re: #347 ObserverArt

Yes. The Ottoman empire collapse surely. But there have been other empires go down and those too caused some bad times, but eventually some form of order did manage to come out of it. In the Middle East that hasn’t been the case.

So, was any progress or recovery from the Ottoman control prevented by the influences of Europeans so they could apply their puppetry, or was it a mix of the Europeans versus the tribal and religious all fighting over everything that there was never any real cooperation and it has gone like that all these years?

And that begs the question, who is the most responsible, and would anything change if let’s say, the outside influences go away. If the Europeans, US. UN, the Russians, the Chinese and others step away would the tribes and religious factions left ever work it out?

At least at that point it would be a chance for the people of the region to do it without outside backing and influence. But even that seems like it wouldn’t work. Or, is that what needs to be done, but it will take time to work out the order?

And would the other countries and UN ever allow it, because that may mean some nasty waring in places like Israel? I can’t see that happening. So, it the region screwed forever?

I’d say it was a mix of European interference combined with tribal/sectarian divisions that paved the way to what we’re seeing now. As to what can be done going forward, that’s a good question.

The Ottoman Empire finally collapsed less than a century ago, and that’s pretty recent, historically speaking. It took a long time for Europe to sort its self out after the collapse of the Roman Empire; the Dark Ages, the Middle Ages, etc.

The ME isn’t screwed forever - it’ll take awhile, but eventually, they’ll sort it out. Who knows? Maybe the Iranians or a combination of the Iranians and the Turks will be the masters of the region over the course of time. The Turks make no secret of their ambitions, which is essentially a re-imagined Ottoman Empire, but this time, as a confederation, like the European Union.

Looking that far ahead is above my pay grade. :)