For Civil War 150th, Neo-Confederates Consign Slavery to the Memory Hole

US NewsNovember 2010 • Views: 34,902

As the 150th anniversary of the Civil War rolls around, Southern neo-Confederate groups are pushing harder than ever to rewrite American history, making it all about an unjust invasion and states’ rights — and sweeping that bothersome slavery stuff under the rug.

… As the 150th anniversary of the four-year conflict gets under way, some groups in the old Confederacy are planning at least a certain amount of hoopla, chiefly around the glory days of secession, when 11 states declared their sovereignty under a banner of states’ rights and broke from the union.

The events include a “secession ball” in the former slave port of Charleston (“a joyous night of music, dancing, food and drink,” says the invitation), which will be replicated on a smaller scale in other cities. A parade is being planned in Montgomery, Ala., along with a mock swearing-in of Jefferson Davis as president of the Confederacy.

In addition, the Sons of Confederate Veterans and some of its local chapters are preparing various television commercials that they hope to show next year. “All we wanted was to be left alone to govern ourselves,” says one ad from the group’s Georgia Division. …

“We in the South, who have been kicked around for an awfully long time and are accused of being racist, we would just like the truth to be known,” said Michael Givens, commander-in-chief of the Sons, explaining the reason for the television ads. While there were many causes of the war, he said, “our people were only fighting to protect themselves from an invasion and for their independence.”

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84 comments

Obdicut Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:35:04pm

The secession declarations of every single seceding state explicitly mentioned slavery.

How do they get around that?

APox Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:37:09pm

re: #1 Obdicut

The secession declarations of every single seceding state explicitly mentioned slavery.

How do they get around that?

Obama. Communism. Muslims.

Does that answer the question?

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:37:25pm

re: #1 Obdicut

The secession declarations of every single seceding state explicitly mentioned slavery.

How do they get around that?

Rabble Lincoln Rabble States Rights Rabble Confederates were heirs of founding fathers Rabble.

William Barnett-Lewis Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:37:27pm

My comment at the NYT:

No matter how hard these Neo-Confederates spin and lie, their treason was driven by slavery and racism. Nothing more; nothing less. Don't let any of these liars get away with saying anything else.

Perhaps we should march the First Armored Division down the middle of Atlanta as a "celebration"?

albusteve Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:39:04pm

states rights and slavery were joined at the hip....there is no rational revision, but you could bullshit the ignorant

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:39:10pm

It's worth noting as I've pointed out before that 9/13 Confederate states seceded before Lincoln even took to oath of office in March 1861. Oh and the fact that they fired on United States Army property in Charleston harbor. No, Lincoln wasn't a perfect man but I'lll take him over Jefferson Davis and the bigots who ran the Confederacy any day of the week. This isn't about heritage, it's about celebrating a society formed to protect the right to enslave fellow human beings.

albusteve Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:40:13pm

re: #1 Obdicut

The secession declarations of every single seceding state explicitly mentioned slavery.

How do they get around that?

smear it with lipstick....immoral pigs

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:42:08pm

“our people were only fighting to protect themselves from an invasion and for their independence."

Irony meter here is pegged.

They wanted independence freedom so that they could deprive a healthy chunk of their population of independence and freedom.

They cannot whitewash this. The issue was slavery. There were no other issues. Not cabbage sales. Not whiskey production or sales. Not zoning rules. Not shipping or taxes or ANYTHING. North & South had no other issue they had been fighting about that could have ripped the country apart. There were no other "states rights" issues. There was no other economic or legal issues at stake.

Just slavery.

McSpiff Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:42:12pm

re: #4 wlewisiii

My comment at the NYT:

No matter how hard these Neo-Confederates spin and lie, their treason was driven by slavery and racism. Nothing more; nothing less. Don't let any of these liars get away with saying anything else.

Perhaps we should march the First Armored Division down the middle of Atlanta as a "celebration"?

I like military parades... personally I think this would be hilarious. Get the national guard marching by the universities again. Show these assholes we win, every time.

reine.de.tout Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:42:39pm

I collected as many Declarations of Secession as I could find, and did a page on them in July.

engineer cat Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:42:59pm

“All we wanted was to be left alone to govern ourselves”

who wants to sign my petition to kick them out?

ozbloke Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:43:26pm

re: #1 Obdicut

The secession declarations of every single seceding state explicitly mentioned slavery.

How do they get around that?

Obdi look over there 'shes got a squirrel in her pants'

Youtube Video

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:45:33pm

Here's the relevant question:

Name one thing the south wanted to do that the north wouldn't let them do, other than own slaves in states that currently wouldn't admit slavery?

One thing. One concrete thing.

Build bronze statues to Zeus.

Paint their houses purple.

Sell rainbow-colored unicorns in the market.

One thing.

Hawaii69 Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:45:42pm

He's right, there were "many causes for the war" beyond slavery.

But, as far as I know, none of those causes are still issues of
contention between the North & the South. Neither were any
of these clowns alive at the time to experience those issues.

What exactly are they getting all nostalgic about?

Beyond all the jokes about rednecks and incest, I don't think
the South is getting "kicked around" much these days.

Tumulus11 Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:46:04pm

. The historical record is clear:

Mississippi Declaration of Secession
'Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery - the greatest material interest of the world. Its labor supplies the product, which constitutes by far the largest and most important portions of commerce of the earth. These products are peculiar to the climate verging on the tropical regions, and by an imperious law of nature, none but the black race can bear exposure to the tropical sun. These products have become necessities of the world, and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization.'

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:46:44pm

re: #15 Tumulus11

. The historical record is clear:

But Lincoln was a Communist!

elizajane Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:47:32pm

“We in the South, who have been kicked around for an awfully long time and are accused of being racist, we would just like the truth to be known,” said Michael Givens

Accused of being racist? ACCUSED?
Where do these people get their nerve?

Bulworth Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:48:23pm

our people were only fighting to protect themselves from an invasion and for their independence.

But they seceded before there was any "invasion".

I'm trying to imagine how Faux Nation would react to, say, Massachusetts, celebrating the anniversary of its seceding from the Union, if it had done so. Traitors!!!

Oh well.

Very Very Urban Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:48:39pm

Meanwhile in Metropolis..."Rep. Steve King (R-IA) says the USDA's black farmer settlement is backdoor "slavery reparations" cooked up by a "very, very urban Senator, Barack Obama.""

[Link: tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

Talking Point Detective Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:49:42pm

“All we wanted was to be left alone to govern ourselves,” says one ad from the group’s Georgia Division. …

Yeah. Right.

Alexander Stephens, vice president of the Confederacy in 1861:

"Slavery is the cornerstone of the Confederacy."

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:50:32pm

re: #19 chadstanton

Meanwhile in Metropolis..."Rep. Steve King (R-IA) says the USDA's black farmer settlement is backdoor "slavery reparations" cooked up by a "very, very urban Senator, Barack Obama.""

[Link: tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

Typical bullshit by Steve King. Race baiting and demonizing urbanites in one sentence. Impressive even for a jackass like him.

General Nimrod Bodfish Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:50:44pm

All of the survivors of the American Civil War are long dead. Many, if not all, of their children are also dead. Sadly, they had a chance to infect the 3rd generation with his sick, sick shit. The neo-Confederates want nothing more than to enslave non-whites again. Nothing more, nothing less. They are the twin sibling of neo-Nazis. These people should never be allowed to procreate or have children anywhere near their vicinity so that society as a whole doesn't get infected.

I hope they disappear from the American consciousness forever, consigned to obscurity, known only to their pathetic little communities, masturbating to the thoughts of whipping those n*****s and all that other sick shit they fantasize about. Fuck them.

Fozzie Bear Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:54:58pm

Let there be NO doubt about which party drives this kind of thing.

[Link: www.google.com...]

The left is a non-entity in the south. There is no credible opposition. It is a one-party region now, effectively.

This is a very bad thing.

General Nimrod Bodfish Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:55:02pm

“We in the South, who have been kicked around for an awfully long time and are accused of being racist, we would just like the truth to be known,” said Michael Givens, commander-in-chief of the Sons, explaining the reason for the television ads.

Gee, maybe it because all of that is, you know, based on facts like Virginia's Confederate celebration thingie. If you don't want to be accused of racism, then don't do things that can be seen as racist. It's that simple.

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:58:12pm

What the revisionists are hoping is that people don't read the real history. I've always been a big reader of Civil War history from a very early age. I know for a fact that former confederate leaders such as James Longstreet who dared to be honest about what the confederacy was all about were villified by Lost Causers such as Jubal Early. There was nothing glamarous about the old confederacy. I've seen confederate apologists argue that it would have died out naturally. Have no idea how they can say this when slavery lasted in Cuba and Brazil well in to the 1880's. Kinda haunting really in a way since that's only a few generations removed from myself given that my great grandparents on my dad's side were children in that decade.

Very Very Urban Tue, Nov 30, 2010 1:59:19pm

re: #24 commadore183

But pointing out racism is just as bad as racism. Why can't we all just move on as we celebrate the 150th anniversary of the Civil War?!

Gus Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:00:10pm

re: #19 chadstanton

Meanwhile in Metropolis..."Rep. Steve King (R-IA) says the USDA's black farmer settlement is backdoor "slavery reparations" cooked up by a "very, very urban Senator, Barack Obama.""

[Link: tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com...]

There's Steve King with his giant dog whistle! What a jerk off.

Jeff In Ohio Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:02:45pm

“We in the South, who have been kicked around for an awfully long time and are accused of being racist, we would just like the truth to be known,” said Michael Givens, commander-in-chief of the Sons

he went on to say

"and that truth is, it's really just me and my SOC brothers. I'm an idiot, revisionist and a bigot, but please, don't judge a whole region by my words and actions."

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:04:22pm

there are not enough jokes with which to mock these people

Fozzie Bear Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:04:37pm

re: #15 Tumulus11

. The historical record is clear:

Mississippi Declaration of Secession
'Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery - the greatest material interest of the world. Its labor supplies the product, which constitutes by far the largest and most important portions of commerce of the earth. These products are peculiar to the climate verging on the tropical regions, and by an imperious law of nature, none but the black race can bear exposure to the tropical sun. These products have become necessities of the world, and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization.'

Note that a very similar parallel argument regrading the use of fossil fuels vs. alternative sources of fuels exists, and is being pushed by the GOP. The history of the world makes no sense unless you understand that the availability and control of mechanical "work" drives everything. Look at ancient Rome, and ancient Greece. Look at Egypt. Look at the south, pre- Civil War. Look at the industrial revolution.

None of it makes sense unless you take into account who or what is used to provide mechanical energy. A gallon of gas contains about 28,900 calories of usable energy. That is a CRAPLOAD of work energy to get for under 4 bucks. Our entire standard of living depends on that, and nobody wants to take seriously the things that need to be done to find other sources of energy.

It pisses me off, because it is a HUGE issue, and it is discussed by the right as though it were an inconvenience to have to talk about it, and that's on a good day.

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:05:12pm

I have to say regarding King's statements. I am sick and tired of this guy race baiting. He's been doing it to the president since he was a presidential candidate and it's completely unprofessional the way he acts. I'm also tired of right wingers like him badmouthing everyone who comes from an urban environment too like they're somehow less Americans. Got news for assholes like King but the people of the cities helped built this country. It really is too bad that it would take an indictment or worse to get him out of office. Him, Bachmann, are probaly among the most useless Congresspeople out there. If I were in their district, I'd hate them for their grandstanding bullshit.

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:05:22pm

re: #27 Gus 802

There's Steve King with his giant dog whistle! What a jerk off.

that's not even a dog-whistle, that's just good old white boys bein' themselves

_{which is nakedly racist}

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:06:41pm

re: #31 HappyWarrior

I have to say regarding King's statements. I am sick and tired of ~~this guy race baiting~~ Texas cheering on and accepting and being totally okay with this guy's race baiting

This is how I see it

Talking Point Detective Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:07:01pm

The vice president of the Confederacy:

Cornerstone Speech

Alexander H. Stephens
March 21, 1861
Savannah, Georgia

Many governments have been founded upon the principle of the subordination and serfdom of certain classes of the same race; such were and are in violation of the laws of nature. Our system commits no such violation of nature's laws. With us, all of the white race, however high or low, rich or poor, are equal in the eye of the law. Not so with the negro. Subordination is his place. He, by nature, or by the curse against Canaan, is fitted for that condition which he occupies in our system. The architect, in the construction of buildings, lays the foundation with the proper material-the granite; then comes the brick or the marble. The substratum of our society is made of the material fitted by nature for it, and by experience we know that it is best, not only for the superior, but for the inferior race, that it should be so. It is, indeed, in conformity with the ordinance of the Creator. It is not for us to inquire into the wisdom of His ordinances, or to question them. For His own purposes, He has made one race to differ from another, as He has made "one star to differ from another star in glory." The great objects of humanity are best attained when there is conformity to His laws and decrees, in the formation of governments as well as in all things else. Our confederacy is founded upon principles in strict conformity with these laws.

They knew that blacks should be slaves because god told them that blacks should be slaves.

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:08:56pm

re: #23 Fozzie Bear

Let there be NO doubt about which party drives this kind of thing.

[Link: www.google.com...]

The left is a non-entity in the south. There is no credible opposition. It is a one-party region now, effectively.

This is a very bad thing.

Well, civil rights had consequences! seems we have a whole chunk of the country that, you know, wasn't so big with the civil rights

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:09:06pm

Hey! I'll start things off. Admitting that past actions were racist isn't actually that painful.

Oregon was not immune to racism and injustice to blacks. It was actually illegal to be black in Oregon from 1844 to 1926, no kidding. Slavery was illegal from 1844 until the EP, as well. (Not that this stopped blacks from living here, or people who live here from owning slaves, but it did mean they were illegally in their own homes.)

My ancestors were here at the time. I regret that it happened. It was wrong, and it was racist. We say now that the prime motivation was economic, and that may be, but it was still persecution of blacks, and that was wrong.

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:09:16pm

re: #33 WindUpBird

This is how I see it

He's from Iowa but your point remains the same. The people who do this crap the most are the people who really have no worries about re-election since their districts are so safe.

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:09:45pm

[Link: www.salemhistory.net...]

albusteve Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:10:28pm

re: #37 HappyWarrior

He's from Iowa but your point remains the same. The people who do this crap the most are the people who really have no worries about re-election since their districts are so safe.

haha!....whoops!

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:10:38pm

re: #36 EmmmieG

Hey! I'll start things off. Admitting that past actions were racist isn't actually that painful.

Oregon was not immune to racism and injustice to blacks. It was actually illegal to be black in Oregon from 1844 to 1926, no kidding. Slavery was illegal from 1844 until the EP, as well. (Not that this stopped blacks from living here, or people who live here from owning slaves, but it did mean they were illegally in their own homes.)

My ancestors were here at the time. I regret that it happened. It was wrong, and it was racist. We say now that the prime motivation was economic, and that may be, but it was still persecution of blacks, and that was wrong.

There's a whole lot of creepy racist history in Portland, parts of the city that were quite ghettoized

_{also, shanghai tunnels, those were probably not our finest hour}

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:11:53pm

re: #37 HappyWarrior

He's from Iowa but your point remains the same. The people who do this crap the most are the people who really have no worries about re-election since their districts are so safe.

guhhh I'm mixing him up with the texas governor, Steve King, Rick Perry, all these generic names get all jumbled up in my head

mojo9 Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:12:39pm

re: #14 Hawaii69

"What exactly are they getting all nostalgic about?"
As a Carolinian born and bred, I never got what it is about the confederacy that I should be enamored with by virtue of being born here. As far as I've always been concerned, the south's position in the war was the wrong one.

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:13:29pm

re: #40 WindUpBird

There's a whole lot of creepy racist history in Portland, parts of the city that were quite ghettoized

_{also, shanghai tunnels, those were probably not our finest hour}

They weren't exclusive to Portland. Other West Coast ports had their own.

Also...my father remembers this place:

[Link: www.flickr.com...]

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:13:38pm

re: #42 mojo9

"What exactly are they getting all nostalgic about?"
As a Carolinian born and bred, I never got what it is about the confederacy that I should be enamored with by virtue of being born here. As far as I've always been concerned, the south's position in the war was the wrong one.

white people being in charge of everything, and no people of color anywhere in power, that's what they're nostalgic about

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:13:41pm

re: #41 WindUpBird

guhhh I'm mixing him up with the texas governor, Steve King, Rick Perry, all these generic names get all jumbled up in my head

Well it makes sense you did that since Perry has been going around expressing secessionist sentiments. I hate it man. As a student of history, I know just how destructive the Civil War was to this country and for people to go around acting like seceeding just because they don't like Obama's policies is just mindblowing. I hated it when people did it with Bush too.

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:14:11pm

re: #43 EmmmieG

They weren't exclusive to Portland. Other West Coast ports had their own.

Also...my father remembers this place:

[Link: www.flickr.com...]

We're the only town that made it into a destination bar/haunted house attraction, though :D

Aye Pod Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:14:12pm

I watched Ken Burns (excellent) civil war documentary series a little while ago. Couldn't help but notice that the current wingnut freak-out over Obama is startlingly reminiscent of the southern freak-out over Lincoln taking office.

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:15:03pm

re: #43 EmmmieG

They weren't exclusive to Portland. Other West Coast ports had their own.

Also...my father remembers this place:

[Link: www.flickr.com...]

I saw the satirical ad for that in that mockumentary, CSA a few years back. Remember seeing the epilogue that all the fake commericals they used by and large were based off real products that existed.

Talking Point Detective Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:15:20pm

It is, indeed, in conformity with the ordinance of the Creator. It is not for us to inquire into the wisdom of His ordinances, or to question them. For His own purposes, He has made one race to differ from another, as He has made "one star to differ from another star in glory." The great objects of humanity are best attained when there is conformity to His laws and decrees, in the formation of governments as well as in all things else. Our confederacy is founded upon principles in strict conformity with these laws.

So, is there a nexus between the religiously-founded political ideology of the Confederacy and the religiously-founded political ideology of today's Southern rightwingers?

Nah. Must be a coincidence.

General Nimrod Bodfish Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:15:29pm

re: #9 McSpiff

I like military parades... personally I think this would be hilarious. Get the national guard marching by the universities again. Show these assholes we win, every time.

How about a military march from the Lincoln Memorial all the way through the South, with stops at Richmond, Chattanooga, and ending at Atlanta with a massive fireworks and bonfire party! That'll get them going!

Gus Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:15:47pm

re: #43 EmmmieG

They weren't exclusive to Portland. Other West Coast ports had their own.

Also...my father remembers this place:

[Link: www.flickr.com...]

Yikes! I've never seen anything like that before.

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:16:47pm

re: #45 HappyWarrior

yeah, I had to take a break from some of my friends politically when they started to pull out all these insane conspiracy theories about 9/11 and Bush remaining president for life

I'm like GUYS! I didn't vote for him either, but you sound like the Lone Gunmen from the x-files

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:16:48pm

re: #47 Jimmah

I watched Ken Burns (excellent) civil war documentary series a little while ago. Couldn't help but notice that the current wingnut freak-out over Obama is startlingly reminiscent of the southern freak-out over Lincoln taking office.

Except for the part about states seceeding.

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:17:21pm

re: #51 Gus 802

Yikes! I've never seen anything like that before.

I've never seen it either, because it was gone before I was born.

One thing to be grateful for.

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:18:10pm

The thing that amazes me is that the people I often see willing to apologize for the CSA the most are the same people who will act like anti war protesters are unpatriotic. It's like hello guys you're apologizing for supporting an entity that was actually you know treasonous. It always goes right over their heads. I saw one neo-confed troll here on LGF suggest that modern teachings of the civil war make southern kids ashamed of their backgrounds. I'm proud to be a Virginian honestly. My state was the home of Washington, Jeffesron, Madison, and countless other founders but I will never ever be proud that my state captial was once the capital city of the confederacy.

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:19:29pm

re: #43 EmmmieG

They weren't exclusive to Portland. Other West Coast ports had their own.

Also...my father remembers this place:

[Link: www.flickr.com...]

That seems to be where the vintage 70's decor Prime Rib joint is now, I pass by that address all the time

Gus Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:19:59pm

re: #54 EmmmieG

I've never seen it either, because it was gone before I was born.

One thing to be grateful for.

Looks like they had quite a few all over the NW.

HappyWarrior Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:20:26pm

Heck if you guys want to hear creepy, my dad rode his bike many a times by the American Nazi Party headquarters in Arlington, Va. My dad and his brothers/sisters were very lucky to have my grandparents for parents. My grandfather was a very racially tolerant man.

WINDUPBIRD DISEASE [S.K.U.M.M.] Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:20:45pm

re: #55 HappyWarrior

I would figure the best way not to be ashamed of your background is to, ya know,m learn the history and know it well and be someone that doesn't accept it anymore

Trying to rewrite history seems like the very definition of being ashamed

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:20:50pm

Looking at the dates. Might have been my grandmother, not my father.

She did grow up in Portland.

mojo9 Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:22:53pm

re: #44 WindUpBird

oh, I get it. the quote was from Hawaii69's post.

Decatur Deb Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:25:02pm

I'll save up to travel to the big celebration in 2014, when they re-enact slamming Jeff Davis into the cell in the artillery casement at Ft. Monroe.

Mostly sane, most of the time. Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:27:22pm

And, BTW, that was not an attempt at a thread-jack. I was just showing that is it possible to acknowledge the racist past without needing to commit hari-kiri in the process.

mojo9 Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:27:43pm

re: #58 HappyWarrior

I went to college in Birmingham, AL in the mid 70s. Actually saw klan rallies complete with cross burnings right off the interstate on the out skirts of the city. That was creepy!

Aye Pod Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:28:21pm

re: #53 EmmmieG

Except for the part about states seceeding.

Well, of course - no actual secession this time, but there has been talk of it in wingnut circles as we all know. It's like a somewhat faded echo of that original butthurt.

Decatur Deb Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:40:59pm

re: #23 Fozzie Bear

Let there be NO doubt about which party drives this kind of thing.

[Link: www.google.com...]

The left is a non-entity in the south. There is no credible opposition. It is a one-party region now, effectively.

This is a very bad thing.

Last week, four of our Alabama state representatives shifted parties from Dem to Repub. We don't have Democrats, we have Rebublicans-in-Waiting.

ozbloke Tue, Nov 30, 2010 2:48:37pm

For those that haven't seen this:

Picking cotton on a racist fieldtrip

Peter Kaufman Tue, Nov 30, 2010 3:00:01pm

And right on cue, a rep. from Virginia, the incoming majority leader, says states should have the right to veto Federal laws.

Can you hear the dog-whistle?

Peter

spikester Tue, Nov 30, 2010 3:16:27pm

Is it just me, or do others find this ironic?

Very Very Urban Tue, Nov 30, 2010 3:32:15pm

re: #33 WindUpBird

As a Texan I must defend my state...he represents Iowa

Very Very Urban Tue, Nov 30, 2010 3:37:22pm

re: #36 EmmmieG

How badass would it have been for me to be born in Oregon during that time. I literally would have been born an outlaw.

But seriously, at least Oregonians as a whole aren't actively celebrating the racist part of their history

SpaceJesus Tue, Nov 30, 2010 3:52:44pm

ah yes, the south.

Lidane Tue, Nov 30, 2010 4:42:22pm

re: #1 Obdicut

The secession declarations of every single seceding state explicitly mentioned slavery.

How do they get around that?

The same way that YEC's get around inconvenient facts-- these Neo-Confederate idiots only accept the limited information that reflects their worldview, and everything else is a plot against them to test their faith.

alexknyc Tue, Nov 30, 2010 4:46:35pm

re: #70 chadstanton

As a Texan I must defend my state...he represents Iowa

"Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?"

mattThaHatter Tue, Nov 30, 2010 5:12:52pm

Hey, hey hey... Take it easy here. I mean JEEZ, EVERYBODY knew the "War of Northern Aggression" was about the sovereignty of the states fighting off the tyranny of Soviet Influenced white house under Woodrow Wilson. I mean, you all act as if there was something wrong with the underlying southern culture of the time. Next thing you know, some windbag, left-wing bed wetter will start saying that the problem with Nazi Germany was based on an underlying, malignant ideology, when WE ALL KNOW that THE REAL PROBLEM there was the SOCIALIST government! Yeah, NATIONAL SOCIALISM, just ONE TINY STEP from bein COMMIE ATHEISTS. Keep on with this talk, and you'll all start tryin to say that Hitler was a CATHOLIC or something. Just keep on listenin to Comrade Obama, &see what it git's ya!

seathingchild Tue, Nov 30, 2010 5:14:01pm

“All we wanted was to be left alone to govern ourselves,” says one ad from the group’s Georgia Division - except that these people weren't even born yet, nor thought of - they didn't 'want' anything because they simply didn't exist yet. So, they are just glossing over the past in total ignorance. So very sad that our country has taken so many steps backwards intellectually in the past decade.

wrenchwench Tue, Nov 30, 2010 5:39:24pm

re: #76 seathingchild

Greetings, hatchling.

Fortitudine Tue, Nov 30, 2010 8:47:43pm

re: #71 chadstanton

It was all over. Here in the wonderful Land of Lincoln, slavery was still legal well into the 1840's. They got around that whole silly Northwest Ordinance thing by re-naming it indentured servitude.

The little central Illinois village in which I live had an law until the 1980's that made it illegal for any person of color to be within the village limits after sundown. Freaking crazy.

Eclectic Infidel Tue, Nov 30, 2010 8:54:18pm

In Print: “our people were only fighting to protect themselves from an invasion and for their independence.”

Not in Print: “our people were only fighting to protect themselves from an invasion and for their independence, and of course the God-given right to enslave peoples of African descent.”

Barflytom Tue, Nov 30, 2010 11:13:37pm

re: #22 commadore183

They are the twin sibling of neo-Nazis. These people should never be allowed to procreate or have children anywhere near their vicinity so that society as a whole doesn't get infected.

Irony isn't in your vocabulary then ?

mattThaHatter Wed, Dec 1, 2010 2:03:33am

re: #78 Fortitudine
Oh YES! That is AWESOME! Cuz, you know, here in Illinois, we don't have anywhere NEAR enough things to be ashamed of. Anybody catch that gem of subtle and refined wit that is the new Blago commercial for pistachios or something? It "warms the cockles" of my Illinoisan heart. And I haven't heard anywhere near enough "Wayne's World, party time, excellent" blurts up here in Aurora lately!
I wouldn't want to advertise your location without knowing it's OK with you. BUT, maybe if I give you something of a cryptic question that would be familiar to us "Boy's 'o' Blago,"(If you ARE a boy, I mean; if not, sorry,but it's late, and I'm running out of steam.Too bad I'm not down there, where I could score some meth from EVERYONE, or their grandmother, huh?) Anyway, here I go:
Does it maybe start with a "P," end with an "N," and the middle is"EKI?" I BET it is!I've heard a version of your story, but it was written on a sign. A municipal, or township or SUMTHIN official, but I thought it was BS. Well, that's what I get for doubting the audacity of the stupid, the fanatics, and the faithful. (I won't say it; someone else can)

mojo9 Wed, Dec 1, 2010 4:14:14am

re: #78 Fortitudine

I believe Alabama still has a community or two with a similar ordinance.

Steve Dutch Wed, Dec 1, 2010 6:03:15am

As others have pointed out, slavery was explicitly mentioned in many (not all) the seceding states' declarations.

On the other hand, write a college paper saying the Civil War was about slavery and you'll get it back covered with red ink and called "simplistic." You'll be told slavery was just an "epiphenomenon," and it was really all about economics.

So how can the Civil War be simultaneously about slavery (when it's about the Virginia observance and flying the Confederate flag) and not about slavery (when it's about getting tenure)?

But a few observations for the Southerners.
1. If the Constitution explicitly gives Congress the power to suppress insurrections (Art.1, Sec. 8), what's your beef about "invasion?"
2. If you're on the receiving end of suppression of an insurrection, do you even have a right to self defense, any more than someone who slugs a police officer during an arrest?
3. Did anyone attempt to introduce legislation in Congress permitting the States to secede? If so, who? If not, why not?
4. Did anyone attempt to use the courts to decide if secession was Constitutional? As soon as the Federal government took any kind of action, you'd have had grounds for a challenge.
5. Even if secession was Constitutional, U.S. property in the seceding states was still U.S. property. What right did you have to seize it?
6. Oh, because it could have been used against you? Show me in the Constitution where the Federal government has an obligation to make it easier for you to secede by force.

The real issue was "Nobody is going to tell me what to do."

Romantic Heretic Wed, Dec 1, 2010 6:08:29am

The simple fact is that the neo-confederates have a mythology which they much prefer to history.

Spy Mode Auto

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For Civil War 150th, Neo-Confederates Consign Slavery to the Memory Hole

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