has continually argued that disclosing what infrastructure it allowed to remain operational, such as hospitals and 911 call centers, could make the city and by extension its more than 1 million residents vulnerable to cyberattacks.

—-

“We are not able to provide that information since it’s protected critical infrastructure information,” Austin Energy spokeswoman Calily Bien told the Austin American-Statesman at the time.

Yet Hash, who has been reverse-engineering the inner-workings of smart meters since 2016, says the argument contains one major flaw: Smart meters used by Austin Energy and other power companies throughout Texas quietly emit data that shows how long businesses and residences have gone since their last power outage. Such information could potentially reveal whose power was shut off and whose wasn’t.

Hash’s discovery was made following extensive analysis of smart meters produced by Landis+Gyr, a multinational corporation that develops both smart meters and related software for electricity and gas utilities.

(more)

52
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:07:31pm

re: #47 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

Here’s the 2-meter temperature anomaly from the GFS, today’s run, from 18 Jun to 10 July:

Image: gfs-T2ma-nhem-fh-72-384.gif

Much of Eurasia and northern Africa are in extended heatwaves.

Now, you may say that the Sahara and central Asia are the hot places anyway.

Yes, that is correct. But the large positive anomaly means the hot places are getting even hotter.

53
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:12:55pm

re: #52 Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus

Here’s the 2-meter temperature anomaly from the GFS, today’s run, from 18 Jun to 10 July:

Image: gfs-T2ma-nhem-fh-72-384.gif

Much of Eurasia and northern Africa are in extended heatwaves.

Now, you may say that the Sahara and central Asia are the hot places anyway.

Yes, that is correct. But the large positive anomaly means the hot places are getting even hotter.

Yikes. That’s a lot of heat anomaly in most of the world.

But we have the purples and blues here on that chart, so the rest doesn’t matter. /s

54
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:13:47pm

re: #30 sagehen

Quentin Tarantino is on Bill Maher tonight. I didn’t know he lives in Tel Aviv. (no, he didn’t convert. I’m sure they’d have let someone of his stature immigrate under any circumstances, but he got there as the Israeli wife’s +1.).

Maybe living in Israel will change Tarantino’s perspective on violence. He and his family had to rush to bomb shelters during the recent Hamas attacks. He is now experiencing threats which are real and current, instead of historical.

Later in the show: Maher was irritating in his failure to understand why Google and other big tech are concerned and warning people who are pursuing information on certain topics. He seems oblivious to the fact that QAnon has led people down the rabbit hole from which they may never escape when the sources of information on a topic are conspiracy sites. For example, he was annoyed that apparently there was some interference in researching ivermectin — a drug I mentioned here the other day that was promoted by a Trump fanatic.

55
jaunte  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:15:58pm

re: #54 Hecuba’s daughter

“promoted by a Trump fanatic”

It’s a simple up or down system for judging recommendations!

56
No Malarkey!  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:18:29pm
57
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:18:31pm

More Daily Dot:

‘How are our police this badly trained?’: Cop demands mail truck’s registration—but Postal Service vehicles aren’t licensed

On Thursday, postal worker and TikToker @HoodHealerAngel posted a now-viral video showing a police officer pulling him over. The user says he was pulled over because the officer misidentified a package scanner as a phone.

As the video continues, the officer says that she needs to open the door to the Postal Service truck to verify the VIN number. As she starts to do so, @HoodHealerAngel tells her that she is not allowed to open the truck.

“Don’t open my door. This is government property. You can’t touch this,” @HoodHealerAngel says in the video that has over 15,000 likes.

“OK,” the officer responds. It’s unclear if there is any policy prohibiting police officers from searching Postal Service vehicles.

—-

The video ends with the driver asking the officer to come back to “the office” with him; the officer says no.

In the comments, TikToker’s lamented police officers’ lack of training and knowledge about the Postal Service.

(more)

58
William Lewis  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:19:36pm

re: #54 Hecuba’s daughter

Nah, he’ll still pimp out the violence porn. He’s incapable of making any other kind of movie which is why I don’t want him anywhere near Star Trek.

59
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:20:17pm

As localities around the world relax their guard, viruses find a way:

IHME | New COVID-19 Projections (June 24, 2021)

Around here most people have stopped wearing masks. Distancing isn’t so strict anymore too.

60
No Malarkey!  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:22:03pm

Rowdy tourists.

61
sagehen  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:24:58pm

re: #58 William Lewis

Nah, he’ll still pimp out the violence porn. He’s incapable of making any other kind of movie which is why I don’t want him anywhere near Star Trek.

Tarantino’s movies aren’t just about violence; they’re about REVENGE. That’s the animating motivation of ALL his characters. Seems tailor-made for a movie set in Israel.

62
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:26:19pm

Conservatives just have to put their proposals to be fired on the Internet. In this case another Covid-19 denying and racist nurse.

Alabama nurse fired after TikTok videos on slavery, COVID and more go viral (Advance Publications)

The first time he’s featured in the clip, Thompson is commenting on a woman who is talking about a COVID-19 study that’s now available for parents to enroll their kid in.

“So I got a question. So your six month old wants to be in a f——— clinical trial for COVID? Good job, Mom! These people are f——— stupid,” Thompson said before he’s interrupted by @rx0rcist, who goes by Savannah.

“I warned you that we were going to hold you accountable,” Savannah said, “You see, while you’ve gotten super comfortable spreading COVID disinformation, racism, homophobia, transphobia, Islamophobia, literally all the phobias you’ve hit in your videos, you forgot the part where freedom of speech does not mean freedom from consequences.”

The video then continues with Thompson saying he can call people whatever he wants to and says that there weren’t as many slave owners as people like to say there was, just people who wanted to use the victim card all the time.

Thompson even laughs at a video of somebody crying about the high costs of a doctor bill.

(more)

63
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:28:57pm

re: #40 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

Explained: Is Israel Facing Another COVID-19 Wave as the Delta Variant Spreads? (Haaretz, yesterday)

(more about the variant and the outbreak at the link)

The Business Insider article
 did repeat the story that it’s possible that up to half the cases were people who had been vaccinated but the infections were not as severe as among the unvaccinated.

64
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:30:17pm

re: #60 No Malarkey!

Rowdy tourists.

Wonderful people. Much blue lives matter energy there.

65
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:31:52pm

re: #62 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

66
JOE 🥓  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:35:13pm
67
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:35:26pm

re: #41 No Malarkey!

I have mentioned before that we should forget about sending people to Mars for the time being, and just send robots. For the same reason UFOs aren’t extraterrestrials; space travel is incredibly difficult and dangerous.

[Embedded content]

So is ocean travel. We just make it look easy because we’ve been doing it for thousands of years. But some managed to get to Hawaii without a map or compass.

68
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:36:27pm
69
jaunte  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:37:45pm
70
No Malarkey!  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:44:48pm

re: #67 Belafon

So is ocean travel. We just make it look easy because we’ve been doing it for thousands of years. But some managed to get to Hawaii without a map or compass.

They did. But Mars ain’t Hawaii. They weren’t being bombarded with cosmic radiation, and they didn’t arrive at a dead, poisonous planet where they would continue to be bombarded with deadly radiation. And they didn’t have the option to send robots instead of risking their own lives.

71
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:47:30pm

re: #70 No Malarkey!

They did. But Mars ain’t Hawaii. They weren’t being bombarded with cosmic radiation, and they didn’t arrive at a dead, poisonous planet where they would continue to be bombarded with deadly radiation. And they didn’t have the option to send robots instead of risking their own lives.

They knew nothing about where they were going either.

I see you’re the dad from Moana before his daughter ran off to save the world.

72
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:51:28pm
73
No Malarkey!  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:51:34pm

re: #71 Belafon

They knew nothing about where they were going either.

I see you’re the dad from Moana before his daughter ran off to save the world.

Mars isn’t going to save the world. I love space exploration, but we can explore Mars with fleets of robots at a fraction of the cost of one manned mission, and no-one has to die.

74
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:53:16pm

(0:14)

75
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:53:55pm

re: #71 Belafon

They knew nothing about where they were going either.

I see you’re the dad from Moana before his daughter ran off to save the world.

And they certainly didn’t know the dangers they would face on their journeys. We understand the hazards of space travel and can protect our explorers to a greater extent than those who traversed the earth in the past.

76
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:55:43pm
77
No Malarkey!  Jun 25, 2021 • 8:58:26pm

re: #75 Hecuba’s daughter

And they certainly didn’t know the dangers they would face on their journeys. We understand the hazards of space travel and can protect our explorers to a greater extent than those who traversed the earth in the past.

That’s the thing, we can’t protect them. Once they are on a minimum near two year voyage through deep space, it will be a near miracle if they make it back alive. And for what? We have robots on Mars; it’s a death trap.

78
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:01:12pm

re: #77 No Malarkey!

That’s the thing, we can’t protect them. Once they are on a minimum near two year voyage through deep space, it will be a near miracle if they make it back alive. And for what? We have robots on Mars; it’s a death trap.

And once explorers launched across the ocean, there was no way to protect them either.

Columbus only is famous because he ran into North America and was able to resupply (and enslave the natives).

Had the continent been just a little farther away, or not there at all, or his ships hit by a hurricane, they’d likely have spent a long time talking about the unknown dangers of the Atlantic and how it’s dangerous to explore it.

79
DesertDenizen  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:01:29pm

re: #77 No Malarkey!

That’s the thing, we can’t protect them. Once they are on a minimum near two year voyage through deep space, it will be a near miracle if they make it back alive. And for what? We have robots on Mars; it’s a death trap.

Yet the astronauts want to go anyway. It’s human nature. We want to explore, and sending robots isn’t the same. A good friend, an Army Doctor, has applied to the astronaut program partly out of a desire to go to Mars.

80
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:07:32pm

(1:10)

81
JOE 🥓  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:08:40pm
82
gocart mozart  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:12:14pm
83
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:13:26pm
84
No Malarkey!  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:13:41pm

re: #78 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

And once explorers launched across the ocean, there was no way to protect them either.

Columbus only is famous because he ran into North America and was able to resupply (and enslave the natives).

Had the continent been just a little farther away, or not there at all, or his ships hit by a hurricane, they’d likely have spent a long time talking about the unknown dangers of the Atlantic and how it’s dangerous to explore it.

But Columbus thought he was traveling to the fabulously wealthy Asian continent, and he actually arrived at the fabulously wealthy western hemisphere. We would be sending people to a poisonous planet to be bombarded with deadly radiation so that they can analyze rocks already being analyzed by robots. Would it be cool to see people walking on Mars on my tv? Of course. But is it worth it. Look at what happened to the folks in the bio-dome experiment, and they could be helped when things went wrong.

85
Jack Burton, Gunner on Death Star of David  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:16:37pm

Do I need to whip out the B5 “All this would have been for nothing” clip again?

86
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:17:27pm

re: #81 JOE 🥓

87
No Malarkey!  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:17:59pm

No hard feelings, it’s an interesting argument, and if we do send a manned mission to Mars in my lifetime, I’ll be in the edge of my seat thrilling to it like everyone else.

88
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:21:31pm
89
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:29:24pm

re: #84 No Malarkey!

But Columbus thought he was traveling to the fabulously wealthy Asian continent, and he actually arrived at the fabulously wealthy western hemisphere. We would be sending people to a poisonous planet to be bombarded with deadly radiation so that they can analyze rocks already being analyzed by robots. Would it be cool to see people walking on Mars on my tv? Of course. But is it worth it. Look at what happened to the folks in the bio-dome experiment, and they could be helped when things went wrong.

That’s true that he thought he was travelling to Asia. I think you didn’t catch the part where he and his crew would have starved to death if North America wasn’t in the way.

Untold numbers of people have died right here on Earth exploring.

There are graves all along US-26 from pioneers going to Oregon, Utah, and California, some very near my home. They knew they were going for a lot less than fabulous wealth (though some might have thought that). And even with the knowns of Native attacks defending their homes, cholera, dysentery, measles, scurvy, &c, they kept on coming.

There is graffiti carved into Scott’s Bluff from those pioneers. The mountain itself is named after a person who didn’t make it, Hiram Scott.

90
JOE 🥓  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:29:55pm

re: #86 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

But even that won’t change Jimmy Dore’s crush on TOOLSI

91
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:40:09pm

The story of Hiram Scott, after whom Scott’s Bluff, Scott’s Bluff County, and the City of Scottsbluff are named.

Around 1825 a fur trapping party was “descending the upper part of the (Nebraska) River in canoes when their frail barks were overturned and all their powder spoiled. Their rifles being thus rendered useless they were unable to procure food by hunting and had to depend upon roots and wild fruits for subsistence. After suffering extremely from hunger, they arrived at Laramie’s Fork, a small tributary of the north branch of the Nebraska, about sixty miles above the cliffs just mentioned. Here, one of their party by the name of Scott was taken ill; and his companions came to a halt, until he should recover health and strength sufficient to proceed. While they were searching round in quest of edible roots they discovered a fresh trail of white men, who had evidently but recently preceded them. What was to be done? By a forced march they might overtake this party, and thus be able to reach the settlements in safety. Should they linger they might all perish of famine and exhaustion. Scott, however, was incapable of moving; they were too feeble to aid him forward, and dreaded that such a clog would prevent them coming up with the advance party. They determined, therefore, to abandon him to his fate. Accordingly, under pretense of seeking food, and such simples as might be efficacious in his malady, they deserted him and hastened forward upon the trail. They succeeded in overtaking the party of which they were in quest, but concealed their faithless desertion of Scott; alleging that he had died of disease.

“On the ensuing summer, these very individuals, visiting these parts in company with others, came suddenly upon the bleached bones and grinning skull of a human skeleton, which by certain signs, they recognized for the remains of Scott. This was sixty long miles from the place where they had abandoned him; and it appeared that the wretched man had crawled that immense distance before death put an end to his miseries. The wild and picturesque bluffs in the neighborhood of his lonely grave have ever since borne his name.”

(“The Adventures of Captain Bonneville” by Washington Irving)

92
Belafon  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:46:09pm

re: #89 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

That’s true that he thought he was travelling to Asia. I think you didn’t catch the part where he and his crew would have starved to death if North America wasn’t in the way.

Untold numbers of people have died right here on Earth exploring.

There are graves all along US-26 from pioneers going to Oregon, Utah, and California, some very near my home. They knew they were going for a lot less than fabulous wealth (though some might have thought that). And even with the knowns of Native attacks defending their homes, cholera, dysentery, measles, scurvy, &c, they kept on coming.

There is graffiti carved into Scott’s Bluff from those pioneers. The mountain itself is named after a person who didn’t make it, Hiram Scott.

I wonder how many Pacific travelers didn’t make it from Indonesia to the other islands in the Pacific

93
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 9:57:00pm
94
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:01:10pm
95
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:03:52pm
96
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:07:51pm

re: #92 Belafon

I wonder how many Pacific travelers didn’t make it from Indonesia to the other islands in the Pacific

If we don’t destroy ourselves or our planet in the next few years, it would not be surprising if we succeed in traveling to Mars before mid-century. Humans have a drive to explore new territory — and Mars is the nearest new destination.

97
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:11:07pm
98
Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:12:09pm

re: #97 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

Yikes. Amazon won’t like that.

99
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:19:37pm
Byron W. Brown, stung by Tuesday’s shocker loss to challenger India B. Walton in the Democratic primary for mayor, is weighing a last-ditch effort to salvage a fifth term through a write-in campaign in the November general election.

Several sources, including Erie County Democratic Chairman Jeremy J. Zellner, say Brown is holed up with his campaign team to determine if he can wage a write-in effort - considered more than daunting in political circles - especially in ultra-Democratic Buffalo.

“He and I talked about that this morning,” Zellner said Wednesday afternoon. “Without speaking for him, I think it’s fair to say they’re weighing all their options, for sure.”

But if Brown decides to challenge Walton in an effort never seriously attempted in a Buffalo mayoral election, Zellner said Erie County Democrats will not be with him.

“I have pledged our full support to her,” the chairman said following a morning conversation with Walton. “We are with the next mayor of Buffalo - India Walton.”

Still, other sources say the mayor continues to consider the option, especially after various community leaders are expressing alarm about a city led by Walton, who acknowledges her socialist politics. Some of those leaders, sources say, are urging Brown to mobilize his City Hall forces to a degree that apparently failed during the primary.

(more at the Buffalo News)

Mayor Byron Brown weighing write-in campaign against India Walton

100
Punish Domestic Terrorists  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:19:49pm

He says he said he was in the cult so the leftist media would say he’s in a cult, showing they’re biased. No, it does not make any sense at all.

Man Hoping to Unseat Liz Cheney Says He Pretended to Support QAnon to Discredit Media (Newsweak via MSN)

101
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:23:26pm

re: #100 Punish Domestic Terrorists

What the heck does a Florida wingnut have to do with an election in Wyoming anyway?

Plus Wyoming already has a state senator lined up against her, who more properly fits the role of a Republican (entangled in a past accusation of child rape).

102
Targetpractice  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:24:06pm

We as a species cannot remain on this rock forever. Eventually we’re going to have to start making our way to other planets, other moons, if only to ensure our long-term survival. And if all we send beyond our world is probes and rovers, then those will be the only things left of us if the day comes that the universe calls in our marker.

103
William Lewis  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:27:38pm

re: #102 Targetpractice

Exactly. As long as all the eggs are in a single basket, one accident can destroy them all. Self sustaining colonies in multiple places are necessary for the long term.

104
Anymouse 🌹🏡😷  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:28:29pm

I’m cold, so I’m going to stagger off to bed. Catch y’all later.

105
JOE 🥓  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:30:52pm

Pulpit Pimp Flips Out

106
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:31:47pm

re: #103 William Lewis

Exactly. As long as all the eggs are in a single basket, one accident can destroy them all. Self sustaining colonies in multiple places are necessary for the long term.

Unfortunately that does require we eventually find a way to other solar systems — and that is certainly beyond today’s technology. But we do have a billion years before this system becomes uninhabitable.

107
plansbandc  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:31:48pm

re: #105 JOE 🥓

Wow. What a loving person.

108
sagehen  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:38:54pm

re: #106 Hecuba’s daughter

Unfortunately that does require we eventually find a way to other solar systems — and that is certainly beyond today’s technology. But we do have a billion years before this system becomes uninhabitable.

I dunno… it’s been awhile since I read Kim Stanley Robinson’s Mars trilogy. Is the terraforming technology he suggests doable?

109
Dread Pirate Ron  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:40:28pm
110
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 25, 2021 • 10:55:28pm

re: #103 William Lewis

Exactly. As long as all the eggs are in a single basket, one accident can destroy them all. Self sustaining colonies in multiple places are necessary for the long term.

True in the long run, but the jump between landing humans on the moon and landing them on Mars is a really big one. Too big, IMHO — at this point it’s a suicide mission. We need to practice before we send anyone all that way. My own preference would be to plan an extended stay on the moon, to find out how to keep them going there for an long period.

While we’re doing that, we can work on the logistics of sending enough food, water and air to sustain our explorers for a couple of years moving out and another couple of years coming back, while protecting them (and their ship and supplies) from constant cosmic ray bombardment (they’ll need that on the moon too, so it’s good practice in another way). It’s not a trivial problem.

111
Dr Lizardo  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:01:03pm

re: #109 Dread Pirate Ron

Sweet. We’re getting astromech droids!

112
Dread Pirate Ron  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:11:18pm
113
Targetpractice  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:12:10pm

re: #110 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

True in the long run, but the jump between landing humans on the moon and landing them on Mars is a really big one. Too big, IMHO — at this point it’s a suicide mission. We need to practice before we send anyone all that way. My own preference would be to plan an extended stay on the moon, to find out how to keep them going there for an long period.

While we’re doing that, we can work on the logistics of sending enough food, water and air to sustain our explorers for a couple of years moving out and another couple of years coming back, while protecting them (and their ship and supplies) from constant cosmic ray bombardment (they’ll need that on the moon too, so it’s good practice in another way). It’s not a trivial problem.

Well, the good thing is that for at least three of those (water, air, & protection), future Mars explorers would be able to live off the land. There are rocks on the Martian surface at certain latitudes (ex: gypsum) that can be pulverized and heated to release water vapors contained within. And one of the experiments aboard Perserverence is a prototype reactor that has proven it possible to use catalysts to convert the Martian atmosphere into oxygen. And the solution to radiation is the same as it would likely be on the Moon: covering the habitats under soil and rock to act as a barrier.

That just leaves food, which for an expedition of any length would require the astronauts to pack their own in until something more self-sustaining could be implemented. The difficulty there is that the Martian soil itself is toxic, requiring processing before it could be used for farming anything safe to consume by humans. But that’s a problem to be overcome, not a barrier to human exploration of the planet.

114
Dr Lizardo  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:12:53pm

re: #112 Dread Pirate Ron

Why do I get the feeling the Missouri has an overall low vaccination rate?

115
William Lewis  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:19:15pm

re: #113 Targetpractice

But that’s a problem to be overcome, not a barrier to human exploration of the planet.

As the saying goes, that’s an engineering problem, not a science problem.

116
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:28:07pm

re: #113 Targetpractice

That just leaves food, which for an expedition of any length would require the astronauts to pack their own in until something more self-sustaining could be implemented. The difficulty there is that the Martian soil itself is toxic, requiring processing before it could be used for farming anything safe to consume by humans. But that’s a problem to be overcome, not a barrier to human exploration of the planet.

Until the food problem is overcome, sending humans to Mars will remain an impossible barrier. And producing breathable air and heat isn’t something we can just scale up from the example of Persistence. The more detail we examine, the surer I am that we’re just not ready, and need to work out a whole lot of details before we can plan the mission.

Also too, don’t forget the problem of two years of radiation exposure out and back. Covering the habitats during the journey would not be feasible.

117
Dread Pirate Ron  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:32:51pm

re: #114 Dr Lizardo

Missouri stopped reporting deaths at the beginning of the month.

118
Dread Pirate Ron  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:36:03pm

My county.

119
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:41:23pm

re: #118 Dread Pirate Ron

My county.

[Embedded content]

Alameda county is at 67% fully vaccinated, 80% partial. We’re getting there…

120
Targetpractice  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:44:29pm

re: #116 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

Until the food problem is overcome, sending humans to Mars will remain an impossible barrier. And producing breathable air and heat isn’t something we can just scale up from the example of Persistence. The more detail we examine, the surer I am that we’re just not ready, and need to work out a whole lot of details before we can plan the mission.

Also too, don’t forget the problem of two years of radiation exposure out and back. Covering the habitats during the journey would not be feasible.

The answer to the food problem in the short term is regular supply shipments, which you could start sending months or years in advance of a manned mission. And I was mistaken, the MOXIE experiment on Perseverance doesn’t use a catalyst, it uses a solid oxide electrolysis cell to break down atmospheric CO2 into carbon monoxide and pure oxygen. And the test unit itself is only a proof of concept for utilizing a proven technology in a new environment, so there’s no reason that it can’t be scaled up. In fact, such tech is the basis for producing rocket fuel on the Mars surface to make return trips easier.

As for the dangers of getting to and from, the only real solution is shortening the trip from the 6+ months that it presently takes to get there. That would mean researching and adopting exotic propulsion technologies that currently are out of our reach either due to technological or (in certain cases) political hurdles. And yeah, this is a place where having a Lunar colony already in place would really help, if only because it would be an easier jumping off point than trying to lift everything we need for a Mars expedition into Earth orbit.

121
Dread Pirate Ron  Jun 25, 2021 • 11:54:08pm

Are we sure they aren’t sentient?

122
Targetpractice  Jun 26, 2021 • 12:19:50am

Really, the biggest obstacle to exploring (let alone colonizing) Mars is the same as would be encountered on the Moon: Finding enough energy. The immediate energy investment will be just in getting the initial settlement and all the supplies you need to the surface, whether it’s a week-long journey or a 6+ month one. If you don’t have the power to process local resources into O2 and water, you’ll have to send regular shipments of those. Food will have to also be sent in regular shipments until you how the power infrastructure to run greenhouses and farms. You’ll need some form of centrifugal habitat to provide pseudo-gravity or else you’re going to have regular turnover of colonists to avoid medical issues associated with micro-gravity. And so on and so forth.

Basically, if we send humans to Mars, we have to be prepared for them to be there for awhile. Not missions like Apollo that were measured in hours or days, but in weeks or months. Anything less is simply not worth the time and investment needed to make it happen.

123
Jack Burton, Gunner on Death Star of David  Jun 26, 2021 • 12:26:50am

re: #122 Targetpractice

Reason #23463758 to get over the irrational fear of anything that has the word “nuclear” in it.

124
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Jun 26, 2021 • 12:33:19am

re: #102 Targetpractice

We’re not going anywhere else.

Sorry.

We are marooned here.

125
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Jun 26, 2021 • 12:34:41am

.

B.B. King - Ole Time Religion [1959]

..

126
Targetpractice  Jun 26, 2021 • 12:58:26am

re: #124 Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus

We’re not going anywhere else.

Sorry.

We are marooned here.

“Earth is the cradle of humanity, but one cannot live in a cradle forever.”

127
Jack Burton, Gunner on Death Star of David  Jun 26, 2021 • 1:01:50am

Getting to Proxima Centauri or Alpha Centauri with nuclear propulsion in a single human lifetime is *almost* possible now. Sending probes to study that solar system could be done but at enormous expense. Beyond pure science the cost/reward ratio isn’t worth it right now IMO. But that is just a starting point.

Constant 1G acceleration that distance (and flipping around to 1G decelerate after the half way point) isn’t possible yet but is not unreasonable within a few hundred years. At that point, Alpha Centauri is a 5 year 3 month trip. I’m really not up for the math of figuring out time dilation for accelerating craft, but I do know that such a vessel would potentially get to .9c by the time it turns around so it would probably feel far less than 5 years to the crew.

128
Dread Pirate Ron  Jun 26, 2021 • 1:34:17am

YouTube

129
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Jun 26, 2021 • 1:40:52am

re: #127 Jack Burton, Gunner on Death Star of David

…a vessel would potentially get to .9c by the time it turns around so it would probably feel far less than 5 years to the crew.

Alas, no: Relativistic rocket

130
Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus  Jun 26, 2021 • 1:41:36am

Everyone thinks Einstein is cool….

… until he crushes your dreams.

131
Teukka  Jun 26, 2021 • 1:44:13am

re: #130 Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus

Everyone thinks Einstein is cool….

… until he crushes your dreams.

Also, I suspect that once we crack interstellar travel technology/technologies, it won’t be an “Eureka! I got it!” moment, but more of a “Hmm. This is funny…” followed by “D’oh!”.

132
John Hughes  Jun 26, 2021 • 1:46:32am

re: #14 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

“If Microsoft ever does applications for Linux it means I’ve won.” — Linus Torvalds, author of git and grandpappy of Linux

Oh, hang on, got a TEAMS chat going on in the other window.

133
Jack Burton, Gunner on Death Star of David  Jun 26, 2021 • 2:05:04am

re: #129 Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus

Alas, no: Relativistic rocket

If it maintains 1g acceleration it would go relativistic in a relatively short period of time. I didn’t say it was easy or possible now. I specifically said maybe in a few hundred years.

Guessing what’s possible in a few hundred years never results in Hari Seldon like accuracy. Look at what futurists believed about the year 2000 in the 1800s. If you could travel back in time and talk to Isaac Newton about physics the average college student knows now, he’d think you were a fucking lunatic.

134
Dr Lizardo  Jun 26, 2021 • 2:49:30am

You love to see it….

James Cusick, Jr., the founder and pastor of the Global Outreach Church in Melbourne, Florida, was arrested this Thursday, along with his son, church vice-president Casey Cusick. As WMNF points out, the arrests come one week after Florida Democratic Rep. Charlie Crist called for an investigation into the state’s connection to the Capitol attack.

The pair were arrested after a tip from David Lesperance, who is a member of Global Outreach Church and was also arrested for partaking in the attack.

deadstate.org

135
Dopamine Fish  Jun 26, 2021 • 2:57:16am

HE WANTED TO KILL MY FRIENDS. FUCK THIS GUY.

136
First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Jun 26, 2021 • 4:06:00am

re: #126 Targetpractice

The Great Filter

With no evidence of intelligent life in other places than the Earth, it appears that the process of starting with a star and ending with “advanced explosive lasting life” must be unlikely. This implies that at least one step in this process must be improbable. Hanson’s list, while incomplete, describes the following nine steps in an “evolutionary path” that results in the colonization of the observable universe:

The right star system (including organics and potentially habitable planets)

Reproductive molecules (e.g. RNA)

Simple (prokaryotic) single-cell life

Complex (eukaryotic) single-cell life

Sexual reproduction

Multi-cell life

Tool-using animals with intelligence

A civilization advancing toward the potential for a colonization explosion (where we are now)

Colonization explosion

According to the Great Filter hypothesis, at least one of these steps—if the list were complete—must be improbable. If it is not an early step (i.e., in our past), then the implication is that the improbable step lies in our future and our prospects of reaching step 9 (interstellar colonization) are still bleak. If the past steps are likely, then many civilizations would have developed to the current level of the human species. However, none appear to have made it to step 9, or the Milky Way would be full of colonies. So perhaps step 9 is the unlikely one, and the only things that appear likely to keep us from step 9 are some sort of catastrophe, an underestimation of the impact of procrastination as technology increasingly unburdens existence, or resource exhaustion leading to the impossibility of making the step due to consumption of the available resources (for example highly constrained energy resources).[6] So by this argument, finding multicellular life on Mars (provided it evolved independently) would be bad news, since it would imply steps 2-6 are easy, and hence only 1, 7, 8 or 9 (or some unknown step) could be the big problem.[4]

Although steps 1-8 have occurred on Earth, any one of these may be unlikely. If the first seven steps are necessary preconditions to calculating the likelihood (using the local environment) then an anthropically biased observer can infer nothing about the general probabilities from its (pre-determined) surroundings.

It’s very anthropocentric but I think this has significant merit.

137
steve_davis  Jun 26, 2021 • 4:12:00am

re: #32 A Mom Anon

Maher is unwatchable, for me at least. He’s such a dick.

I stopped watching him when he told Kasparov to shut up. Not coincidentally, that’s the last time Kasparov has watched him as well. He used to be semi-regular, but not after that.

138
First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Jun 26, 2021 • 4:19:13am

re: #32 A Mom Anon

Maher is unwatchable, for me at least. He’s such a dick.

I sometimes watch his show depending on who the guests are, but I can’t stand HIM. He’s dumber than a bag of left-handed hammers, and his “comedy” is unforgivably un-funny. Just flat-out lame. Plus, he steals jokes from other, much more talented comics.

139
steve_davis  Jun 26, 2021 • 4:20:26am

re: #57 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

More Daily Dot:

‘How are our police this badly trained?’: Cop demands mail truck’s registration—but Postal Service vehicles aren’t licensed

(more)

It is not unclear if it is illegal for the cops to search postal vehicles. It is illegal as hell. It would constitute interference with the delivery of the mail, which is a felony. Once mail is in the postal system, nobody touches that shit except postal employees and the recipient, eventually. I remember a postal employee telling me that if a piece of mail gets dropped while it’s being sorted and winds up on the floor, they have to have a supervisor come over and witness the piece of mail getting picked up and dealt with. They are serious as shit about that stuff.

140
steve_davis  Jun 26, 2021 • 4:35:41am

re: #89 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

That’s true that he thought he was travelling to Asia. I think you didn’t catch the part where he and his crew would have starved to death if North America wasn’t in the way.

Untold numbers of people have died right here on Earth exploring.

There are graves all along US-26 from pioneers going to Oregon, Utah, and California, some very near my home. They knew they were going for a lot less than fabulous wealth (though some might have thought that). And even with the knowns of Native attacks defending their homes, cholera, dysentery, measles, scurvy, &c, they kept on coming.

There is graffiti carved into Scott’s Bluff from those pioneers. The mountain itself is named after a person who didn’t make it, Hiram Scott.

He didn’t think about that because the estimates were that the world was about 5,000 miles smaller than it was. And the reason he thought that is because a diaspora of Jews from the Muslim world at that time brought with it a rediscovery of Greek texts where someone whom I’ve forgotten estimated the diameter of the planet based on measuring the curvature through where the sun was in the sky at various places when it was at the zenith somewhere in Egypt. But they weren’t quite accurate with their distances between points, unsurprisingly, and the error was cumulative. This didn’t make it into a Connections episode, but it damned well should have, because it’s cool as hell.

141
steve_davis  Jun 26, 2021 • 4:40:27am

re: #108 sagehen

I dunno… it’s been awhile since I read Kim Stanley Robinson’s Mars trilogy. Is the terraforming technology he suggests doable?

we can almost build a space elevator now, and that would be a massive game-changer.

142
Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 26, 2021 • 4:59:09am

re: #135 Dopamine Fish

HE WANTED TO KILL MY FRIENDS. FUCK THIS GUY.

I always knew it was worse than we ever imagined…and I’m sure there’s more to come.

143
jeffreyw  Jun 26, 2021 • 5:12:39am

Good morning!

144
Dave In Austin  Jun 26, 2021 • 5:34:22am

Insurrection Thread:

145
Dangerman  Jun 26, 2021 • 5:41:46am

green heron just flew in
we’re just assuming it’s the same one every day

this time instead of wading at the edges, it jumped right out into the middle deep of the pond where the fish were feeding, grabbed a good sized one and ‘flew’ back to the deck. interesting cause there are like 30 or so smaller ones.

again it was a pretty good sized fish - one of the more ornamental comets and by the size probably one of the original 7.

this time it worked it around for a few minutes, then swallowed it whole

now hes wading in the shallows on the first shelf. more food? where’s he gonna put it?

146
Dangerman  Jun 26, 2021 • 5:46:51am

yup got another one
smaller
swallowed it before I could snap a pic

147
Dr Lizardo  Jun 26, 2021 • 5:52:38am

re: #144 Dave In Austin

Offer them witness protection if they’re willing to flip on higher-ups?

Eh, we did it with Cosa Nostra, I figure we can do it with these asshats. Depends on who they’re willing to flip. If they rat out, let’s say, Roger Stone or some high-profile GOP member of Congress - or better yet, someone high-up in TFG’s administration - I’d say that’s a legit case for witness protection.

148
Dangerman  Jun 26, 2021 • 5:55:20am

re: #147 Dr Lizardo

Offer them witness protection if they’re willing to flip on higher-ups?

Eh, we did it with Cosa Nostra, I figure we can do it with these asshats. Depends on who they’re willing to flip. If they rat out, let’s say, Roger Stone or some high-profile GOP member of Congress - or better yet, someone high-up in TFG’s administration - I’d say that’s a legit case for witness protection.

theyd still need to be closely monitored/watched/guarded
Just cause they got caught and squealed a bit doesn’t mean they’re done or they’ve had a permanent change of heart

149
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 5:58:07am

re: #120 Targetpractice

The vertical faming techniques we’ve seen pop up dont use soil at all.

150
Dangerman  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:01:48am

re: #124 Love-Child of Cassandra and Sisyphus

We’re not going anywhere else.

Sorry.

We are marooned here.

I thought we were divinely and lovingly and carefully placed here

151
Dopamine Fish  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:02:15am

Today’s breakfast:

For the kids - bacon, egg in the middle of bread.
Mrs. Fish has pepper added to her bacon.
I made a breakfast burrito with scrambled eggs, pepper bacon, and cheese.
Nom.

152
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:05:38am

re: #133 Jack Burton, Gunner on Death Star of David

If it maintains 1g acceleration it would go relativistic in a relatively short period of time. I didn’t say it was easy or possible now. I specifically said maybe in a few hundred years.

Guessing what’s possible in a few hundred years never results in Hari Seldon like accuracy. Look at what futurists believed about the year 2000 in the 1800s. If you could travel back in time and talk to Isaac Newton about physics the average college student knows now, he’d think you were a fucking lunatic.

Shadowrun, a game created in the late 80s about an alternate future after 2012, didn’t predict wireless technology. Neuromancer had a bank of pay phones at an airport.

153
Dr Lizardo  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:09:22am

re: #148 Dangerman

theyd still need to be closely monitored/watched/guarded
Just cause they got caught and squealed a bit doesn’t mean they’re done or they’ve had a permanent change of heart

Of course, that goes without saying. These fuckers simply aren’t to be trusted. They need to be on some kind of domestic terrorist watchlist, even under witness protection.

154
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:13:48am

A use for grapefruit:

155
Dangerman  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:14:16am

re: #151 Dopamine Fish

Today’s breakfast:

For the kids - bacon, egg in the middle of bread.
Mrs. Fish has pepper added to her bacon.
I made a breakfast burrito with scrambled eggs, pepper bacon, and cheese.
Nom.

Steel cut oats for the humans
Kibble and pate for the felines
Flakes and pellets for indoor and outdoor fish
Outdoor fish for the heron

156
William Lewis  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:18:15am

re: #152 Belafon

Shadowrun, a game created in the late 80s about an alternate future after 2012, didn’t predict wireless technology. Neuromancer had a bank of pay phones at an airport.

Neuromancer also had an opening sentence that will mean different things depending on when you were born…
“The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel.”

I doubt my son has ever seen the snowy static of no signal just the blue used by the TV companies now to show an empty channel.

157
Dangerman  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:20:40am

There are some creepy undercurrents here

Donald Trump enjoyed tormenting Rudy Giuliani, mocking him for falling asleep in meetings and calling him ‘pathetic’ after the former mayor’s television appearances,” the Daily Mail reports.

“Giuliani ‘rarely complained’ and, instead, ‘seemed to crave the attention,’ according to Michael Bender in his new book Frankly, We Did Win This Election: The Inside Story of How Trump Lost.”

158
Dr Lizardo  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:21:08am

re: #156 William Lewis

Neuromancer also had an opening sentence that will mean different things depending on when you were born…
“The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel.”

I doubt my son has ever seen the snowy static of no signal just the blue used by the TV companies now to show an empty channel.

I wonder how many young Americans would raise a quizzical eyebrow at the national anthem end of broadcast day signoff in the original Poltergeist?

159
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:21:31am
160
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:23:20am

Exactly what is happening at my company, and I will say the answer is most likely going to be not much.

161
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:25:09am
162
GlutenFreeJesus  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:49:58am

Gee. Who would have predicted this.

163
William Lewis  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:55:12am

re: #162 GlutenFreeJesus

[Embedded content]

Gee. Who would have predicted this.

Stupid fucking John Wayne wannabes…

164
Dave In Austin  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:57:08am
165
Dave In Austin  Jun 26, 2021 • 6:59:30am

The bulldogs do not like the new Roomba. I sure do.

166
Dopamine Fish  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:01:29am

re: #160 Belafon

Exactly what is happening at my company, and I will say the answer is most likely going to be not much.

Nominally, we are the same way, but no one is wearing masks in the office that I’ve seen. However, it is also entirely possible that we’re all vaccinated; every single member of my team got their shots, at least.

167
Eric The Fruit Bat  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:06:15am

re: #163 William Lewis

So much for the NRA’s “The only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun”.

This would actually make a great ad for gun control advocates - all the end of the ad has to say is: “Really?”

168
Dopamine Fish  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:07:17am

re: #167 Eric The Fruit Bat

So much for the NRA’s “The only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun”.

This would actually make a great ad for gun control advocates - all the end of the ad has to say is: “Really?”

Well, give the man credit, he DID stop the bad guy with the gun. The only problem is, the police mistook HIM for the bad guy with the gun, which makes our entire point: “How, exactly, do the police tell the difference between a bad guy with a gun and a good guy with a gun?”

169
Dr Lizardo  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:11:08am

Still too soon to say with absolute certainty, but looks like structural problems with the Champlain Tower South in Miami could’ve led to its collapse:

The oceanfront condominium building that collapsed near Miami had “major structural damage” to a concrete slab below its pool deck that needed to be extensively repaired, according to a 2018 engineering report on the building.

The report was among a series of documents released by the city of Surfside as rescuers continued to dig Saturday through the rubble of the building in an effort to find any of the 159 people who remain unaccounted for after its collapse. At least four people were killed.

—————

It said the waterproofing under the pool deck had failed and had been improperly laid flat instead of sloped, preventing water from draining off.

“The failed waterproofing is causing major structural damage to the concrete structural slab below these areas. Failure to replaced the waterproofing in the near future will cause the extent of the concrete deterioration to expand exponentially,” the report said.

The firm recommended that the damaged slabs be replaced in what would be a major repair.

The report also uncovered “abundant cracking and spalling” of concrete columns, beams and walls in the parking garage. Some of the damage was minor, while other columns had exposed and deteriorating rebar. It also noted that many of the building’s previous attempts to fix the columns and other damage with epoxy were marred by poor workmanship and were failing.

Beneath the pool deck “where the slab had been epoxy-injected, new cracks were radiating from the originally repaired cracks,” the report said.

apnews.com

170
Dopamine Fish  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:15:07am

re: #169 Dr Lizardo

Still too soon to say with absolute certainty, but looks like structural problems with the Champlain Tower South in Miami could’ve led to its collapse:

—————

apnews.com

I’m wondering if this was an engineering issue, or if the contractors didn’t build it to spec. 90% likely it’s the latter, but engineers do make mistakes, and unfortunately, they’re sometimes deadly.

171
William Lewis  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:16:04am

re: #168 Dopamine Fish

Well, give the man credit, he DID stop the bad guy with the gun. The only problem is, the police mistook HIM for the bad guy with the gun, which makes our entire point: “How, exactly, do the police tell the difference between a bad guy with a gun and a good guy with a gun?”

They can’t.

As someone who carries, I look at it like this: Do not pull your weapon unless there is absolutely utterly no other way to prevent the loss of life. That moment was already passed and he was playing cop.

If you do pull and shoot, after the incident is over, place your weapon on the ground and sit, hands in the air, far enough away from it that you can not possibly reach it and do everything the cops tell you to do. Expect to be cuffed, arrested and charged. IF you’re really lucky the charges will be dropped in a month or two and you might be able to get your firearm back from evidence.

172
Dopamine Fish  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:16:38am

re: #171 William Lewis

You literally pulled every thought from my brain on the matter. Well stated.

173
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:19:39am

re: #119 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

Alameda county is at 67% fully vaccinated, 80% partial. We’re getting there…

Among those 12 and over, Cook county is 54.4% fully vaccinated and 71.9% partial. Illinois as a whole has met Biden’s goal of 70% adults partially vaccinated.

Re: earlier comment that Missouri has stopped reporting deaths. Hopefully this is a temporary situation and that they will resume on a regular schedule. They are reporting new cases.

174
First As Tragedy, Then As Farce  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:24:07am

re: #165 Dave In Austin

I don’t trust those things not to run over an errant dog turd and smear it all over the place.

175
A Cranky One  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:34:59am

Hmmm…

Seeing a trend here,:

176
Barefoot Grin  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:37:02am

re: #175 A Cranky One

Hmmm…

Seeing a trend here,:

[Embedded content]

Parentage includes a Champion Chihuahua named Malthus.

177
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:37:45am

re: #166 Dopamine Fish

Nominally, we are the same way, but no one is wearing masks in the office that I’ve seen. However, it is also entirely possible that we’re all vaccinated; every single member of my team got their shots, at least.

That’s good. I’m in the great state of Texas where, as stated above, only half of Republicans are getting vaccinated. And I work with a lot of Republicans.

178
ckkatz  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:38:39am

re: #171 William Lewis

I agree fully with you.

About 20 years ago, I looked at the costs associated with a legally adjudicated ‘good’ shoot. In those days, in Virginia (not exactly a hard-nosed state) I assessed the costs as in the neighborhood of $35,000 in legal bills and up to 2 years of investigation.

On a purely cost-benefit basis, that reduced the scope of reasonable uses for a firearm. For me, anyway. And that doesn’t count the results of my personal moral and ethical review.

179
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:47:41am

What if Manchin doesn’t want either Bill passed?

180
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:51:12am
181
Eclectic Cyborg  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:51:40am

re: #179 Belafon

What if Manchin doesn’t want either Bill passed?

Then he’s basically a fucking Republican.

182
PhillyPretzel  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:53:55am

re: #180 Belafon

That would have been an interesting phone call. I would have liked to have been a fly on the wall to hear that one.

183
Jay C  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:54:43am

re: #175 A Cranky One

Hmmm…

Seeing a trend here,:

[Embedded content]

“….And I looked, and beheld the Rider, and his name was Death, and he rode a pale Chihuahua…..”

184
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:55:22am

My wife taped Billy Connally’s tour through places in the South where Scots brought their influence. He brought up that Richard Nixon was at the opening of the Grand Ole Opry. The clip showed Nixon going to work on the piano but I didn’t hear the audio.

185
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:56:48am

re: #136 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

The Great Filter

It’s very anthropocentric but I think this has significant merit.

I’ve always thought that the issue was with #9: technologically advanced societies self-destructed before they could develop a means to travel outside their solar system.

Most science fiction stories that adhered to our current knowledge about how slow travel is between star systems overcame that with two alternative approaches: (a) the Passenger mechanism of placing travelers in hibernation or (b) multi-generational ships that provided all the food/oxygen/fuel required to make these long journeys. Either of these should certainly be feasible within a few hundred years, assuming we haven’t suffered the apocalypse. But first we would have to use unmanned craft to determine that there are in fact habitable worlds out there.

186
ckkatz  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:58:18am

There was a discussion on Rachel Maddow this past week where the guest (maybe the Indivisible guy?) thought that the Manchin move was highly choreographed with Schumer and Biden. Certainly both Schumer and Biden, neither of whom is inexperienced, seemed quite comfortable with the ongoing process. And so far the disarray that I’ve been seeing, seems to be entirely on the Republican… and media side.

187
PhillyPretzel  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:59:22am

re: #186 ckkatz

That would not surprise me one bit.

188
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 7:59:44am

re: #185 Hecuba’s daughter

I’ve always thought that the issue was with #9: technologically advanced societies self-destructed before they could develop a means to travel outside their solar system.

How many examples do we have of this?

189
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:02:09am

re: #168 Dopamine Fish

Well, give the man credit, he DID stop the bad guy with the gun. The only problem is, the police mistook HIM for the bad guy with the gun, which makes our entire point: “How, exactly, do the police tell the difference between a bad guy with a gun and a good guy with a gun?”

Years ago, I remember an article about the Gifford shooting. According to the article, a “good” man with a gun was present but he was uncertain about who was the criminal and so did not shoot. As it turned out, the person he thought was the shooter was an innocent bystander.

190
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:03:07am

re: #143 jeffreyw

[Embedded content]

Good morning!

Western good morning!

191
A Cranky One  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:04:35am

re: #180 Belafon

[Embedded content]

192
sagehen  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:06:57am

re: #136 First As Tragedy, Then As Farce

The Great Filter

It’s very anthropocentric but I think this has significant merit.

If it’s a 1-in-100000000000 chance… there’s a lot more than 100000000000 stars and planets. The galaxy is enormous.

I believe there’s intelligent life somewhere; I just don’t believe it’s within visiting distance. Even at Star Trek speeds.

193
ckkatz  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:07:59am

The Rachel Maddow comment that woke me up last night was an almost throw-away comment that a lot of former guy stuff had happened over this past week, and a lot more, mostly not good for tfg, was scheduled for this weekend and next week.

As I understood her comment she was seeming to imply that tfg and friends might try some crazy stuff this weekend.

That comment seemed similar to Frum’s 2017 comment that a lot of Republicans, when given a choice between democracy and power, would choose power. (Which has proven true.)

I’m not fully sure what Maddow was alluding to, but I have been trying to keep up situational awareness. And I have not yet seen anything that would warrant (imho) her warning.

194
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:10:01am

re: #153 Dr Lizardo

Of course, that goes without saying. These fuckers simply aren’t to be trusted. They need to be on some kind of domestic terrorist watchlist, even under witness protection.

They’ll have to join the witness protection program and live very, very quietly forever if they cooperate with prosecutors. Their former brothers-in-arms make lousy soldiers, but one-on-one murders they could handle.

195
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:11:03am
196
sagehen  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:12:34am

re: #145 Dangerman

green heron just flew in
we’re just assuming it’s the same one every day

this time instead of wading at the edges, it jumped right out into the middle deep of the pond where the fish were feeding, grabbed a good sized one and ‘flew’ back to the deck. interesting cause there are like 30 or so smaller ones.

[Embedded content]

now hes wading in the shallows on the first shelf. more food? where’s he gonna put it?

How often do you have to buy new fish to restock the pond?

197
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:14:04am

re: #188 Belafon

How many examples do we have of this?

Plenty of examples here on earth: the Greeks and the Romans both were advanced, but imploded or were overrun by barbarians. The Mayan civilization was doomed by climate change. And the dinosaurs were wiped out by an asteroid. So there are a host of scenarios under which our civilization can be wiped off the face of the earth: internal violence, plague, an uncontrolled Chernobyl, etc.

198
DesertDenizen  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:15:22am

re: #189 Hecuba’s daughter

Years ago, I remember an article about the Gifford shooting. According to the article, a “good” man with a gun was present but he was uncertain about who was the criminal and so did not shoot. As it turned out, the person he thought was the shooter was an innocent bystander.

That is correct. I know the kid who ran to the scene with his gun. Wisely, he didn’t shoot when we couldn’t be sure what was going on. At that point the shooter had been disarmed and a bystander was holding the weapon.

199
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:17:15am

re: #197 Hecuba’s daughter

Plenty of examples here on earth: the Greeks and the Romans both were advanced, but imploded or were overrun by barbarians. The Mayan civilization was doomed by climate change. And the dinosaurs were wiped out by an asteroid. So there are a host of scenarios under which our civilization can be wiped off the face of the earth: internal violence, plague, an uncontrolled Chernobyl, etc.

I could set indoor plumbing as a baseline for the examples you gave.

200
sagehen  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:18:39am

re: #168 Dopamine Fish

Well, give the man credit, he DID stop the bad guy with the gun. The only problem is, the police mistook HIM for the bad guy with the gun, which makes our entire point: “How, exactly, do the police tell the difference between a bad guy with a gun and a good guy with a gun?”

according to Jon Stewart:

THAT’S WHY THE COPS WEAR UNIFORMS!!

201
plansbandc  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:22:13am

re: #196 sagehen

re: #145 Dangerman

Just hope he doesn’t tell his friends about the heron food bowl.

202
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:23:01am

re: #167 Eric The Fruit Bat

So much for the NRA’s “The only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun”.

This would actually make a great ad for gun control advocates - all the end of the ad has to say is: “Really?”

TBF, he picked up the killer’s rifle and was holding it when the police arrived. Bad idea.

203
Teukka  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:23:30am

re: #197 Hecuba’s daughter

Plenty of examples here on earth: the Greeks and the Romans both were advanced, but imploded or were overrun by barbarians. The Mayan civilization was doomed by climate change. And the dinosaurs were wiped out by an asteroid. So there are a host of scenarios under which our civilization can be wiped off the face of the earth: internal violence, plague, an uncontrolled Chernobyl, etc.

Let’s not forget the Permian-Triassic (P-T or P-Tr) extinction event. It is the Earth’s most severe known extinction event, with the extinction of 57% of biological families, 83% of genera, 81% of marine species and 70% of terrestrial vertebrate species. It was the largest known mass extinction of insects.
[…]
There is evidence for one to three distinct pulses, or phases, of extinction. The scientific consensus is that the causes of extinction were elevated temperatures and widespread oceanic anoxia and ocean acidification due to the large amounts of carbon dioxide that were emitted by the eruption of the Siberian Traps. It has also been proposed that the burning of hydrocarbon deposits, including oil and coal, by the Siberian Traps and emissions of methane by methanogenic microorganisms contributed to the extinction.

TL;DR - it was caused by a runaway greenhouse effect caused by CO2, which hit +5°C above average, which triggered release of other GHG’s, bringing the total to +10°C above average… It was a long and drawn-out affair, 10s of thousands of years…

Let’s see, how much above average are we again?

I’m not saying the result would be the same, but given margins of error, this is one loaded firearm I would not play with…

204
Dopamine Fish  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:25:58am

re: #202 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

TBF, he picked up the killer’s rifle and was holding it when the police arrived. Bad idea.

A bad idea even without the possibility of mistaken identity and getting shot; that would be contaminated evidence, since his fingerprints would be on it. I know the case seems cut-and-dried, but all evidence is important and contaminated evidence can introduce reasonable doubt.

205
sagehen  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:27:20am

re: #193 ckkatz

The Rachel Maddow comment that woke me up last night was an almost throw-away comment that a lot of former guy stuff had happened over this past week, and a lot more, mostly not good for tfg, was scheduled for this weekend and next week.

As I understood her comment she was seeming to imply that tfg and friends might try some crazy stuff this weekend.

That comment seemed similar to Frum’s 2017 comment that a lot of Republicans, when given a choice between democracy and power, would choose power. (Which has proven true.)

I’m not fully sure what Maddow was alluding to, but I have been trying to keep up situational awareness. And I have not yet seen anything that would warrant (imho) her warning.

4th of July.

When lots of gunshots would be unnoticed against a background of lots of other gunshots.

206
GlutenFreeJesus  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:28:05am

re: #202 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

TBF, he picked up the killer’s rifle and was holding it when the police arrived. Bad idea.

Absolutely.

207
Dr Lizardo  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:29:00am

re: #194 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

They’ll have to join the witness protection program and live very, very quietly forever if they cooperate with prosecutors. Their former brothers-in-arms make lousy soldiers, but one-on-one murders they could handle.

They’ll be looking over their shoulders for the rest of their lives.

208
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:29:03am

re: #203 Teukka

Let’s not forget the Permian-Triassic (P-T or P-Tr) extinction event. It is the Earth’s most severe known extinction event, with the extinction of 57% of biological families, 83% of genera, 81% of marine species and 70% of terrestrial vertebrate species. It was the largest known mass extinction of insects.
[…]
There is evidence for one to three distinct pulses, or phases, of extinction. The scientific consensus is that the causes of extinction were elevated temperatures and widespread oceanic anoxia and ocean acidification due to the large amounts of carbon dioxide that were emitted by the eruption of the Siberian Traps. It has also been proposed that the burning of hydrocarbon deposits, including oil and coal, by the Siberian Traps and emissions of methane by methanogenic microorganisms contributed to the extinction.

TL;DR - it was caused by a runaway greenhouse effect caused by CO2, which hit +5°C above average, which triggered release of other GHG’s, bringing the total to +10°C above average… It was a long and drawn-out affair, 10s of thousands of years…

Let’s see, how much above average are we again?

I’m not saying the result would be the same, but given margins of error, this is one loaded firearm I would not play with…

Too bad we are already playing with it and the fossil fuel industry is guaranteeing that we might very well reach the tipping point after which there is no way to stop the destruction.

209
Dr Lizardo  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:30:53am

re: #197 Hecuba’s daughter

Plenty of examples here on earth: the Greeks and the Romans both were advanced, but imploded or were overrun by barbarians. The Mayan civilization was doomed by climate change. And the dinosaurs were wiped out by an asteroid. So there are a host of scenarios under which our civilization can be wiped off the face of the earth: internal violence, plague, an uncontrolled Chernobyl, etc.

Don’t forget the Late Bronze Age Collapse, ~1177 BCE.

210
Dr Lizardo  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:33:19am

re: #208 Hecuba’s daughter

Too bad we are already playing with it and the fossil fuel industry is guaranteeing that we might very well reach the tipping point after which there is no way to stop the destruction.

Not to be a gloomy Gus, but I think it’s already past the point of no return.

211
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:35:09am

re: #202 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

TBF, he picked up the killer’s rifle and was holding it when the police arrived. Bad idea.

Imagine of the cop had shown up and the two men were shooting at each other.

It all boils down to the cops not being able to identify the bad guy.

212
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:37:26am

re: #197 Hecuba’s daughter

Plenty of examples here on earth: the Greeks and the Romans both were advanced, but imploded or were overrun by barbarians. The Mayan civilization was doomed by climate change. And the dinosaurs were wiped out by an asteroid. So there are a host of scenarios under which our civilization can be wiped off the face of the earth: internal violence, plague, an uncontrolled Chernobyl, etc.

The Greeks were overrun by Romans (barbarians? dunno), and current thinking is that the Romans became vulnerable because of waves of plagues. Their civilization wasn’t wiped off the face of the earth, although it suffered a major setback. The Mayans were probably done in by overpopulation — with no way to import or export food (no domestic animals), they had no choice but to starve in place. But their descendents are still around.

213
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:38:05am

Russian reported cases have doubled in a month and the deaths are now at about the same level as in December, at its height, and these are just the official figures, which apparently way understate the devastation in the nation. Nyet said that he received Pfizer, which suggests that Putin has gotten really serious about trying to stop further spread of the disease. My guess is that was the vaccine that Putin received when he finally was vaccinated — and not Russia’s Sputnik.

214
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:38:22am

re: #200 sagehen

according to Jon Stewart:

THAT’S WHY THE COPS WEAR UNIFORMS!!

And why only the MPs carry weapons on military bases.

215
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:42:52am

re: #212 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

The Greeks were overrun by Romans (barbarians? dunno), and current thinking is that the Romans became vulnerable because of waves of plagues. Their civilization wasn’t wiped off the face of the earth, although it suffered a major setback. The Mayans were probably done in by overpopulation — with no way to import or export food (no domestic animals), they had no choice but to starve in place. But their descendents are still around.

People are around but not their civilizations. In some cases, the knowledge they acquired was preserved so later societies could eventually rebuild using that information. Mayans (and all New World civilizations) were handicapped by not having horses.

216
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:48:58am

Looks like major law suits will be coming soon regarding the Florida disaster. As mentioned above, a 2018 report identified serious structural flaws in the building, including problems related to slapdash repairs to existing damage. The Democrats should seize on this as an example of what happens when infrastructure is ignored in this Ayn Rand corporate world — this privatize profit, socialize costs paradigm that infects modern capitalism.

217
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:49:00am

On the Israel outbreak:

Total infections is at 138 cases (after outbreaks in two schools). Out of a population above nine million.

55% of the population have received two Pfizer doses (they’re including people who have recovered from covid in their vaccination totals).

I’ve seen no data whatsoever about how many cases were serious enough to require hospitalization.

My conclusion:it’s not time to panic, and indoor masking sounds like a good idea (still required in CA, by the way).

218
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:52:43am

re: #213 Hecuba’s daughter

Russian reported cases have doubled in a month and the deaths are now at about the same level as in December, at its height, and these are just the official figures, which apparently way understate the devastation in the nation. Nyet said that he received Pfizer, which suggests that Putin has gotten really serious about trying to stop further spread of the disease. My guess is that was the vaccine that Putin received when he finally was vaccinated — and not Russia’s Sputnik.

Sputnik has been tested by researchers outside of Russia and found to be effective. Not at 94%, but it meets the basic requirement of preventing serious disease.

Since Russians don’t trust the government, an unknown number are buying forged certificates on Russia’s flourishing black market instead of getting their shot.

219
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:57:15am

re: #218 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

Sputnik has been tested by researchers outside of Russia and found to be effective. Not at 94%, but it meets the basic requirement of preventing serious disease.

Since Russians don’t trust the government, an unknown number are buying forged certificates on Russia’s flourishing black market instead of getting their shot.

It may be effective — but there were other reports that production quality control was severely lacking. So the versions received by other nations were not the vaccine that underwent thorough testing,

220
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 8:58:39am

re: #215 Hecuba’s daughter

People are around but not their civilizations. In some cases, the knowledge they acquired was preserved so later societies could eventually rebuild using that information. Mayans (and all New World civilizations) were handicapped by not having horses.

People don’t stop being a civilization because they’re not living in cities anymore. What was lost in the collapse of Rome was the links among the population centers (a serious loss), not the technology itself. (The “dark ages” are more an illustration of 19th century prejudices than a real event.) People no longer had the resources (or the need) to build major projects.

221
A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:00:19am

re: #219 Hecuba’s daughter

It may be effective — but there were other reports that production quality control was severely lacking. So the versions received by other nations were not the vaccine that underwent thorough testing,

Yup. But forged certificates make the vaccine quality irrelevant.

222
plansbandc  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:02:28am

Had a balloon crash here this morning. Hit power lines and went down. Five people, 4 dead (including the pilot). The fifth is in critical condition.

Awful.

223
PhillyPretzel  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:03:27am

re: #222 plansbandc

Yes. That is awful. :(

224
A Cranky One  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:04:18am

225
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:05:55am

re: #222 plansbandc

Had a balloon crash here this morning. Hit power lines and went down. Five people, 4 dead (including the pilot). The fifth is in critical condition.

Awful.

Wasn’t there another one somewhere a few days ago?

226
PhillyPretzel  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:07:36am

I am testing my IPad and its keyboard. After my Fire 8 HD problem earlier this week I want to see if the iPad and keyboard still works.

227
PhillyPretzel  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:08:33am

And yes it appears to work nicely. :)

228
mmmirele  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:12:07am

There is absolutely nothing like being awakened by a call from one of my work partners, the person who is the head of platform support for the group I provide availability support for, and they have an issue with something my group is supposed to do. (And, why yes, he has my personal phone number because if there’s a money transfer issue, I don’t want to be finding out from a page.)

Oh, and at the moment I started talking on the phone, my cat decided it was Just The Right Moment to jump on me and meow in my face.

I was relieved it was a non-production server test and not something to do with money transfer which I got squared away. But I do like awakening in an orderly fashion. Not with a cat meowing on my chest.

229
plansbandc  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:12:25am

re: #225 Belafon

Yes, in Colorado. No fatalities in that one. They were close to the ground and landing when a gust of wind hit them. Not optimal. Rode in a balloon several years ago and we had a hard landing for that same reason. But we were closer to the ground, so just some scrapes and bruises.

230
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:15:17am

re: #220 A hollow voice says NOW drain that swamp!

People don’t stop being a civilization because they’re not living in cities anymore. What was lost in the collapse of Rome was the links among the population centers (a serious loss), not the technology itself. (The “dark ages” are more an illustration of 19th century prejudices than a real event.) People no longer had the resources (or the need) to build major projects.

But if you are living in an illiterate society, the remaining civilization in small rural communities is stagnant or in decline and resistant to progress. Look at here, where the comparable communities are roadblocks to advancement, even though they do have access to new information. For at least the 500 years after the fall of Rome, were there any improvements in the West in terms of technology or science?

231
calochortus  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:15:47am

re: #216 Hecuba’s daughter

Looks like major law suits will be coming soon regarding the Florida disaster. As mentioned above, a 2018 report identified serious structural flaws in the building, including problems related to slapdash repairs to existing damage. The Democrats should seize on this as an example of what happens when infrastructure is ignored in this Ayn Rand corporate world — this privatize profit, socialize costs paradigm that infects modern capitalism.

There’s a thread on FR about the condo collapse. When I read it, they had gotten around to a discussion of condo boards and fees. The general consensus seemed to be that condo boards are populated with people who just want to keep fees low, so they defer maintenance. In FL a lot of people figure they’ll die before the building falls down, so why maintain anything. This is unironically being viewed as bad, and a good reason not to own a condo.

232
mmmirele  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:19:52am

re: #104 Anymouse 🌹🏡😷

I’m cold, so I’m going to stagger off to bed. Catch y’all later.

You know, it’s June 26 and it never got lower than 86F/30C overnight and I don’t know about this *cold* you keep talking about.

233
A Cranky One  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:22:31am

re: #232 mmmirele

You know, it’s June 26 and it never got lower than 86F/30C overnight and I don’t know about this *cold* you keep talking about.

I have a similar issue. People keep talking about something called “vacation” and I don’t know what they mean.

234
mmmirele  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:22:42am

re: #121 Dread Pirate Ron

[Embedded content]

Are we sure they aren’t sentient?

It could have been a “fatberg.”

235
Belafon  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:28:16am

About that Russian Naval incident:

A cyberattack may have been involved in a naval confrontation this week between Russia and a British warship in the Black Sea that never really happened. The global positioning system (GPS)-tracking Automatic Identification System (AIS) last week showed both a U.K. warship and a Dutch naval vessel coming within a few kilometers of a Russian naval base at Sevastopol, but a live Web camera feed confirmed that both ships were docked in Odessa, Ukraine, at the time. The spoofing in this case suggests a deliberate deception, as the ships’ coordinates were changed gradually to imitate normal travel. Dana Goward at the Resilient Navigation and Timing Foundation said Russia could have executed the spoofing attack, and warned that such a hack “could easily lead to a shooting war by making things more confusing in a crisis.”

newscientist.com

236
mmmirele  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:30:07am

re: #132 John Hughes

Oh, hang on, got a TEAMS chat going on in the other window.

oh God, don’t EVEN mention Teams to me. I was dumped into a Microsoft Teams test group last December. There is nobody from my team in Teams, so it just sits in my tray, occasionally booping at me.

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

237
mmmirele  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:35:10am

re: #154 Belafon

A use for grapefruit:

[Embedded content]

Good, because millions of us are on statins and can’t eat grapefruit. But if I can smear it on me and keep those damned mosquitoes off (why yes, we get mosquitoes in Arizona in late summer if there’s a decent monsoon unlike last summer), I’d be thrilled. Until then, it’s “Skin So Soft.”

238
Sufficient unto the day...  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:50:42am

re: #154 Belafon

Good, because people seem to think that this is an overreaction to mosquitoes…

239
A Cranky One  Jun 26, 2021 • 9:56:30am

240
sagehen  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:00:32am

re: #238 Sufficient unto the day…

Good, because people seem to think that this is an overreaction to mosquitoes…

[Embedded content]

And people are right. That’s what you do to spiders.

241
Dopamine Fish  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:02:26am

re: #240 sagehen

And people are right. That’s what you do to spiders.

Actually, I feel the image as presented is accurate. This is what you do to spiders.

242
sagehen  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:03:28am

So we’ve been talking about Bill Maher?

Tiffany Cross would like to chime in.

243
mmmirele  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:07:59am

re: #160 Belafon

[Embedded content]

Exactly what is happening at my company, and I will say the answer is most likely going to be not much.

Right now my evil too big to fail employer is not mandating the shot because we’re not back in the office and won’t be until after September. They did do a brief survey week before last to find out how many people had gotten the jab but when someone asked the exec vp in charge of tech what the results were, he said he didn’t know. (Which is probably true.) There’s a whole thing about wanting to push people back to the office, and there’s a LOT of resistance. I’ll be damned if I have to go back to work in that room with the huge air handlers and the 288 monitors across one wall that are absolutely of no fucking use to me and in fact are extraordinarily distracting.

But if they’re not going to mandate the shot, and the Delta variant (which looks to be extremely contagious) is going around, I am for damn sure not going back to the office, because I am not going to catch Delta variant (or something worse) and/or bring it home to my brother and/or mother.

244
FFL (GOP Delenda Est)  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:13:17am

re: #180 Belafon

I think the bishops “won” since they made a political point for their conservative base and got a pile of media attention. And then quickly folded once the higher ups demanded they not do something like that. So they get to claim, “We wanted to do the right thing, but father told us ‘no’.”

It pretty much was political theater all the way. Which, in my opinion, the churches should not be dabbling in. Then again, I also think the various religious house tax and other exemptions should be pulled and they be subject to the same rules as any other 501-c charitable organization. (Which in some states are relatively liberal in terms of property ownership and some tax exemptions.)

245
Barefoot Grin  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:14:27am

re: #239 A Cranky One

[Embedded content]

My girl does both ways. She could use a unisex toilet, I guess.

246
FFL (GOP Delenda Est)  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:15:10am

re: #185 Hecuba’s daughter

I’ve always thought that the issue was with #9: technologically advanced societies self-destructed before they could develop a means to travel outside their solar system.

Most science fiction stories that adhered to our current knowledge about how slow travel is between star systems overcame that with two alternative approaches: (a) the Passenger mechanism of placing travelers in hibernation or (b) multi-generational ships that provided all the food/oxygen/fuel required to make these long journeys. Either of these should certainly be feasible within a few hundred years, assuming we haven’t suffered the apocalypse. But first we would have to use unmanned craft to determine that there are in fact habitable worlds out there.

Also a variation with only a few travelers, but they are carrying a gene or “seed” bank from which a colony can be started up.

247
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:20:10am

re: #246 FFL (GOP Delenda Est)

Also a variation with only a few travelers, but they are carrying a gene or “seed” bank from which a colony can be started up.

A variation on the Passengers scenario makes the most sense. A crew that hibernates in shifts, so that there are always a few crew members who can address catastrophes, such as the one that affected the ship in the movie.

248
FFL (GOP Delenda Est)  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:21:03am

re: #228 mmmirele

There is absolutely nothing like being awakened by a call from one of my work partners, the person who is the head of platform support for the group I provide availability support for, and they have an issue with something my group is supposed to do. (And, why yes, he has my personal phone number because if there’s a money transfer issue, I don’t want to be finding out from a page.)

Oh, and at the moment I started talking on the phone, my cat decided it was Just The Right Moment to jump on me and meow in my face.

I was relieved it was a non-production server test and not something to do with money transfer which I got squared away. But I do like awakening in an orderly fashion. Not with a cat meowing on my chest.

Your needs are secondary and of lower priority than those of the Feline Overlord!

249
FFL (GOP Delenda Est)  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:22:05am

re: #230 Hecuba’s daughter

But if you are living in an illiterate society, the remaining civilization in small rural communities is stagnant or in decline and resistant to progress. Look at here, where the comparable communities are roadblocks to advancement, even though they do have access to new information. For at least the 500 years after the fall of Rome, were there any improvements in the West in terms of technology or science?

Though that was the time period where the Arab world was carrying out a lot of discovery and research.

250
Hecuba's daughter  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:22:54am

re: #249 FFL (GOP Delenda Est)

Though that was the time period where the Arab world was carrying out a lot of discovery and research.

The Arab world, yes, but not Europe.

251
FFL (GOP Delenda Est)  Jun 26, 2021 • 10:24:23am

re: #237 mmmirele

Good, because millions of us are on statins and can’t eat grapefruit. But if I can smear it on me and keep those damned mosquitoes off (why yes, we get mosquitoes in Arizona in late summer if there’s a decent monsoon unlike last summer), I’d be thrilled. Until then, it’s “Skin So Soft.”

I use a lemon oil repellent that seems to work decently on mosquitoes. Ineffective on ticks, so it’s use of some DEET stuff in rings on my legs when hiking just in case. So this new discovery would be a useful adjunct to the repellent arsenal.

252
Eventual Carrion  Jun 26, 2021 • 2:19:25pm

re: #114 Dr Lizardo

Why do I get the feeling the Missouri has an overall low vaccination rate?

Governor: Mike Parson (Republican Party)
Attorney general: Eric Schmitt (Republican Party)
Senators: Josh Hawley (Republican Party), Roy Blunt (Republican Party)


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