A Profile of Freeman Dyson

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The New York Times Magazine has a fascinating profile of renowned physicist Freeman Dyson, focusing on his skepticism about human-caused climate change: The Civil Heretic - Freeman Dyson.

Dyson is well aware that “most consider me wrong about global warming.” That educated Americans tend to agree with the conclusion about global warming reached earlier this month at the International Scientific Conference on Climate Change in Copenhagen (“inaction is inexcusable”) only increases Dyson’s resistance. Dyson may be an Obama-loving, Bush-loathing liberal who has spent his life opposing American wars and fighting for the protection of natural resources, but he brooks no ideology and has a withering aversion to scientific consensus. The Nobel physics laureate Steven Weinberg admires Dyson’s physics — he says he thinks the Nobel committee fleeced him by not awarding his work on quantum electrodynamics with the prize — but Weinberg parts ways with his sensibility: “I have the sense that when consensus is forming like ice hardening on a lake, Dyson will do his best to chip at the ice.”

Dyson says he doesn’t want his legacy to be defined by climate change, but his dissension from the orthodoxy of global warming is significant because of his stature and his devotion to the integrity of science. Dyson has said he believes that the truths of science are so profoundly concealed that the only thing we can really be sure of is that much of what we expect to happen won’t come to pass. In “Infinite in All Directions,” he writes that nature’s laws “make the universe as interesting as possible.” This also happens to be a fine description of Dyson’s own relationship to science. In the words of Avishai Margalit, a philosopher at the Institute for Advanced Study, “He’s a consistent reminder of another possibility.” When Dyson joins the public conversation about climate change by expressing concern about the “enormous gaps in our knowledge, the sparseness of our observations and the superficiality of our theories,” these reservations come from a place of experience. Whatever else he is, Dyson is the good scientist; he asks the hard questions. He could also be a lonely prophet. Or, as he acknowledges, he could be dead wrong.

This is the kind of reputable scientist who should be cited when discussing the pros and cons of AGW — instead of kooks like Nils-Axel M�rner.

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1237 comments
1 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 2:57:40pm

Do Dyson Spheres have global warming?

2 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 2:57:45pm

His name is awesome too.

3 PerfectSense  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 2:58:53pm

Belief in man made global warming is proof people will believe anything.

4 UncleRancher  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:00:14pm

Yikes! Will this put an end to the snake oil market?

/I hope so!

5 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:00:39pm

re: #3 PerfectSense

Belief in man made global warming is proof people will believe anything.

Considering its on the nightly news and talked about by politicians, I can understand that. Its that they drown out and openly DERIDE man-made global warming skeptics that gets me.

6 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:00:42pm

re: #3 PerfectSense

Belief in man made global warming is proof people will believe anything.

The problem is that there are those who fail to look at any evidence one way or another, and then proclaim they believe in it, and those who do not believe as they do are wrong.

7 Right mind left  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:00:47pm

Dyson is in a vacuum!

8 jamgarr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:01:04pm

Where do you get all the stuff to make a Dyson Sphere?

9 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:01:29pm

Just another hoax. Just like the "moderate" Obama.

10 jamgarr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:01:41pm

And how do you pay for it?

11 jamgarr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:02:17pm

And don't tell me it'll pay for itself in a trillion years!

12 RaiderDan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:02:30pm

Rogue editor at work apparently at the New York Times magazine. Either that or they didn't read it carefully and just assumed it was another paint-by-the-numbers global-warming-is-getting-worse piece.

13 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:03:06pm
14 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:03:13pm

re: #5 Hengineer

Considering its on the nightly news and talked about by politicians, I can understand that. Its that they drown out and openly DERIDE man-made global warming skeptics that gets me.

Because it is yeat another way for the government to interfere in business and the lives of citizens.

15 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:03:59pm
Among Dyson’s gifts is interpretive clarity, a penetrating ability to grasp the method and significance of what many kinds of scientists do. His thoughts about how science works appear in a series of lucid, elegant books for nonspecialists that have made him a trusted arbiter of ideas ranging far beyond physics. Dyson has written more than a dozen books, including “Origins of Life” (1999), which synthesizes recent discoveries by biologists and geologists into an evaluation of the double-origin hypothesis, the possibility that life began twice

Interesting- I'll have to check that out.

I wonder, however, how Mr. Dyson would feel about anti-science zealots latching onto his ideas to help them promote pseudo-science in the classrooms. Reading this, it sounds like he's likely not the friend to the IDers they wish he was.

16 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:04:26pm

Michael Crichton also had some sanity when looking at the issue as well.

Aliens Cause Global Warming

He takes aim at SETI, nuclear winter, and then global warming (as it was known before he passed away).

17 loppyd  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:04:32pm

Al Gore is in Boston today so naturally it's an unseasonably raw cold day.

18 ArchangelMichael  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:04:50pm

re: #1 Kosh's Shadow

Do Dyson Spheres have global warming?

No because they are unstable and will collapse or drift relative to the central star way before moonbat inhabitants can come up with a theory to force communism on you.

19 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:04:57pm

Sorry for the early OT: Via Taranto--

Palestinian Authority shuts down Palestinian youth orchestra for daring to play in a concert for Holocaust survivors in Israel.

Remember, children, the most important lesson is to hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate.

20 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:05:20pm

And no. I don't have ODS. I just think he is a fifth rate college professor.

21 loppyd  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:05:40pm

re: #19 Occasional Reader

OR I saw that earlier today. This was a move by the "moderate" Fatah party.

22 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:06:01pm

I recently heard an interview on the radio with John Coleman, he is the founder of the Weather Channel. He is a Global Warming sceptic & dissenter from man made climate change.
He was very honest saying that he is willing to be forthright, because he is close to retirement. He said that deviating from the Global Warming dogma has caused people to have carrers & reputations ruined.

23 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:06:01pm

re: #19 Occasional Reader

Sorry for the early OT: Via Taranto--

Palestinian Authority shuts down Palestinian youth orchestra for daring to play in a concert for Holocaust survivors in Israel.

Remember, children, the most important lesson is to hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate.

And Palestinians should be taken very seriously on the world stage, yes yes

24 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:06:17pm

There is a fine example for all in the way Dyson and his wife of 50 years can disagree.

25 Honorary Yooper  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:06:54pm

re: #15 Sharmuta

Interesting- I'll have to check that out.

I wonder, however, how Mr. Dyson would feel about anti-science zealots latching onto his ideas to help them promote pseudo-science in the classrooms. Reading this, it sounds like he's likely not the friend to the IDers they wish he was.

The anti-science zealots have latched onto differing sides in many scientific debates and arguments. They rather enjoyed the punctuated equilibrium versus gradualism debate in evolutionary theory in the 1980s. Consistently, they tried to use the debate to show that there was something wrong with evolutionary theory and that evolution had to be wrong because not all scientists agreed. Stephen J. Gould had quite a bit to write about it in several of his books.

26 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:07:09pm

Dyson understands the flaws in science profoundly. That makes him far more valuable to the scientific community, and to policy-makers, than any half-baked creationist.

27 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:07:14pm

re: #17 loppyd

Al Gore is in Boston today so naturally it's an unseasonably raw cold day.

Manbearpig is like a jowlly Jack Frost.

28 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:07:16pm

re: #17 loppyd

Al Gore is in Boston today so naturally it's an unseasonably raw cold day.

* * * *
Al Gore is a gashog with a private plane fetish masquerading as a conservationist after jetting Air Force Two around the globe for 8 years.

Somehow, Al Gore missed the "heat" Al Qaeda applied to our embassies while blowing up humans during his 8 years in office.

29 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:07:59pm

re: #20 NYCHardhat

And no. I don't have ODS. I just think he is a fifth rate college professor.

/ it is not so much a "syndrome" imho, more like an allergic reaction.

30 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:08:25pm

the Lonely Prophet...how poetic

31 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:08:39pm
32 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:09:24pm
Among those he considers true believers, Dyson has been particularly dismissive of Al Gore, whom Dyson calls climate change’s “chief propagandist,” and James Hansen, the head of the NASA Goddard Institute for Space Studies in New York and an adviser to Gore’s film, “An Inconvenient Truth.” Dyson accuses them of relying too heavily on computer-generated climate models that foresee a Grand Guignol of imminent world devastation as icecaps melt, oceans rise and storms and plagues sweep the earth, and he blames the pair’s “lousy science” for “distracting public attention” from “more serious and more immediate dangers to the planet.”

On this, I could not agree more. AGW is a distraction from very serious problems that need attention now.

This is not to say, however, that I think we shouldn't be good stewards of this planet, but that there are issues more pressing and that will have devastating consequences much more quickly than AGW.

33 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:09:34pm

There is no money or power to be made in simply accepting the real evidence and data

34 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:09:42pm

This is gonna cause some heads to burst.

35 loppyd  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:09:56pm

re: #28 alegrias

* * * *
Al Gore is a gashog with a private plane fetish masquerading as a conservationist after jetting Air Force Two around the globe for 8 years.

Somehow, Al Gore missed the "heat" Al Qaeda applied to our embassies while blowing up humans during his 8 years in office.



He blew off Earth Hour too.

36 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:09:57pm

re: #31 buzzsawmonkey

Al Gore is the Joe Bftsplk of climatology.

Refresh my memory... L'il Abner?

37 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:10:17pm

re: #18 ArchangelMichael

No because they are unstable and will collapse or drift relative to the central star way before moonbat inhabitants can come up with a theory to force communism on you.

Dyson didn't propose continuous spheres.
Article.
Some of the others forms are stable, or can be made more stable.

38 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:10:19pm

re: #22 opnion

I recently heard an interview on the radio with John Coleman, he is the founder of the Weather Channel. He is a Global Warming sceptic & dissenter from man made climate change.
He was very honest saying that he is willing to be forthright, because he is close to retirement. He said that deviating from the Global Warming dogma has caused people to have carrers & reputations ruined.

GW is all about profit...the biggest scam in history...SCAMZILLA!

39 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:10:24pm

re: #25 Honorary Yooper

The anti-science zealots have latched onto differing sides in many scientific debates and arguments. They rather enjoyed the punctuated equilibrium versus gradualism debate in evolutionary theory in the 1980s. Consistently, they tried to use the debate to show that there was something wrong with evolutionary theory and that evolution had to be wrong because not all scientists agreed. Stephen J. Gould had quite a bit to write about it in several of his books.

The ultimate irony is that Gore supports creationism in the classrooms.

40 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:10:29pm

Global warming could melt winter sport industry

Global warming could cripple winter sports and winter tourism in Canada, according to a report published Monday by the David Suzuki Foundation.

"If heat-trapping greenhouse gas emissions are not significantly cut, global warming stands to wipe out more than half of Canada's ski season later this century with few exceptions," said the study.

I guess you can make any claim you want to as long as you qualify it by stating it will happen "later this century." No one reading this claim today will then be alive to debate the statement's viability.

41 dhg4  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:10:32pm

re: #19 Occasional Reader

Sorry for the early OT: Via Taranto--

Palestinian Authority shuts down Palestinian youth orchestra for daring to play in a concert for Holocaust survivors in Israel.

Remember, children, the most important lesson is to hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate.

Elder of Ziyon, JoshuaPundit, and Carl in Jerusalem, among others, had excellent posts on this. And Daled Amos tied it into another case.

42 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:10:48pm

re: #35 loppyd


He blew off Earth Hour too.

So did I. I deliberately left the dome light on in my Hummer.

/oh, now Killgore's gonna be all upset with me

43 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:10:49pm
44 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:01pm

re: #33 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

There is no money or power to be made in simply accepting the real evidence and data

'cause theres no sensationalism

45 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:26pm

re: #19 Occasional Reader

Sorry for the early OT: Via Taranto--

Palestinian Authority shuts down Palestinian youth orchestra for daring to play in a concert for Holocaust survivors in Israel.

Remember, children, the most important lesson is to hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate.

0bama says give them a state, or he won't talk to Netanyahu. And the Eeeeeuuus say their relationship will be affected if he doesn't talk a two state solution. But he is, in fact; it is the Palis who will not accept a viable Israel.

46 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:27pm

re: #39 Sharmuta

The ultimate irony is that Gore supports creationism in the classrooms.

That, I did not know, nor am I surprised.

47 loppyd  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:27pm

re: #42 Occasional Reader

So did I. I deliberately left the dome light on in my Hummer.

/oh, now Killgore's gonna be all upset with me

I was at Attitash. The place was lit up like Times Square.

48 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:47pm

re: #40 midwestgak

Adriana Lima may be having my love child later this century.

49 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:50pm

Having attended a debate between two climate change scientists with profound respect for each other, I remain a human-caused climate change skeptic. The data support climate change (which actually isn't a surprise, because the climate always is changing), but human-generated CO2 levels don't correlate with expected levels of warming. That doesn't mean there's no correlation, but that the correlation, if any, is more complex than Gore has led us to believe.

In this highly politicized setting it take guts for a distinguished scientist to say, "We still don't know".

50 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:56pm

I'll be honest--my main reason for being suspicious of the screaming crowds of Cassandras on climate change is that everything they want us to do to avert disaster is exactly what they wanted us to do before climate change was discussed.

That makes me a little suspicious.

51 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:58pm

OT

Great news. Mr. Peter Hoekstra will run for governor of poor Michigan! He filed his papers to run for governor today.

Hoekstra is a principled patriot of the first degree. Born in the Netherlands!

Please help Hoekstra become governor of Michigan.

52 vagabond trader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:11:59pm

Then there's this classic.Don't ding me bro, he said it.

[Link: gatewaypundit.blogspot.com...]

53 Dan G.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:12:08pm

He appears to be a philosophical skeptic (i.e. that nothing is truly knowable) and his reticence arises from the confidence in AGW itself, not necessarily the arguments against it. I'll read more of his work to see if this is in fact the case.

54 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:12:09pm
55 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:12:16pm

re: #14 NYCHardhat

Because it is yeat another way for the government to interfere in business and the lives of citizens.

That's it in a nutshell. It's not about science or climate. It's about money and power.

56 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:12:18pm

I have, and have read, the book Project Orion, about the Orion nuclear-powered spacecraft project headed by Dr. Theodore B. Taylor, and including Dr. Dyson in the 1960s (and incidentally, written by George Dyson, Freeman's son). It's a fascinating book about a genuinely amazing proposal, that seems crazy- propelling an interplanetary spacecraft by detonating small fission devices behind it. But it worked in scale models, and would have worked for real, as well, but the Test Ban Treaty and later treaties banned the detonation of nuclear devices in or above the atmosphere.

One of the often-overlooked advantages of such a craft is that your velocity is limited only by the number of "bomblets" you can carry along, and how much "banging" your aft pusher plate can take. As Carl Sagan pointed out (in Cosmos), While Taylor, Dyson, & Co. were thinking of Orion purely as an interplanetary vehicle, with enough "crackers", it could achieve up to 10% of the speed of light. While that's slow by Star Trek standards, it makes unmanned probes to the nearer stars (Alpha/Proxima Centauri, etc) quite feasible, with results available via telemetry within a human lifetime. Sagan also pointed out that of all the theoretical interstellar drive systems (Bussard ramjets, etc), the Orion is the only one that has been proven to work, and that we could build right now. (And he said that back in the 1980s.)

Like I said, Project Orion is a fascinating book about a fascinating project, and man.

cheers

eon

57 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:17pm

re: #54 buzzsawmonkey

Oh, the cycle of violins.

Leave it to the Palis to give in to their most bass instincts.

58 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:19pm

re: #51 alegrias

OT

Great news. Mr. Peter Hoekstra will run for governor of poor Michigan! He filed his papers to run for governor today.

Hoekstra is a principled patriot of the first degree. Born in the Netherlands!

Please help Hoekstra become governor of Michigan.

He really is one of the good guys.

59 Sheila Broflovski  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:34pm

re: #19 Occasional Reader

Sorry for the early OT: Via Taranto--

Palestinian Authority shuts down Palestinian youth orchestra for daring to play in a concert for Holocaust survivors in Israel.

Remember, children, the most important lesson is to hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate.

NOTHING must interfere with their sacred victimness!

60 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:38pm
61 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:42pm
“The climate-studies people who work with models always tend to overestimate their models,” Dyson was saying. “They come to believe models are real and forget they are only models.”

Again- I agree. And this isn't even touching on the models themselves, that if the input is flawed, the output will be flawed.

I hate that this issue has become so politicized that we can't tell the truth from bullshit. It's absolutely shameful the way some of these people on all sides are behaving. It does nothing but further mistrust of science.

62 Lizard by the Bay  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:46pm

Just so I am clear on the posting rules. Posts not supporting AGW in the last climate change thread were bad, posts not supporting AGW in this thread are...?

63 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:48pm

re: #51 alegrias

OT

Great news. Mr. Peter Hoekstra will run for governor of poor Michigan! He filed his papers to run for governor today.

Hoekstra is a principled patriot of the first degree. Born in the Netherlands!

Please help Hoekstra become governor of Michigan.

it's about time...he has had this planned for awhile, at least since that commie Canadian took the office...GO PETE!

64 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:48pm

re: #56 eon

I have, and have read, the book Project Orion, about the Orion nuclear-powered spacecraft project headed by Dr. Theodore B. Taylor, and including Dr. Dyson in the 1960s (and incidentally, written by George Dyson, Freeman's son). It's a fascinating book about a genuinely amazing proposal, that seems crazy- propelling an interplanetary spacecraft by detonating small fission devices behind it. But it worked in scale models, and would have worked for real, as well, but the Test Ban Treaty and later treaties banned the detonation of nuclear devices in or above the atmosphere.

One of the often-overlooked advantages of such a craft is that your velocity is limited only by the number of "bomblets" you can carry along, and how much "banging" your aft pusher plate can take. As Carl Sagan pointed out (in Cosmos), While Taylor, Dyson, & Co. were thinking of Orion purely as an interplanetary vehicle, with enough "crackers", it could achieve up to 10% of the speed of light. While that's slow by Star Trek standards, it makes unmanned probes to the nearer stars (Alpha/Proxima Centauri, etc) quite feasible, with results available via telemetry within a human lifetime. Sagan also pointed out that of all the theoretical interstellar drive systems (Bussard ramjets, etc), the Orion is the only one that has been proven to work, and that we could build right now. (And he said that back in the 1980s.)

Like I said, Project Orion is a fascinating book about a fascinating project, and man.

cheers

eon

The same design was used in the Niven/Pournelle book "Footfall"

65 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:13:54pm

re: #39 Sharmuta

The ultimate irony is that Gore supports creationism in the classrooms.

/well, only in the sense that he want's to take the credit for it...

66 Right mind left  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:14:21pm

re: #54 buzzsawmonkey

Oh, the cycle of violins.

The Dyson cyclone of violins - stay On topic!

67 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:14:27pm
68 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:14:32pm

he is a very courageous man.
science has become so 'emotional' that now it is difficult to really
engage in true scientific study.

69 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:14:48pm

re: #56 eon

One of the often-overlooked advantages of such a craft is that your velocity is limited only by the number of "bomblets" you can carry along

Not only by that, of course. 186,282 miles per second: It's not just a good idea, it's the law.

But you knew that.

70 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:15:01pm

re: #38 albusteve

GW is all about profit...the biggest scam in history...SCAMZILLA!

If you have not yet read Michael Crichtons "State of Fear" I highly reccomend it. As usual he wrapped a story around great research.
I came away with a much better appreciation of just how much money is at stake ,driving the promotion of the Global Warming hysteria.

71 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:15:03pm

re: #54 buzzsawmonkey

Oh, the cycle of violins.

They distort all sense of rosin.

72 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:15:14pm

re: #67 Sharmuta

Al Gore supports creationism in schools

Thanks kind lady.

73 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:15:31pm

re: #60 buzzsawmonkey

Not "Cassandras."

The curse of Cassandra was that she always told the truth, but was never believed. That does not apply to the climate change crowd; they are believed, but do not tell the truth.

You are right. They are the reverse. I'm getting my mythology mixed up.

74 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:15:35pm

OT

Bad news. Obama and Eric Holder the Attorney General want to put Gitmo's Al Qaeda dudes & enemy combatants in my neighborhood of Alexandria, Virginia. (President George Washington's nearest town to Mount Vernon, six miles south of Washington DC)

Jihadists in my hood may already be a done deal. Damn dems.

(as reported by Fox News' Catherine Herridge)

75 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:15:44pm

re: #40 midwestgak

Global warming could melt winter sport industry

Global warming could cripple winter sports and winter tourism in Canada, according to a report published Monday by the David Suzuki Foundation.

"If heat-trapping greenhouse gas emissions are not significantly cut, global warming stands to wipe out more than half of Canada's ski season later this century with few exceptions," said the study.

I guess you can make any claim you want to as long as you qualify it by stating it will happen "later this century." No one reading this claim today will then be alive to debate the statement's viability.

But, but, what about Michelle's children?

76 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:16:03pm

re: #72 DEZes

Thanks kind lady.

uh oh, liberals' shining light going behind their back!

77 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:16:07pm

re: #62 Lizard by the Bay

Are you being intentionally difficult? The issue in the debate is WHO you use for a source. Using kooks to back up your position is a bad idea.

78 Lizard by the Bay  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:16:13pm

re: #39 Sharmuta

The ultimate irony is that Gore supports creationism in the classrooms.

He used to be strongly anti-abortion as well. But then he was informed that the Dem big tent is just not that big, so he switched beliefs (which is as easy for a Dem to do as changing underwear, I suspect).

79 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:16:59pm

re: #74 alegrias

Bad news. Obama and Eric Holder the Attorney General want to put Gitmo's Al Qaeda dudes & enemy combatants in my neighborhood of Alexandria, Virginia

When you say "in my neighborhood", you mean... please tell me you mean... in some sort of lockup in your neighborhood?

80 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:17:05pm

re: #42 Occasional Reader

So did I. I deliberately left the dome light on in my Hummer.

/oh, now Killgore's gonna be all upset with me

Not as much as he'll be with me. I didn't turn on all the lights, but I did do a normal Saturday evening; ran the dishwasher, made popcorn, and watched The Greatest '70s Cop Shows DVD.

/Groaning audibly at all the tactical errors in the premiere episode of S.W.A.T. from 1975

cheers

eon

81 USBeast  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:17:15pm

re: #78 Lizard by the Bay

He used to be strongly anti-abortion as well. But then he was informed that the Dem big tent is just not that big, so he switched beliefs (which is as easy for a Dem to do as changing underwear, I suspect).

Dems change their underwear? Who knew?

82 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:17:29pm

re: #70 opnion

If you have not yet read Michael Crichtons "State of Fear" I highly reccomend it. As usual he wrapped a story around great research.
I came away with a much better appreciation of just how much money is at stake ,driving the promotion of the Global Warming hysteria.

cashing in on the weather to the extent of (potentially) trillions, holding whole cultures hostage, writing the future history is nothing less than Heinlein type fiction....simply unbelievable

83 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:17:47pm

re: #81 USBeast

Dems change their underwear? Who knew?

They have underwear?

84 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:17:54pm

re: #81 USBeast

Dems change their underwear? Who knew?

the question is do they change their socks?

85 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:17:57pm

Dyson is a giant. He keeps us honest.

Einstien kept Bohr and Shroedinger honest about QM. Einstien was wrong about QM. I am convinced professionally that Dyson is wrong about AGW.

86 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:18:01pm

re: #81 USBeast

Dems change their underwear? Who knew?

Turn them inside out.

87 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:18:18pm

re: #84 Hengineer

the question is do they change their socks?

They use those for puppets.

88 Dianna  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:18:23pm

re: #43 buzzsawmonkey

Yes, he's the little guy with the cloud over his head who is the World's Worst Jinx; everywhere he goes, disasters happen all around him, though he remains untouched.

I have days like that!

89 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:18:42pm

re: #57 Occasional Reader

Leave it to the Palis to give in to their most bass instincts.

But neither is an occasion to fret.

90 callahan23  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:18:49pm

re: #19 Occasional Reader

Sorry for the early OT: Via Taranto--

Palestinian Authority shuts down Palestinian youth orchestra for daring to play in a concert for Holocaust survivors in Israel.

Remember, children, the most important lesson is to hate hate hate hate hate hate hate hate.

In the same vein:
///Shame on us a thousand times!
/ It is not true that the Palestinians are unable to self critique. They are very able at criticizing their own as this example shows:
Palestinian Authority shuts down Palestinian youth orchestra for daring to play in a concert for Holocaust survivors in Israel. Link is to the god-awful palestinethinktank

91 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:18:55pm

re: #87 DEZes

They use those for puppets.

Now now, libertarians (often mistaken for liberals and conservatives) also use those for puppets, too.

92 vagabond trader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:18:55pm

re: #74 alegrias

I heard your mayor being interviewed about this. He supported potus but is now crying NIMBY. Hope they end up in the Arctic wasteland or someplace similar.

93 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:19:00pm

re: #84 Hengineer

the question is do they change their socks?

/can't you just let Spitzer go?

94 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:19:16pm

re: #43 buzzsawmonkey

Yes, he's the little guy with the cloud over his head who is the World's Worst Jinx; everywhere he goes, disasters happen all around him, though he remains untouched.

Harry Reid!

95 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:19:17pm
96 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:19:31pm

re: #91 Hengineer

Now now, libertarians (often mistaken for liberals and conservatives) also use those for puppets, too.

Do they draw faces on them?

97 Lizard by the Bay  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:19:36pm

re: #77 Sharmuta

Are you being intentionally difficult? The issue in the debate is WHO you use for a source. Using kooks to back up your position is a bad idea.

Agreed, but there was more going on in that thread. There were plenty of posters whose only point was that just because a kook said something doesn't negate it, a concept which seemed to be too much for others to swallow.

98 wrenchwench  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:19:41pm

re: #60 buzzsawmonkey

Not "Cassandras."

The curse of Cassandra was that she always told the truth, but was never believed. That does not apply to the climate change crowd; they are believed, but do not tell the truth.

re: #73 EmmmieG

You are right. They are the reverse. I'm getting my mythology mixed up.


Ardnassacs?

99 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:19:59pm

re: #80 eon

/Groaning audibly at all the tactical errors in the premiere episode of S.W.A.T. from 1975

I can only imagine.

I re-watched part of the SWAT movie (the relatively recent one with Colin Farrell) not long ago. Clearly they had consulted some knowledgable people about firearms for part of the script, at least. But there was one hilarious competition shooting scene in which the M1911 of the guy in the foreground visibly stovepipes, and yet the soundtrack keeps going "bang bang bang bang". Damn, I want one of those!

100 USBeast  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:20:04pm

re: #86 Aviator

Turn them inside out.

There's a few of 'em I'd like to turn inside out, or at least reverse their cranial/rectal inversion.

101 dhg4  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:20:06pm

I have, and have read, the book Project Orion, about the Orion nuclear-powered spacecraft project headed by Dr. Theodore B. Taylor, and including Dr. Dyson in the 1960s (and incidentally, written by George Dyson, Freeman's son).
re: #56 eon

Is that Or-i-on or Or-ee-on?

102 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:20:17pm

re: #74 alegrias

We should support the proposal to bring GITMO detainees to the U.S. if they change it to require that former GITMO detainees to be housed with prominent Democrats, including President Obama, Joe Biden, Nancy Pelosi, and the rest of the Democrat leadership, until the detainees have liquidated them all.

103 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:20:23pm
104 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:20:30pm

re: #96 DEZes

Do they draw faces on them?

Sure? They look like those Quiznos roadkill commercial socks.

105 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:20:50pm

re: #89 pre-Boomer Marine brat

But neither is an occasion to fret.

I just hope the Israeli government doesn't bow to the pressure, or let the PA just string them along.

106 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:20:52pm

re: #5 Hengineer

Considering its on the nightly news and talked about by politicians, I can understand that. Its that they drown out and openly DERIDE man-made global warming skeptics that gets me.

It is no longer just on the nightly news or talked about by politicians. It is a selling point for a brand of insurance, a station-break commercial on a popular cable kids network, amongst other venues.

107 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:20:59pm

re: #79 Occasional Reader

When you say "in my neighborhood", you mean... please tell me you mean... in some sort of lockup in your neighborhood?

* * * *
Obama and Eric Holder may ask us Alexandrian Virginians to "adopt an enemy combatant", you know the old 60s saying, "each one teach one"? And "love the one you're with"?

Naturally I'm thrilled to share my home & possessions with jihadists who wanted only to murder American infidels. NOT.

/sarc

108 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:21:36pm

re: #82 albusteve

cashing in on the weather to the extent of (potentially) trillions, holding whole cultures hostage, writing the future history is nothing less than Heinlein type fiction....simply unbelievable

Follow the cash. Tons of grant money & watch all of the government contracts to "Green" businesses go to the politically connected.
Thirty years ago Newsweek was schilling a new 'Ice Age"

109 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:21:53pm

re: #67 Sharmuta

Al Gore supports creationism in schools

Religious dogma masquerading as science, the lot. This doesn't surprise me.

110 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:22:13pm

re: #82 albusteve

cashing in on the weather to the extent of (potentially) trillions, holding whole cultures hostage, writing the future history is nothing less than Heinlein type fiction....simply unbelievable

Again, this blind belief can be directly correlated to our sub-standard education system. (Give me the minds of your children for the first twelve years.........as the saying goes)

111 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:22:15pm

Have we all perhaps been secretly transported to the bizarro world?

112 Claire  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:22:34pm

re: #74 alegrias

Why's that? So the CIA can keep a closw watch on them? Bait.

113 Dan G.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:22:38pm

re: #61 Sharmuta [...] It does nothing but further mistrust of science. [...]

That is the motive behind one group of shills.

114 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:22:52pm

re: #4 UncleRancher

Yikes! Will this put an end to the snake oil market?

/I hope so!

Hardly, that quack James Hansen has been saying that Dyson doesn't know he is talking about.

115 Macker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:22:58pm

re: #56 eon

If I could upding you a thousand times I would do so! Project Orion Kicked Ass!

116 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:23:08pm

re: #107 alegrias

Obama and Eric Holder may ask us Alexandrian Virginians to "adopt an enemy combatant",

Okay, but seriously, folks... what are they proposing?

117 Leonidas Hoplite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:23:22pm

re: #109 FurryOldGuyJeans

Religious dogma masquerading as science, the lot. This doesn't surprise me.

Well that's AGP in a nutshell so it fits

118 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:23:43pm

re: #101 dhg4

I have, and have read, the book Project Orion, about the Orion nuclear-powered spacecraft project headed by Dr. Theodore B. Taylor, and including Dr. Dyson in the 1960s (and incidentally, written by George Dyson, Freeman's son).
re: #56 eon

Is that Or-i-on or Or-ee-on?

Or-ee-on is Okinawan Beer

119 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:23:57pm

re: #105 Occasional Reader

I just hope the Israeli government doesn't bow to the pressure, or let the PA just string them along.

I think they may just have used up their supply of bowing...

120 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:24:12pm

re: #116 Occasional Reader

Okay, but seriously, folks... what are they proposing?

getting nervous?....

121 USBeast  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:24:21pm

re: #111 Spare O'Lake

Have we all perhaps been secretly transported to the bizarro world?

We're going through Heinlein's "Crazy Years".

122 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:24:29pm

One should also note from this article that Steven Weinberg agrees with AGW. Steven Weinberg is a much bigger fish than Dyson.

123 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:24:30pm

re: #105 Occasional Reader

I just hope the Israeli government doesn't bow to the pressure, or let the PA just string them along.

mmpff
grppff

I would've replied sooner, but the catgut my tongue.

124 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:24:49pm

re: #92 vagabond trader

I heard your mayor being interviewed about this. He supported potus but is now crying NIMBY. Hope they end up in the Arctic wasteland or someplace similar.

* * * *
Yeah, that was Mayor Bill Euille, who "delivered" our city for Obama and supported the closing of GITMO.

Obama shoving GITMO prisoners on our fair little city may cause an electoral rout on May 5, when Republicans may finally get a seat on the Alexandria City Council.

Talk about Tea'd off!

125 Right mind left  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:24:54pm

re: #107 alegrias

Obama and Eric Holder may ask us Alexandrian Virginians to "adopt an enemy combatant",
re: #116 Occasional Reader

Okay, but seriously, folks... what are they proposing?

Maybe like the exchange program, take one in and send your young to be retrained! We just need to extend a hand to unclench their fists!

/

126 Digital Display  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:24:55pm

re: #103 buzzsawmonkey

It sounds like an obscure French brandy.

Aren't all French brandy's obscure?
/running

127 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:24:57pm

re: #56 eon

I have, and have read, the book Project Orion, about the Orion nuclear-powered spacecraft project headed by Dr. Theodore B. Taylor, and including Dr. Dyson in the 1960s (and incidentally, written by George Dyson, Freeman's son). It's a fascinating book about a genuinely amazing proposal, that seems crazy- propelling an interplanetary spacecraft by detonating small fission devices behind it. But it worked in scale models, and would have worked for real, as well, but the Test Ban Treaty and later treaties banned the detonation of nuclear devices in or above the atmosphere.

One of the often-overlooked advantages of such a craft is that your velocity is limited only by the number of "bomblets" you can carry along, and how much "banging" your aft pusher plate can take. As Carl Sagan pointed out (in Cosmos), While Taylor, Dyson, & Co. were thinking of Orion purely as an interplanetary vehicle, with enough "crackers", it could achieve up to 10% of the speed of light. While that's slow by Star Trek standards, it makes unmanned probes to the nearer stars (Alpha/Proxima Centauri, etc) quite feasible, with results available via telemetry within a human lifetime. Sagan also pointed out that of all the theoretical interstellar drive systems (Bussard ramjets, etc), the Orion is the only one that has been proven to work, and that we could build right now. (And he said that back in the 1980s.)

Like I said, Project Orion is a fascinating book about a fascinating project, and man.

cheers

eon

I have the book, too; great.

128 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:25:04pm

re: #64 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

The same design was used in the Niven/Pournelle book "Footfall"

You also find it on the Atomic Rocket website. Commonly known as "Old Boom-Boom".

One point made on AR about the Orion, in terms of (possible) space warcraft (as in Footfall), is that by its very design, it carries a big honking radiation-and-blast-proof shield around with it at all times. Aim a nuclear-tipped missile at an Orion "space cruiser", the captain of same swings ship, puts his pusher plate between him and your party favor, it goes boom, and then he says, "My turn"- and unloads a whole bunch of similar goodies on you.

In interplanetary space combat, only an encounter between two Orion-type warships would be anything like a fair fight. The winner is whoever runs out of maneuvering propellant and ammo last.

cheers

eon

129 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:25:13pm

re: #113 Dan G.

[...] It does nothing but further mistrust of science. [...]

That is the motive behind one group of shills.

I'm starting to seriously suspect if it isn't behind more than one.

130 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:25:51pm

re: #40 midwestgak

Global warming could melt winter sport industry

Global warming could cripple winter sports and winter tourism in Canada, according to a report published Monday by the David Suzuki Foundation.

"If heat-trapping greenhouse gas emissions are not significantly cut, global warming stands to wipe out more than half of Canada's ski season later this century with few exceptions," said the study.

I guess you can make any claim you want to as long as you qualify it by stating it will happen "later this century." No one reading this claim today will then be alive to debate the statement's viability.

The alarmists learned to not make concrete doom and gloom statements after the Global Cooling fiasco during the 70's. Why make verifiable pronouncements that can be proven when nebulous unverifiable ones makes getting converts easier.

131 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:26:00pm

goddess is lurking ... I just KNOW it! ... I just KNOW it!
*setting up the anti-aircraft gun*

132 Dianna  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:26:11pm

re: #128 eon

"God was knocking, and he wanted in bad."

133 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:27:30pm

re: #128 eon

(as in Footfall),

Great book.

134 Macker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:27:39pm

re: #64 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

The same design was used in the Niven/Pournelle book "Footfall"

And its name was Michael.

135 vagabond trader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:27:40pm

re: #124 alegrias

Perhaps we need to stoke up some good old fashioned righteous indignation to bring out a few quality candidates.

136 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:27:46pm

Here's a couple more:

[Link: www.denverpost.com...]

The words "global warming" provoke a sharp retort from Colorado State University meteorology professor emeritus William Gray: "It's a big scam."

And the name of climate researcher Kevin Trenberth elicits a sputtered "opportunist."

At the National Center for Atmospheric Research, where Trenberth works, Gray's name prompts dismay. "Bill Gray is completely unreasonable," Trenberth says. "He has a mind block on this."

Only 55 miles separate NCAR's headquarters, nestled in the Front Range foothills, from CSU in Fort Collins. But when it comes to climate change, the gap is as big as any in the scientific community.

At Boulder-based NCAR, researchers project a world with warmer temperatures, fiercer storms and higher seas.

From CSU, Gray and Roger Pielke Sr., another climate professor emeritus, question the data used to make those projections and their application to regional climate change.

Science by its nature is disputatious - with every idea challenged, tested and retested. It's always been that way.

137 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:28:06pm

re: #128 eon

You also find it on the Atomic Rocket website. Commonly known as "Old Boom-Boom".

One point made on AR about the Orion, in terms of (possible) space warcraft (as in Footfall), is that by its very design, it carries a big honking radiation-and-blast-proof shield around with it at all times. Aim a nuclear-tipped missile at an Orion "space cruiser", the captain of same swings ship, puts his pusher plate between him and your party favor, it goes boom, and then he says, "My turn"- and unloads a whole bunch of similar goodies on you.

In interplanetary space combat, only an encounter between two Orion-type warships would be anything like a fair fight. The winner is whoever runs out of maneuvering propellant and ammo last.

cheers

eon

To which my answer would be "MARINES! MAN THE BOARDING TORPEDOES!"

138 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:28:26pm

re: #123 pre-Boomer Marine brat

mmpff
grppff

I would've replied sooner, but the catgut my tongue.

Say what

139 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:28:38pm

Footfall would make a truly kickass sci fi movie.

140 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:29:13pm

re: #138 DEZes

Say what

YECH!
(-:

141 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:29:18pm

re: #132 Dianna

"God was knocking, and he wanted in bad."

"what if God was one of us
just a slob like one of us
just a stranger on the bus
trying to make his way home"

142 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:30:02pm

re: #133 Occasional Reader

Great book.

I've viewed elephants with suspicion every since.
////

143 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:30:05pm

re: #139 Occasional Reader

Footfall would make a truly kickass sci fi movie.

Especially the kinetic weapons from orbit

144 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:30:09pm

Later.

145 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:30:29pm

re: #144 Occasional Reader

Later.

Later.

146 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:30:56pm

re: #143 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Especially the kinetic weapons from orbit

ripped from 'the Moon is a Harsh Mistress'

147 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:31:09pm

re: #144 Occasional Reader

Later.

Thanks for the warning.

148 Querent  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:31:09pm

re: #143 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Especially the kinetic weapons from orbit

kinetic-bomb the site from orbit -- it's the only way to be sure!

149 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:31:12pm
“Most of the evolution of life occurred on a planet substantially warmer than it is now,” he contends, “and substantially richer in carbon dioxide.” Dyson calls ocean acidification, which many scientists say is destroying the saltwater food chain, a genuine but probably exaggerated problem. Sea levels, he says, are rising steadily, but why this is and what dangers it might portend “cannot be predicted until we know much more about its causes.”

I like this guy. He seems very reasonable, and I'm looking forward to picking up a few of his books.

150 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:31:13pm
151 Macker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:31:38pm

re: #139 Occasional Reader

Footfall would make a truly kickass sci fi movie.

As long as Skiffy doesn't get their hands on it.

152 johnnyreb  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:31:52pm

Global warming is not about saving the planet. It is 100% about control. Everything the greens have done since the 1970s is about trying to control you and your lifestyle.

153 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:32:13pm

re: #102 quickjustice

There could actually be a Sitcom of a released Gitmo prisoner living with Nancy Pelosi.
"Achmed, I do not like your superior attitude toward women, including me"
"Shut up woman!'
"Ah ok, put the sword away. i wont mention it again. By the way , what happened to the dog?"
Caned laughter.

154 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:32:34pm

re: #152 johnnyreb

Global warming is not about saving the planet. It is 100% about control. Everything the greens have done since the 1970s is about trying to control you and your lifestyle.

oh and money.

155 USBeast  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:32:45pm

re: #146 albusteve

ripped from 'the Moon is a Harsh Mistress'

"The good ones borrow. The great ones steal."

I forget who said it.

156 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:32:47pm

re: #150 buzzsawmonkey

If you're dying to ski during warm weather, and you don't want to travel to New Zealand, there are technologies that permit this.

157 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:33:19pm

re: #155 USBeast

"The good ones borrow. The great ones steal."

I forget who said it.

Capone the Magnificent?

158 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:33:40pm

re: #153 opnion

There could actually be a Sitcom of a released Gitmo prisoner living with Nancy Pelosi.
"Achmed, I do not like your superior attitude toward women, including me"
"Shut up woman!'
"Ah ok, put the sword away. i wont mention it again. By the way , what happened to the dog?"
Caned laughter.

Caned laughter was the down fall of sugar commercials. ;)

159 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:33:58pm

re: #143 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Especially the kinetic weapons from orbit

careful what you hope for...

160 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:34:04pm

re: #155 USBeast

"The good ones borrow. The great ones steal."

I forget who said it.

That was me, I said it.

161 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:34:18pm

re: #157 albusteve

Capone the Magnificent?

Could be. He knew Al about it.

162 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:34:35pm

re: #99 Occasional Reader

I can only imagine.

I re-watched part of the SWAT movie (the relatively recent one with Colin Farrell) not long ago. Clearly they had consulted some knowledgable people about firearms for part of the script, at least. But there was one hilarious competition shooting scene in which the M1911 of the guy in the foreground visibly stovepipes, and yet the soundtrack keeps going "bang bang bang bang". Damn, I want one of those!

My favorite goofs from the pilot were;

1. Using an M-16 as a "step", held by two men, to get a third up a wall; one holding it by the muzzle, the other by the butt, third man plants foot on receiver and goes. In real life, that trick works just fine with an M-1, but try it with an Armalite and you usually end up breaking its stock off.

2. Having the long rifle and his spotter do a "recon by fire" instead of having the rifle neutralize the one guy, in plain sight, with a scoped M-1 carbine.

3. Going into a possible (and expected) ambush situation at a college campus, where they knew they would face at least one sniper (the guy with the scoped M-1), known to prefer working from "high ground", who is up in the building's bell tower- and they can't find him because nobody thinks to look up!

I could go on, but I'm sure you get the general idea.

/Did that gig for real in training a couple of years later, and gags like that would have definitely not impressed the instructor.

cheers

eon

163 USBeast  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:34:36pm

re: #157 albusteve

Capone the Magnificent?

No. It was in regards to literary efforts.

164 Querent  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:34:38pm

re: #155 USBeast

"The good ones borrow. The great ones steal."

I forget who said it.

i remember this man, who taught me the secret of success in one word:
PLAGIARIZE --- let noone else's work evade your eyes
remember why the good Lord made your eyes,
so don't shade your eyes, but plagiarize, plagiarize, PLAGIARIZE...
only remember to always call it, please, "research"

- T. Lehrer, "Lobachevski"

165 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:35:04pm

re: #153 opnion

There could actually be a Sitcom of a released Gitmo prisoner living with Nancy Pelosi.
"Achmed, I do not like your superior attitude toward women, including me"
"Shut up woman!'
"Ah ok, put the sword away. i wont mention it again. By the way , what happened to the dog?"
Caned laughter.

At the end of the episode you have their daughter with her body leaning over a block of wood with her head chopped off.

Nancy rolling her eyes with a sarcastic "Aaaachmed!", and all the onlookers laughing.

166 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:35:17pm

re: #158 DEZes

Caned laughter was the down fall of sugar commercials. ;)

Can I have one more N?

167 Dianna  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:35:45pm

Time to hit the road. Take care, all!

168 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:35:57pm

re: #166 opnion

Can I have one more N?

Sure, have an n, just messing with ya. ;)

169 pbird  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:36:03pm

re: #25 Honorary Yooper

The anti-science zealots have latched onto differing sides in many scientific debates and arguments. They rather enjoyed the punctuated equilibrium versus gradualism debate in evolutionary theory in the 1980s. Consistently, they tried to use the debate to show that there was something wrong with evolutionary theory and that evolution had to be wrong because not all scientists agreed. Stephen J. Gould had quite a bit to write about it in several of his books.

Gould is or was a putz.

170 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:36:52pm

re: #167 Dianna

Time to hit the road. Take care, all!

Have a good afternoon and evening!

171 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:37:00pm

re: #161 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Could be. He knew Al about it.

it led to a real ness tho

172 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:37:23pm

re: #70 opnion

If you have not yet read Michael Crichtons "State of Fear" I highly reccomend it. As usual he wrapped a story around great research.
I came away with a much better appreciation of just how much money is at stake ,driving the promotion of the Global Warming hysteria.

That was a great read, and probably the most footnoted piece of fiction that I have ever read, but my main question is, what the hell did Martin Sheen ever do to Michael Crichton to have the obvious parody of him be given such a gruesome end?

173 Randall Gross  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:37:37pm

Definitely. Freeman Dyson is a far thinker, and one who sticks to reality and what's truly possible in that far thinking.

Dyson Sphere

174 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:37:37pm

re: #166 opnion

Can I have one more N?

uhhh, que up buddy... I am on the list for a "n"

175 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:37:38pm

re: #167 Dianna

Time to hit the road. Take care, all!

If I don't see ya! Good afternoon, good evening and goodnight!

176 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:37:39pm

re: #171 albusteve

it led to a real ness tho

*rimshot*

177 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:37:41pm

re: #33 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

There is no money or power to be made in simply accepting the real evidence and data

The problem is that the data is in a constant state of flux, as is normal with science:

NASA Backtracks on 1998 Warmest Year Claim

UW-Milwaukee Study Could Realign Climate Change Theory

The alarmists and religionists want set-in-stone dogma, not in flux data.

178 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:37:55pm

re: #165 Hengineer

At the end of the episode you have their daughter with her body leaning over a block of wood with her head chopped off.

Nancy rolling her eyes with a sarcastic "Aaaachmed!", and all the onlookers laughing.

Wanna work on this together? We need a meeting with a network honcho.
"Harry, work with me on this. It will drive your prime time ratings through the roof."

179 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:38:40pm
180 johnnyreb  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:38:51pm

re: #172 CyanSnowHawk

That was a great read, and probably the most footnoted piece of fiction that I have ever read, but my main question is, what the hell did Martin Sheen ever do to Michael Crichton to have the obvious parody of him be given such a gruesome end?

I have wondered about that too. There had to be some very bad blood there.

181 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:38:54pm

re: #151 Macker

As long as Skiffy doesn't get their hands on it.

No joke; this summer, they are officially changing the name from the Sci-Fi Channel to "SyFy".

Either this is leetspeek, or they are proving what I have long suspected- namely, that SFC is run by illiterates.

/One look at the script of one of their "Sci-Fi Original Productions" of the last two or three years is also strong supporting evidence.

cheers

eon

182 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:39:23pm

re: #172 CyanSnowHawk

That was a great read, and probably the most footnoted piece of fiction that I have ever read, but my main question is, what the hell did Martin Sheen ever do to Michael Crichton to have the obvious parody of him be given such a gruesome end?

You thought it was Martin Sheen?

183 Right Brain  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:39:28pm

What was stunning to read in the article, although in keeping with the NY Times self-immolation was this line:

"Which makes Dyson something far more formidable than just the latest peevish right-wing climate-change denier."


If someone disagrees with the anthropogenic global warming hypothesis, its not because they have different or better information, its because they are "right wing" or a "denier," the latter used for its shared homophony with "holocaust denier," as a way of painting such as venal. Name-calling, once eschewed by journalists, is basically all they have left anymore, certainly all that they have left at the NY Times.

No one considers them a news source.

184 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:40:03pm

re: #150 buzzsawmonkey

So are all the people now making money off winter sports/tourism too stupid to adapt if this prediction does, over time, come to pass?

I don't know if people are too supid to adapt to anything. I would not "adapt" my behavior/choices in any way based upon some silly "prediction" that is supposed to happen long after I am dead.

185 Ojoe  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:40:04pm
When Dyson joins the public conversation about climate change by expressing concern about the “enormous gaps in our knowledge, the sparseness of our observations and the superficiality of our theories,”

Exactly. Who can tell me with good certainty how much grass there is on the planet, and how many trees, and how much CO2 they absorb every day?

And on and on and on, and that's just an uncertainty about the earth; there is a lot we do not know about the sun.

Dyson is spot on.

186 callahan23  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:40:09pm

Philip Stott: Last Days of the ‘Global Warming’ Grand Narrative?

Crunch Time for ‘Global Warming’
Sadly, I think that neither our politicians, nor the mainstream media like the BBC and The Times, have quite yet grasped how few people are convinced by the ‘global warming’ panic. I speak to many groups around the country, and I am constantly amazed (and encouraged, I might add) by the level of scepticism I encounter. Indeed, I am now more convinced than ever that, despite the hysteria and the manic depressive hyperactivity that will inevitably accompany the run up to the Copenhagen climate meeting in December, we are about to enter the Last Days of the ‘Global Warming’ Grand Narrative. It is surely crunch time for ‘global warming’, as it faces what I call the five Big ‘C’s:
-The Credit Crunch
-The Coal Crunch
-The Colonial Crunch
-The Climate Crunch
-The Credibility Crunch

Some background on Philip Stott here and here.

187 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:40:11pm
188 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:40:15pm

re: #152 johnnyreb

Global warming is not about saving the planet. It is 100% about control. Everything the greens have done since the 1970s is about trying to control you and your lifestyle.

The Greens movement of the 60's and 70's is an outgrowth of the Socialist/Communist movements of the 20's and 30's, with a counter-reaction of the staid conservatism of the post-war cold war mentality.

189 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:40:25pm

re: #179 buzzsawmonkey

I'm just saying that people are not going to wake up one day with winter...gone forever. Any change is going to happen over time, if indeed it happens at all. Which means that if there is no snow in Canada for winter sports (not going to happen), then people will take nature hikes to look at wildflowers or something.

"Predictions" that if something we think might happen maybe perhaps should happen to come about then it could kill the [fill in the blank] industry is scaremongering bullshit pure and simple.

photographing polar bears in downtown Calgary will become very popular

190 Last Mohican  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:40:35pm

Hillary Clinton confirms it: the Obama administration will no longer use the term "global war on terror."

AP reminds us that "the use of the term 'global war on terror' is widely disliked overseas." And by "widely disliked overseas," they mean "widely disliked by terrorists." And it's oh so important that we not offend the terrorists.

So what's Hillary's explanation for dropping the term?

She said the absence of the "war on terror" language speaks for itself.

I'd say that explanation speaks for itself. If we're not gonna fight it, then why say we're fighting it?

191 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:41:23pm

re: #187 buzzsawmonkey

But it is kosher for Passover, so at this time of year it replaces the more corny syrupy laughter that is generally used the rest of the year.

What a sticky mess, I gotta goo.

192 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:41:33pm

re: #187 buzzsawmonkey

But it is kosher for Passover, so at this time of year it replaces the more corny syrupy laughter that is generally used the rest of the year.

At least it ain't high fructosy laughter, or partially hydrogenated laughter....

193 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:41:46pm

re: #187 buzzsawmonkey

But it is kosher for Passover, so at this time of year it replaces the more corny syrupy laughter that is generally used the rest of the year.

I hear that when it's used at Passover, it has no Equal.

194 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:42:17pm

re: #190 Last Mohican

Hillary Clinton confirms it: the Obama administration will no longer use the term "global war on terror."

AP reminds us that "the use of the term 'global war on terror' is widely disliked overseas." And by "widely disliked overseas," they mean "widely disliked by terrorists." And it's oh so important that we not offend the terrorists.

So what's Hillary's explanation for dropping the term?

I'd say that explanation speaks for itself. If we're not gonna fight it, then why say we're fighting it?

It is now "Global Contingency Operations"

195 SteveC  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:42:25pm

re: #193 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I hear that when it's used at Passover, it has no Equal.

Well, that's just Splenda! Order a case!

196 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:43:03pm

re: #191 DEZes

What a sticky mess, I gotta goo.

When you find it out in the yard, it's either from squirrels or mole asses.

197 Dan G.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:43:46pm

re: #129 Sharmuta

I agree. The other group (greens/leftists) are primarily driven by hatred of humanity; science would be inherited in that.

198 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:44:00pm

re: #193 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I hear that when it's used at Passover, it has no Equal.

Is nothing saccharine around here?

199 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:44:32pm

re: #116 Occasional Reader

Okay, but seriously, folks... what are they proposing?

* * *
To put them in our dinky jail, where Zacharias Moussaoui was held while on Federal trial in Alexandria VA.

200 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:44:52pm

re: #62 Lizard by the Bay

Just so I am clear on the posting rules. Posts not supporting AGW in the last climate change thread were bad, posts not supporting AGW in this thread are...?

What a bunch of crap.

201 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:44:54pm

re: #190 Last Mohican

Hillary Clinton confirms it: the Obama administration will no longer use the term "global war on terror."

AP reminds us that "the use of the term 'global war on terror' is widely disliked overseas." And by "widely disliked overseas," they mean "widely disliked by terrorists." And it's oh so important that we not offend the terrorists.

So what's Hillary's explanation for dropping the term?


I'd say that explanation speaks for itself. If we're not gonna fight it, then why say we're fighting it?

War implies fighting back, and I see no sign that Barry plans to do that.

202 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:44:58pm
He could also be a lonely prophet.

Apparently, the NYT thinks Dyson is the only major scientist who has serious question about the validity of AGW.

203 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:44:59pm

re: #181 eon

No joke; this summer, they are officially changing the name from the Sci-Fi Channel to "SyFy".

Either this is leetspeek, or they are proving what I have long suspected- namely, that SFC is run by illiterates.

/One look at the script of one of their "Sci-Fi Original Productions" of the last two or three years is also strong supporting evidence.

cheers

eon

I used to watch the channel near religiously a few years back since they were the only good source of obscure sci-fi TV shows and movies. Now they are a very poor Nick at Night imitation.

204 Shay4l  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:45:01pm

The entire raison d'etre of AGW is the institution of cap-and-trade type legislation in the developed world. Wealth gets transferred from the producers to the leeches, and, oh bye the way, the brokers who are allowed to manage the trade part of cap-and-trade will become even more fabulously wealthy...and the politicians who receive their kickbacks.

205 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:45:15pm
206 Dan G.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:45:27pm

re: #198 DEZes

Is nothing saccharine around here?

That's a Splenda pun!

207 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:45:31pm

re: #198 DEZes

Is nothing saccharine around here?

Certainly not. How sweet it is to be raising cane!

208 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:45:37pm

re: #196 pre-Boomer Marine brat

When you find it out in the yard, it's either from squirrels or mole asses.

If I just would have spelled it "canned" laughter, none of these puns would be happening. That's just a sweetner.

209 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:45:57pm

re: #8 jamgarr

Where do you get all the stuff to make a Dyson Sphere?

Same place our treasury gets the money for trillion dollar deficits?

With any luck, all you have to do is disassemble a few local planets. That's to fix our budget. For a Dyson sphere, pretty much the same.

210 Ojoe  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:46:32pm

re: #205 Iron Fist

One hand chain saw use? What a maniac.

211 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:46:51pm

re: #181 eon

No joke; this summer, they are officially changing the name from the Sci-Fi Channel to "SyFy".

Either this is leetspeek, or they are proving what I have long suspected- namely, that SFC is run by illiterates.

/One look at the script of one of their "Sci-Fi Original Productions" of the last two or three years is also strong supporting evidence.

cheers

eon

A-men! The Sci-Fi channel was a very good idea, gone very bad.

212 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:46:53pm

re: #199 alegrias

* * *
To put them in our dinky jail, where Zacharias Moussaoui was held while on Federal trial in Alexandria VA.

where is he these days anyhow?

213 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:46:54pm

re: #207 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Certainly not. How sweet it is to be raising cane!

As long as your Abel to justify it.

214 SteveC  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:46:54pm

re: #203 FurryOldGuyJeans

I used to watch the channel near religiously a few years back since they were the only good source of obscure sci-fi TV shows and movies. Now they are a very poor Nick at Night imitation.

Caprica better be one hell of a series, because now that they've parked the Battlestar my interest in the network is lacking.

215 Dan G.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:47:06pm

re: #205 Iron Fist

Did he laugh maniacally when wielding it?

216 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:47:18pm

re: #194 Hengineer

Hillary Clinton is a moron who should be in a federal pen feeding pigeons and wondering how her long lost husband fares....she is beyond the pale

217 Ojoe  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:47:58pm

re: #216 albusteve

"Who painted it?"

Sheesh.

218 summergurl  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:48:08pm

re: #216 albusteve

Hillary Clinton is a moron who should be in a federal pen feeding pigeons and wondering how her long lost husband fares....she is beyond the pale

Did you just see her comments on Fox about the Virgin Mary? Is that why you commented?

219 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:48:22pm

re: #60 buzzsawmonkey

Not "Cassandras."

The curse of Cassandra was that she always told the truth, but was never believed. That does not apply to the climate change crowd; they are believed, but do not tell the truth.

Charlatan comes to mind.

220 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:48:30pm

re: #18 ArchangelMichael

No because they are unstable and will collapse or drift relative to the central star way before moonbat inhabitants can come up with a theory to force communism on you blame the drift on Bush.


//

221 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:48:40pm

re: #203 FurryOldGuyJeans

I used to watch the channel near religiously a few years back since they were the only good source of obscure sci-fi TV shows and movies. Now they are a very poor Nick at Night imitation.

I loved Stargate SG-1

I own Seasons 1-10 and the movies: Ark of Truth and Continuum

As well as the original movie Stargate.

222 Dan G.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:48:40pm

re: #213 DEZes

Hey boneheads, quit your jawing.

223 johnnyreb  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:48:41pm

re: #202 HelloDare

Apparently, the NYT thinks Dyson is the only major scientist who has serious question about the validity of AGW.

Actually I think they did a series of articles on him years ago and praised him as a great scientist. Now they certainly can't go out and say he is a kook. However IMO the article does try and marginalize him to a certain extent.

224 Ojoe  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:48:45pm

re: #218 summergurl

Re Our Lady of Guadalupe to be exact.

225 SteveC  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:49:02pm

re: #218 summergurl

Did you just see her comments on Fox about the Virgin Mary? Is that why you commented?

Hillary is dissin' Mary? I think she's just jealous.

226 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:49:04pm

re: #205 Iron Fist

One summer when I was a kid I worked under the table (cash money for labor; I was doing jobs that Americans just won't do) for a rather wealthy man. He was a good guy to work for. Most times when I'd be busting my ass doing whatever, he'd be there right next to me busting his own ass to get the job done (he wasn't too proud to do the jobs Americans just won't do, either. He used to scare the hell out of me with a chainsaw. He was crippled on the right side of his body from a gunshot wound. He'd get out there and fire the bad boy up and use it with his left hand. I always just knew he was going to cut off a hand or something. He never did, thank God).

He told me the secret to getting rich: use other people shamelessly. Use other people's ideas, other people's work, other people's money, etc. to make you money. It seems real simple when you say it, buit I've never been smart enough to actually put it into practice :-)

OK, but "shameless" doesn't really have to be the key, if you recognize the real value you do by getting things moving and keeping them organized. IOW, be proudly shameless.

227 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:49:21pm
228 Mirage  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:49:25pm

re: #35 loppyd


He blew off Earth Hour too.

So did I. I have better things to do than waste an hour like this.

229 Last Mohican  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:49:43pm

re: #62 Lizard by the Bay

Just so I am clear on the posting rules. Posts not supporting AGW in the last climate change thread were bad, posts not supporting AGW in this thread are...?

In the last thread, posts not supporting a raving crazy person were bad.

In this thread, posts supporting an accomplished and respected physicist are good.

230 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:49:54pm

re: #16 Honorary Yooper

Michael Crichton also had some sanity when looking at the issue as well.

Aliens Cause Global Warming

He takes aim at SETI, nuclear winter, and then global warming (as it was known before he passed away).

That is a fabulous article by Michael Crichton. Thanks for posting it. I've saved it among my favorites.
What a loss he was........

231 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:49:58pm

re: #221 Hengineer

I loved Stargate SG-1

I own Seasons 1-10 and the movies: Ark of Truth and Continuum

As well as the original movie Stargate.

And yet they cancelled MST3K!

Could you imagine if they simply let Mike and the Bots loose on any SciFi original movie?

232 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:50:17pm

re: #212 brookly red

where is he these days anyhow?

* * **
I don't know where Zacharias Moussaoui ended up after he left our fair city, Alexandria, Virginia. He was such a bastard Al Qaedan, foul mouthing the female judge and screaming like the maniac would-be murderer he was raised to be.

233 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:50:17pm

re: #222 Dan G.

Hey boneheads, quit your jawing.

Im not Eve n gonna touch that one.

234 summergurl  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:50:47pm

re: #224 Ojoe

Re Our Lady of Guadalupe to be exact.

Oh yeah .. and
"Nice virgin you got there." or something like it...

Doofwad

235 Digital Display  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:50:57pm

re: #205 Iron Fist

One summer when I was a kid I worked under the table (cash money for labor; I was doing jobs that Americans just won't do) for a rather wealthy man. He was a good guy to work for. Most times when I'd be busting my ass doing whatever, he'd be there right next to me busting his own ass to get the job done (he wasn't too proud to do the jobs Americans just won't do, either. He used to scare the hell out of me with a chainsaw. He was crippled on the right side of his body from a gunshot wound. He'd get out there and fire the bad boy up and use it with his left hand. I always just knew he was going to cut off a hand or something. He never did, thank God).

He told me the secret to getting rich: use other people shamelessly. Use other people's ideas, other people's work, other people's money, etc. to make you money. It seems real simple when you say it, buit I've never been smart enough to actually put it into practice :-)


I dinged you up..But maybe the secret to getting rich is hard work..
If you are doing something you just love..and willing to work hard to achieve your goals...You'll be rich and well to do.

236 pat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:51:00pm

First read Freeman Dyson in the late 60s.

237 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:51:07pm

re: #218 summergurl

Did you just see her comments on Fox about the Virgin Mary? Is that why you commented?

no I commented because she has never had an original thought, can't control her husband and is privy and accomplice to federal crimes

238 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:51:16pm

re: #233 DEZes

Im not Eve n gonna touch that one.

A, Dam you

239 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:51:30pm
240 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:07pm

re: #234 summergurl

Oh yeah .. and
"Nice virgin you got there." or something like it...

Doofwad

That was a close quote, her and Biden should do a routine.
The gaff sisters.

241 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:11pm

re: #227 Iron Fist

Man, didn't they just absolutely fuck up Battlestar Galactica? I loved the first two seasons, then it went downhill fast. Maybe they pulled it out of its tailspin, but I haven't been able to trouble myself to watch it.

Last I watched, they had just escaped off a second planet after the Cylons caught up with them and wasn't able to get back into it after that. About the only thing I've watched in the last year is maybe Lost and I haven't even been keeping up with that.

Now if they made a Gaunt's Ghosts movie/series, I'd be all over it.

242 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:16pm

Freeman Dyson on Global Warming Bogus Climate Models, 1 of 2

Freeman Dyson on Global Warming Bogus Climate Models, 2 of 2

243 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:16pm

re: #71 rightymouse

They distort all sense of rosin.

A bridge too far.

244 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:28pm

re: #219 LGoPs

OT ... between us.

I noticed that you up-dinged my nautical pun on "Bulgine Run" a few days ago.

LOL! ... That was an obscure one, didn't expect anyone to get it.

245 SteveC  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:32pm

re: #237 albusteve

no I commented because she has never had an original thought, can't control her husband and is privy and accomplice to federal crimes

Other than that, she's a pretty nice person!

*Sarcasm Meter explodes, Charles charges me $120 to replace and install new Sarcasm Meter*

246 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:40pm

re: #233 DEZes

Im not Eve n gonna touch that one.

up and adam.......

247 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:48pm

re: #235 HoosierHoops

I dinged you up..But maybe the secret to getting rich is hard work..
If you are doing something you just love..and willing to work hard to achieve your goals...You'll be rich and well to do.

Speaking of, did you hear Geithner today:

"With the new economy, you won't care how much money you make, what will be important is what you do, and living within your means."

248 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:52:53pm

re: #181 eon

No joke; this summer, they are officially changing the name from the Sci-Fi Channel to "SyFy".

Either this is leetspeek, or they are proving what I have long suspected- namely, that SFC is run by illiterates.

/One look at the script of one of their "Sci-Fi Original Productions" of the last two or three years is also strong supporting evidence.

cheers

eon

They can't trademark "Sci-Fi", it's a common term. They can with SyFy.

249 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:53:09pm

re: #232 alegrias

* * **
I don't know where Zacharias Moussaoui ended up after he left our fair city, Alexandria, Virginia. He was such a bastard Al Qaedan, foul mouthing the female judge and screaming like the maniac would-be murderer he was raised to be.

/well just as long as he is not teaching civics or something...

250 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:53:15pm

re: #216 albusteve

Hillary Clinton is a moron who should be in a federal pen feeding pigeons and wondering how her long lost husband fares....she is beyond the pale

All of them in this administration should be in jail. Good grief! What a corrupt bunch of stalinist assholes.

251 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:53:46pm
What may trouble Dyson most about climate change are the experts. Experts are, he thinks, too often crippled by the conventional wisdom they create, leading to the belief that “they know it all.” The men he most admires tend to be what he calls “amateurs,” inventive spirits of uncredentialed brilliance like Bernhard Schmidt, an eccentric one-armed alcoholic telescope-lens designer; Milton Humason, a janitor at Mount Wilson Observatory in California whose native scientific aptitude was such that he was promoted to staff astronomer; and especially Darwin, who, Dyson says, “was really an amateur and beat the professionals at their own game.”

OK- I'm now totally sold on this guy.

252 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:53:57pm

re: #244 pre-Boomer Marine brat

OT ... between us.

I noticed that you up-dinged my nautical pun on "Bulgine Run" a few days ago.

LOL! ... That was an obscure one, didn't expect anyone to get it.

My mind works in twisted ways.........thanks to a diet of Monty Python when I was a kid.....
:)

253 ArchangelMichael  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:01pm

re: #203 FurryOldGuyJeans

I used to watch the channel near religiously a few years back since they were the only good source of obscure sci-fi TV shows and movies. Now they are a very poor Nick at Night imitation.

Given the success of the new BSG, and the planned SGU show which is supposed to be darker, more dramatic, and more BSG-like, I thought maybe the Sci-Fi channel was finally getting it that their "Monster of the Week" B Movies were total garbage and a waste of money. Putting Bruce Campbell in them to play clone-Ash, doesn't make them any better.

But maybe they aren't getting the clue.

254 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:02pm

re: #182 opnion

You thought it was Martin Sheen?

With a little Ed Begley Jr. thrown in, but he struck me as much more like Sheen.

255 opnion  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:04pm

re: #234 summergurl

Oh yeah .. and
"Nice virgin you got there." or something like it...

Doofwad

She asked "Who painted this." According to beliefs of many Mexicans, the image appeared miraculously & was not painted.
Hillary should have been prepared, but really I wonder if the Obama people are sabotaging her

256 horse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:05pm

re: #56 eon

The science fiction book Footfall, by Larry Niven incorporated the Project Orion model into the design of a human space ship rapidly put together to respond to an alien invasion. It was one of the better science fiction books I read during school years that really stuck with me; filled with several interesting undeveloped scientific ideas at the time put into possible applied scenarios. A very fun read.

257 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:18pm

re: #250 Soona'

All of them in this administration should be in jail. Good grief! What a corrupt bunch of stalinist assholes.

At the rate they're going, they'll be the ones selling the rope come 2012

258 summergurl  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:22pm

re: #247 itellu3times

Speaking of, did you hear Geithner today:

"With the new economy, you won't care how much money you make, what will be important is what you do, and living within your means."

link?

My husband's head will explode so I better not show him that one

259 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:28pm

re: #188 FurryOldGuyJeans

The Greens movement of the 60's and 70's is an outgrowth of the Socialist/Communist movements of the 20's and 30's, with a counter-reaction of the staid conservatism of the post-war cold war mentality.

As I've said elsewhere (and maybe here, too, ALTA), the same data that was used to predict a "new Ice Age" in the 1970s is being used to predict a global meltdown now. And each time, the solution demanded has been to deep-six technological society, and democracy along with it, and return to "living in harmony with Holy Mother Gaia" in a pre-Bronze Age agricultural collectivist state- run by the "enlightened elite'".

It is logically impossible for two diametrically-opposed phenomena to be caused by a single set of conditions. Physics. Does. Not. Allow. It.

And when the same "solution" is demanded as "the only answer" to two such conditions (the existence of neither of which has ever been proven by observation of actual real-world data), it is in fact the "solution" which is the prime desideratum, for reasons unrelated to the ostensible ones.

My training is in science. I'm a retired police lab geek. That means I've done the test-tube trip in addition to the "Code Three" sort of thing. (It's not really like on TV- trust me.) And since I was trained in the scientific method Way Back When, I know the siren call of pseudo-scientific and politically-motivated bulls#!t when I hear it. (Like in the Carter Administration, when we were supposed to "prove" that rural areas with a higher percentage of gun owners had a higher rate of gun-related violent crime- at the behest of Carter's DOJ; But That, as Conan's chronicler said, Is Another Story.)

I've been hearing it on "climate change" for thirty-plus years. And at some point, somebody needs to call BS on this bunch. Loudly, clearly, and firmly.

cheers

eon

260 Last Mohican  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:36pm

re: #247 itellu3times

Speaking of, did you hear Geithner today:

"With the new economy, you won't care how much money you make, what will be important is what you do, and living within your means."

Um, excuse me? Did he say that? In public?

I started reaching for my google, but I think I may just go ahead and assume you're kidding.

261 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:50pm

re: #243 Cygnus

A bridge too far.

No jumping off of clefs, ya hear?

262 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:51pm

re: #252 LGoPs

My mind works in twisted ways.........thanks to a diet of Monty Python when I was a kid.....
:)

I take it you were aware, at least, of the sea shanty?

263 Randall Gross  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:55pm

re: #181 eon

No joke; this summer, they are officially changing the name from the Sci-Fi Channel to "SyFy".

Either this is leetspeek, or they are proving what I have long suspected- namely, that SFC is run by illiterates.

/One look at the script of one of their "Sci-Fi Original Productions" of the last two or three years is also strong supporting evidence.

cheers

eon

I'm surprised they aren't calling it "skiffy"

264 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:54:59pm

OT

Tomorrow our administration will have its first high level talks with Iran, woo hoo. In the Hague, per Charles Krauthammer, who is NOT thrilled.

Juan Williams says pictures of our Hillary with Iran's Deputy Foreign Minister
will make the world happy.

Fox News Cable.

265 Digital Display  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:55:14pm

re: #247 itellu3times

Speaking of, did you hear Geithner today:

"With the new economy, you won't care how much money you make, what will be important is what you do, and living within your means."

That must have sent chills down Al Gore's spine

266 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:55:42pm

Here are some basics on Global warming data for those interested in having a discussion without naming Al Gore.

Key points are:

that CO2, and other gases ARE "greenhouse" gases.

that humans DO have a measurable incontrovertible net effect on the amounts of such gases being produced, and prevented from being absorbed.

The debatable points are what other factors may be causing warming (provable today), the extent to which greenhouse gases are a contributing factor, the time frame in which such effects will show themselves and, of course, whether there is any point in doing anything.

Do Volcanoes Generate More Greenhouse Gas Than Humans?


Earth Gases - Carbon Dioxide.


Enjoy

267 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:55:53pm

re: #252 LGoPs

My mind works in twisted ways.........thanks to a diet of Monty Python when I was a kid.....
:)

Same here, not to mention the Marx Brothers. I thought I caught all their dialogue when I watched their movies, but I have a book with it all written out. Truely genius!

268 summergurl  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:56:16pm

re: #264 alegrias

OT

Tomorrow our administration will have its first high level talks with Iran, woo hoo. In the Hague, per Charles Krauthammer, who is NOT thrilled.

Juan Williams says pictures of our Hillary with Iran's Deputy Foreign Minister
will make the world happy.

Fox News Cable.


Juan's on crack

269 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:56:27pm
270 Shay4l  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:56:40pm

I just heard a clip of Zero on the radio, saying the US government will stand "behind the warranty" on GM vehicles. The way his annunciation was stressed was...odd, and brought to mind unsavory thoughts on why the government is "behind the warranty", and the bent-over position the warranty holders might be in.

271 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:56:45pm

re: #132 Dianna

"God was knocking, and he wanted in bad."

"Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If you don't let Me in, I'm kicking this door down and giving you an ass-whupping you soon won't forget!"

Revelation 3:20, Revised Bubba Edition

272 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:56:56pm

re: #261 rightymouse

No jumping off of clefs, ya hear?

Now that WOULD be looking for treble!

273 Steffan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:56:58pm

OT: This might actually be a good reason to visit Amsterdam:

An exhibition at the Rijksmuseum in Amsterdam, Return to Manhattan, includes the only evidence of the purchase of the island from the Indians for 60 guilders.

The centrepiece of the exhibition Return to Manhattan - 400th anniversary of Henry Hudson's voyage is a letter from Pieter Schaghen, a representative of the Dutch States General.

In the letter dating from 1626, the sale of Manhattan, "valued at 60 guilders", is documented. It is the only evidence of the historical event as the actual purchase contract for Manhattan no longer exists.

The story I recall from school was that Peter Minuit bought the island with $24 worth of beads. Counting inflation, $24 or 60 guilders then would be worth a heck of a lot more now.

According to Paul Harvey, though, he bought the land from Canarsie Indians who were just visiting the place -- they didn't own it. Too bad they couldn't include a bridge or two into the deal, hmmm?

274 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:57:54pm

re: #250 Soona'

All of them in this administration should be in jail. Good grief! What a corrupt bunch of stalinist assholes.

ALOT of bad stuff went down in Arkansas they never had to explain...they walked right through it...and the jennifer Flowers thing never got sorted out

275 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:57:58pm

re: #249 brookly red

/well just as long as he is not teaching civics or something...

* * **
Thanks for the tip...

I'll check out the new "community center" in the middle of our huge public housing neighborhood, to make sure enemy combatant Zacharias Moussaoui hasn't received a bailout, welfare plus housing allowance--in addition to a JOB teaching "basket weaving for Allah"-- on my Alexandria City tax dollar!

276 kansas  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:58:40pm

re: #270 Shay4l

I just heard a clip of Zero on the radio, saying the US government will stand "behind the warranty" on GM vehicles. The way his annunciation was stressed was...odd, and brought to mind unsavory thoughts on why the government is "behind the warranty", and the bent-over position the warranty holders might be in.

WTF does that even mean? Does he have a clue? Of course he doesn't. He's winging it now. Rally killer that guy.

277 Russkilitlover  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:58:56pm

re: #247 itellu3times

Speaking of, did you hear Geithner today:

"With the new economy, you won't care how much money you make, what will be important is what you do, and living within your means."

Linky?

278 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:59:46pm

re: #227 Iron Fist

Man, didn't they just absolutely fuck up Battlestar Galactica? I loved the first two seasons, then it went downhill fast. Maybe they pulled it out of its tailspin, but I haven't been able to trouble myself to watch it.

I watched the pilot. Nothing else. I thought it was better than the original (which I really disliked), but not enough to be worth bothering with.

As it went downhill, what I heard led me to conclude that it was just another Hollywood "package", being used to vent the political views of its creators.

(Tip to same; Get. A. Blog.)

By that time, I had moved, and no longer had satellite or cable. And where SFC is concerned, I didn't, and don't, particularly care.

cheers

eon

279 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 3:59:48pm

re: #276 kansas

WTF does that even mean? Does he have a clue? Of course he doesn't. He's winging it now. Rally killer that guy.

Welcome to the DMV/GM Chrysler warranty center.....
Please take a number.

280 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:00:07pm

re: #272 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Now that WOULD be looking for treble!

And on that sour note, I must get busy.

281 Querent  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:00:35pm

re: #205 Iron Fist

One summer when I was a kid I worked under the table (cash money for labor; I was doing jobs that Americans just won't do) for a rather wealthy man. He was a good guy to work for. Most times when I'd be busting my ass doing whatever, he'd be there right next to me busting his own ass to get the job done (he wasn't too proud to do the jobs Americans just won't do, either. He used to scare the hell out of me with a chainsaw. He was crippled on the right side of his body from a gunshot wound. He'd get out there and fire the bad boy up and use it with his left hand. I always just knew he was going to cut off a hand or something. He never did, thank God).

He told me the secret to getting rich: use other people shamelessly. Use other people's ideas, other people's work, other people's money, etc. to make you money. It seems real simple when you say it, buit I've never been smart enough to actually put it into practice :-)

there's a quote from Wuthering Heights in here somewhere, about making one's fortune "in the usual way -- taking advantage of others' weaknesses..."

282 horse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:01:06pm

re: #62 Lizard by the Bay

Just so I am clear on the posting rules. Posts not supporting AGW in the last climate change thread were bad, posts not supporting AGW in this thread are...?

Could have seen that karma coming a mile away. As I initially learned, smart a$$ comments have negative value here. It is too easy a cop out when others are engaging the more developed areas of their brains for both reason and humor.

283 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:01:10pm

re: #188 FurryOldGuyJeans

The Greens movement of the 60's and 70's is an outgrowth of the Socialist/Communist movements of the 20's and 30's, with a counter-reaction of the staid conservatism of the post-war cold war mentality.

Commies are chameleons. They will infect seemingly good, seemingly benevolent causes with the intent of using them as vehicles to drive their statist, totalitarian agenda. I'm talking about the hard core shakers and movers behind these causes, not the average well meaning dolt that supports them. These are the useful idiots, the cover so to speak, that the cadre needs to camoflage the real agenda. And it's effective because when skeptical conservatives take them on, generally we're taking on the idiots who really are without a deeper agenda and thus effective barriers to the bastards behind the scenes.

284 Russkilitlover  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:01:38pm

re: #269 Iron Fist

I only had one job that I had to go back at, and that was because I didn't understand what he wanted me to do (it was cleaning out a horse stable. It isn't like I had a lot of experience doing that :-)

I've mucked more stalls in my youth than I can count. Did it in exchange for riding lessons. You can keep your smelly Patchouli - give me eau de horse any day. Love that smell!

285 Steffan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:01:52pm

re: #247 itellu3times

Speaking of, did you hear Geithner today:

"With the new economy, you won't care how much money you make, what will be important is what you do, and living within your means."

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his need."

Obama might not be able or willing to identify the author of that quote, but it's becoming increasingly evident that it is the core of his beliefs.

286 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:01:59pm

re: #262 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I take it you were aware, at least, of the sea shanty?

Oh yes.
:)

287 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:02:11pm

re: #254 CyanSnowHawk

With a little Ed Begley Jr. thrown in, but he struck me as much more like Sheen.

Ed Begley Jr. is a huge greenie

"I took out the water-sucking lawns front and back. We live in a desert, and you don’t waste water. I now have drought-tolerant California plants like lavender and ceanothus. We also grow produce, which is more efficient then trucking it in using fossil fuels."

Who ever wrote this quote doesn't know the difference between than and then.

288 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:02:24pm

Nicolas Sarkozy’s threat to walk out of global summit

President Sarkozy yesterday threatened to wreck the London summit if France’s demands for tougher financial regulation are not met.

France will not accept a G20 that produces a “false success with language that sounds good but contains no commitments”, his advisers said.

Asked if this meant a possible walk-out, Xavier Musca, Mr Sarkozy’s deputy chief of staff for economic affairs, said: “A basic rule with nuclear deterrence is that you do not say at what point you will use the weapon.”

The French threat dramatically raised the temperature hours before President Obama arrives in London today. If carried through, it would ruin a summit for which Mr Brown and Mr Obama have high ambitions, believing it vital to international recovery.

Has anyone told the teleprompter about this yet?

289 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:03:04pm

re: #267 sattv4u2

Same here, not to mention the Marx Brothers. I thought I caught all their dialogue when I watched their movies, but I have a book with it all written out. Truely genius!

Remember them well. Karl, Groucho, Chico and Zeppo.......
/ :)

290 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:03:09pm

fit's my mood...here's my Guy


291 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:03:36pm

re: #231 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

And yet they cancelled MST3K!

Could you imagine if they simply let Mike and the Bots loose on any SciFi original movie?

MST3k = win

292 Kragar  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:03:42pm

re: #278 eon

I watched the pilot. Nothing else. I thought it was better than the original (which I really disliked), but not enough to be worth bothering with.

As it went downhill, what I heard led me to conclude that it was just another Hollywood "package", being used to vent the political views of its creators.

(Tip to same; Get. A. Blog.)

By that time, I had moved, and no longer had satellite or cable. And where SFC is concerned, I didn't, and don't, particularly care.

cheers

eon

I still like the mini-series/pilot, I just gave up on the series.

293 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:03:46pm
294 Mirage  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:04:06pm

re: #247 itellu3times

Speaking of, did you hear Geithner today:

"With the new economy, you won't care how much money you make, what will be important is what you do, and living within your means."

Every time that idiot opens his big mouth and spews more crap, the DOW tumbles ... he needs to learn to pull his head out and stfu about what he knows nothing about. (Yes, I know that will never happen but one can always hope)

295 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:04:32pm

re: #248 CyanSnowHawk

They can't trademark "Sci-Fi", it's a common term. They can with SyFy.

True. But;

"The trouble is, they were so wrapped up in figuring out if they could do something, they never bothered to ask themselves if they should."

- Jeff Goldblum, Jurassic Park

cheers

eon

296 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:04:48pm

re: #252 LGoPs

My mind works in twisted ways.........thanks to a diet of Monty Python when I was a kid.....
:)

And Gary Larson cartoons, too.

297 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:04:56pm

re: #242 HelloDare

Forest management- that's a novel concept!

298 loppyd  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:04:57pm

test

299 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:05:05pm

re: #272 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Now that WOULD be looking for treble!

Shhhhhhhhh...don't tell the staff.

300 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:05:06pm

re: #294 Mirage

Every time that idiot opens his big mouth and spews more crap, the DOW tumbles ... he needs to learn to pull his head out and stfu about what he knows nothing about. (Yes, I know that will never happen but one can always hope)

DOW 7522.02 -254.16‎

301 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:05:46pm

re: #298 loppyd

test

roger, Roger

302 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:05:52pm
303 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:06:08pm

re: #299 rightymouse

Shhhhhhhhh...don't tell the staff.

Yeah, we gotta keep it solo no one can hear us.

304 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:06:09pm

re: #301 midwestgak

roger, Roger

Over, Unger

305 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:06:10pm

re: #194 Hengineer

It is now "Global Contingency Operations"

what exactly are we calling terrorists, themselves, these days?
i know they are committing 'human caused events" and that's why we must engage in' overseas contingency operations'.
but how do we define the fcking murderous jihadi scum?

this pc b.s. would be so damn funny if it wasn't so deadly stupid.

306 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:06:12pm

re: #296 Cygnus

And Gary Larson cartoons, too.

Far Side ftw.

307 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:06:15pm
308 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:06:35pm

re: #301 midwestgak

roger, Roger

What's my vector, Victor?

309 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:06:56pm

re: #288 Kragar (Proud to be Kafir)

Nicolas Sarkozy’s threat to walk out of global summit


Has anyone told the teleprompter about this yet?

Er...uh......hmmmmmm.

310 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:07:04pm

re: #294 Mirage

Every time that idiot opens his big mouth and spews more crap, the DOW tumbles ... he needs to learn to pull his head out and stfu about what he knows nothing about. (Yes, I know that will never happen but one can always hope)

Have you ever considered that Geithner is doing exactly the job O picked him for? The man sure is good at destabilizing the capitalist markets so as to ease the transition to Socialism, and make a majority of the American voting public actually demand such.

311 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:07:09pm

re: #302 Iron Fist

I can thankfully say I never read Wuthering Heights. I don't even have a vague idea of what the plot was. The Girlfriend probably loved it. She likes shit like that.

Wuthering Heights is the ONLY word of pre-20th century fiction I absolutely loathe.

312 Pietr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:08:08pm

re: #308 Hengineer

What's my vector, Victor?

Either an 'Airplane' quote, or a paraphrase of 'What's the frequency, Kenneth'.........:>))

313 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:08:08pm

re: #272 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Now that WOULD be looking for treble!

Don't string this along.

314 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:08:14pm

re: #310 FurryOldGuyJeans

Have you ever considered that Geithner is doing exactly the job O picked him for? The man sure is good at destabilizing the capitalist markets so as to ease the transition to Socialism, and make a majority of the American voting public actually demand such.

I think its worse than that, I think Obama wants true communism.

I know what Obama's running for. He's running for General Chairman.

315 johnnyreb  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:08:30pm

re: #304 sattv4u2

Over, Unger


What's our clearance Clarence?

316 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:08:35pm

re: #312 Pietr

Either an 'Airplane' quote, or a paraphrase of 'What's the frequency, Kenneth'.........:>))

Airplane =P

317 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:08:42pm
318 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:09:10pm

What the hell is wuthering heights? never read it.

319 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:09:10pm

re: #305 nyc redneck

what exactly are we calling terrorists, themselves, these days?
i know they are committing 'human caused events" and that's why we must engage in' overseas contingency operations'.
but how do we define the fcking murderous jihadi scum?

this pc b.s. would be so damn funny if it wasn't so deadly stupid.

We could call them Agents of Unpleasantness....?
/////

320 Querent  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:09:38pm

re: #302 Iron Fist
me neither, but i saw the miniseries -- delightfully Gothic and twisted. If that's your cup of hemlock, that is.

321 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:01pm

re: #286 LGoPs

Oh yes.
:)

I know of a DAMNED good CD -- I've got a copy.
Performed a cappela, traditional manner.
I'll go get a link to the lead performer's web site.

322 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:06pm

re: #304 sattv4u2

Over, Unger

What's the vector, Victor?

323 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:15pm

re: #314 Hengineer

I think its worse than that, I think Obama wants true communism.

I know what Obama's running for. He's running for General Chairman.

Socialism before Communism.

And Obama is campaigning for UN General Secretary since Bill has now been non-personed.

324 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:15pm

re: #319 LGoPs

We could call them Agents of Unpleasantness....?
/////

But to call them agents would mean they are behind a fully conspiracy sinister plot.

How about Unpleasant Cultural Guides?

325 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:18pm

re: #318 Hengineer

What the hell is wuthering heights? never read it.

The most depressing, pointless romance ever written.

326 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:39pm

re: #317 buzzsawmonkey

A wuthering criticism if ever I heard one.

I omitted "British." I don't mean to suggest I've read all pre-20th century fiction, British or otherwise, but I have read most of the "classics" as well as some obscure titles.

327 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:49pm

re: #322 Cygnus

What's the vector, Victor?

Beat you

re: #308 Hengineer

What's my vector, Victor?

328 Steffan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:57pm

re: #311 goddessoftheclassroom

Wuthering Heights is the ONLY word of pre-20th century fiction I absolutely loathe.

I read someplace that the only reason the Bronte sisters wrote in the first place was to support their worthless brother.

He has a lot to answer for.

/

329 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:10:58pm

re: #296 Cygnus

And Gary Larson cartoons, too.

Big time......that and Calvin and Hobbes
:)

330 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:00pm
331 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:07pm

re: #325 Sharmuta

The most depressing, pointless romance ever written.

No wonder I haven't read it, its a "romance"

=-)

332 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:09pm

Interesting line about Dyson and No-Doz, "a habit he first acquired during his R.A.F. days."

333 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:10pm

re: #324 Hengineer

But to call them agents would mean they are behind a fully conspiracy sinister plot.

How about Unpleasant Cultural Guides?

An Unpleasant Culture? Too judgmental.

334 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:10pm

re: #325 Sharmuta

The most depressing, pointless romance ever written.

You mean there are other types of trashy romance stories? ;)

335 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:39pm

re: #321 pre-Boomer Marine brat

MWAH!

336 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:40pm

re: #303 DEZes

Yeah, we gotta keep it solo no one can hear us.

Then it better be Hans off.

337 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:51pm

re: #316 Hengineer

Airplane =P

Steve McCroskey: Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit drinking.
Steve McCroskey: Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit smoking.
Steve McCroskey: Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit sniffing glue.
Steve McCroskey: Looks like I picked the wrong week to quit amphetamines

338 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:56pm

re: #325 Sharmuta

The most depressing, pointless romance ever written.

soon to be replaced by the 'Saga of Bill and Hillary'

339 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:11:56pm

re: #318 Hengineer

What the hell is wuthering heights? never read it.

It's about some chick falling in love, probably.

340 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:12:09pm

re: #311 goddessoftheclassroom

Wuthering Heights is the ONLY word of pre-20th century fiction I absolutely loathe.

Oh, thank God- I thought I was one of the only people that hated that book.

341 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:12:16pm

re: #327 Hengineer

"Have you ever been in a Turkish prison?"

342 Mirage  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:12:17pm

re: #310 FurryOldGuyJeans

Have you ever considered that Geithner is doing exactly the job O picked him for? The man sure is good at destabilizing the capitalist markets so as to ease the transition to Socialism, and make a majority of the American voting public actually demand such.

Yep, have considered it and still would like him to pull his head out of his @$$

343 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:12:25pm

re: #300 JCM

DOW 7522.02 -254.16‎

Awwww come on, it is not like we didn't see it coming... and that was just the knee jerk. By tomorrow investors will have gotten over their denial about GM & the DOW should open at about 7198... (of course the overseas markets may get a bump on auto speculations).

344 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:12:56pm

re: #301 midwestgak

re: #308 Hengineer

re: #322 Cygnus

re: #315 johnnyreb

"Joey, do you like movies about gladiators?"

345 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:12:56pm

re: #336 rightymouse

Then it better be Hans off.

Like tenor twelve miles from here.

346 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:13:01pm

re: #330 Iron Fist

Jesus. "From each according to his ability. To each according to his needs". The fucker is paraphrasing the fucking Communist Manifesto. You won't care how much money you make because it will be worthless anyway. You'll be busy enough trying to live in the huts the State gives you, and you wiil eat the tasty stone soup you have for dinner every night, and be glad.

It's like putting lipstick on a pig...

Need I put up that infamous blamebush blog post?

Its an oldie and goodie I need to dig it up.

347 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:13:04pm

re: #328 Steffan

I read someplace that the only reason the Bronte sisters wrote in the first place was to support their worthless brother.

He has a lot to answer for.

/

I do like Jane Eyre by sister Charlotte.

348 johnnyreb  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:13:05pm

re: #330 Iron Fist

Jesus. "From each according to his ability. To each according to his needs". The fucker is paraphrasing the fucking Communist Manifesto. You won't care how much money you make because it will be worthless anyway. You'll be busy enough trying to live in the huts the State gives you, and you wiil eat the tasty stone soup you have for dinner every night, and be glad.

It's like putting lipstick on a pig...

I still have not seen a link, nor any source for this "quote" 24 hour rule is in effect.

349 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:13:18pm

re: #305 nyc redneck

what exactly are we calling terrorists, themselves, these days?
i know they are committing 'human caused events" and that's why we must engage in' overseas contingency operations'.
but how do we define the fcking murderous jihadi scum?

this pc b.s. would be so damn funny if it wasn't so deadly stupid.

* * * *
Well if Pres. Obama has his way, formerly called enemy combatants will now be my "neighbors" from GITMO here in beautiful downtown Alexandria, Virginia.

Democrats are gonna pay in this state, big time.

350 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:13:32pm

re: #303 DEZes

Yeah, we gotta keep it solo no one can hear us.

Getting a Napoleon complex again, eh?

351 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:13:57pm

re: #344 sattv4u2

re: #308 Hengineer

re: #322 Cygnus

re: #315 johnnyreb

"Joey, do you like movies about gladiators?"

Ted Striker: My orders came through. My squadron ships out tomorrow. We're bombing the storage depots at Daiquiri at 1800 hours. We're coming in from the north, below their radar.
Elaine Dickinson: When will you be back?
Ted Striker: I can't tell you that. It's classified.

352 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:14:12pm

re: #334 FurryOldGuyJeans

You mean there are other types of trashy romance stories? ;)

Like "Debbie Does Dallas"?

353 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:14:14pm
354 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:14:20pm

I also hated Great Expectations. What a poor title.

355 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:14:25pm

re: #346 Hengineer

BlameBush:Socialism is your Friend!

SOCIALISM IS YOUR FRIEND

Look at it this way:

You go to the pie shop and realize that you only have enough money for one slice of pie. Then in walks Bill Gates who proceeds to buy all the pies and leaves you standing there completely pieless. Is that fair? Why does he get all the pies? Shouldn't he be made to share some of his pies instead of hording them all? Socialism says "YES, everyone is entitled to a piece of the pie! For now on, all pie shops will be under the control of The People, and The People will decide how to distribute the pies fairly and equitably."

Imagine a world where, instead of walking into a pie shop and hoping, PRAYING you have enough money for one itty bitty little piece of pie, you simply put your name on a waiting list for the priviledge to go before a special commitee, who will carefully determine how deserving you are of pie, and will then give you a slice of pie FOR FREE! Never again will anyone have to pay for pie, and never again will one man be able to horde ALL the pie. No more will people compete to get more pie than their neighbor. Everyone will be entitled to exactly the same amount of pie, with the exception of the People on the Pie Committee, who will get extra pie because they wear party pins.

How do you get a party pin? Well, you have to join the Party, and that will cost you a fee of 100 pies. Then you have to be approved by the party leader, MOI, and I don't like the shape of your nose. In fact, I think you're being greedy by coming around and asking for pie all the time when the People are starving in the streets. "I want pie! I want pie! ME ME ME ME ME!" You are putting your needs above the needs of The People, and that just won't do. Your selfish attitude is harmful to The People, and you're the reason everyone is starving. It's because of YOU that there aren't enough pies to go around. The only way we're going to make this a perfect Socialist Utopia is if we put a stop to big-nosed, pie-stealing scum like you sabotaging the system! THE PEOPLE MUST BE CLEANSED OF YOUR DISEASE! GET ON THE BOXCAR! NOW!

So the next time some right-wing extemist asks if you're a socialist, just smile and say, "I like pie".

356 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:14:53pm

re: #340 Sharmuta

Oh, thank God- I thought I was one of the only people that hated that book.

You MUST read the Thursday Next series by Jasper Fforde. They can't be described or explained; only enjoyed.

I will give a tiny hint: in the 3rd novel of the series, a character mediates an anger management session for Heathcliff, It's brilliant.

357 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:15:40pm

re: #354 Sharmuta

I also hated Great Expectations. What a poor title.

Yes, quite. It's doomed to obscurity.

358 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:15:41pm

re: #355 Hengineer
From one of the commenters there...

Under Socialism, the most highly rewarded talent is the ability to demonstrate need. The second most highly rewarded talent is the ability to hide means.
359 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:15:44pm

re: #356 goddessoftheclassroom

You MUST read the Thursday Next series by Jasper Fforde. They can't be described or explained; only enjoyed.

I will give a tiny hint: in the 3rd novel of the series, a character mediates an anger management session for Heathcliff, It's brilliant.

I love that book.

360 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:15:56pm

re: #350 FurryOldGuyJeans

Getting a Napoleon complex again, eh?

Lets pick that Bonaparte.

361 Russkilitlover  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:16:10pm

Quit Yer Whining!

All of you in a fit about the state and future of the economy? Government to the rescue!

362 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:16:21pm

re: #325 Sharmuta

The most depressing, pointless romance ever written.


How about 'The Bridges of Madison County' and 'Love Story' to name a few other ones?

363 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:16:22pm

Kate Bush. Wuthering Heights.

364 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:16:35pm

re: #344 sattv4u2

re: #308 Hengineer

re: #322 Cygnus

re: #315 johnnyreb

"Joey, do you like movies about gladiators?"

Rumack: You'd better tell the Captain we've got to land as soon as we can. This woman has to be gotten to a hospital.
Elaine Dickinson: A hospital? What is it?
Rumack: It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.

365 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:16:36pm
366 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:16:43pm
367 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:16:55pm

My kitty is laying on my bed, having a dream and twitching like crazy. Too cute.

368 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:17:01pm

re: #325 Sharmuta

The most depressing, pointless romance ever written.

I read the heath Cliffe Notes.........
/

369 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:17:01pm

Wow, another blizzard hitting Fargo, North Dakota. 200 pets in the animal shelter, lots of volunteers caring for them.

Bless those Midwestern folks, saving their towns.

370 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:17:07pm

re: #357 Cognito

Yes, quite. It's doomed to obscurity.

Cognita!....my what a pretty dress today!

371 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:17:14pm

re: #362 rightymouse

How about 'The Bridges of Madison County' and 'Love Story' to name a few other ones?

And people wonder why I read non-fiction.

372 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:17:43pm

re: #354 Sharmuta

I also hated Great Expectations. What a poor title.

I hated it the first time I read it, but I've had to teach it the past two years, and it's grown on me.
Did you know that there are two endings? Dickens's friends read his first conclusion and told him that he had to change it. The first one is just too grim to bear, but the second one is ok. David Copperfield is my favorite of his novels, though.

373 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:18:05pm

re: #371 Sharmuta

And people wonder why I read non-fiction.

Trashy modern romance novels are hilarious. Its like reading porn, many of them are extremely explicit.

374 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:18:49pm

re: #372 goddessoftheclassroom

Yes- I read both endings. My favorite piece of Dickens work is A Christmas Carol.

375 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:18:56pm

re: #373 Hengineer

Trashy modern romance novels are hilarious. Its like reading porn, many of them are extremely explicit.

do tell....who's your favorite author?

376 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:18:56pm

re: #362 rightymouse

How about 'The Bridges of Madison County' and 'Love Story' to name a few other ones?

At least those two had some likable characters with redeeming features. WH does not,

377 FrogMarch  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:19:25pm

re: #355 Hengineer

how do the pie makers get paid?

378 Russkilitlover  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:19:30pm

re: #374 Sharmuta

Yes- I read both endings. My favorite piece of Dickens work is A Christmas Carol.

Pickwick Papers!

379 lostlakehiker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:19:43pm

re: #8 jamgarr

Where do you get all the stuff to make a Dyson Sphere?

Take Ceres and break it up for parts? Radius 200 million km, thickness 1 mm [we just need a thin skin to pick up the solar energy], and you have more than enough mass in Ceres to do the trick.

The sphere wouldn't be a solid shell. It would just be a beehive of orbiting reflectors for concentrating solar energy, so many that in aggregate they intercepted a goodly fraction of the outgoing sunlight.

With such a sphere, we could have, well, a lot more energy to play with than we do now. Making the sphere smaller would require less mass but then your civilization would have to be able to tolerate fairly high temperatures. There's a limit; if you tried to put the sphere near Mercury's orbit, you'd have to be hot enough to melt lead in order to re-radiate to space the energy you were taking up and using.

Dyson's point was that a super-advanced civilization that used a lot of energy might be hard to recognize, them being so much smarter than we are. But they probably wouldn't have any way around basic thermodynamics, so if they captured a lot of their sun's energy, they'd be a very bright source of energy in the infrared spectrum.

Dyson is a really bright guy, and if he's a skeptic on global warming, the jury isn't in. And yet---there are some equally bright folk in the other camp, and though Dyson is famed for his honesty, he's not alone in that. Feynman was another case in point, and there are many others.

380 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:19:59pm

re: #371 Sharmuta

And people wonder why I read non-fiction.

I don't wonder, do a lot of that non-fiction stuff myself.

381 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:20:03pm

re: #374 Sharmuta

Yes- I read both endings. My favorite piece of Dickens work is A Christmas Carol.

That's a close second!

382 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:20:17pm

re: #260 Last Mohican

Um, excuse me? Did he say that? In public?

I started reaching for my google, but I think I may just go ahead and assume you're kidding.

I heard it on the radio, I think on Hannity, but it was a direct tape of G his own self. I shall Google.

383 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:20:22pm

re: #377 FrogMarch

how do the pie makers get paid?

In the sky.

384 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:20:26pm

re: #270 Shay4l

I just heard a clip of Zero on the radio, saying the US government will stand "behind the warranty" on GM vehicles. The way his annunciation was stressed was...odd, and brought to mind unsavory thoughts on why the government is "behind the warranty", and the bent-over position the warranty holders might be in.

"Well, we can fix this under warranty, but the IRS may need to look into you tax returns if we do...."

385 alegrias  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:20:31pm

Dr. Zhivago, especially the scene where the Bolsheviks take over his house & allow him and his wife & child to live in one bedroom, is romantic in a neo-socialist way. Nice tale for our times!

386 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:20:46pm

re: #256 horse

The science fiction book Footfall, by Larry Niven incorporated the Project Orion model into the design of a human space ship rapidly put together to respond to an alien invasion. It was one of the better science fiction books I read during school years that really stuck with me; filled with several interesting undeveloped scientific ideas at the time put into possible applied scenarios. A very fun read.

I got a "kick" out of the redeployed 16"/50 cal. battleship gun turrets on the ship. If you can't have heavy-cycle directed-energy weapons, and you want to do some serious damage, even in a guided-missile environment a set of big honkin' guns are still pretty effective.

/comparatively cheap, too.

cheers

eon

387 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:20:50pm

re: #377 FrogMarch

how do the pie makers get paid?

With one piece of pie, just like everybody else! Unless they have a party pin, but the party pin wearers are too good to do menial work such as make pies! back in line you peasant!

388 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:20:55pm

re: #345 DEZes

Like tenor twelve miles from here.

That's quite lyric.

389 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:21:00pm

re: #368 LGoPs

Jonny Collins
"Shanties & Songs of the Sea"
Two copies are still available on Amazon at a reasonable price

This is his web site:
[Link: www.johnnycollins.net...]

I happened to be acquainted with Collins, in Hong Kong in the mid-early Sixties.

390 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:21:09pm

re: #383 Cognito

In the sky.

We've got high hopes.

391 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:21:39pm

re: #389 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Jonny Collins
"Shanties & Songs of the Sea"
Two copies are still available on Amazon at a reasonable price

This is his web site:
[Link: www.johnnycollins.net...]

I happened to be acquainted with Collins, in Hong Kong in the mid-early Sixties.

SHIT!
PIMF
JOHNNY Collins

392 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:21:48pm
393 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:21:54pm

re: #375 albusteve

do tell....who's your favorite author?

I don't have one, really I just pick one up in the ship's library and glance and see how trashy it is.

394 FrogMarch  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:21:57pm

re: #383 Cognito

In the sky.

with diamonds?

395 callahan23  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:22:09pm

re: #373 Hengineer

Trashy modern romance novels are hilarious. Its like reading porn, many of them are extremely explicit.

Example: Jean M. Auel - The Clan of the Cave Bear, and the series other novels.

396 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:22:19pm

re: #390 midwestgak

We've got high hopes.

Have you ever seen an ant move a rubber tree plant?

397 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:22:29pm

re: #307 buzzsawmonkey

I've already read B.F. Skinner and Ayn Rand, ain't that enough already?

/

398 freetoken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:22:39pm

Dyson is quite the contrarian. That can be quite a noble activity if it is done with integrity.

So many of the anti-AGW crowd though turns to quacks, mal-contents, and those with political (and financial) motivation to simply make a name for themselves.

399 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:22:40pm

re: #393 Hengineer

I don't have one, really I just pick one up in the ship's library and glance and see how trashy it is.

sure...okay...LIAR!

400 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:22:43pm

re: #381 goddessoftheclassroom

Do you have your classes read any Steinbeck?

401 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:22:58pm

re: #374 Sharmuta

Yes- I read both endings. My favorite piece of Dickens work is A Christmas Carol.

I still find the original story to be much better than any of the media adaptations. Too many of them are like current educational standards, watered down and quite useless.

402 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:22:59pm
403 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:23:09pm

re: #363 HelloDare

I made it six seconds into that video. It's as annoying as Wuthering Heights.

BTW, goddess, I prefer the scene where the main character has to fend off the attacks to try and off Heathcliff because he's too insufferable to live.

404 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:23:12pm

re: #396 Hengineer

Have you ever seen an ant move a rubber tree plant?

I saw one with a bitty little chainsaw once.

405 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:23:31pm

re: #386 eon

According to E = MC^2, a lump of matter is equivalent to a LOT of energy, ... if you can just manage to deliver it properly.

406 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:23:54pm

re: #335 goddessoftheclassroom

MWAH!

MWAH!
Sorry. I was out for a bit, looking for a link to a sea shanty CD.

407 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:23:57pm

re: #404 Cygnus

I saw one with a bitty little chainsaw once.

he was soooo cute

408 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:24:22pm

re: #402 Iron Fist

That is good. I've never heard it put that way, but it is so true.

I know, its my favorite quote, I wish I knew if that guy made it up or actually saw it somewhere.

409 NY Nana  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:24:31pm

Freeman Dyson speaks:

410 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:24:52pm

re: #400 Sharmuta

Do you have your classes read any Steinbeck?

He's not part of the 9th grade curriculum; The 7th graders read The Red Pony. I loved East of Eden, but I confess I couldn't finish The Grapes of Wrath--too depressing (no pun intended).

411 MittDoesNotCompute  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:25:02pm

re: #253 ArchangelMichael

Given the success of the new BSG, and the planned SGU show which is supposed to be darker, more dramatic, and more BSG-like, I thought maybe the Sci-Fi channel was finally getting it that their "Monster of the Week" B Movies were total garbage and a waste of money. Putting Bruce Campbell in them to play clone-Ash, doesn't make them any better.

But maybe they aren't getting the clue.

Blasphemy!

/love Bruce Campbell in most anything (including, but not limited to, the Evil Dead movies, The Adventures of Brisco County Jr., Burn Notice, and his Old Spice commercials)...

412 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:25:19pm

re: #406 pre-Boomer Marine brat

MWAH!
Sorry. I was out for a bit, looking for a link to a sea shanty CD.

What will we do with a drunken sailor
what will we do with a drunken sailor
what will we do with a drunken sailor
Earl-eye in the mornin'

Way-hay-up she rises
Way-hay-up she rises
Way-hay-up she rises
Earl-eye in the mornin'

Shave is belly with a rusty razor
Shave is belly with a rusty razor
Shave is belly with a rusty razor
Early-ey in the mornin

413 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:25:47pm

re: #376 goddessoftheclassroom

At least those two had some likable characters with redeeming features. WH does not,

Couldn't stand any of them. Not into sappy romance. Guess I'm not a romantic at heart, although I did get weak-kneed in 'Gladiator'. :)

414 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:25:49pm

re: #403 EmmmieG

I made it six seconds into that video. It's as annoying as Wuthering Heights.

BTW, goddess, I prefer the scene where the main character has to fend off the attacks to try and off Heathcliff because he's too insufferable to live.

Beware the pro-Cathys!

415 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:25:50pm

re: #407 Hengineer

he was soooo cute

And he was wearing the most adorable teeny weeny hockey mask.

416 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:25:52pm

I would also like to comment on how strong a statement "consensus is forming like ice hardening on a lake" really is.

As of now, people in the legitimate scientific community and honestly, anyone else's opinions are nothing more than just opinions, for more than twenty years.

There is a lot of data. There is very hard data.

Models that many here love to go on and on about with the assumption that they must be complete crap have actually made good predictions in the past twenty years.

So I am going to say it firmly. AGW is real as best as the vast bulk of scientific community can tell after twenty years of looking at it very hard.

417 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:25:58pm

re: #410 goddessoftheclassroom

He's not part of the 9th grade curriculum; The 7th graders read The Red Pony. I loved East of Eden, but I confess I couldn't finish The Grapes of Wrath--too depressing (no pun intended).

The Grapes of Wrath was banned in my county for a few decades.
It obviously isn't now, but guess what my county was?

418 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:26:03pm

re: #386 eon

I got a "kick" out of the redeployed 16"/50 cal. battleship gun turrets on the ship. If you can't have heavy-cycle directed-energy weapons, and you want to do some serious damage, even in a guided-missile environment a set of big honkin' guns are still pretty effective.

/comparatively cheap, too.

cheers

eon

IIRC the book, the enemy couldn't track the inert 16" shells.......

419 DEZes  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:26:35pm

Gotta run all, have fun.

420 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:26:41pm

re: #413 rightymouse

Couldn't stand any of them. Not into sappy romance. Guess I'm not a romantic at heart, although I did get weak-kneed in 'Gladiator'. :)

I got weak-kneed in "The Boondock Saints"
That count?

421 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:26:54pm

re: #410 goddessoftheclassroom

He's not part of the 9th grade curriculum; The 7th graders read The Red Pony. I loved East of Eden, but I confess I couldn't finish The Grapes of Wrath--too depressing (no pun intended).

I really enjoyed The Pearl.

422 IslandLibertarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:26:54pm

re: #394 FrogMarch

with diamonds?

....so we tax Lucy?

423 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:26:56pm

and G-d I wish I could edit my posts for stupid typos....

424 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:27:06pm

re: #411 talon_262

Blasphemy!

/love Bruce Campbell in most anything (including, but not limited to, the Evil Dead movies, The Adventures of Brisco County Jr., Burn Notice, and his Old Spice commercials)...

Borrowed the complete Adventures on DVD from my local library, maybe I should set aside some time to actually watch 'em.

425 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:27:24pm

re: #422 IslandLibertarian

....so we tax Lucy?

No, we tax Paul Simon, bastard hid them in the soles of his shoes.

426 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:27:25pm
427 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:27:37pm

re: #400 Sharmuta

Do you have your classes read any Steinbeck?

East of Eden.

Steinbeck's inspiration for the novel comes from the Bible, the fourth chapter of the book of Genesis, verses one though sixteen, which recounts the story of Cain and Abel. The title, East of Eden, was chosen by Steinbeck from Genesis, Chapter 4, verse 16.

The novel was originally addressed to Steinbeck's young sons, Thom and John IV (then 6 1/2 and 4 1/2 respectively). Steinbeck wanted to describe the Salinas Valley for them in detail: the sights, sounds, smells, and colors.

428 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:27:38pm

re: #422 IslandLibertarian

....so we tax Lucy?

So they're taxing fossils now?

429 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:27:41pm

re: #385 alegrias

Dr. Zhivago, especially the scene where the Bolsheviks take over his house & allow him and his wife & child to live in one bedroom, is romantic in a neo-socialist way. Nice tale for our times!

I recommend both the book and the movie. The movie is one of my favorites....a real classic and with a beautiful score to boot.

430 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:27:56pm

Question: Any musicians or parents of musicians willing to share how they disciplined themselves to practice regularly, or got their kids to practice without nagging and fighting with them.

We are starting piano, and one son is starting the sax. I'm trying to avoid the whole "mom as shrew" scenario.

431 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:06pm

re: #412 Hengineer

What will we do with a drunken sailor
what will we do with a drunken sailor
what will we do with a drunken sailor
Earl-eye in the mornin'

Way-hay-up she rises
Way-hay-up she rises
Way-hay-up she rises
Earl-eye in the mornin'

Shave is belly with a rusty razor
Shave is belly with a rusty razor
Shave is belly with a rusty razor
Early-ey in the mornin

Throw him in the hold with the Captain's daughter
Throw him in the hold with the Captain's daughter
Throw him in the hold with the Captain's daughter
Earl-eye in the mornin'

...add your own? :)

432 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:08pm

re: #419 DEZes

Gotta run all, have fun.

Hope to catch you later DEZ.....
:)

433 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:17pm

re: #287 midwestgak

Ed Begley Jr. is a huge greenie

He is, but he tends to actually live his life doing what he says should be done. You might be able to find some hypocritical stuff on him, but you'd have to work for it. I can respect that. Don't know much about him in regards to other parts of his life. I would imagine he's a moonbat too.

434 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:24pm

re: #412 Hengineer

What will we do with a drunken sailor
what will we do with a drunken sailor
what will we do with a drunken sailor
Earl-eye in the mornin'

Did you see my #391 pre-Boomer Marine brat ... ?

Damned fine album.

435 NY Nana  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:26pm

re: #423 LudwigVanQuixote

and G-d I wish I could edit my posts for stupid typos....

You ain't the only one!

436 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:26pm

re: #411 talon_262

Blasphemy!

/love Bruce Campbell in most anything (including, but not limited to, the Evil Dead movies, The Adventures of Brisco County Jr., Burn Notice, and his Old Spice commercials)...

I love him in Burn Notice.

437 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:27pm

re: #425 Hengineer

No, we tax Paul Simon, bastard hid them in the soles of his shoes.

heh...he did in fact

438 FrogMarch  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:29pm

re: #387 Hengineer

With one piece of pie, just like everybody else! Unless they have a party pin, but the party pin wearers are too good to do menial work such as make pies! back in line you peasant!

so the pie makers get paid with their own pie. Socialism seems really keen.

439 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:32pm

re: #428 Cygnus

So they're taxing fossils now?

at the pump yes...

440 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:33pm

re: #392 Iron Fist

Here's what I found.


That seems pretty solid to me.


Freaking scary if you ask me. Geithner graduated from the International School of Bangkok. My moonbat sister knew him as they were closer in age (I was quite a bit older). Guess what? She's had an epiphany and went on a rant about Geithner and I do believe we now have a conservative in the making. I cheered her on. :)

441 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:37pm

That was Mr. Geithner speaking on Press the Meat on Sunday:

SEC'Y GEITHNER: I think the adjustment to a period of excess is necessary. You never, you never want to have a crisis to remind people of the importance of living within your means, not borrowing too much or why regulation of the...(unintelligible)...is important. You never want to have a crisis that's damaging to make that point. But we're going to emerge stronger than this. When we get through this people are going to care less about what they make, more about what they do, what they achieve with what they make, and that will help make this country stronger

This is your Secretary of the Treasury, boys and girls lizards.

442 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:28:57pm

re: #430 DistantThunder

Question: Any musicians or parents of musicians willing to share how they disciplined themselves to practice regularly, or got their kids to practice without nagging and fighting with them.

We are starting piano, and one son is starting the sax. I'm trying to avoid the whole "mom as shrew" scenario.

It helps if they have music books with songs that they know....

I learned to play clarinet and my parents got me 3 music books that had a few songs I knew and trust me...it helped.

443 Cygnus  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:29:00pm

re: #430 DistantThunder

Question: Any musicians or parents of musicians willing to share how they disciplined themselves to practice regularly, or got their kids to practice without nagging and fighting with them.

We are starting piano, and one son is starting the sax. I'm trying to avoid the whole "mom as shrew" scenario.

Make it fun, like a game.

444 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:29:09pm

re: #435 NY Nana

You ain't the only one!

so true

445 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:29:44pm

re: #438 FrogMarch

so the pie makers get paid with their own pie. Socialism seems really keen.

Yea, its like a perpetual motion machine....bound to work!

446 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:29:46pm

re: #419 DEZes

Gotta run all, have fun.


See ya!

447 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:29:50pm

re: #295 eon

cheers

eon

It does kind of smack of MBAs on the loose, doesn't it?

448 Russkilitlover  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:30:01pm

re: #421 Sharmuta

I really enjoyed The Pearl.

The Winter of our Discontent is my fave - that and Cannery Row.

449 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:30:01pm
450 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:30:04pm

re: #423 LudwigVanQuixote

and G-d I wish I could edit my posts for stupid typos....

Did you MISS something?!?!
Lemme run back up and find it! ! !
I'll be right back to haunt you with it! ! !

/:D

451 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:30:18pm

re: #421 Sharmuta

I really enjoyed The Pearl.

Sharm, have you read, "The Glass Castle" by Jeannette Wall? It's one of the most inspirational books about the human spirit and resilience in children that I have ever read, and very humorous.

452 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:30:19pm

re: #390 midwestgak

We've got high hopes.

We've got high apple pie (shit, that's too American). Ah, forget it.

453 Colonel Panik  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:30:40pm

re: #441 itellu3times

That was Mr. Geithner speaking on Press the Meat on Sunday:

This is your Secretary of the Treasury, boys and girls lizards.

Does everyone in this administration sound like freaking Op-rah?

I think we've been invaded by Op-rah Pods...

454 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:30:43pm

re: #405 itellu3times

According to E = MC^2, a lump of matter is equivalent to a LOT of energy, ... if you can just manage to deliver it properly.

Jon's Law;

Anything moving at over two miles a second packs its own mass in BLAM.

With the battleship guns on the Orion ship in Footfall, it wasn't so much their own velocity (about half a mile/sec), as it was that plus the ship's own velocity added to the MV.

And since a 16" round weighs about as much as a VW anyway, get it up to escape velocity plus 0.5 mi/sec, and you do not want to be whoever or whatever it hits.

cheers

eon

455 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:31:06pm

re: #449 Iron Fist

Sometimes you just don't know. I've got a favorite on gun/weapon control:


I don't know where that comes from. No one has ever been able to give me a source for it. It is even possible that it is really 100% me, although I'd say that there are a lot of books that I have read on all kinds of different subjects. It is actually less powerful if it is just me, instead of, say, Thomas Jefferson.

It might be but it is a powerful quote all by itself anyway.

456 psyop  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:31:12pm

I would take Dyson over Morner any day of the week.

Politics be damned (re: Dyson is a liberal), science and the scientific method must reign supreme.

The moment when the State demonizes you for your scientific research (because it runs counter to the agenda) is the moment when science, true science, is the most desperately needed.

457 MittDoesNotCompute  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:31:13pm

re: #436 DistantThunder

I love him in Burn Notice.

Hail to the king, baby!

458 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:31:18pm

re: #431 Hengineer

Throw him in the hold with the Captain's daughter
Throw him in the hold with the Captain's daughter
Throw him in the hold with the Captain's daughter
Earl-eye in the mornin'

...add your own? :)

Bail him out with a trillion dollars,
Throw the captain from his quarters,
Fill the ship with green whale watchers,
Early in the morning.
/obama

459 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:31:30pm

re: #406 pre-Boomer Marine brat

MWAH!
Sorry. I was out for a bit, looking for a link to a sea shanty CD.

I'd NEVER suggest printing this out and leaving it on the desk of any female moonbat you might know...

460 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:31:31pm

re: #452 Soona'

We've got high apple pie (shit, that's too American). Ah, forget it.

Is Frank Sinatra too American?

Screw em, sing anyway!

461 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:31:59pm

re: #430 DistantThunder

Question: Any musicians or parents of musicians willing to share how they disciplined themselves to practice regularly, or got their kids to practice without nagging and fighting with them.

We are starting piano, and one son is starting the sax. I'm trying to avoid the whole "mom as shrew" scenario.

You can't "make them" like it. They either have to enjoy it or they don't. The only thing we did with our son when he started taking Cello lessons was small rewards for practicing (extra time on video games ,,his choice of restaurant,,,, etc) After he gave it a fair amount of time, he was allowed to decide if he wanted to keep up the lessons. Becuase he became good enough to actually "HEAR" music coming from his cello (as opposed to random sounds) he has kept up with it

462 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:03pm

re: #412 Hengineer

Put him in a longboat 'til he's sober.

My, some of the lyrics are quite rude! ;)

463 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:04pm

re: #440 rightymouse

Freaking scary if you ask me. Geithner graduated from the International School of Bangkok. My moonbat sister knew him as they were closer in age (I was quite a bit older). Guess what? She's had an epiphany and went on a rant about Geithner and I do believe we now have a conservative in the making. I cheered her on. :)

When he said America needs to live within her means it is code for people having one car, and 1200sqft homes with regulated energy meters - while the political elite live and entirely different lifestyle.

464 FrogMarch  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:11pm

re: #441 itellu3times

That was Mr. Geithner speaking on Press the Meat on Sunday:

When we get through this people are going to care less about what they make, more about what they do, what they achieve with what they make, and that will help make this country stronger

We will all work for the state, and we will all be equal. That's communism.

465 Steffan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:21pm

re: #326 goddessoftheclassroom

I omitted "British." I don't mean to suggest I've read all pre-20th century fiction, British or otherwise, but I have read most of the "classics" as well as some obscure titles.

If you want to read something entertaining in pre-20th-century British nonfiction, check Project Gutenburg for Three Months in the Southern States, April-June 1863, by Arthur J. L. (Lieut.-Col.) Fremantle.

Fremantle took leave from his posting in the Coldstream Guards and traveled in the Confederacy to see for himself what the ACW was about. He crossed the lines after Gettysburg and was in NYC just in time to watch the draft riots. He predicts a Confederate victory.

This morning, before marching from Chambersburg,
General Longstreet introduced me to the Commander-in-Chief. General Lee
is, almost without exception, the handsomest man of his age I ever saw.
He is fifty-six years old, tall, broad-shouldered, very well made, well
set up - a thorough soldier in appearance; and his manners are most
courteous and full of dignity. He is a perfect gentleman in every
respect. I imagine no man has so few enemies, or is so universally
esteemed. Throughout the South, all agree in pronouncing him to be as
near perfection as a man can be. He has none of the small vices, such as
smoking, drinking, chewing, or swearing, and his bitterest enemy never
accused him of any of the greater ones. He generally wears a well-worn
long grey jacket, a high black felt hat, and blue trousers tucked
into his Wellington boots. I never saw him carry arms; and the only mark of his military rank are the three stars on his collar. He rides a handsome horse, which is extremely well groomed. He himself is very neat in his dress and person, and in the most arduous marches he always looks smart and clean.

466 Randall Gross  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:21pm
James Randi --- Wizard (JREFInfo@ssr.com)
Mon, 2 Mar 1998 10:29:56 -0800 (PST)

* Messages sorted by: [ date ][ thread ][ subject ][ author ]
* Next message: James Randi --- Wizard: "It's back!"
* Previous message: James Randi --- Wizard: "Hoping that this gets to Duffie, and just betting that it will....."

AN IDEA FROM DOWN UNDER

I'm borrowing a simply swell idea from the Australian Skeptics. I'm
now offering a "finder's fee" of US$50,000 to anyone who can locate a
"psychic" who will (a) take us up on our Pigasus Prize offer
([Link: www.randi.org)...] and (b) will win that prize. But I don't
expect a rush of applicants, though the rabid believers out there will
have a difficult time explaining why their favorite psychic hasn't
accepted the challenge.....and made them financially happy, as well.

LOOKING IN ON SWEDEN

I've described here previously how a pompous-assed "dowsing expert"
named Nils-Axel Morner, associate professor of geology from Stockholm
University, has consistently refused to be tested for the Pigasus
Prize. A helpful correspondent in Sweden referred me to
[Link: www.tdb.uu.se...] where I found that Morner was
tested -- amateurishly -- on a prominent Swedish TV show, "The Plain &
Simple Truth," on TV2 on February 27th. Morner was first provided the
opportunity to brag about anecdotal successes, then he was tested. A
local celebrity -- a singer -- was involved, as is usual with these
drearily predictable affairs. The singer chose one of ten cups under
which to conceal a packet of sugar. He chose number seven; are we
surprised? Morner had designed this test, saying that it was
especially difficult for him to do. (?) He said that water or
metal could be located "right away," but not sugar. Morner blathered
on about "interference" and mumbled about "influences" and "might be
here" and the usual alibis, then chose number eight.

[Link: www.randi.org...]

467 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:28pm

re: #430 DistantThunder

Question: Any musicians or parents of musicians willing to share how they disciplined themselves to practice regularly, or got their kids to practice without nagging and fighting with them.

We are starting piano, and one son is starting the sax. I'm trying to avoid the whole "mom as shrew" scenario.

I can only speak to piano--we buy them sheet music they will want to play. Our piano teacher works with us on this. At any time, they have stuff she assigns, as well as stuff they picked out. Hedwig's Theme, Raiders March, Star Wars, etc.

My daughter has, I think, about $50 worth of Enya sheet music. The weird part is that she was a colicky baby, and we used to get her to quiet down by putting in Enya. Hours, and hours, and hours...so she hadn't heard any since she was a baby.

468 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:30pm

could not resist...
Ladysmith Black Mambazo

469 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:46pm

re: #416 LudwigVanQuixote

I would also like to comment on how strong a statement "consensus is forming like ice hardening on a lake" really is.

As of now, people in the legitimate scientific community and honestly, anyone else's opinions are nothing more than just opinions, for more than twenty years.

There is a lot of data. There is very hard data.

Models that many here love to go on and on about with the assumption that they must be complete crap have actually made good predictions in the past twenty years.

So I am going to say it firmly. AGW is real as best as the vast bulk of scientific community can tell after twenty years of looking at it very hard.

Then I consider you an ignorant putz.

470 Randall Gross  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:32:51pm

bah, wrong thread... :(

471 stuiec  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:33:16pm
This is the kind of reputable scientist who should be cited when discussing the pros and cons of AGW — instead of kooks like Nils-Axel Mörner.


I think you need to recognize that just as expertise in one field doesn't convey expertise in all fields, outright nuttiness in one field doesn't negate expertise in all other fields.

William Shockley deserves to be remembered and hailed as the co-inventor of the transistor, one of the fundamental transformational technologies of our age and one of the necessary underpinnings of the Internet. He also deserves to be remembered and reviled as a eugenicist nut -- but the latter doesn't invalidate the former.

Rene Magritte remains one of my favorite artists, even though he was a Fascist before the Second World War.

If a kook is a genuine expert in a particular field, he should be given credibility in that field and that field alone. We have plenty of examples of this in entertainment: Sean Penn may be politically infantile and deranged, but he's still a good actor.

472 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:33:38pm

re: #449 Iron Fist

Sometimes you just don't know. I've got a favorite on gun/weapon control:


I don't know where that comes from. No one has ever been able to give me a source for it. It is even possible that it is really 100% me, although I'd say that there are a lot of books that I have read on all kinds of different subjects. It is actually less powerful if it is just me, instead of, say, Thomas Jefferson.

We should have a favorite quote section. Charles has posted some great ones, I click the heart, but then i forget to tag them as quotes, and well they are hard to relocate.

473 Mostly sane, most of the time.  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:33:56pm

re: #470 Thanos

bah, wrong thread... :(

...for what?

474 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:34:05pm
475 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:34:30pm

re: #462 FurryOldGuyJeans

Put him in a longboat 'til he's sober.

My, some of the lyrics are quite rude! ;)

I love it that you can add your own anyway, as long as it matches the right syllable pattern.

476 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:34:49pm

re: #454 eon

Great book.

WHEN will Hollyweird make that into a movie? Guaranteed billion dollar gross.

477 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:34:50pm

lizards, go check out the ABCnews.com front page. opening headline: Obama takes wheel, tanks DOW

I kid you not

478 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:34:55pm

re: #429 LGoPs

I recommend both the book and the movie. The movie is one of my favorites....a real classic and with a beautiful score to boot.

Slightly OT, and sad to relate- Maurice Jarre', the composer of the score of Doctor Zhivago, died yesterday.

/My favorite was his score for Villa Rides with Yul Brynner, Robert Mitchum, and Charles Bronson.

cheers

eon

479 NY Nana  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:35:10pm

re: #444 LudwigVanQuixote

;) Welcome to the club!

480 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:35:12pm

re: #463 DistantThunder

When he said America needs to live within her means it is code for people having one car, and 1200sqft homes with regulated energy meters - while the political elite live and entirely different lifestyle.

You're only allotted one square of toilet paper per day.

481 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:35:14pm

re: #461 sattv4u2

You can't "make them" like it. They either have to enjoy it or they don't. The only thing we did with our son when he started taking Cello lessons was small rewards for practicing (extra time on video games ,,his choice of restaurant,,,, etc) After he gave it a fair amount of time, he was allowed to decide if he wanted to keep up the lessons. Becuase he became good enough to actually "HEAR" music coming from his cello (as opposed to random sounds) he has kept up with it

Much appreciated. That's a great idea. I've read that rewards are a double edge sword but I can see that in the short term it can get them past the start-up phase.

482 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:35:38pm

re: #464 FrogMarch

We will all work for the state, and we will all be equal. That's communism.

'Some more equal than others', doncha know.

483 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:35:49pm
484 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:36:07pm

re: #482 itellu3times

'Some more equal than others', doncha know.

So sayeth the pigs.

485 lawhawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:36:27pm

My first experience reading Dyson was Weapons and Hope in a course dealing with US foreign policy in the 20th century, focusing on nuclear weapons. He was an ardent opponent of nuclear proliferation, but also opposed nationalism. His multilateralism is naive in that he expects our current enemies to suddenly find it in their self-interest to carry out policy alongside the US.

More to the point, he considered nuclear disarmament to be paramount, regardless that our enemies wouldn't feel the same.

Dyson says he doesn’t want his legacy to be defined by climate change, but his dissension from the orthodoxy of global warming is significant because of his stature and his devotion to the integrity of science. Dyson has said he believes that the truths of science are so profoundly concealed that the only thing we can really be sure of is that much of what we expect to happen won’t come to pass. In “Infinite in All Directions,” he writes that nature’s laws “make the universe as interesting as possible.” This also happens to be a fine description of Dyson’s own relationship to science. In the words of Avishai Margalit, a philosopher at the Institute for Advanced Study, “He’s a consistent reminder of another possibility.” When Dyson joins the public conversation about climate change by expressing concern about the “enormous gaps in our knowledge, the sparseness of our observations and the superficiality of our theories,” these reservations come from a place of experience. Whatever else he is, Dyson is the good scientist; he asks the hard questions. He could also be a lonely prophet. Or, as he acknowledges, he could be dead wrong.

Despite my misgivings over Dyson's political views, he does remain a good scientist who remains true to the scientific method. His rational breakdown of the issue - and the lack of evidence and data to support or contest the hypothesis, is admirable.

Still, he is not a climatologist or an environmental scientist; he's a physicist. I would love to hear more climatologists and environmental scientists taking this tact, since they all apparently have decided to chase the government grants and stuck their collective finger in the air and decided that it's in their interest to believe that global warming is happening, and that is man-made.

486 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:36:47pm

re: #470 Thanos

bah, wrong thread... :(

Wrong color, or did you pick up a roll of polyester instead of cotton?

487 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:37:18pm

re: #416 LudwigVanQuixote

I would also like to comment on how strong a statement "consensus is forming like ice hardening on a lake" really is.

As of now, people in the legitimate scientific community and honestly, anyone else's opinions are nothing more than just opinions, for more than twenty years.

There is a lot of data. There is very hard data.

Models that many here love to go on and on about with the assumption that they must be complete crap have actually made good predictions in the past twenty years.

So I am going to say it firmly. AGW is real as best as the vast bulk of scientific community can tell after twenty years of looking at it very hard.

A lizard up-thread (Honorary Yooper I think) posted this link and I found it thoughtful and interesting:
[Link: home.comcast.net...]

488 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:37:20pm

re: #486 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Wrong color, or did you pick up a roll of polyester instead of cotton?


Wool

489 Querent  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:37:28pm

re: #458 itellu3times

Bail him out with a trillion dollars,
Throw the captain from his quarters,
Fill the ship with green whale watchers,
Early in the morning.
/obama

Forge his name and cash his paychecks...

490 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:37:35pm

re: #430 DistantThunder

Question: Any musicians or parents of musicians willing to share how they disciplined themselves to practice regularly, or got their kids to practice without nagging and fighting with them.

We are starting piano, and one son is starting the sax. I'm trying to avoid the whole "mom as shrew" scenario.

It can be a pain in the neck at times if the motivation is not there but they have talent. Teenlet has perfect pitch and a gorgeous voice. But won't study voice - he is adamant. My husband (his Dad) is a musician, but he loved everything about music as a child so practicing was part of his passion.

491 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:37:44pm

re: #463 DistantThunder

When he said America needs to live within her means it is code for people having one car, and 1200sqft homes with regulated energy meters - while the political elite live and entirely different lifestyle.

There it is.

492 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:37:56pm

re: #474 pre-Boomer Marine brat

GAACK! ... :D

MWAH!

Be careful what you wish for...

493 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:38:07pm

re: #463 DistantThunder

When he said America needs to live within her means it is code for people having one car, and 1200sqft homes with regulated energy meters - while the political elite live and entirely different lifestyle.

Thomas Jefferson said much the same thing, he was offended after the revolution, that so many people seemed intent on making money, and not just polishing their yeos, or whatever plebian yeomen do.

494 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:38:15pm

re: #488 Hengineer

Wool

Did I detect a sheepish tone in that?

495 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:38:41pm

re: #384 Aviator

"Well, we can fix this under warranty, but the IRS may need to look into you tax returns if we do...."

Could be a test run for Gubmint Health Care.
/

496 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:38:53pm

re: #494 pre-Boomer Marine brat

Did I detect a sheepish tone in that?

Nah, just sheared off course a bit.

497 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:38:58pm

re: #465 Steffan

I atteneded a re-enactment near Manassas with 10,000 actors, and 2000 horses - and there was Stonewall Jackson on a magnificent black steed. Made the hair stand up on the back of my neck he was so authentic.

498 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:39:03pm

re: #471 stuiec

I think you need to recognize that just as expertise in one field doesn't convey expertise in all fields, outright nuttiness in one field doesn't negate expertise in all other fields.

But he isn't just nutty in one field. This guy is associated with Lyndon LaRouche, for Pete's sake! And he works for a concealed energy industry lobby group. And he believes in dowsing and water witching, and has completely insane views on archaeology.

I'm frankly amazed that there are people trying to defend him on his view that the rise in sea levels is a gigantic hoax perpetrated by the evil scientific establishment. This is nonsense and it's promoted by a wacko with ties to extremists and other wackos.

499 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:39:23pm

re: #463 DistantThunder

When he said America needs to live within her means it is code for people having one car, and 1200sqft homes with regulated energy meters - while the political elite live and entirely different lifestyle.

That's what is so scary. Can you imagine a conservative ever saying such rubbish?

500 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:40:05pm

re: #467 EmmmieG

I can only speak to piano--we buy them sheet music they will want to play. Our piano teacher works with us on this. At any time, they have stuff she assigns, as well as stuff they picked out. Hedwig's Theme, Raiders March, Star Wars, etc.

My daughter has, I think, about $50 worth of Enya sheet music. The weird part is that she was a colicky baby, and we used to get her to quiet down by putting in Enya. Hours, and hours, and hours...so she hadn't heard any since she was a baby.

That's a great idea.

501 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:40:14pm

re: #492 goddessoftheclassroom

Be careful what you wish for...

OUCH!
D*MN, th' PAIN!
pant ... whew!
ROFLMAO

You win!
MWAH!

502 Querent  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:40:50pm

cupcakes for everybody!

503 NY Nana  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:41:01pm

re: #477 funky chicken

/Can I just sit here smirking?

I am going to see it now...it makes me smirk, so help me, even before I see it there! Thanks for a great lift of my spirits today.

Hmmm, if we could collect $5.00 per each of those who are experiencing severe buyers' remorse over The One, we might have the equivalent of our stolen tax $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

BBL.

504 ArchangelMichael  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:41:33pm

re: #411 talon_262

Blasphemy!

/love Bruce Campbell in most anything (including, but not limited to, the Evil Dead movies, The Adventures of Brisco County Jr., Burn Notice, and his Old Spice commercials)...

You must have never seen Alien Apocalypse then.

505 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:41:51pm

re: #503 NY Nana

/Can I just sit here smirking?

I am going to see it now...it makes me smirk, so help me, even before I see it there! Thanks for a great lift of my spirits today.

Hmmm, if we could collect $5.00 per each of those who are experiencing severe buyers' remorse over The One, we might have the equivalent of our stolen tax $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

BBL.

Buyers remorse would imply that Obama was bought and sold...

oh wait

506 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:41:56pm

re: #410 goddessoftheclassroom

He's not part of the 9th grade curriculum; The 7th graders read The Red Pony. I loved East of Eden, but I confess I couldn't finish The Grapes of Wrath--too depressing (no pun intended).

I enjoyed James Michener novels, especially The Source. I read that book in route to Israel to actually work on a dig in Jerusalem back in 1982. A group of us took a semester's worth of classes in preparation for it. The Source was the only novel that I read that coincided with my life's experience as it was unfolding.

507 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:42:04pm

We had politically incorrect kittens 2 night ago. For the first day there were only three - and then magically - four.

508 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:42:17pm

re: #371 Sharmuta

And people wonder why I read non-fiction.

Yep. History. It's about all I read this days.

509 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:42:31pm
510 lostlakehiker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:42:38pm

re: #430 DistantThunder

Question: Any musicians or parents of musicians willing to share how they disciplined themselves to practice regularly, or got their kids to practice without nagging and fighting with them.

We are starting piano, and one son is starting the sax. I'm trying to avoid the whole "mom as shrew" scenario.

Very much it depends on the kid. My mother is a music teacher and a good one, and I was a reasonably good student. The work that it took to be good was requited in better playing skills, better results in the pushing and shoving for chairs in the school band, etc.

If that kind of equation works for your child, then it may be possible to get them to exert themselves and improve. If not, it probably won't happen. It takes a while for the kid to understand that skill with an instrument builds over time, and that real skill requires real time. Time on a scale the kid has probably never dreamed of up til that point. The trick is to break it up---practice to master this or that sticking point, where your music isn't coming out the way you want. A half an hour a day, or if there's the tolerance, twice a day, is plenty.

511 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:42:55pm

re: #496 Hengineer

Nah, just sheared off course a bit.

Well, ... comb back on course then.
There's Merino this thread that we need your help with.

512 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:43:27pm

re: #506 midwestgak

I enjoyed James Michener novels, especially The Source. I read that book in route to Israel to actually work on a dig in Jerusalem back in 1982. A group of us took a semester's worth of classes in preparation for it. The Source was the only novel that I read that coincided with my life's experience as it was unfolding.

How cool is that? Not good to read Jaws during a beach vacation which is what I did.

513 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:43:31pm

re: #397 itellu3times

I've already read B.F. Skinner and Ayn Rand, ain't that enough already?

/

Currently reading Atlas Shrugged after finally setting aside some time to do that. Been meaning to do that since about the mid-90s.

Also putting up my opinions of it on my blog, ColdRaptor, as I go along. Enjoying it so far.

514 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:43:35pm

re: #477 funky chicken

lizards, go check out the ABCnews.com front page. opening headline: Obama takes wheel, tanks DOW

I kid you not

They "balanced" out their coverage with this polished turd:

PAYDAY: GM's Rick Wagoner Drives Away with $20M Retirement

515 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:44:03pm

re: #471 stuiec

I think you need to recognize that just as expertise in one field doesn't convey expertise in all fields, outright nuttiness in one field doesn't negate expertise in all other fields.

William Shockley deserves to be remembered and hailed as the co-inventor of the transistor, one of the fundamental transformational technologies of our age and one of the necessary underpinnings of the Internet. He also deserves to be remembered and reviled as a eugenicist nut -- but the latter doesn't invalidate the former.

Rene Magritte remains one of my favorite artists, even though he was a Fascist before the Second World War.

If a kook is a genuine expert in a particular field, he should be given credibility in that field and that field alone. We have plenty of examples of this in entertainment: Sean Penn may be politically infantile and deranged, but he's still a good actor.

I'm not buying that logic. It's like saying the Mohammed Atta really was fun at parties and a fabulous personality....it's just that killing of thousands of innocent people......

516 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:44:18pm

re: #498 Charles

But he isn't just nutty in one field. This guy is associated with Lyndon LaRouche, for Pete's sake! And he works for a concealed energy industry lobby group. And he believes in dowsing and water witching, and has completely insane views on archaeology.

I'm frankly amazed that there are people trying to defend him on his view that the rise in sea levels is a gigantic hoax perpetrated by the evil scientific establishment. This is nonsense and it's promoted by a wacko with ties to extremists and other wackos.

With opinions like that on other forms of fringe subjects, I'm surprised he's not on the other ("We have to stop it now!") side of the AGW business. That's where I'm accustomed to finding people who think dowsing, etc., is "valid".

Not to mention LaRouchies.

/Of course, if he's like the rest of that crowd, he relies on his belief in vast conspiracies to keep him warm at night, too.

cheers

eon

517 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:44:33pm

re: #420 Hengineer

I got weak-kneed in "The Boondock Saints"
That count?

Never saw that one. :)

Which actor/character got your knees all mushy?

518 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:45:04pm

re: #517 rightymouse

Never saw that one. :)

Which actor/character got your knees all mushy?

The guns.

519 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:45:09pm
520 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:45:33pm

re: #512 DistantThunder

How cool is that? Not good to read Jaws during a beach vacation which is what I did.

heh. Really?

521 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:46:08pm

re: #517 rightymouse

Never saw that one. :)

Which actor/character got your knees all mushy?

Its a movie where these two average Irish blokes become vigilantes after a run-in with some russian mob guys in an Irish Bar on St. Paddy's day in an inner city (Chicago? Boston?)

522 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:46:35pm

re: #514 FurryOldGuyJeans

They "balanced" out their coverage with this polished turd:

PAYDAY: GM's Rick Wagoner Drives Away with $20M Retirement

Can I get fired by Obama?

523 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:46:48pm

re: #510 lostlakehiker

Very much it depends on the kid. My mother is a music teacher and a good one, and I was a reasonably good student. The work that it took to be good was requited in better playing skills, better results in the pushing and shoving for chairs in the school band, etc.

If that kind of equation works for your child, then it may be possible to get them to exert themselves and improve. If not, it probably won't happen. It takes a while for the kid to understand that skill with an instrument builds over time, and that real skill requires real time. Time on a scale the kid has probably never dreamed of up til that point. The trick is to break it up---practice to master this or that sticking point, where your music isn't coming out the way you want. A half an hour a day, or if there's the tolerance, twice a day, is plenty.

Great idea. Have you hard of the 5 Browns? Siblings that are all Julliard trained concert pianists? They were homeschooled and practiced 3 hours a day. And they all seem normal, most are married...etc.
[Link: www.the5browns.com...]

524 Pietr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:48:35pm
525 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:48:38pm

re: #430 DistantThunder

Question: Any musicians or parents of musicians willing to share how they disciplined themselves to practice regularly, or got their kids to practice without nagging and fighting with them.

We are starting piano, and one son is starting the sax. I'm trying to avoid the whole "mom as shrew" scenario.

My parents made me study paino for about 12 years, starting around the 5th grade. They used threats and intimidation to make me practice (just kidding.....a little). I started with the classics but I didn't appreciate it until I started playing contemporary music (Bacharach, Ferranti and Teicher et al - I know, square sounding but the music was good) and found that I could be a stranger at a party and within 5 minutes of sitting down at a piano everyone in the room was my friend.
Don't know how old your kids are but if you can get them to play contemporary stuff it might picque their interest more. If that doesn't work, just beat them like a mule....
/ :)

526 MittDoesNotCompute  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:48:46pm

re: #512 DistantThunder

How cool is that? Not good to read Jaws during a beach vacation which is what I did.

It'd be alright if you were already familiar with the story, but you'd read it out on the beach in full view just to mindf*ck with people...

/just mean, ain't it? ;-P

527 lostlakehiker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:49:06pm

re: #463 DistantThunder

When he said America needs to live within her means it is code for people having one car, and 1200sqft homes with regulated energy meters - while the political elite live and entirely different lifestyle.

If we don't improve our energy technology and come up with something better than buying oil at the spot market price, we'll find ourselves some fine day thinking of that one car and that 1200 ft2 home as the privileged life of the elite, the different lifestyle.

Breeder reactors? Solar thermal? Wind? If AGW isn't a problem, we could rock along on coal for a while still. But not indefinitely, and then the same list of choices would be before us. It's better to make the transition while we have energy "to burn". If it ever gets to the point that energy for steelmaking is in a mortal tradeoff with energy for home heating, we're going to have to shiver and die just to get enough steel made to scrape by and maintain an industrial civilization and fend off the mass die-off that comes with the Fall.

528 freetoken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:49:14pm

re: #416 LudwigVanQuixote

As of now, people in the legitimate scientific community and honestly, anyone else's opinions are nothing more than just opinions, for more than twenty years.


Note my spin-off link (from an EOS article this Jan.)

529 lawhawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:49:34pm

re: #522 JCM

It's unconstitutional, but it didn't stop Obama from doing so. Wagoner was the sacrificial lamb.

530 pre-Boomer Marine brat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:49:47pm

I'm leaving for the evening.
{goddess} !
Everyone have a good night.

531 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:49:56pm

re: #519 Iron Fist

I'm not sure why anyone is getting too excercized about the seas rising, anyway, at least as it is used as "proof" of anthropomorphic global warming. The seas have been much higher that they are now in the past. Much higher. If youknow where to look and what rocks to look into here (in East Tennessee) you can find all the fossil evidence you care to that this area was at one time under water.

And it was under water a long time before there were humans to "cause" the sea to rise.

Anyway, isn't this a moot point? Barack Obama said that if he was elected the seas would stop rising. Well, he's been elected. So that is one potential catastrophy of "global warming" that we need no longer worry about.

If the seas are indeed rising, it's pretty darned exciting if you're a human being. We're wee delicate creatures who like things to stay the same.

(Anthropomorphic?)

532 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:50:00pm

re: #522 JCM

Can I get fired by Obama?

Wanna bet Wagoner becomes the new FMSM whipping boy for the evils of unrestrained capitalism?

533 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:51:02pm

re: #525 LGoPs

My parents made me study paino for about 12 years, starting around the 5th grade. They used threats and intimidation to make me practice (just kidding.....a little). I started with the classics but I didn't appreciate it until I started playing contemporary music (Bacharach, Ferranti and Teicher et al - I know, square sounding but the music was good) and found that I could be a stranger at a party and within 5 minutes of sitting down at a piano everyone in the room was my friend.
Don't know how old your kids are but if you can get them to play contemporary stuff it might picque their interest more. If that doesn't work, just beat them like a mule....
/ :)

They love Star WArs and Phantom of the Opera. They are 17, 13, 10 & 8.

534 Bagua  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:51:19pm

Egad, there is a new thread, I was apparently commenting to myself in the other AGW thread. This chat business takes some skill it appears.

535 MittDoesNotCompute  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:51:27pm

re: #532 FurryOldGuyJeans

Wanna bet Wagoner becomes the new FMSM whipping boy for the evils of unrestrained capitalism?

Becomes? I thought he and his fellow corporate "tycoons" already were the MFMSM's whipping boys...

536 Taqiyyotomist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:51:30pm

Obama takes over GM.
Rush talks about it.
Dow Jones drops like a rock.

Obviously this is all Rush's fault.

537 Steffan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:51:34pm

re: #497 DistantThunder

I atteneded a re-enactment near Manassas with 10,000 actors, and 2000 horses - and there was Stonewall Jackson on a magnificent black steed. Made the hair stand up on the back of my neck he was so authentic.

Was that when they filmed "Gods and Generals?" Stephen Lang is one of the best actors I've ever seen, and his depiction of Jackson in that film and Pickett in "Gettysburg" is outstanding.

538 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:51:50pm

re: #527 lostlakehiker

If we don't improve our energy technology and come up with something better than buying oil at the spot market price, we'll find ourselves some fine day thinking of that one car and that 1200 ft2 home as the privileged life of the elite, the different lifestyle.

Breeder reactors? Solar thermal? Wind? If AGW isn't a problem, we could rock along on coal for a while still. But not indefinitely, and then the same list of choices would be before us. It's better to make the transition while we have energy "to burn". If it ever gets to the point that energy for steelmaking is in a mortal tradeoff with energy for home heating, we're going to have to shiver and die just to get enough steel made to scrape by and maintain an industrial civilization and fend off the mass die-off that comes with the Fall.

Hydrogen looks promising.

539 Taqiyyotomist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:52:04pm

re: #536 Taqiyyotomist

/sarc!

540 Zimriel  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:52:33pm

Thank you Charles for this.

541 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:52:34pm

re: #529 lawhawk

It's unconstitutional, but it didn't stop Obama from doing so. Wagoner was the sacrificial lamb.

Pretty scary stuff, POTUS firing a CEO of a corporation.

542 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:52:36pm

re: #521 Hengineer

Its a movie where these two average Irish blokes become vigilantes after a run-in with some russian mob guys in an Irish Bar on St. Paddy's day in an inner city (Chicago? Boston?)

Which one is the hotty?

543 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:52:44pm

re: #522 JCM

Can I get fired by Obama?

this whole thing is like a spat between a whore, her john and the customers...what a bunch of thieving, worthless humans...I have no sympathy at all for any of them....the builders should go down and drag the unions with them...this shit has gone to far by about 40 years

544 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:52:59pm

re: #518 Hengineer

The guns.

lol!

545 NonNativeTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:53:25pm

Ok, this may be stupid, (but it has never stopped me before).
I was thinking the problem with solar and wind power is the storing of
the electricity because the power is not consistently produced.
Would it be feasible to build two huge reservoirs, reservoir one would be at a
higher elevation than reservoir two. You could use Francis turbines to generate
electricity using the water pressure of the water flowing from reservoir one
into reservoir two. Then you could use solar and wind power to pump the water
from reservoir two back into reservoir one. What do you think? Kinda of
the wind mill coming full circle.

546 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:53:39pm

re: #535 talon_262

Becomes? I thought he and his fellow corporate "tycoons" already were the MFMSM's whipping boys...

Those were AIG people, the GM execs were last stimulus package with their private jet travel. Now Wagoner can be reconstituted for being greedy with his golden parachute this week.

547 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:54:02pm

re: #537 Steffan

Was that when they filmed "Gods and Generals?" Stephen Lang is one of the best actors I've ever seen, and his depiction of Jackson in that film and Pickett in "Gettysburg" is outstanding.

YES! They had cameras there I wasn't sure what it was for. We stood next to two historians that explained the whole battle as it was unfolding. I remember it was 95 degrees, 95% humidity, and seeing all these people in hot wool clothing was also impressive - they claimed to be cool due to the linen underclothes that wicked away moisture. I'll have to trust them on that - I was in shorts.

548 whiterasta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:54:17pm

I did not go along with "moonbat hour" on Saturday. I just carried on as normal. (No Carbon Police came banging on my door, yet!

This morning, what do I get as my reward? Six inches of Global Warming.

549 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:54:33pm

re: #514 FurryOldGuyJeans

They "balanced" out their coverage with this polished turd:

PAYDAY: GM's Rick Wagoner Drives Away with $20M Retirement

Oh goody. Is Congress going to go after the golden parachutes now?

550 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:54:50pm

re: #545 NonNativeTexan

Ok, this may be stupid


You should have quit there while you were lucid!

j/k

551 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:54:52pm

re: #541 JCM

Pretty scary stuff, POTUS firing a CEO of a corporation.

No scarier than the guvmint for all practical purposes nationalizing private business with bail-out largesse.

552 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:55:05pm

re: #527 lostlakehiker

If we don't improve our energy technology and come up with something better than buying oil at the spot market price, we'll find ourselves some fine day thinking of that one car and that 1200 ft2 home as the privileged life of the elite, the different lifestyle.

Breeder reactors? Solar thermal? Wind? If AGW isn't a problem, we could rock along on coal for a while still. But not indefinitely, and then the same list of choices would be before us. It's better to make the transition while we have energy "to burn". If it ever gets to the point that energy for steelmaking is in a mortal tradeoff with energy for home heating, we're going to have to shiver and die just to get enough steel made to scrape by and maintain an industrial civilization and fend off the mass die-off that comes with the Fall.

There's plenty of coal and plenty of oil for all of us. I am a fan of nuclear energy, but the shithead greenies won't even consider that. I see no practical alternatives to coal and oil for the near future.

553 Taqiyyotomist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:55:17pm

re: #545 NonNativeTexan

That's a really interesting idea. Hydroelectric for the people, solar and wind only for moving the water from res. A to res. B via pumps.

554 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:55:25pm

re: #417 Hengineer

The Grapes of Wrath was banned in my county for a few decades.
It obviously isn't now, but guess what my county was?

Kern County, California

I was born and raised in Bakersfield, CA. Many of the farms in the Grapes of Wrath are still around today.

555 freetoken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:55:30pm

One more thought before I head off...

Too many of the lizards have become lazy, and expect Charles to feed them, IMO.

By that I mean, so often I see in the spin-off links, or posted in the comments, links to sites and people that are pretty marginal... If only the posters would take a minute and do a simple Google search on the names involved, look at what they find, and think about the information that comes up, perhaps they wouldn't post what they do.

Sometimes the link actually contradicts the poster, so I wonder if they have even read that to which they link?

Research is work, which is why people don't do it (or do it as often as they should.) Yet it remains the primary means by which we can educate ourselves.

556 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:55:38pm

re: #541 JCM

Pretty scary stuff, POTUS firing a CEO of a corporation.

Did any of us image this could happen pre-Tuesday, November 4, 2008?

557 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:55:40pm

re: #541 JCM

Pretty scary stuff, POTUS firing a CEO of a corporation.

TErry Kennan on Fox said it would have been reasonable to replace the board and let the board replace the CEO. This is Obama's grandiosity. Hhe underestimates the distrust that people have for government entities.

558 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:56:26pm

re: #385 alegrias

Dr. Zhivago, especially the scene where the Bolsheviks take over his house & allow him and his wife & child to live in one bedroom, is romantic in a neo-socialist way. Nice tale for our times!

if it could happen then, it could happen now.
imgine what that bus load of acorn thugs were thinking when they were
targeting wealthy people in ct.

559 lostlakehiker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:56:30pm

re: #519 Iron Fist

I'm not sure why anyone is getting too excercized about the seas rising, anyway, at least as it is used as "proof" of anthropomorphic global warming. The seas have been much higher that they are now in the past. Much higher. If youknow where to look and what rocks to look into here (in East Tennessee) you can find all the fossil evidence you care to that this area was at one time under water.

And it was under water a long time before there were humans to "cause" the sea to rise.

Anyway, isn't this a moot point? Barack Obama said that if he was elected the seas would stop rising. Well, he's been elected. So that is one potential catastrophy of "global warming" that we need no longer worry about.

You completely misunderstand the fossil evidence. There are sea shell fossils all through the limestone cliffs of Everest. This does not mean that Everest was once under water, with sea levels 29000 feet higher than they are today. There isn't enough water on earth for that to be possible. What it does mean is that the rock which now forms the summit of Everest was once seabed. As the Indian subcontinent crowded into Asia [a very slow motion collision!], Asia rode up while India plowed under. Erosion then sculpted the Himalayan peaks. The basic outline of the range is it's just one long high ridge.

Mountains rise and fall surprisingly quickly. They spring up, are worn away, ground to nubs, and drowned, all in a blink compared to the stately billions of the history of life on earth.

560 whiterasta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:57:08pm

re: #553 Taqiyyotomist

Sounds like perpetual motion, and we all know there is no such thing.....

561 Randall Gross  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:57:09pm

re: #471 stuiec

Here's just one of the many papers the finds serious flaws in Morner's work

[Link: www.imedea.uib.es...]

Morner's been beating this drum a while, and has been refuted for a while, you might want to do some reading before you hop on the bandwagon.

562 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:57:10pm

re: #546 FurryOldGuyJeans

Those were AIG people, the GM execs were last stimulus package with their private jet travel. Now Wagoner can be reconstituted for being greedy with his golden parachute this week.

what a sick cartoon...the unions killed the steel business, the education system, the auto industry....everybody ignores the 2 ton elephant...fuck the lot of them...taxpayers should not have to get dragged into this fiasco....these fuckers are criminals, BO included....this is FRAUD and EXTORTION

563 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:57:15pm

re: #548 whiterasta

I did not go along with "moonbat hour" on Saturday. I just carried on as normal. (No Carbon Police came banging on my door, yet!

This morning, what do I get as my reward? Six inches of Global Warming.

When my sister in law is here she makes a big deal about not using the dryer and hanging up all the clothes in the basement to drip dry - but because of our hard water, the clothes stiffen into cardboard. My son said: Mom, these pants hurt.
Her quote: "I don't believe it unless I read about it in the NYTimes."

564 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:57:30pm

re: #545 NonNativeTexan

Ok, this may be stupid, (but it has never stopped me before).
I was thinking the problem with solar and wind power is the storing of
the electricity because the power is not consistently produced.
Would it be feasible to build two huge reservoirs, reservoir one would be at a
higher elevation than reservoir two. You could use Francis turbines to generate
electricity using the water pressure of the water flowing from reservoir one
into reservoir two. Then you could use solar and wind power to pump the water
from reservoir two back into reservoir one. What do you think? Kinda of
the wind mill coming full circle.

Actually that method is used now. Water is pumped into a reservoir when there is excess power on the grid and released thru a water turbine generator at high demand times.

565 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:57:55pm

re: #544 rightymouse

lol!

If you watch it, you might understand why a young male in his 20's might get weak-kneed at that movie.

Its a good thought provoking movie nonetheless (despite the violence and foul language)

566 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:58:10pm

re: #562 albusteve

what a sick cartoon...the unions killed the steel business, the education system, the auto industry....everybody ignores the 2 ton elephant...fuck the lot of them...taxpayers should not have to get dragged into this fiasco....these fuckers are criminals, BO included....this is FRAUD and EXTORTION

It's taxpayer torture and economic abuse.

567 Taqiyyotomist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:58:12pm

re: #555 freetoken

I spend quite a bit of time in the links, and you're spot-on. Some folks are posting at a rate of Links Per Minute. Maybe they've read them prior to the linkposting binge, but for many of them, I'm guessing: not at all.

568 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:58:40pm

To those who refused to vote for McCain because he wasn't conservative enough (or really any reason):

ARE YOU FUCKING HAPPY NOW?

569 Bagua  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:58:42pm

re: #555 freetoken

While that is a valid point Freetoken, it can also work both ways, just googling up trash is not research either, nor is relying on Wiki, it's a start, but one needs to be wary of some of whats out there as well.

570 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:58:43pm

re: #555 freetoken

Research is work, which is why people don't do it (or do it as often as they should.) Yet it remains the primary means by which we can educate ourselves.

Spot on it, freetoken.

571 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:58:47pm

re: #538 DistantThunder

Hydrogen looks promising.

But all the excess man-made water vapor will produce cataclysmic storms like the world has never seen. (Moonbats won't give up until we're all walking behind their limos)

572 Pietr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:58:48pm

re: #539 Taqiyyotomist

/sarc!

re: #545 NonNativeTexan

Ok, this may be stupid, (but it has never stopped me before).
I was thinking the problem with solar and wind power is the storing of
the electricity because the power is not consistently produced.
Would it be feasible to build two huge reservoirs, reservoir one would be at a
higher elevation than reservoir two. You could use Francis turbines to generate
electricity using the water pressure of the water flowing from reservoir one
into reservoir two. Then you could use solar and wind power to pump the water
from reservoir two back into reservoir one. What do you think? Kinda of
the wind mill coming full circle.

Wasn't necessary. I believe you've reponded to one of my points, Charles covered 1 last thread. and I posted the other UK Telegraph link somewhere last thread, just as this one started....:>((re: #553 Taqiyyotomist

That's a really interesting idea. Hydroelectric for the people, solar and wind only for moving the water from res. A to res. B via pumps.

Law of Diminishing Returns, and Coservation of energy say it can partially work-but it can NEVER be Self sustaining-there is no "Perpetual Motion Machine".......Nice Try....

573 NukeAtomrod  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:59:35pm

re: #181 eon

No joke; this summer, they are officially changing the name from the Sci-Fi Channel to "SyFy".

Either this is leetspeek, or they are proving what I have long suspected- namely, that SFC is run by illiterates.

/One look at the script of one of their "Sci-Fi Original Productions" of the last two or three years is also strong supporting evidence.

cheers

eon

SyFy rhymes with sissy.

574 Taqiyyotomist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:59:49pm

re: #560 whiterasta

Sounds like perpetual motion, and we all know there is no such thing.....

Yes, there is a consensus...:)

575 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 4:59:52pm

re: #529 lawhawk

It's unconstitutional, but it didn't stop Obama from doing so. Wagoner was the sacrificial lamb.

Obama radio interview in 2001.

If you look at the victories and failures of the civil rights movement and its litigation strategy in the court. I think where it succeeded was to invest formal rights in previously dispossessed people, so that now I would have the right to vote. I would now be able to sit at the lunch counter and order as long as I could pay for it I’d be o.k. But, the Supreme Court never ventured into the issues of redistribution of wealth, and of more basic issues such as political and economic justice in society. To that extent, as radical as I think people try to characterize the Warren Court, it wasn’t that radical. It didn’t break free from the essential constraints that were placed by the founding fathers in the Constitution, at least as its been interpreted and Warren Court interpreted in the same way, that generally the Constitution is a charter of negative liberties. Says what the states can’t do to you. Says what the Federal government can’t do to you, but doesn’t say what the Federal government or State government must do on your behalf, and that hasn’t shifted and one of the, I think, tragedies of the civil rights movement was, um, because the civil rights movement became so court focused I think there was a tendancy to lose track of the political and community organizing and activities on the ground that are able to put together the actual coalition of powers through which you bring about redistributive change. In some ways we still suffer from that.

576 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:00:08pm

re: #571 Soona'

But all the excess man-made water vapor will produce cataclysmic storms like the world has never seen. (Moonbats won't give up until we're all walking behind pushing their limos)

FIFY

577 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:00:20pm

re: #562 albusteve

what a sick cartoon...the unions killed the steel business, the education system, the auto industry....everybody ignores the 2 ton elephant...fuck the lot of them...taxpayers should not have to get dragged into this fiasco....these fuckers are criminals, BO included....this is FRAUD and EXTORTION

The art of the confidence man is making sure the mark wants to be "taken". And O sure is doing that, hands down.

578 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:00:23pm

re: #568 FurryOldGuyJeans

To those who refused to vote for McCain because he wasn't conservative enough (or really any reason):

ARE YOU FUCKING HAPPY NOW?

Some people believe that some in the middle and on the left would never have believed that Obama would be this radical and that they had to see it to believe it.

579 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:00:33pm

re: #571 Soona'

But all the excess man-made water vapor will produce cataclysmic storms like the world has never seen. (Moonbats won't give up until we're all walking behind their limos)

Which is funny because Water Vapor is a product of combustion now...

580 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:00:53pm

re: #572 Pietr

The question for that fellow, I guess, is why not simply use solar and wind directly.

581 MittDoesNotCompute  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:00:54pm

re: #578 DistantThunder

Some people believe that some in the middle and on the left would never have believed that Obama would be this radical and that they had to see it to believe it.

To the detriment of us all...

582 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:00:56pm

re: #573 NukeAtomrod

SyFy rhymes with sissy.

it IS sissy pronounced with a lisp...

583 eon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:01:07pm

Well, I just realized I've been here almost continuously since about 0800 this AM.

Einstein was right about the definition of relativity. When you're doing something enjoyable, an hour really does seem like five minutes.

But it's close to my bedtime, and I have to be up early tomorrow. So;

Good night, Lizards.

Sleep well.

cheers

eon

584 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:01:11pm

re: #545 NonNativeTexan

Ok, this may be stupid, (but it has never stopped me before).
I was thinking the problem with solar and wind power is the storing of
the electricity because the power is not consistently produced.
Would it be feasible to build two huge reservoirs, reservoir one would be at a
higher elevation than reservoir two. You could use Francis turbines to generate
electricity using the water pressure of the water flowing from reservoir one
into reservoir two. Then you could use solar and wind power to pump the water
from reservoir two back into reservoir one. What do you think? Kinda of
the wind mill coming full circle.

Conservative of energy. It takes as much energy to move the water to the top as you'll get out letting the water back down, if you included loses to inefficiency you use more energy than you can get out.

585 lostlakehiker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:01:39pm

re: #545 NonNativeTexan

Ok, this may be stupid, (but it has never stopped me before).
I was thinking the problem with solar and wind power is the storing of
the electricity because the power is not consistently produced.
Would it be feasible to build two huge reservoirs, reservoir one would be at a
higher elevation than reservoir two. You could use Francis turbines to generate
electricity using the water pressure of the water flowing from reservoir one
into reservoir two. Then you could use solar and wind power to pump the water
from reservoir two back into reservoir one. What do you think? Kinda of
the wind mill coming full circle.

This has been done with conventional energy, in Germany. Fill a reservoir during periods of slack energy demand, then drain it through turbines during times of peak demand. A smaller power plant, operating steadily, can thus meet demand that fluctuates widely. There's no violation of thermodynamics here. The energy comes from the sun in the final analysis, so we're not trying to run a closed circuit perpetual motion machine. We just feed in fresh energy from sunlight. Until the sun burns out, that works. After the sun goes cold, it doesn't work. But maybe we can cross that bridge when we come to it.

(If we can't, then we die.)

586 Lizard by the Bay  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:01:44pm

re: #578 DistantThunder

Some people believe that some in the middle and on the left would never have believed that Obama would be this radical and that they had to see it to believe it.

There are some who still don't believe he's a radical. He has been successfully using the Congressional Democrats as cover.

587 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:01:57pm

re: #577 FurryOldGuyJeans

The art of the confidence man is making sure the mark wants to be "taken". And O sure is doing that, hands down.

Grifters. The markets will hold him accountable.

588 LGoPs  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:02:31pm

Later lizards. Gotta run.......

589 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:02:31pm
590 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:03:05pm

re: #580 Cognito

The question for that fellow, I guess, is why not simply use solar and wind directly.

Not enough.... There has to be a ton of money poured into producing power plants that produce enough energy, and while feasible requires a lot of money, and is only good while the wind is blowing/sun is shining.

My take on the bulk of the power grid is to use Nuclear.

Screw the NIMBY folks. Have the US Navy run nuclear power plants if the Federal Gubmint wishes to downsize the navy while still maintaining a strong grip on the energy industry.

591 NonNativeTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:03:15pm

re: #584 JCM

No, you guys did not read it throughly. You use wind and solar power to move the water back to reservoir A.

592 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:03:39pm

re: #584 JCM

Conservative of energy. It takes as much energy to move the water to the top as you'll get out letting the water back down, if you included loses to inefficiency you use more energy than you can get out.

Where this is used, the losses and inefficiencies are acceptable to have the power available on demand.

593 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:03:44pm
594 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:03:52pm

re: #565 Hengineer

If you watch it, you might understand why a young male in his 20's might get weak-kneed at that movie.

Its a good thought provoking movie nonetheless (despite the violence and foul language)

I'm a chick, so I'll suggest the movie for my hubby who loves to watch that kind of stuff and doesn't mind the language. Have to still watch out for the kind of movies teenlet watches although he LOVES guns.

595 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:03:58pm

there are tens of thousands of feds and union whores shuffling paper, writing memos, making phone calls running around uselessly while hauling down 80k a year doing nothing to solve the problem...it is a gigantic ripoff...the problems are right there for anybody to see yet all these people are being paid enormous bucks to pretend...pretend that any of this shit matters...bust the unions and get on with it....meanwhile we are all being bilked for our honest money...these bailouts are an outrage...it's all theater and people are cashing in BIGTIME on YOUR DIME

596 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:04:01pm

re: #584 JCM

Conservative of energy. It takes as much energy to move the water to the top as you'll get out letting the water back down, if you included loses to inefficiency you use more energy than you can get out.

Not necessarily, what you're saying is true if you use the energy of the falling water to try and pump the water back up.

He's using external sources of energy to run the pumps.

597 whiterasta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:04:07pm

re: #574 Taqiyyotomist

We all know the Joooos and Exxon kiboshed the perpetual motion machine.....

598 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:04:09pm

re: #568 FurryOldGuyJeans

To those who refused to vote for McCain because he wasn't conservative enough (or really any reason):

ARE YOU FUCKING HAPPY NOW?

Mandy?

599 Taqiyyotomist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:04:29pm

Later eon, LGoPs.

600 lawhawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:04:41pm

re: #559 lostlakehiker

You completely misunderstand the fossil evidence. There are sea shell fossils all through the limestone cliffs of Everest. This does not mean that Everest was once under water, with sea levels 29000 feet higher than they are today. There isn't enough water on earth for that to be possible. What it does mean is that the rock which now forms the summit of Everest was once seabed. As the Indian subcontinent crowded into Asia [a very slow motion collision!], Asia rode up while India plowed under. Erosion then sculpted the Himalayan peaks. The basic outline of the range is it's just one long high ridge.

Mountains rise and fall surprisingly quickly. They spring up, are worn away, ground to nubs, and drowned, all in a blink compared to the stately billions of the history of life on earth.

The planet is constantly in motion, whether it is orbiting the sun, rotating on its axis, tides are ebbing and flowing, tectonic plates moving about pushing land up or subducting land beneath or just rubbing along. You have hotspots and other volcanic activity creating new land where none exists.

And for all that, the eco-left wants people to think that a specific point in time, the right point in time, is the one that we must perpetuate, even as the climate has always ebbed and flowed, heated up, or cooled off.

601 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:04:44pm

re: #578 DistantThunder

Some people believe that some in the middle and on the left would never have believed that Obama would be this radical and that they had to see it to believe it.

And we are ALL being dragged down by their ignorance.

whee. :%P%

602 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:05:11pm

re: #530 pre-Boomer Marine brat

I'm leaving for the evening.
{goddess} !
Everyone have a good night.

Nighty night!

MWAH!

603 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:05:21pm

re: #591 NonNativeTexan

No, you guys did not read it throughly. You use wind and solar power to move the water back to reservoir A.

Wind and Solar still cost. Currently much more than our traditional sources. The power source may be "free", but the infrastructure is not. Not by a long shot.

604 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:05:29pm

re: #597 whiterasta

We all know the Joooos and Exxon kiboshed the perpetual motion machine.....

And the oil companies kiboshed the 200 mpg carburetor.

605 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:06:01pm

re: #603 CyanSnowHawk

Wind and Solar still cost. Currently much more than our traditional sources. The power source may be "free", but the infrastructure is not. Not by a long shot.

Which was my point, it would require huge amounts of money to install the system in the first place.

606 Taqiyyotomist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:06:17pm

re: #595 albusteve

Meanwhile I'm wondering wtf I am going to eat tomorrow. I wonder if Hoffa has ever had to dig up and roll a buncha pennies like I did this AM?

Unions and their workers can BLOW ME.

607 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:06:19pm

re: #590 Hengineer

Not enough.... There has to be a ton of money poured into producing power plants that produce enough energy, and while feasible requires a lot of money, and is only good while the wind is blowing/sun is shining.

My take on the bulk of the power grid is to use Nuclear.

Screw the NIMBY folks. Have the US Navy run nuclear power plants if the Federal Gubmint wishes to downsize the navy while still maintaining a strong grip on the energy industry.

Isn't it Shell that's getting out of wind and solar because it is unprofitable? Not only that, but those wacky unlovable environementalists, with Diane Feinstein's help, are suing to keep the Mojave desert free of solar panels. The Career of NO is the lawyers.

608 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:06:38pm

re: #509 buzzsawmonkey

Bill Clinton should claim Randi's dowsing prize. He could always follow his rod and find himself in hot water.

Words fail me.

lol!

609 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:06:59pm

re: #591 NonNativeTexan

No, you guys did not read it throughly. You use wind and solar power to move the water back to reservoir A.

re: #596 Hengineer

Not necessarily, what you're saying is true if you use the energy of the falling water to try and pump the water back up.

He's using external sources of energy to run the pumps.

Ahh, okay. That has potential.

Until a snail darter moves into the reservoir.

610 Bagua  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:07:07pm

re: #603 CyanSnowHawk

The other problem is many of the locations that are best for wind or solar, are also quite flat, making it tricky to store the water at elevation.

By contrast, there is lots of good old coal ready now.

611 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:07:22pm

re: #607 DistantThunder

Isn't it Shell that's getting out of wind and solar because it is unprofitable? Not only that, but those wacky unlovable environementalists, with Diane Feinstein's help, are suing to keep the Mojave desert free of solar panels. The Career of NO is the lawyers.

omfg, of all places.

Well at least the latest power plant in that desert region isn't made from solar panels, but Stirling Engines driven by directed solar heat.

612 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:07:58pm

re: #558 nyc redneck

if it could happen then, it could happen now.
imgine what that bus load of acorn thugs were thinking when they were
targeting wealthy people in ct.

/ I do not have ODS, I do however have European ancestry & that makes me susceptible.

613 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:08:09pm

re: #575 HelloDare

Obama radio interview in 2001.

. . . the Constitution is a charter of negative liberties.

hum, I never knew liberty to be a negative.

614 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:08:35pm

re: #575 HelloDare

Great post!

615 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:08:51pm

re: #595 albusteve

there are tens of thousands of feds and union whores shuffling paper, writing memos, making phone calls running around uselessly while hauling down 80k a year doing nothing to solve the problem...it is a gigantic ripoff...the problems are right there for anybody to see yet all these people are being paid enormous bucks to pretend...pretend that any of this shit matters...bust the unions and get on with it....meanwhile we are all being bilked for our honest money...these bailouts are an outrage...it's all theater and people are cashing in BIGTIME on YOUR DIME

My EZPASS didn't work going through a toll booth and so I got a notice with a 70 cent charge. I sent the paperwork back with my account number, and the next month I still had the charge with a $25 late fee. 4 months later and I'm still fighting the $25.70 and had to contact my state representatives office who have agreed to handle it.

616 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:09:29pm

re: #613 midwestgak

I think what he meant is that all the Constitution says is what you can't do, not what you can. Which is the point. How can you specify what you can do when it specifically leaves that up to the states in the 10th Ammendment?

617 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:09:30pm

I attended a lecture on nuclear energy a month ago. I asked about safety and reliability, which are the age-old questions about nuclear. The lecturer said that back in the 1990s, navy-trained nuclear engineers were able to improve safety and reliability of civilian nuclear power plants by an order of magnitude. If that's true, nuclear energy is finally ready for prime time.

Further, nuclear is the only substitute for coal, gas, and oil that can deliver the quantity of electricity we need to keep our economy growing. Pickens thinks the Saudis may be out of oil within a decade. Even if he's off by ten years, we still need to begin planning replacement sources of energy now that don't leave us in thrall to the Venezuelans and Russians.

618 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:09:32pm

re: #606 Taqiyyotomist

Meanwhile I'm wondering wtf I am going to eat tomorrow. I wonder if Hoffa has ever had to dig up and roll a buncha pennies like I did this AM?

Unions and their workers can BLOW ME.

The FMSM is fond of portraying Republican administrations are when the elderly are forced to eat pet food. With Democratic administrations, especially teh (sic) O, Americans are just relearning the true priorities of life, doing more with less, etc.

619 Taqiyyotomist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:09:43pm

re: #608 rightymouse

I really thank God for buzzsawmonkey, and his presence here. In the grimmest of threads, I find a bit of humor, and in most I wind up laughing my ass off. And it's never overdone, or callous, or out of place, or offensive. Unless you're offended by punnage, that is. I'll say again: Thank God for Buzz! :)

Later all.

620 whiterasta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:09:45pm

re: #607 DistantThunder

I thought I had not seen any of those irritating "We're a Green company, too" rubbish from Shell lately.

621 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:09:55pm
Prominent hurricane forecaster Dr. William M. Gray, a professor at Colorado State University, told the audience at the 2008 International Conference on Climate Change on March 4 in New York that a natural cycle of ocean water temperatures related to the salinity (the amount of salt) in ocean water was responsible for some global warming that has taken place. However, he said that same cycle means a period of cooling would begin within 10 years.

I'm willing to wait 10 years to see if Dr. Gray's prediction is better than Dr. Hanson's. If Hanson's proves correct, let's do the cap and trade thing.

Also, we can spend the 10 years on more alternative energy source research. I hope by then solar will be economically feasible and Dianne Feinstein and her wacky environmentalist friends/backers will not still be powerful enough to block the big solar power plant in the Mojave Desert.

622 Pietr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:09:56pm

re: #593 goddessoftheclassroom


PC Cat needs....

Once restarted:

PC Cat Error Msg

623 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:10:11pm

re: #560 whiterasta

Sounds like perpetual motion, and we all know there is no such thing.....

You misunderstand. The reference is to store energy in the form of potential energy. IE pump it up higher when you have power (like wind, sun, or when people are at the beach), then let it come down to make power when the other sources don't work, like at night.

624 IslandLibertarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:10:26pm

re: #604 Hengineer

And the oil companies kiboshed the 200 mpg carburetor.

.........and it will take TEN YEARS to get ANY oil from new drilling to our gas tanks.......

/The LEFT Lies!

Power to the Correct People!
(They know how to get that power too!)

625 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:10:39pm

re: #619 Taqiyyotomist

I really thank God for buzzsawmonkey, and his presence here. In the grimmest of threads, I find a bit of humor, and in most I wind up laughing my ass off. And it's never overdone, or callous, or out of place, or offensive. Unless you're offended by punnage, that is. I'll say again: Thank God for Buzz! :)

Later all.

Totally agree!

He cracks me up. :)

626 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:11:03pm

re: #615 DistantThunder

My EZPASS didn't work going through a toll booth and so I got a notice with a 70 cent charge. I sent the paperwork back with my account number, and the next month I still had the charge with a $25 late fee. 4 months later and I'm still fighting the $25.70 and had to contact my state representatives office who have agreed to handle it.

They're everywhere...

(I can't believe I can use this one--I'm so thrilled!)

627 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:11:15pm

re: #590 Hengineer

Screw the NIMBY folks. Have the US Navy run nuclear power plants if the Federal Gubmint wishes to downsize the navy while still maintaining a strong grip on the energy industry.

I couldn't agree more...

628 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:11:24pm

I heard a great metaphor for energy. Imagine that you are scaling down a rope from a cliff, half way down, you cut the rope above you and you crash to earth. The reason you cut the rope was that you were going to run out of rope anyway. It's much better to plan to make a smooth transition before you actually run out.

629 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:11:43pm

re: #615 DistantThunder

My EZPASS didn't work going through a toll booth and so I got a notice with a 70 cent charge. I sent the paperwork back with my account number, and the next month I still had the charge with a $25 late fee. 4 months later and I'm still fighting the $25.70 and had to contact my state representatives office who have agreed to handle it.

Well let's hope they catscan better than they passcan, if you know what I mean.

630 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:11:45pm

re: #624 IslandLibertarian

.........and it will take TEN YEARS to get ANY oil from new drilling to our gas tanks.......

/The LEFT Lies!

Power to the Correct People!
(They know how to get that power too!)

Its funny how people do NOT understand exactly how oil gets from that mucky hydrocarbony stuff in the ground through the refinery to becoming gasoline that goes into your tank.

apparently all they think of is the gasoline in their tank, they don't think about the Vasoline that they use to lube each other up before they.....


nevermind.

631 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:11:48pm

re: #609 JCM

Ahh, okay. That has potential.

Until a snail darter moves into the reservoir.

I think what I'm missing is this:

Human needs = X energy.
Falling water production = X energy.
Pumping it back up requirement = X energy + gravity.
So if solar and wind = X energy + gravity, why not let
Solar and wind = Human needs?

Can't work, right?

632 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:12:49pm

the solutions to our economic woes and energy problems are right at our finger tips...everybody knows what they are and how to move forward....the government is the problem not the solution....it is all so simple yet they have this fantasy...that's what frustrates me...politics, not real world events, artificial fantasy has cost me a bundle and will be our downfall...there is no real reason any of these problems cannot be met head on and solves....I hate the feds with a passion

633 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:13:02pm

re: #627 funky chicken

I couldn't agree more...

The US Navy has an IMPECCABLE nuclear record.

Speaking of civilian nuclear power plant records, whats the French safety record (considering over 80% of their electrical power comes from a nuclear source)?

634 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:13:04pm

re: #619 Taqiyyotomist

re: #625 rightymouse

Oh man! You guys are going to make buzzsaw think he deserves a larger cut of the Zionist Conspiracy money!

635 Abu Boo Boo  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:13:11pm

Freeman Dyson: My opinion is that most people believe in intelligent design as a reasonable explanation of the universe, and this belief is entirely compatible with science. So it is unwise for scientists to make a big fight against the idea of intelligent design. The fight should be only for the freedom of teachers to teach science as they see fit, independent of political or religious control. It should be a fight for intellectual freedom, not a fight for science against religion.

[Link: www.uncommondescent.com...]

636 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:13:18pm

re: #626 goddessoftheclassroom

They're everywhere...

(I can't believe I can use this one--I'm so thrilled!)

Purrrfect!

637 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:13:47pm

re: #631 Cognito

I think what I'm missing is this:

Human needs = X energy.
Falling water production = X energy.
Pumping it back up requirement = X energy + gravity.
So if solar and wind = X energy + gravity, why not let
Solar and wind = Human needs?

Can't work, right?

Cognito, the point of what they were talking about is energy production at night and when the wind is calm. How to store the energy for later use.

638 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:13:53pm

re: #610 Bagua

The other problem is many of the locations that are best for wind or solar, are also quite flat, making it tricky to store the water at elevation.

By contrast, there is lots of good old coal ready now.

That's what I'm saying. Plus, don't forget the vast (and I mean vast) natural gas deposits off our coast that we can't touch. Much of our so called energy problems are caused be none other...yes, you guessed it...the communist democats.

639 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:13:58pm

Hmmm... I think the "+gravity" may be unnecessary, there, being built into the "X energy" produced by the falling water.

640 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:14:25pm

re: #629 brookly red

Well let's hope they catscan better than they passcan, if you know what I mean.

Obama is going to be the Neurosurgeon in Chief taking personal responsibility for the cranial health of the nation - actually - have you seen Drudge in the last 20 minutes?

641 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:14:27pm

re: #634 FurryOldGuyJeans

re: #625 rightymouse

Oh man! You guys are going to make buzzsaw think he deserves a larger cut of the Zionist Conspiracy money!

He only gets two slices of pie if he has a party pin.

642 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:14:28pm
643 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:14:28pm

re: #634 FurryOldGuyJeans

re: #625 rightymouse

Oh man! You guys are going to make buzzsaw think he deserves a larger cut of the Zionist Conspiracy money!

And he deserves every quatloo!

644 NonNativeTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:14:48pm

re: #631 Cognito

I think what I'm missing is this:

Human needs = X energy.
Falling water production = X energy.
Pumping it back up requirement = X energy + gravity.
So if solar and wind = X energy + gravity, why not let
Solar and wind = Human needs?

Can't work, right?


The sun doesn't always shine and the wind doesn't always blow.

645 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:15:01pm

re: #584 JCM

Conservative of energy. It takes as much energy to move the water to the top as you'll get out letting the water back down, if you included loses to inefficiency you use more energy than you can get out.

Yes you do, but if you had more than you needed at any time (wind, sun, river flow) and did not use it, you would never get it back. This way you can store what you would otherwise have lost.

646 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:15:02pm

re: #637 Hengineer

Cognito, the point of what they were talking about is energy production at night and when the wind is calm. How to store the energy for later use.

Wind is usually combined with nuclear like in Europe.

647 Teh Flowah  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:15:08pm

I'm not sure what pointing out that Al Gore, a politician, is supportive of creationism is classrooms does for those in the Anti-AGW crowd. I mean, are you denying that the vast majority of scientists accept both AGW and Evolution as the correct theories? So what if one famous person shows poor judgment in his beliefs, you're going to have to do better than that to show a problem with the theory.

But I think, that once again, it just shows that weakness of your position. "Here here, look at this pandering politician, he holds these views, clearly they must both be wrong!" Seriously?

You're going to find many many many times more, proportionally, creationists that doubt AGW than people who accept evolution as the appropriate model. It's just a fact. There's really only one way for doubters to counter AGW, and it's by analyzing the science, because you certainly don't have scientific consensus. And if you think you're all better scientists than the.. you know.. actual scientists out there, then go right ahead. And while you're at it, ask yourself why you're not so incredulous about all other scientific theories, why you do not likewise voraciously attack them with similar skepticism.

I think the answer is clear, you've tied in AGW with government control when it is a false connection, and that dictates that you must deny rationality.

648 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:15:24pm

re: #631 Cognito

I heard Pickens talk about energy here in NYC last October. He made it clear that we'll need every type of energy, including nuclear, to maintain our economy and our standard of living. He's partial to natural gas, which he said exists in great abundance all over the U.S. Although he also favors wind and solar, he doesn't think they can deliver the kind of energy we'll need. To illustrate, he said no wind or solar device in existence or contemplated can fuel a fully loaded 18-wheeler.

649 Zimriel  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:15:29pm

re: #555 freetoken

One more thought before I head off...

Too many of the lizards have become lazy, and expect Charles to feed them, IMO.

By that I mean, so often I see in the spin-off links, or posted in the comments, links to sites and people that are pretty marginal... If only the posters would take a minute and do a simple Google search on the names involved, look at what they find, and think about the information that comes up, perhaps they wouldn't post what they do.

Sometimes the link actually contradicts the poster, so I wonder if they have even read that to which they link?

Research is work, which is why people don't do it (or do it as often as they should.) Yet it remains the primary means by which we can educate ourselves.

If they're sending emails to Charles, they should do the research. Full stop.

I recall sending only one mail to Charles. He didn't think it worthy of posting. It had to do with the left-wing agitprop which passes for AP English in Dallas, following up on a claim by Cathy Young on the Weekly Standard. Charles can't have rejected it because it wasn't sourced; it was. Charles probably rejected the thing because it included too much personal information about a non-public figure (a teacher, here), and/or was too trivial.

As for comments: I personally do the research when I post; however, I don't mind so much if some other commenter posts a half-baked comment (as long as it's not obviously ridiculous, or linked to V-ng--rd News etc).

If you're worried about downdings / deletes, I'd say to air the opinion first at the Lounge, but it's a crapshoot as to which lizards will be there. If I'm there, and your comment is about early Byzantine history, I might be able to help; but if it's about economics, I won't be.

Maybe there could be available, if logged in, a sidebar of which lizards are currently in the Lounge...

650 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:15:41pm

re: #644 NonNativeTexan

The sun doesn't always shine and the wind doesn't always blow.

Right. I know.

That's what I'm asking: Why, if solar and wind are inadequate to do the job directly, do they think it might work indirectly?

651 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:15:59pm

re: #642 buzzsawmonkey

This interview shows that Obama has absolutely no understanding of the US Constitution, or what "liberty" or "civil rights" mean. Rather, he subscribes to the "human rights" model under which "rights" are granted by the government, or withheld at the government's whim.

He does not understand that the Constitution was a truly radical document because it believed in the maximum possible liberty of the individual, and that what he calls "negative liberties" are the essential means of ensuring that this maximum liberty would be protected, by enshrining civil rights that protected the individual from all but the most minimal government interference.

The reason the Constitution does not say what the government is "supposed to do for you" is that it is supposed to do nothing for you, aside from providing certain essential services such as national security. It is not supposed to impinge on individual liberty for the purpose of redistributing wealth.

And that the rights don't come from a document, but are inherent in being a Human Being.

it says what the Government CAN'T do to you.

652 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:16:24pm

re: #648 quickjustice

I heard Pickens talk about energy here in NYC last October. He made it clear that we'll need every type of energy, including nuclear, to maintain our economy and our standard of living. He's partial to natural gas, which he said exists in great abundance all over the U.S. Although he also favors wind and solar, he doesn't think they can deliver the kind of energy we'll need. To illustrate, he said no wind or solar device in existence or contemplated can fuel a fully loaded 18-wheeler.

I'll do my part and fart away.

653 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:16:44pm

More Dr. Gray:

[Link: tropical.atmos.colostate.edu...]

654 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:16:48pm

re: #645 Naso Tang

Yes you do, but if you had more than you needed at any time (wind, sun, river flow) and did not use it, you would never get it back. This way you can store what you would otherwise have lost.

Ah, an answer. Thank you. So is it correct that we could have more solar and wind power, at peak production, than could be used simultaneously?

655 Neo Con since 9-11  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:16:53pm

re: #631 Cognito

He's talking about using the water as a battery to store energy when the sun isn't shining and the wind isn't blowing. Wind and solar are very inconsistent and if you don't have a way to store the energy created by them you end up in the dark.

656 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:16:54pm

re: #617 quickjustice

I attended a lecture on nuclear energy a month ago. I asked about safety and reliability, which are the age-old questions about nuclear. The lecturer said that back in the 1990s, navy-trained nuclear engineers were able to improve safety and reliability of civilian nuclear power plants by an order of magnitude. If that's true, nuclear energy is finally ready for prime time.

Further, nuclear is the only substitute for coal, gas, and oil that can deliver the quantity of electricity we need to keep our economy growing. Pickens thinks the Saudis may be out of oil within a decade. Even if he's off by ten years, we still need to begin planning replacement sources of energy now that don't leave us in thrall to the Venezuelans and Russians.

Oil is not going away anytime soon. We have significant reserves that are currently "off-limits" through legislation, not technical know-how. Other alternatives are also available. Algal Oil, oil extracted from algae and compatible with current infrastructure, is a proven concept, and there are companies at this moment doing the work to scale up its production and bring down its cost. Current estimates make it competitive with deep sea drilling in the next five-ten years, faster if demand calls for it.

657 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:17:26pm

re: #648 quickjustice

I heard Pickens talk about energy here in NYC last October. He made it clear that we'll need every type of energy, including nuclear, to maintain our economy and our standard of living. He's partial to natural gas, which he said exists in great abundance all over the U.S. Although he also favors wind and solar, he doesn't think they can deliver the kind of energy we'll need. To illustrate, he said no wind or solar device in existence or contemplated can fuel a fully loaded 18-wheeler.

He's just bought massive wind turbines from GE - but he doesn't want to pay for the infastructure so he is lobbing congress along with GE for the taxpayer to pay for the grid set up. By the way, GE is using bailout money to lobby the government for more money...

658 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:17:35pm

re: #650 Cognito

Right. I know.

That's what I'm asking: Why, if solar and wind are inadequate to do the job directly, do they think it might work indirectly?

Maybe, the problem is I don't think there truly is enough sun power. The sun energy reaching us is pretty weak, which is why solar power plants are very acreage-intensive.

659 whiterasta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:17:50pm

re: #646 DistantThunder

That is proving to be a complete waste of time, as the power plants, both coal and nuke have to be spooled up and ready to take up demand at a few seconds notice.

So the net effect of having wind turbines is zero, at best.

Wind power is basically a socialist subsidy scam.

660 IslandLibertarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:17:58pm

re: #630 Hengineer

my argument:
You can't manufacture
windmills,
solar panels,
fluorescent bulbs,
green autos,
green anything,
ANYTHING,
WITHOUT OIL!

/and don't even mention ipods and kewl stuff....lame ass lef-tard Real Life MTV shit-heads..............

661 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:18:16pm

re: #631 Cognito

Because this Image: windFarm4.jpg produces enough energy for maybe one medium size city, meanwhile one nuclear plant can supply the energy needed for an entire region. There are 8 plants in the 6 New England states and non of them are anywhere near capacity

662 NonNativeTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:18:16pm

re: #650 Cognito

Right. I know.

That's what I'm asking: Why, if solar and wind are inadequate to do the job directly, do they think it might work indirectly?


Because the water pressure would be constant, as long as
you have enough energy to pump the water back into reservoir a.

663 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:18:29pm

re: #652 Hengineer

Cow flatulence is a major cause of increased CO2 levels globally. Your problem isn't the flatulence; it's capturing it for use in your hybrid automobile.

664 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:18:39pm

re: #657 DistantThunder

GE is using bailout money to lobby the government for more money...

self-perpetuating!

665 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:18:40pm

re: #644 NonNativeTexan

The sun doesn't always shine and the wind doesn't always blow.

On the way to Virginia last year for a visit, we passed by a large wind farm. Most of the wind thingies weren't even working. Deader'n'doornails. Not very efficient, if you ask me.

666 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:18:55pm

re: #660 IslandLibertarian

my argument:
You can't manufacture
windmills,
solar panels,
fluorescent bulbs,
green autos,
green anything,
ANYTHING,
WITHOUT OIL!

/and don't even mention ipods and kewl stuff....lame ass lef-tard Real Life MTV shit-heads..............

Anything plastic....

667 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:18:57pm

re: #644 NonNativeTexan

The sun doesn't always shine and the wind doesn't always blow.

Yet there will always be lots of hot air and bullshit from the seats of government.

668 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:19:15pm

re: #663 quickjustice

Cow flatulence is a major cause of increased CO2 levels globally. Your problem isn't the flatulence; it's capturing it for use in your hybrid automobile.

Cow flatulence is CO, not CO2.

669 IslandLibertarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:19:23pm

re: #631 Cognito

I think what I'm missing is this:


Can't work, right?

You've never worked in the energy industry, right?

670 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:19:24pm

re: #640 DistantThunder

Obama is going to be the Neurosurgeon in Chief taking personal responsibility for the cranial health of the nation - actually - have you seen Drudge in the last 20 minutes?

yes, I have in fact... but still no ODS, it's just a rash I tell yah.

671 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:19:26pm

re: #660 IslandLibertarian

my argument:
You can't manufacture
windmills,
solar panels,
fluorescent bulbs,
green autos,
green anything,
ANYTHING,
WITHOUT OIL!

/and don't even mention ipods and kewl stuff....lame ass lef-tard Real Life MTV shit-heads..............

RE-education camp for you comrade. Camp Liberty is nice this time of year I hear.

672 BlueCanuck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:19:55pm

re: #657 DistantThunder

He's just bought massive wind turbines from GE - but he doesn't want to pay for the infastructure so he is lobbing congress along with GE for the taxpayer to pay for the grid set up. By the way, GE is using bailout money to lobby the government for more money...

Perpetual motion?

673 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:20:25pm

re: #648 quickjustice

I heard Pickens talk about energy here in NYC last October. He made it clear that we'll need every type of energy, including nuclear, to maintain our economy and our standard of living. He's partial to natural gas, which he said exists in great abundance all over the U.S. Although he also favors wind and solar, he doesn't think they can deliver the kind of energy we'll need. To illustrate, he said no wind or solar device in existence or contemplated can fuel a fully loaded 18-wheeler.

anybody that thinks we don't need oil is living in dream land...we have a hell of alot of it right here on our sovereign soil....it's nothing short of criminal that we don't use it....there is billions in profits for those people that convince the public otherwise....all this will not end well...the donks will go to far and pay the long buck for it

674 Russkilitlover  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:20:36pm

re: #658 Hengineer

Maybe, the problem is I don't think there truly is enough sun power. The sun energy reaching us is pretty weak, which is why solar power plants are very acreage-intensive.

Works well enough for me. Just paid the elec bill - $16.33. Heh.

Seriously, residential and commercial buildings in the southwest should absolutely have solar panels. It just makes so much sense.

675 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:20:45pm

re: #635 Abu Boo Boo

Freeman Dyson: My opinion is that most people believe in intelligent design as a reasonable explanation of the universe, and this belief is entirely compatible with science. So it is unwise for scientists to make a big fight against the idea of intelligent design. The fight should be only for the freedom of teachers to teach science as they see fit, independent of political or religious control. It should be a fight for intellectual freedom, not a fight for science against religion.

[Link: www.uncommondescent.com...]

My two cents worth of guessing:

He probably doesn't pay too much attention to the shenanigans of the Discovery Institute.
He probably knows that ID would come down to Panspermia if considered scientifically.
He is 86 or so.

676 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:20:59pm

re: #668 Hengineer

Cow flatulence is CO, not CO2.

Carbon monoxide? Do you mean methane, CH4 (superscript)?

677 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:07pm

re: #660 IslandLibertarian

my argument:
You can't manufacture
windmills,
solar panels,
fluorescent bulbs,
green autos,
green anything,
ANYTHING,
WITHOUT OIL!

/and don't even mention ipods and kewl stuff....lame ass lef-tard Real Life MTV shit-heads..............

Let's not forget what is in the oil sump in the green cars?

What lubricates the bearings of the Windmills, wind turbines, hydroelectric turbines...etc?

678 Pietr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:11pm

re: #668 Hengineer

Cow flatulence is CO, not CO2.

You forgot Methane and Hydrogen Sulfide.......LOL.

679 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:15pm

Have you heard about the noise complaints about wind turbines -a low humming that is driving neighbors crazy in Oregon I think. anyone else see that article? More lawsuits and disability claims, probably. Party of Lawyers to the rescue.

680 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:17pm

re: #676 goddessoftheclassroom

Carbon monoxide? Do you mean methane, CH4 (superscript)?

Oop, subscript, not superscript.

681 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:22pm

re: #663 quickjustice

Cow flatulence is a major cause of increased CO2 levels globally. Your problem isn't the flatulence; it's capturing it for use in your hybrid automobile.

hence the new GM front wheel drive "Poot" ...

682 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:35pm
683 BlueCanuck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:36pm

re: #676 goddessoftheclassroom

Carbon monoxide? Do you mean methane, CH4 (superscript)?

CH4. Subscript. :)

684 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:38pm

re: #669 IslandLibertarian

Nyuk nyuk.

Easier to offer snark than an actual explanation, as someone else did.

685 Racer X  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:45pm

re: #545 NonNativeTexan

Ok, this may be stupid, (but it has never stopped me before).
I was thinking the problem with solar and wind power is the storing of
the electricity because the power is not consistently produced.
Would it be feasible to build two huge reservoirs, reservoir one would be at a
higher elevation than reservoir two. You could use Francis turbines to generate
electricity using the water pressure of the water flowing from reservoir one
into reservoir two. Then you could use solar and wind power to pump the water
from reservoir two back into reservoir one. What do you think? Kinda of
the wind mill coming full circle.


I read somewhere recently that power companies are doing this now - with no solar energy.

During the day they route the hydro-electricity to where it is needed. At night they use that excess electricity to pump water back up into the reservoir. It is easier on the system to just keep the generators going than it would be to turn them off.

686 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:21:56pm

re: #674 Russkilitlover

Works well enough for me. Just paid the elec bill - $16.33. Heh.

Seriously, residential and commercial buildings in the southwest should absolutely have solar panels. It just makes so much sense.

Oh I agree, but the thing is your solar panels were installed for free, right?

did you actually pay for your solar panels?

687 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:22:37pm

re: #683 BlueCanuck

CH4. Subscript. :)

As soon as I hit "post this comment," I thought, "Wait a minute,.."

688 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:22:43pm

re: #642 buzzsawmonkey

This interview shows that Obama has absolutely no understanding of the US Constitution, or what "liberty" or "civil rights" mean. Rather, he subscribes to the "human rights" model under which "rights" are granted by the government, or withheld at the government's whim.

He does not understand that the Constitution was a truly radical document because it believed in the maximum possible liberty of the individual, and that what he calls "negative liberties" are the essential means of ensuring that this maximum liberty would be protected, by enshrining civil rights that protected the individual from all but the most minimal government interference.

The reason the Constitution does not say what the government is "supposed to do for you" is that it is supposed to do nothing for you, aside from providing certain essential services such as national security. It is not supposed to impinge on individual liberty for the purpose of redistributing wealth.

You must be mistaken. Obama is a constitutional scholar, after all. /////////

689 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:09pm

re: #656 CyanSnowHawk

Here's the Pickens plan: [Link: www.pickensplan.com...]

690 Salem  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:13pm

re: #122 LudwigVanQuixote

One should also note from this article that Steven Weinberg agrees with AGW. Steven Weinberg is a much bigger fish than Dyson.

Well, I'll take the fish that doesn't want to gut our economy to protect polar bears who don't need it.

691 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:15pm

re: #678 Pietr

You forgot Methane and Hydrogen Sulfide.......LOL.

Something like that. =-P

692 Russkilitlover  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:24pm

re: #686 Hengineer

Oh I agree, but the thing is your solar panels were installed for free, right?

did you actually pay for your solar panels?

They were a standard feature on the new home we bought and it was a standard feature in every home in the community. I did pay for it in the cost of the home.

693 DistantThunder  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:25pm

Young un is pestering me to get on the computer. Catch ya, slater....

694 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:34pm

Here's hoping that whole cold fusion thing works out.

695 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:36pm
696 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:38pm
697 BlueCanuck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:46pm

re: #687 goddessoftheclassroom

For a teacher, we will forgive you. Especially when you caught the mistake. Science and chemistry can be difficult.

698 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:23:57pm

re: #668 Hengineer

Cow flatulence is CO, not CO2.

Composition of flatus gases

I see nary a mention of Carbon Monoxide.

699 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:24:10pm

re: #685 Racer X

I read somewhere recently that power companies are doing this now - with no solar energy.

During the day they route the hydro-electricity to where it is needed. At night they use that excess electricity to pump water back up into the reservoir. It is easier on the system to just keep the generators going than it would be to turn them off.

Its interesting that its better and easier on Diesel Engines to keep them running than to stop and start them in the morning and at night.

700 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:24:28pm

re: #698 FurryOldGuyJeans

Composition of flatus gases

I see nary a mention of Carbon Monoxide.

thanks.

701 goddessoftheclassroom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:25:06pm

re: #697 BlueCanuck

For a teacher, we will forgive you. Especially when you caught the mistake. Science and chemistry can be difficult.

I actually considered being a chemistry teacher! I LOVE chemistry. I just use "superscript" more often than "subscript" as an English teacher.

702 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:25:19pm

re: #700 Hengineer

thanks.

CO is sometimes a product of incomplete combustion.

I got some of my advanced thermodynamics chemistry equations rolled around in my head when I remembered that Water is a product of combustion.

703 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:25:37pm

re: #694 Cognito

Here's hoping that whole cold fusion thing works out.

How many have you had so far tonight?

704 Teh Flowah  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:25:45pm

re: #531 Cognito

If the seas are indeed rising, it's pretty darned exciting if you're a human being. We're wee delicate creatures who like things to stay the same.

(Anthropomorphic?)

You're right, we like things to stay the same. And we should. The Ice Age was not good for us. The last several thousand years have been unprecedentedly stable and temperate, and it is FANTASTIC for us. It allowed us to flourish and develop civilization and technology. Another Ice Age would NOT be good news, neither would any amount of warming that upsets this temperate climate.

Fact is, the climate we have right now is good for humans, any changes higher or lower temperature-wise would require massive investments on our part to adapt, assuming we could. Besides, I'm all for learning how to control the climate. It's just a good idea for us to invest in that. We love to control every other aspect of nature, we invented central heating and central air, we filter water, we seed rain clouds. Ultimately, it would be the human goal to control every aspect our environment, wherever that is.

Unless you have some idea that some things are just too sacred to mess with and that includes our "environment" (In which case, I suggest you become a hippie or something and engage in subsistence living, or kill yourself I guess.)

705 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:25:51pm

re: #666 Hengineer

Anything plastic....

Anything metal.

706 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:26:09pm

re: #631 Cognito

I think what I'm missing is this:

Human needs = X energy.
Falling water production = X energy.
Pumping it back up requirement = X energy + gravity.
So if solar and wind = X energy + gravity, why not let
Solar and wind = Human needs?

Can't work, right?

Need a whole lot more efficiency to both methods of production.

You need to produce enough to supply both needs, and filling reservoir. While the wind blows and sun shines. You means of production would have to produce 2x (very rough estimate) needs to provide for need and fill the reservoir.

Plus you'd need to shut down the real whackos who are attempting to block solar farms in the desert and shut down wind farms for the birds.

707 Racer X  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:26:12pm

re: #696 NYCHardhat

Trolls.

Avanti?

708 Bloodnok  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:26:34pm

re: #696 NYCHardhat

Trolls.

Thank God we don't have any one like that here.

////

709 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:27:13pm

re: #707 Racer X

Avanti?

You read my mind you magnificent bastard.

710 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:27:33pm

A government big enough to give you everything you want, is big enough to take away everything you have."
Thomas Jefferson

711 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:27:38pm

re: #656 CyanSnowHawk

Pickens claims that even if all U.S. oil reserves now off limits were opened to exploration, it wouldn't be enough to replace Saudi or other foreign sources.

I'll repeat: [Link: www.pickensplan.com...]

I understand that Pickens may have personal interests in promoting wind and solar, but even he says that wind and solar won't be nearly enough.

712 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:27:50pm

re: #651 Hengineer

And that the rights don't come from a document, but are inherent in being a Human Being.

it says what the Government CAN'T do to you.

That makes Obama's statement about "negative liberties" true? Respectfully, you are missing the point.

713 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:28:11pm

re: #694 Cognito

Here's hoping that whole cold fusion thing works out.

It would be opposed by the NIMBYs and Greens if it ever did become economically and technologically feasible.

714 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:28:31pm

re: #703 Naso Tang

How many have you had so far tonight?

A little joke. Although there is apparently something happening in the field, although nobody knows what.

715 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:28:32pm

re: #706 JCM

Need a whole lot more efficiency to both methods of production.

You need to produce enough to supply both needs, and filling reservoir. While the wind blows and sun shines. You means of production would have to produce 2x (very rough estimate) needs to provide for need and fill the reservoir.

Plus you'd need to shut down the real whackos who are attempting to block solar farms in the desert and shut down wind farms for the birds.

or shutting down wind farms because they block their view of Nantucket Sound....

716 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:28:59pm

re: #685 Racer X

I read somewhere recently that power companies are doing this now - with no solar energy.

During the day they route the hydro-electricity to where it is needed. At night they use that excess electricity to pump water back up into the reservoir. It is easier on the system to just keep the generators going than it would be to turn them off.

As I mentioned up thread:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

717 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:29:11pm

re: #712 midwestgak

That makes Obama's statement about "negative liberties" true? Respectfully, you are missing the point.

No, I never said that, I'm on your side.

I have no idea what a "negative liberty" is anyway

718 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:29:33pm

the number one priority at this point is generating more electricity and that can be quickly and simply done with nuclear power....next we need to supply ourselves with our own oil, again it is right here and we need to mine it and let the markets determine it's value...the ME is a dead end, Hugo is a dead end....Nigeria is a dead end....Canada and the US have plenty of energy at our finger tips...fossile yes but we NEED that stuff to get us over the hump to renewables....bio fuel should be grown in the desert from algea

719 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:29:48pm

re: #704 Teh Flowah

You're right, we like things to stay the same. And we should. The Ice Age was not good for us. The last several thousand years have been unprecedentedly stable and temperate, and it is FANTASTIC for us. It allowed us to flourish and develop civilization and technology. Another Ice Age would NOT be good news, neither would any amount of warming that upsets this temperate climate.

Fact is, the climate we have right now is good for humans, any changes higher or lower temperature-wise would require massive investments on our part to adapt, assuming we could. Besides, I'm all for learning how to control the climate. It's just a good idea for us to invest in that. We love to control every other aspect of nature, we invented central heating and central air, we filter water, we seed rain clouds. Ultimately, it would be the human goal to control every aspect our environment, wherever that is.

Unless you have some idea that some things are just too sacred to mess with and that includes our "environment" (In which case, I suggest you become a hippie or something and engage in subsistence living, or kill yourself I guess.)

The one thing the greeny weinies and the hippies fail to recognize is the fact that mankind has never controlled or never will control the the Earth's enviroment. What man has become very very good at is adapting to the enviroment.

720 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:30:09pm

re: #711 quickjustice

Pickens claims that even if all U.S. oil reserves now off limits were opened to exploration, it wouldn't be enough to replace Saudi or other foreign sources.

I'll repeat: [Link: www.pickensplan.com...]

I understand that Pickens may have personal interests in promoting wind and solar, but even he says that wind and solar won't be nearly enough.

Pickens is a liar

721 Racer X  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:30:13pm

re: #711 quickjustice

I understand that Pickens may have personal interests in promoting wind and solar, but even he says that wind and solar won't be nearly enough.


That is an understatement.

722 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:30:49pm
723 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:30:50pm

re: #640 DistantThunder

Obama is going to be the Neurosurgeon in Chief taking personal responsibility for the cranial health of the nation - actually - have you seen Drudge in the last 20 minutes?

it is really frightening how this unqualified inept person is pushing forward like he
has some experience and talent to draw from.
imagine if he was your neighbor. i'm thinking if he lived down the road from me,
he would be helpless in the real world. he has never had a real job. he has never had to earn money in the private sector. he doesn't know business. he knows theory and community organizing to gain power.
and he sure as hell does not know how to drive a tractor.
he looks like a goofy idiot on bicycle.

724 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:31:12pm

re: #719 Soona'

The one thing the greeny weinies and the hippies fail to recognize is the fact that mankind has never controlled or never will control the the Earth's enviroment. What man has become very very good at is adapting to the enviroment.

Or blocking out the effect of environment, such as building houses to get out of the elements.

725 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:31:21pm

re: #719 Soona'

The one thing the greeny weinies and the hippies fail to recognize is the fact that mankind has never controlled or never will control the the Earth's enviroment. What man has become very very good at is adapting to the enviroment.

To quote George Carlin:
"Save the planet! Save the planet? Are these people completely insane? The planet is fine! Its the PEOPLE that are fucked!"

726 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:31:21pm

re: #716 Aviator

As I mentioned up thread:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

New buildings are chilling water reservoirs at night when the rates are low. Then using the chilled water during the day for cooling.

727 NonNativeTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:31:24pm

re: #706 JCM


My idea is to use only the water turbines to generate electricity.
Solar and water to refill the tank.

728 Racer X  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:31:49pm

re: #716 Aviator

As I mentioned up thread:
[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

Nice!

Thanks - I missed that.

729 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:32:09pm

re: #717 Hengineer

No, I never said that, I'm on your side.

I have no idea what a "negative liberty" is anyway

I don't know either. The notion came from his 2001 quote.

{Hengineer}

730 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:32:19pm

re: #719 Soona'

The one thing the greeny weinies and the hippies fail to recognize is the fact that mankind has never controlled or never will control the the Earth's enviroment. What man has become very very good at is adapting to the enviroment.

Pfft, we all now Rove has a weather machine!
Jeesh, some people!

////////////

731 rightymouse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:32:55pm

Speaking of wind, it's time to join my male units for some TV while the night is still somewhat young.

Later.

732 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:33:07pm

re: #727 NonNativeTexan

My idea is to use only the water turbines to generate electricity.
Solar and water to refill the tank.

in a few short years we could have more electricity than we need by far....build the goddamned nukes

733 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:33:10pm

As a tribute to Al Gore's great work on Global Warming, I think a greenhouse gas should be named after him. Methane comes to mind.

We should call methane Gore Gas.

734 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:33:18pm

cow burps, not farts, are the problem.....

eructation

735 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:33:25pm

re: #722 NYCHardhat

Fuck solar. HRSG.

Not Fuck Solar, Solar helps.
Solar Panels for flat surfaces

Solar Stirling Engines for everything else

736 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:33:37pm

re: #726 JCM

New buildings are chilling water reservoirs at night when the rates are low. Then using the chilled water during the day for cooling.

Neat!
(what about in winter?)

737 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:33:42pm

re: #725 Hengineer

To quote George Carlin:
"Save the planet! Save the planet? Are these people completely insane? The planet is fine! Its the PEOPLE that are fucked!"

I miss 'ole George......sometimes.

738 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:34:07pm

re: #731 rightymouse

Speaking of wind, it's time to join my male units for some TV while the night is still somewhat young.

Later.

heh heh

you said "male unit"

739 Bloodnok  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:34:08pm

re: #734 windhorse

cow burps, not farts, are the problem.....

eructation

Cud you be more specific?

740 NY Nana  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:34:18pm

re: #505 Hengineer

Buyers remorse would imply that Obama was bought and sold...

oh wait

/And he took a massive salary cut, as he feels our pain.

741 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:34:23pm

re: #735 Hengineer

Not Fuck Solar, Solar helps.
Solar Panels for flat surfaces

Solar Stirling Engines for everything else

Too much $$$$

742 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:34:51pm

re: #734 windhorse

cow burps, not farts, are the problem.....

eructation

It's Gore Gas.

743 NonNativeTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:35:01pm

re: #732 albusteve

in a few short years we could have more electricity than we need by far....build the goddamned nukes

Nuclear passes the liberal test. France has been doing it for years.

744 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:35:36pm

re: #714 Cognito

A little joke. Although there is apparently something happening in the field, although nobody knows what.

Many assume neutron = reactor.

A few slow neutrons created by some so far unknown process in a jar aren't going to fuse anything together. It's interesting theoretically, but there is absolutely nothing that suggests how it can be scaled to
create power.

745 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:35:45pm

re: #718 albusteve

Nuclear energy solves most of the electricity problem if we start building nuclear plants and upgrade the electric grid. There is no battery in existence, however, that can power an 18 wheeler. For that we need fossil fuel of some sort.

746 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:36:08pm

re: #743 NonNativeTexan

Nuclear passes the liberal test. France has been doing it for years.


No it doesn;'t. They've opposed it from day one!

747 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:36:13pm

re: #743 NonNativeTexan

Nuclear passes the liberal test. France has been doing it for years.

What kind of wine do they recommend with a nuke?

748 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:36:52pm

re: #743 NonNativeTexan

Nuclear passes the liberal test. France has been doing it for years.

there is a ton of money to be made denying this natural gift to the people...it is simply criminal...what else can you call it....people suffer while the elites prosper....I hate the feds

749 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:36:54pm

re: #745 quickjustice

Nuclear energy solves most of the electricity problem if we start building nuclear plants and upgrade the electric grid. There is no battery in existence, however, that can power an 18 wheeler. For that we need fossil fuel of some sort.

Bingo. We are tied to fossil power for awhile.

750 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:36:55pm

re: #741 NYCHardhat

Too much $$$$

Stirling Engines produce more power per square inch of sun than solar panels.

751 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:37:02pm
752 NonNativeTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:37:08pm

re: #747 HelloDare

What kind of wine do they recommend with a nuke?

Red?

753 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:37:25pm

re: #736 brookly red

Neat!
(what about in winter?)

Heat the water at night, warm the building during the day. Water is a great heat reservoir.re: #747 HelloDare

What kind of wine do they recommend with a nuke?


Glow du Darke.

754 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:37:51pm

re: #745 quickjustice

Nuclear energy solves most of the electricity problem if we start building nuclear plants and upgrade the electric grid. There is no battery in existence, however, that can power an 18 wheeler. For that we need fossil fuel of some sort.

CAPITALIST! Are your packages too good for the Party-supplied electric trains?

755 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:37:52pm

re: #753 JCM

Glow du Darke.

ha...

756 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:38:08pm

re: #752 NonNativeTexan

Red?

Definitely Red.

757 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:38:50pm

re: #751 buzzsawmonkey

A "negative liberty" is a "thou shalt not"; in Obama's view, the government being proscribed from unreasonable searches and seizures is a "negative liberty" because it says what cannot be done, rather than what can be done. Saying "you shall not discriminate in voting" is a negative liberty because it prevents discrimination rather than providing, say, redress or reparation for prior grievance. Saying that the government cannot deprive a citizen of property without due process of law is a negative liberty, because it restricts the government; and, as he mournfully notes, there is nothing which affirmatively says that the government can take a citizen's property to give to someone else in order to further somebody's notion of justice.

In other words, a "negative liberty" as Obama uses the term is a disparaging view of the civil rights which are intended to protect the individual's actual liberty from the officious interference of government do-gooders. Those pesky "negative liberties" are a roadblock to his human rights vision of "positive" liberties, i.e., the benefits that he believes it is the function of the government to provide.

Wait a sec, so Obama thinks the Constitution should be a document which outlines the rights of the government, and not the people?

What?

758 Racer X  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:38:54pm

re: #716 Aviator

More info on Ludington Pumped Storage

759 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:39:43pm

re: #747 HelloDare

Lumenescent?

760 midwestgak  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:40:15pm

re: #757 Hengineer

Wait a sec, so Obama thinks the Constitution should be a document which outlines the rights limitations of the government, and not the people?

What?

761 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:40:19pm
762 NonNativeTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:41:23pm

re: #758 Racer X

More info on Ludington Pumped Storage


Hey, they stole most of my idea, And already built it.

763 IslandLibertarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:41:28pm

re: #684 Cognito

Nyuk nyuk.

Easier to offer snark than an actual explanation, as someone else did.

Solar and wind = Human needs?

................begging to be snarked............

764 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:41:38pm

re: #760 midwestgak

I know what its supposed to be, don't correct me =-P

I was questioning what Obama thinks it is.

765 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:41:55pm

there are 300 million people in this country...we are being denied nuclear energy by a very small fraction of elitists who make a permanent living as professional roadblocks....we have to stop this madness somehow....

766 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:42:14pm

[Link: www.drudgereport.com...]

NANNY STATE: GOVERNMENT WEBSITE TO WARN OF SADNESS/CRYING OVER ECONOMY
Mon Mar 30 2009 18:43:56 ET

The U.S. government is set to offer an online emotional rescue kit!

"Getting Through Tough Economic Times" will launch Tuesday with a media push across all platforms.

The site is meant to help people identify health concerns related to financial worries.

The feds will warn of depression, suicidal thinking and other serious mental illnesses. It will raise warning flags for: Persistent sadness/crying; Excessive anxiety; Lack of sleep/constant fatigue; Excessive irritability/anger.

The guide will be available starting at midnight at [Link: www.samhsa.gov...]

Developing...

I'm depressed cuz nobody will give me a billion dollars, waah.

767 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:42:22pm

re: #754 Hengineer

Stay away from my package! ;-) And the 100-year-old NYC subway system is electric. In fact, it consumes 1/3 of all electricity in NYC.

768 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:42:24pm

re: #765 albusteve

there are 300 million people in this country...we are being denied nuclear energy by a very small fraction of elitists who make a permanent living as professional roadblocks....we have to stop this madness somehow....

populist!

/s

769 Killian Bundy  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:42:31pm
770 Bagua  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:42:41pm

re: #720 albusteve

Pickens is a liar

I recently read that Pickens Hedge Fund is down 97%, a near total loss if closed today, it is heavily invested in his solar and nat. gas ideas and at this point the only way it will regain its value is should his campaigning lead to government subsidy of his plans.

771 Soona'  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:42:44pm

As was discussed at the beginning of this thread, all of the energy/enviromental problems have been artificially created so that a small elite fraction of people can gain power and wealth. They've cut off our own supplies until such time they feel they will have free reign (and I do mean reign) and acquire complete control over not only the way we transport ourselves, but in absolutely every aspect of our lives. This is their goal.
Gotta go, ya' all.

772 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:44:13pm

re: #761 NYCHardhat

I'm glad I didn't start taking these.

Obama is the cause of my high blood pressure.

773 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:44:22pm

re: #770 Bagua

I recently read that Pickens Hedge Fund is down 97%, a near total loss if closed today, it is heavily invested in his solar and nat. gas ideas and at this point the only way it will regain its value is should his campaigning lead to government subsidy of his plans.

right...and he's trying to bilk Texas out of billions for his grid...Pickens only cares about Pickens...it's a scam beneath the surface

774 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:44:39pm
775 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:45:10pm

re: #770 Bagua

I recently read that Pickens Hedge Fund is down 97%, a near total loss if closed today, it is heavily invested in his solar and nat. gas ideas and at this point the only way it will regain its value is should his campaigning lead to government subsidy of his plans.

He only jumped on the bandwagon because he had made some investments that would have paid off handsomely if the guv'mint had gone the route he was angling for.

776 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:45:26pm
777 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:45:35pm

re: #770 Bagua

All energy is down in the recession. It's a great buying opportunity. "Pickens is a liar" is a little difficult to parse. Care to criticize any of his specific ideas?

[Link: www.pickensplan.com...]

778 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:45:46pm

re: #774 buzzsawmonkey

Not exactly; rather, he feels it should set forth, or be interpreted as setting forth, the government's broad powers to do things like redistribute wealth. He sees the government's job as enabling such a redistribution--he says so quite clearly in the upthread transcript--and he decries as "negative liberties" the civil rights which limit the government's power and thus prevent the government from acting in a broad an redistributive fashion.

In effect, that does outline the rights of the government, because it gives the government broad powers and even broader discretion to impose on the people whatever the government thinks is just, right, fair or equitable, rather than forcing the government to sit back, do its minimal job(s) as unobtrusively as possible, and trusting people to otherwise handle their own affairs, which is what the actual Constitution was modeled to do.

so basically you agree with my question then?

=P

779 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:46:16pm

re: #772 Harry Tuttle

Obama is the cause of my high blood pressure.

Shit. He is the cause of my weight gain, high blood pressure, firearm purchase, nervous twitch, shaky lip, penchant for scotch, and swamp ass.

780 rawmuse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:46:22pm

re: #761 NYCHardhat

I'm glad I didn't start taking these.

I take them, but not for heart issues, but for my eyesight, which, if I lose it, I am hosed. Cod liver oil capsules, twice a day.

781 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:46:23pm

re: #773 albusteve

right...and he's trying to bilk Texas out of billions for his grid...Pickens only cares about Pickens...it's a scam beneath the surface

He sure didn't hide it very well since it is common knowledge by a lot of people outside of Texas.

782 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:46:29pm

re: #775 FurryOldGuyJeans

He only jumped on the bandwagon because he had made some investments that would have paid off handsomely if the guv'mint had gone the route he was angling for.

of course, he plays the feds like a fiddle...he must be stroking right about now

783 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:46:31pm

re: #774 buzzsawmonkey

Not exactly; rather, he feels it should set forth, or be interpreted as setting forth, the government's broad powers to do things like redistribute wealth. He sees the government's job as enabling such a redistribution--he says so quite clearly in the upthread transcript--and he decries as "negative liberties" the civil rights which limit the government's power and thus prevent the government from acting in a broad an redistributive fashion.

In effect, that does outline the rights of the government, because it gives the government broad powers and even broader discretion to impose on the people whatever the government thinks is just, right, fair or equitable, rather than forcing the government to sit back, do its minimal job(s) as unobtrusively as possible, and trusting people to otherwise handle their own affairs, which is what the actual Constitution was modeled to do.

You mean that document that starts something like 'We the People of the United States'?

784 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:46:34pm

re: #767 quickjustice

Stay away from my package! ;-) And the 100-year-old NYC subway system is electric. In fact, it consumes 1/3 of all electricity in NYC.

uhhhh, no. and the alligators in the sewers, again, no.

785 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:46:37pm
786 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:47:03pm

re: #751 buzzsawmonkey

A "negative liberty" is a "thou shalt not"; in Obama's view, the government being proscribed from unreasonable searches and seizures is a "negative liberty" because it says what cannot be done, rather than what can be done. Saying "you shall not discriminate in voting" is a negative liberty because it prevents discrimination rather than providing, say, redress or reparation for prior grievance. Saying that the government cannot deprive a citizen of property without due process of law is a negative liberty, because it restricts the government; and, as he mournfully notes, there is nothing which affirmatively says that the government can take a citizen's property to give to someone else in order to further somebody's notion of justice.

In other words, a "negative liberty" as Obama uses the term is a disparaging view of the civil rights which are intended to protect the individual's actual liberty from the officious interference of government do-gooders. Those pesky "negative liberties" are a roadblock to his human rights vision of "positive" liberties, i.e., the benefits that he believes it is the function of the government to provide.

Which is funny because much of the bill of rights, if he reads it, is full of double negatives.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

787 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:47:26pm

re: #780 rawmuse

I take them, but not for heart issues, but for my eyesight, which, if I lose it, I am hosed. Cod liver oil capsules, twice a day.

They help with eyesight?

788 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:47:52pm

re: #786 Hengineer

and double negatives, as you know = positive

tada!

789 rawmuse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:48:25pm

re: #787 NYCHardhat

They help with eyesight?

Yes, they are rich in Vitamin D.

790 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:48:39pm

re: #744 Naso Tang

Many assume neutron = reactor.

A few slow neutrons created by some so far unknown process in a jar aren't going to fuse anything together. It's interesting theoretically, but there is absolutely nothing that suggests how it can be scaled to
create power.

Your criticism is true and, yet, invalid.

How many great advances in science started as an "unknown process in a jar"? So it won't power my car next week -- that doesn't mean it's not worthwhile.

791 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:48:44pm

re: #781 FurryOldGuyJeans

He sure didn't hide it very well since it is common knowledge by a lot of people outside of Texas.

I have friends over there that are furious with that whole gig...he wants to become Power Czar of the Metroplex

792 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:49:06pm

re: #776 Iron Fist

There are two factors that I look at before I simply write off the Global Warmist as a kook: are they pro-nuclear power, and do they think China and India need to be taken into account or have any restrictions placed on them to combat this "global crisis" we are facing. Certainly, the entire Kyoto Accord can be scrapped as being simply kooks being kooks. They had all kinds of novel experimentation they wanted to perform with the American economy, but China and India were free to continue growing their economies.

yep

793 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:49:11pm

re: #790 Cognito

Your criticism is true and, yet, invalid.

How many great advances in science started as an "unknown process in a jar"? So it won't power my car next week -- that doesn't mean it's not worthwhile.

Zero Point Energy denier!

/S

794 HelloDare  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:49:16pm
795 pink freud  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:49:46pm

re: #772 Harry Tuttle

Omega 3 fatty acids lower cortisol levels and reduce anxiety. High cortisol levels result in chronic stress. Chronic stress takes a high toll on our bodies - and minds - in many ways.

796 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:50:16pm

re: #795 pink freud

Omega 3 fatty acids lower cortisol levels and reduce anxiety. High cortisol levels result in chronic stress. Chronic stress takes a high toll on our bodies - and minds - in many ways.

Toxic Fat is a good book

I found it very interesting..

797 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:50:27pm

re: #757 Hengineer

Wait a sec, so Obama thinks the Constitution should be a document which outlines the rights of the government, and not the people?

What?

No, Obama thinks that that positive liberties are the things that should be dealt with. He knows that the Constitution is not written from that point of view, but he thinks he can take control of the economy and then the rest will fall into lines. He knows he can't attack the Constitution directly, so he goes at it indirectly. Classic Alinsky strategy.

798 Bagua  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:51:06pm

re: #777 quickjustice

I agree that all energy is down in the recession, also, I never called Pickens a liar, what I am saying is that he stands to gain tremendously should his plan be subsidised by the government, (I already pay a monthly tax on my electric bill because of some Pickens supported legislation.)

Also, most energy is not down 97%, that is because Pickens has bet heavy on a solar development near his ranch, stranded far from any market. This may not be a very good buy at any price, unless he gets government subsidy.

799 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:51:07pm

re: #770 Bagua

I recently read that Pickens Hedge Fund is down 97%, a near total loss if closed today, it is heavily invested in his solar and nat. gas ideas and at this point the only way it will regain its value is should his campaigning lead to government subsidy of his plans.

i heard pickens on the imus show. i think it was today.
he said he would be meeting later w/ his "good friend",
algore.

800 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:51:15pm

re: #791 albusteve

I have friends over there that are furious with that whole gig...he wants to become Power Czar of the Metroplex

Every time I see or hear Pickens I can't help but think of the "temporary" Tennessee Valley Authority.

801 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:51:23pm

re: #789 rawmuse

Yes, they are rich in Vitamin D.

I should look into that then. I've had glasses since I was 2.

802 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:51:27pm
803 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:52:21pm

re: #795 pink freud

Omega 3 fatty acids lower cortisol levels and reduce anxiety. High cortisol levels result in chronic stress. Chronic stress takes a high toll on our bodies - and minds - in many ways.

Well in truth I do take the fish pills because, and I have tried, I can't stand to eat fish.

Why can't they feed the fish pills to pigs I ask?

804 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:52:39pm

re: #784 brookly red

Check out [Link: www.todaysengineer.org...]

"Today, the NYC Subway is the city’s largest user of electricity. AC operates signals, station and tunnel lighting, ventilation and miscellaneous line equipment, while DC operates trains and such auxiliary equipment as water pumps and emergency lighting. The system’s 215 electric substations receive high- and low-voltage power from the New York Power Authority, at voltages as high as 27kV AC, prior to transforming it for use within the system. The subway's third rail requires 625 volts DC for operating the trains. Power is distributed throughout the system via 2,500 miles of cable, which passes beneath 7,651 manholes located throughout the city. The power required to operate the subway system during peak hours is about 500 MW. And at 1.8 billion kilowatt hours, the subway’s annual power consumption equals that of the city of Buffalo, New York."

805 rawmuse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:53:09pm

re: #801 NYCHardhat

I should look into that then. I've had glasses since I was 2.

I used to wear glasses, and now do not.
It may or may not be attributable to diet.
Maybe my whole head got bigger, and pulled my eyes in to focus...

806 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:53:18pm

re: #802 buzzsawmonkey

Basically, Obama's statements in the radio transcript point out clearly that "human rights"--which Obama believes in--are antithetical to the civil rights which safeguard liberty in the United States.

That fundamental disconnect--that Obama does not believe in the civil rights which the Constitution enshrines, but wishes to use the Constitution to impose a "human rights" regime--is what worries me far more than the mountains of debt.

I wonder what he'll use as his battle standard, perhaps the UN Human Rights Declaration?

807 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:53:32pm

re: #802 buzzsawmonkey

Basically, Obama's statements in the radio transcript point out clearly that "human rights"--which Obama believes in--are antithetical to the civil rights which safeguard liberty in the United States.

That fundamental disconnect--that Obama does not believe in the civil rights which the Constitution enshrines, but wishes to use the Constitution to impose a "human rights" regime--is what worries me far more than the mountains of debt.

The entirety of what teh (sic) O proposes is antithetical to America and American Democracy.

808 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:53:55pm

re: #803 Harry Tuttle

Well in truth I do take the fish pills because, and I have tried, I can't stand to eat fish.

Why can't they feed the fish pills to pigs I ask?

I take flax seed pills

also full of Omega-3 fatty acids.

809 Pietr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:55:15pm

re: #726 JCM

New buildings are chilling water reservoirs at night when the rates are low. Then using the chilled water during the day for cooling.

Actually this is a Heat pump solution-the warmed water is then sent to the roof, to gain heat for other uses, thereby making it a dual system. It isn't 100% effiicient, but it heats and cools the building, and supplies hot and cold water. There are various designs for this.......

810 monkeytime  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:55:28pm

re: #772 Harry Tuttle

Obama is the cause of my high blood pressure.

See # 766 for help!

811 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:55:52pm

re: #774 buzzsawmonkey

Not exactly; rather, he feels it should set forth, or be interpreted as setting forth, the government's broad powers to do things like redistribute wealth. He sees the government's job as enabling such a redistribution--he says so quite clearly in the upthread transcript--and he decries as "negative liberties" the civil rights which limit the government's power and thus prevent the government from acting in a broad an redistributive fashion.

In effect, that does outline the rights of the government, because it gives the government broad powers and even broader discretion to impose on the people whatever the government thinks is just, right, fair or equitable, rather than forcing the government to sit back, do its minimal job(s) as unobtrusively as possible, and trusting people to otherwise handle their own affairs, which is what the actual Constitution was modeled to do.

Would you argue that social programs are unconstitutional?

812 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:55:57pm

re: #800 FurryOldGuyJeans

Every time I see or hear Pickens I can't help but think of the "temporary" Tennessee Valley Authority.

really all my stuff is word of mouth...but everyone I know in the Dallas area is way more up to speed on oil and gas and energy than normal...these people know their shit...they grew up with it and can smell a rat miles away...I'm a hick from NM

813 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:56:06pm

Just thinking about Euna Lee and Laura Ling.

A prayer for them, in North Korea.

814 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:56:29pm

re: #808 Hengineer

I take flax seed pills

also full of Omega-3 fatty acids.

Omega-3 rich proscuitto? Would that work?

815 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:56:29pm

re: #807 FurryOldGuyJeans

The entirety of what teh (sic) O proposes is antithetical to America and American Democracy.

He knows this. He think America should be remade to his standards. Our challenge is making sure people understand why it should not be remade.

816 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:56:30pm

re: #799 nyc redneck

Pickens told my group he's a friend of Gore's, but added that he's also told Gore he disagrees with his priorities. Unlike Gore, Pickens's top priority is energy independence, or reduced dependence on foreign energy.

817 Bagua  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:56:37pm

The problem with Pickens is in part the problem with Solar, its just not very economical with present technology. It sounds great, but doesn't pay off, besides destabilizing the grid, thus requiring conventional backup generation, it simply doesn't make sense economically. Wind farms are in reality just subsidy farms at the present time. Add to this is Pickens insistance on locating his Wind/Subsidy farms near his massive ranch, (though he refuses to site them on his own property) being in the panhandle, he needs the taxpayers to finance billions of dollars of transmission lines and massive amounts of property condemned, all to produce power that could be done for far less money and effort using conventional means.

818 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:56:52pm

re: #813 Cognito

Just thinking about Euna Lee and Laura Ling.

A prayer for them, in North Korea.

Amen,,, for once I 100% agree with you

819 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:57:01pm
820 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:57:31pm

Looking through the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights...one wonders at it.

Article 23.

* (1) Everyone has the right to work, to free choice of employment, to just and favourable conditions of work and to protection against unemployment.
* (2) Everyone, without any discrimination, has the right to equal pay for equal work.
* (3) Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection.
* (4) Everyone has the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests.

In Article 23, does it seem that Line 4 contradicts Line 1? The way trade Unions behave, it seems that it does.

821 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:57:53pm
822 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:58:12pm
Article 25.

* (1) Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.
* (2) Motherhood and childhood are entitled to special care and assistance. All children, whether born in or out of wedlock, shall enjoy the same social protection.

Obama takes his cue from Article 25

823 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:58:24pm

re: #817 Bagua

that's it in a nutshell...Pickens is all about himself

824 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:58:43pm

re: #809 Pietr

Actually this is a Heat pump solution-the warmed water is then sent to the roof, to gain heat for other uses, thereby making it a dual system. It isn't 100% effiicient, but it heats and cools the building, and supplies hot and cold water. There are various designs for this.......

The savings is heating/cooling the reservoir during off peak times, paying the lower rates.

When I redo my heating cooling here at home, I'll put in a geothermal heat pump.

825 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:58:43pm
826 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:59:04pm

re: #817 Bagua

To the extent Pickens is self-dealing, it's appropriate to be skeptical of him. I'm more interested in his macro-argument, which is that we've become dangerously dependent on foreign energy that is in the hands of our enemies.

827 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:59:21pm

The best solution we have is actually fission reactors with ceramic encased fuel pellets.

For a fraction of the bail out, we could have provided thousands of jobs, cut our emissions enormously and dramatically reduced our need for Arab oil. We got both the Republican and the Democratic version of a bailout instead.

While we could have been building those reactors we could have also been giving incentives to switch to electric vehicles and researching fusion.

But then again, it seems so much more attractive to send billions to people who want to kill us whilst polluting the environment and contributing to warming...

828 pink freud  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:59:38pm

re: #822 Hengineer

Insanity.

829 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 5:59:45pm

Did you know that "Easy Cheese" is an excellent source of calcium? Says so, right here on the can.

830 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:00:30pm

re: #828 pink freud

Insanity.

BO is going down...bet on it

831 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:00:34pm

re: #829 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Did you know that "Easy Cheese" is an excellent source of calcium? Says so, right here on the can.

Isn't that the stuff that also was never made from any cows whatsoever? :)

832 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:00:42pm
Article 29.

* (1) Everyone has duties to the community in which alone the free and full development of his personality is possible.
* (2) In the exercise of his rights and freedoms, everyone shall be subject only to such limitations as are determined by law solely for the purpose of securing due recognition and respect for the rights and freedoms of others and of meeting the just requirements of morality, public order and the general welfare in a democratic society.
* (3) These rights and freedoms may in no case be exercised contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.

Check out the VERY LAST LINE

You are free to do as you wish AS LONG AS IT PLEASES THE UN. HEIL UN!

833 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:00:57pm

re: #819 buzzsawmonkey

It may factor in, but it's hardly necessary. People have become inured to such Trojan Horse phrases as "social justice" (which mean the opposite of what they appear to mean) over the past few decades.

Calling for income redistribution as "a matter of justice" will pass muster with all too many people who either do not understand what the phrases mean; do understand, but feel compelled to go along out of guilt; or stand to benefit.

"who either do not understand what the phrases mean;"

You mean like "

(how Obama got elected).

834 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:01:21pm

re: #827 LudwigVanQuixote

....or paying for some dumbass exec bonuses..... now THAT'S really attractive

/

835 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:01:24pm

re: #829 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

And cutting the cheese is an excellent source of flatulence. It's capturing that flatulence, and putting it to good use that's the problem.

836 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:01:46pm

re: #804 quickjustice

During peak hours, the subways have twice the population of Buffalo...
but 1/3 the power usage in a city of 8 million ? I don't think so. But hey let's say you are right... it is well spent.

837 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:01:54pm

re: #831 LudwigVanQuixote

Free Range Easy Cheese.

838 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:01:57pm

re: #829 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Did you know that "Easy Cheese" is an excellent source of calcium? Says so, right here on the can.

So? I've had Minute Maid Orange Juice that was an excellent source of calcium.

your serve.

839 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:02:15pm

re: #831 LudwigVanQuixote

Isn't that the stuff that also was never made from any cows whatsoever? :)

You mean cheese food made from vegetable oil ain't from cows?!?

840 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:02:32pm

re: #827 LudwigVanQuixote

The best solution we have is actually fission reactors with ceramic encased fuel pellets.

For a fraction of the bail out, we could have provided thousands of jobs, cut our emissions enormously and dramatically reduced our need for Arab oil. We got both the Republican and the Democratic version of a bailout instead.

While we could have been building those reactors we could have also been giving incentives to switch to electric vehicles and researching fusion.

But then again, it seems so much more attractive to send billions to people who want to kill us whilst polluting the environment and contributing to warming...

The problem remains overcoming intense opposition to anything nuclear. The only way to build such plants would be with a PR campaign designed to showcase their benefits. I won't 'we' on this one, because we here can't make it happen: the kind of campaign needed would need deep pockets and would have to more media blitz than grassroots.

841 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:02:48pm

I don't know about you.... but I feel some weeping coming on.... say.... what is that toll free number to the government?

842 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:02:55pm

re: #835 quickjustice

And cutting the cheese is an excellent source of flatulence. It's capturing that flatulence, and putting it to good use that's the problem.

Here. Pull my finger.

843 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:03:17pm

re: #836 brookly red

You may be right, and my percentage too high. Let me check total consumption.

844 UncleRancher  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:03:25pm

The following has been attributed to State Representative Mitchell Aye from GA. This guy should run for President one day...

"We the sensible people of the United States, in an attempt to help everyone get along, restore some semblance of justice, avoid more riots, keep our nation safe, promote positive behavior, and secure the blessings of debt-free liberty to ourselves and our great-great-great-grandchildren, hereby try one more time to ordain and establish some common sense guidelines for the terminally whiny, guilt ridden, delusional, and other Liberal bed-wetters.

We hold these truths to be self evident: that a whole lot of people are confused by the Bill of Rights and are so dim they require a Bill of NON-Rights."

ARTICLE I
You do not have the right to a new car, big screen TV, or any other form of wealth. More power to you if you can legally acquire them, but No one is guaranteeing anything.

ARTICLE II
You do not have the right to never be offended. This country is Based on freedom, and that means freedom for everyone -- not just you! You may leave the room, turn the channel, express a different opinion, etc.; But the world is full of idiots, and probably always will be.

ARTICLE III
You do not have the right to be free from harm. If you stick a screwdriver in your eye, learn to be more careful, do not expect the tool Manufacturer to make you and all your relatives independently wealthy.

ARTICLE IV
You do not have the right to free food and housing. Americans are the most charitable people to be found, and will gladly help anyone in need, but we are quickly growing weary of subsidizing generation after generation of professional couch potatoes who achieve nothing more than the Creation of another generation of professional couch potatoes. (This one is my pet peeve...get an education and go to work .. don't expect everyone else to take care of you!)

ARTICLE V
You do not have the right to free health care. That would be nice, but from the looks of public housing, we're just not interested in public health care.

ARTICLE VI
You do not have the right to physically harm other people. If you kidnap, rape, intentionally maim, or kill someone, don't be surprised if the rest of us want to see you fry in the electric chair.

ARTICLE VII
You do not have the right to the possessions of others. If you rob, cheat, or coerce away the goods or services of other citizens, don't be surprised if the rest of us get together and lock you away in a place where you still won't have the right to a big screen color TV or a life of leisure.

ARTICLE VIII
You do not have the right to a job. All of us sure want you to have a job, and will gladly help you along in hard times, but we expect you to take advantage of the opportunities of education and vocational training laid before you to make yourself useful. (AMEN!)

ARTICLE IX
You do not have the right to happiness. Being an American means that you have the right to PURSUE happiness, which by the way, is a lot easier if you are unencumbered by an over abundance of idiotic laws created by those of you who were confused by the Bill of Rights.

ARTICLE X
This is an English speaking country. We don't care where you are from, English is our language. Learn it or go back to wherever you came from! (lastly....)

ARTICLE XI
You do not have the right to change our country's history or heritage. This country was founded on the belief in God. And yet, you are given the freedom to believe in any religion, any faith, or no faith at all; with no fear of persecution. The phrase IN GOD WE TRUST is part of our heritage and history, and if you are uncomfortable with it, TOUGH!

845 pink freud  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:03:25pm

re: #830 albusteve

I'm not yet ready to concede that. You take 20 million illegals who slurp that stuff down, add to that the exploding welfare rolls, the 0-voters who think government is mommy and daddy, and what's left? The old timers who were raised to believe in self sufficiency and individuality? The numbers are against it.

846 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:03:35pm

re: #842 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

hey ,,, you coming to Atlanta this week?

847 monkeytime  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:03:58pm

re: #832 Hengineer

Check out the VERY LAST LINE

You are free to do as you wish AS LONG AS IT PLEASES THE UN. HEIL UN!

Exactly so. They are idiots. So does Syria follow these UN guidelines? Does anyone give a shit what the UN says? Oh wait - I can think of "O"ne person. What a joke.

848 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:04:05pm

re: #840 Dark_Falcon

The problem remains overcoming intense opposition to anything nuclear. The only way to build such plants would be with a PR campaign designed to showcase their benefits. I won't 'we' on this one, because we here can't make it happen: the kind of campaign needed would need deep pockets and would have to more media blitz than grassroots.

even if "The One" publicly and gushingly endorsed it?

849 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:04:23pm

re: #841 windhorse

I don't know about you.... but I feel some weeping coming on.... say.... what is that toll free number to the government?

1-800-BND-OVER

850 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:04:34pm

I think Obama should have a call-in program every Wednesday night called "Dear President" on some FM station..... with groovy music.... he could talk us all through our personal crises..... he could you know.... he could....

851 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:04:37pm

re: #839 FurryOldGuyJeans

You mean cheese food made from vegetable oil ain't from cows?!?

well the vegetables used to make the oil were grow in cow poop...

852 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:04:52pm

re: #840 Dark_Falcon

The problem remains overcoming intense opposition to anything nuclear. The only way to build such plants would be with a PR campaign designed to showcase their benefits. I won't 'we' on this one, because we here can't make it happen: the kind of campaign needed would need deep pockets and would have to more media blitz than grassroots.

it will happen one way or another...our culture will not just die from a lack of something so fundamental and easy to produce as electricity...BO will fail and we can get on with our survival

853 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:04:57pm

he's the President man....

854 horse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:05:01pm

re: #386 eon

I got a "kick" out of the redeployed 16"/50 cal. battleship gun turrets on the ship. If you can't have heavy-cycle directed-energy weapons, and you want to do some serious damage, even in a guided-missile environment a set of big honkin' guns are still pretty effective.

/comparatively cheap, too.

cheers

eon

Indeed, sometimes good ol' kinetic energy one ton slugs are all that is needed to stop an enemy. Additionally, the mix of the classic 16" cannons with the futuristic gamma ray lasers powered by the same nuclear explosions used for propulsion gave them the versatile option of either killing the enemy ships or killing the beings inside them.

855 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:05:19pm

re: #846 sattv4u2

I am here. In Norcross. Can't you smell me?

856 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:05:26pm

I thought he meant "freedom from want" and "freedom from fear"

857 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:05:40pm

re: #850 windhorse

I think Obama should have a call-in program every Wednesday night called "Dear President" on some FM station..... with groovy music.... he could talk us all through our personal crises..... he could you know.... he could....

"and this next tune goes out to Malik, from your boo!"

858 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:05:48pm

re: #841 windhorse

I don't know about you.... but I feel some weeping coming on.... say.... what is that toll free number to the government?

don't show vulnerability. they will put you on a list.
pick a private therapist.
i'm only half joking.

859 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:05:48pm

re: #854 horse

Indeed, sometimes good ol' kinetic energy one ton slugs are all that is needed to stop an enemy. Additionally, the mix of the classic 16" cannons with the futuristic gamma ray lasers powered by the same nuclear explosions used for propulsion gave them the versatile option of either killing the enemy ships or killing the beings inside them.

Chuck Norris could kill them with his thumb.

860 Bagua  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:05:55pm

re: #826 quickjustice

To the extent Pickens is self-dealing, it's appropriate to be skeptical of him. I'm more interested in his macro-argument, which is that we've become dangerously dependent on foreign energy that is in the hands of our enemies.

I agree, dependence on foreign is a massive problem. Part of the danger of Pickens, and the whole "alternatives" argument, is that it addresses a very real problem, but with expensive and futile responses that do not fix the problem, instead, they act as distractions and waste our money and efforts.

We could be completely energy independent in short order if we pursued the correct remedies.

861 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:06:07pm

re: #855 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I am here. In Norcross. Can't you smell me?

You Fat (V) Bastard~

862 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:06:19pm

re: #850 windhorse

I think Obama should have a call-in program every Wednesday night called "Dear President" on some FM station..... with groovy music.... he could talk us all through our personal crises..... he could you know.... he could....

And the best part is we don't have to see him reading from a teleprompter!

863 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:06:38pm

re: #790 Cognito

Your criticism is true and, yet, invalid.

How many great advances in science started as an "unknown process in a jar"? So it won't power my car next week -- that doesn't mean it's not worthwhile.

I didn't say that. I said there is nothing in this discovery, which is unexplained at this time, that suggests how to turn it into power. The term "Cold Fusion" is cute, but it is also self contradictory as far as a source of energy goes.

864 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:06:51pm

re: #845 pink freud

I'm not yet ready to concede that. You take 20 million illegals who slurp that stuff down, add to that the exploding welfare rolls, the 0-voters who think government is mommy and daddy, and what's left? The old timers who were raised to believe in self sufficiency and individuality? The numbers are against it.

laws can easily be stricken...anything can be undone

865 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:07:03pm

re: #830 albusteve

BO is going down...bet on it

Hillary was anointed and crowned as the POTUS just as assuredly before the Messiah-King announced his ascension.

866 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:07:14pm

re: #855 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I am here. In Norcross. Can't you smell me?

You here all week? Will you have time for lunch Thursday or Friday? (those are my days off)

867 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:07:25pm

I apologize if this was posted before, but my favorite line was:

“Al Gore’s just an opportunist. The person who is really responsible for this overestimate of global warming is Jim Hansen. He consistently exaggerates all the dangers.”

Algore is a private citizen and can be an asshole. But why the hell are our tax dollars still being used to keep Jim Hansen at NASA?

868 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:07:37pm

re: #865 FurryOldGuyJeans

Hillary was anointed and crowned as the POTUS just as assuredly before the Messiah-King announced his ascension.

Makes you wonder about her motives as she goes about acting as the SecState.

869 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:07:42pm

re: #855 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I am here. In Norcross. Can't you smell me?

what?...feces again?

870 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:07:53pm

Thank You Charles for Printing this one. This guy Dyson is the Scientific version of Christopher Hitchens, opinionated YES - AND - Not a Lemming.
Basically, Man HAS done some Crummy Things to the Environment - We Have Also Become Aware of them and taken measures to reduce impact, Especially in the WEALTHIER Nations. AGW and the CO2 Theories go beyond that. They are - More or Less - A Religion, without a G-d in the Conventional Sense, unless one includes "GAIA." De-Forestation IS an Environmental Problem - AND - is easily solved by planting TREES to replace those cut down. Actually, can NOT get TREES out of my mind - as a child in single digit years, I remember being encouraged to contribute pennies into a Blue and White Metal Box to Plant Trees in "Eretz Yisroel." Knowingly or not, those old Zionists Had It Right. Growing up "Center Left" - we also collected pennies on Halloween for UNICEF in the Orange Paper Boxes. I would like to think BOTH helped.
As for the "Wit and Wisdom" of Professor Obama - Bet He Had a LOT of Wit - WISDOM - Not So Much - I hereby CHALLENGE the US President to DEBATE ME, YES MOI, about the the Incorporation Doctrine of the 14th Amendment as it affects the States. HE WILL LOSE in ANY FAIR DEBATE.
Yes Mr. President - I Challenge YOU - with ONE and only ONE Caveat - NO TELEPROMPTER or either of us.
Mr. President - YOU were raised with the ATTITUDE that YOU were put down by "THE MAN" - I WAS TOO! I am Jewish, Blond and Blue Eyed - Few knew I was a "White 'N'" - Well Disguised. I heard a LOT of Ugly Stuff when I was a "Kid" - Bet'cha (Copywright, Gov. SARAH PALIN) I heard more POOP than all 'y'all heard in Hawaii growing up. I learned a response - fighting back - with fists and anything in my hand. I have a slightly bent nose from it - as do my opponents. We'all learned equality - if not congruence, that way. I TOO "taught Law" - for Seton Hall University Law School. I taught Law to Pay off Student Loans. Legal Research - "by The Colors" - a WAY Practical Way to do research - before the Internet. Mr. President, bet all 'y'all never HAD to teach anything to pay off Student Loan Debts.
I TOO - was a Leftist - I Grew Up - When Will You? That is all.

-S-

871 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:08:14pm

re: #869 albusteve

what?...feces again?

Tell the monkeys to stop playing catch, they ran out of balls.

872 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:08:45pm

re: #867 Unakite

I apologize if this was posted before, but my favorite line was:

“Al Gore’s just an opportunist. The person who is really responsible for this overestimate of global warming is Jim Hansen. He consistently exaggerates all the dangers.”

Algore is a private citizen and can be an asshole. But why the hell are our tax dollars still being used to keep Jim Hansen at NASA?

Because he makes cute furry muppets?
Oh, Jim Hanson, not Henson

873 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:09:16pm

re: #848 Hengineer

even if "The One" publicly and gushingly endorsed it?

Even then there would still be considerable resistance thanks to the decades long vilification.

Not that teh (sic) Messiah-King would ever propose Nuclear Energy as a viable alternative energy source.

874 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:09:19pm

Is this Dyson guy got anything to do with the vacuum cleaner thing?

I'm sorry I really don't know.

I'm guessing no.

875 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:09:20pm

re: #861 sattv4u2

I know I started it, but I don't think I'll be able to get in on a meet up. My Schedule appears to be FUBARBAB...and this is a pretty freaking large town. I think everyone is 30 miles away...in Atlanta time, what is that, a 45 minute drive? Or a 4.5 hour drive?

876 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:09:36pm

re: #865 FurryOldGuyJeans

Hillary was anointed and crowned as the POTUS just as assuredly before the Messiah-King announced his ascension.

the MSM will go down with him...that's the only differece between the two...I really believe it...BO is dirt

877 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:09:38pm

re: #871 Hengineer

Tell the monkeys to stop playing catch, they ran out of balls.

monkey balls!?!?!

Image: MonkeyBallsItchcopy.jpg

878 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:10:27pm

re: #875 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I know I started it, but I don't think I'll be able to get in on a meet up. My Schedule appears to be FUBARBAB...and this is a pretty freaking large town. I think everyone is 30 miles away...in Atlanta time, what is that, a 45 minute drive? Or a 4.5 hour drive?

I can be in Norcross from home in about 30 minutes (back roads, and i'm on the same side of town)

879 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:10:27pm

re: #858 nyc redneck

(I was being facetious....) Don't worry, Obama and his Admin do not understand the meaning of the word.... cuz if they did.... oh - nevermind.....

880 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:10:40pm

re: #848 Hengineer

even if "The One" publicly and gushingly endorsed it?

If Obama endorsed it, it could be done since he could overcome much of the resistance. I doubt he will do so.

881 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:10:52pm

re: #877 sattv4u2

monkey balls!?!?!

[Link: media.photobucket.com...]

Blue Ones!

882 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:11:22pm

re: #13 buzzsawmonkey

Too many people, alas, have too much invested in spooking the sheep to listen to sense.

I think the scary thing is that there are so many sheep to be spooked.

883 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:11:56pm
884 hazzyday  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:12:47pm

Dyson, very well thought out, perceptive and wise.

885 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:13:26pm

re: #874 Harry Tuttle

Is this Dyson guy got anything to do with the vacuum cleaner thing?

I'm sorry I really don't know.

I'm guessing no.

Maybe he sells chickens on the side?

886 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:13:28pm

re: #870 Dr. Shalit

i'll buy a ticket to see you smack him down.
:)

887 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:13:37pm

re: #883 buzzsawmonkey

There's gold in that there fleecing.

Knox it off!

888 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:13:46pm

re: #878 sattv4u2

Cool! Didn't know. I had to go down to Lithonia today, took back roads...took me an hour to go down (20 miles) took me 25 minutes to get back. How the hell do you people keep schedules down here?

889 Aviator  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:13:50pm

re: #885 Aviator

Wait, thats Tyson.

890 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:14:10pm

Larry Kudlow on Obama's economic actions:

A ‘Truly Breathtaking’ Departure

891 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:14:27pm

re: #887 Hengineer

Knox it off!

I gotta pan that pun

892 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:14:56pm

re: #888 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Cool! Didn't know. I had to go down to Lithonia today, took back roads...took me an hour to go down (20 miles) took me 25 minutes to get back. How the hell do you people keep schedules down here?

It's the south ,,, they don't!

893 jdog29  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:15:02pm

Producer/Provider: Now that things have gotten so tough financially and I'm having to work 3 jobs to maintain my standard of living, my life is like wake up, work, go to bed, wake up, work, go to bed.

Leech/Parasite: I know what you mean, ever since I've been unemployed it's like I'm in some sort of time continuum. It's Jan. 1st, Feb. 1st, Mar. 1st. It's just brutal.

894 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:15:08pm

re: #874 Harry Tuttle

Is this Dyson guy got anything to do with the vacuum cleaner thing?

I'm sorry I really don't know.

I'm guessing no.

Vacuum cleaners?

Those things are DANGEROUS!

Woman burned by exploding vacuum

895 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:15:25pm

re: #879 windhorse

i was being facetious too.
:)

896 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:15:45pm

re: #888 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

so seriously, how long are you "here"? I'll come out and meet you Thursday or Friday

897 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:15:53pm

re: #840 Dark_Falcon

The problem remains overcoming intense opposition to anything nuclear. The only way to build such plants would be with a PR campaign designed to showcase their benefits. I won't 'we' on this one, because we here can't make it happen: the kind of campaign needed would need deep pockets and would have to more media blitz than grassroots.

You are of course correct. The public needs to be educated on how fission reactions work and they need to understand that it is possible to build a reactor that is incapable of melting down with the new ceramics.

You would also need to fight through those members of congress who are wholly bought and paid for by the oil lobbies.

898 albusteve  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:15:57pm

re: #890 Dark_Falcon

Larry Kudlow on Obama's economic actions:

A ‘Truly Breathtaking’ Departure

I wish he'd run for office...I'm a big fan of his

899 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:15:59pm

Obamare: #895 nyc redneck

I fingered so.....

900 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:16:00pm

re: #894 JCM

Vacuum cleaners?

Those things are DANGEROUS!

Woman burned by exploding vacuum

Bush's fault!

901 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:16:03pm

re: #889 Aviator

Wait, thats Tyson.

You're right, never mind.

:-)

902 jdog29  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:16:28pm

looks like someone got "out facetioused"

903 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:17:12pm

re: #896 sattv4u2

I'm here until Saturday. I'm bluing my nic...shoot me an email...I'll email back my phone number....

904 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:18:07pm

re: #890 Dark_Falcon

Larry Kudlow on Obama's economic actions:

A ‘Truly Breathtaking’ Departure

Wow, a lot of banks now want to pay BACK already received monies, but the government is refusing to allow that while simultaneously shoving more money at them. O and Geithner want to nationalize and socialize the economy before any blowback can erupt.

905 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:18:56pm

re: #883 buzzsawmonkey

There's gold in that there fleecing.

Yes.

906 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:19:14pm

re: #834 windhorse

....or paying for some dumbass exec bonuses..... now THAT'S really attractive

/

I hear you... Despite what has been explained to me by my fellow lizards - and I do, I really do, understand that we can't renig on contracts - when I think about not just AIG but all of those billions that vanished in round one, I honestly want to go Madame Defarge on someone.

907 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:19:34pm

re: #904 FurryOldGuyJeans

Wow, a lot of banks now want to pay BACK already received monies, but the government is refusing to allow that while simultaneously shoving more money at them. O and Geithner want to nationalize and socialize the economy before any blowback can erupt.

I think you and everyone else saw this coming a year ago.

908 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:19:38pm

re: #904 FurryOldGuyJeans

Wow, a lot of banks now want to pay BACK already received monies, but the government is refusing to allow that while simultaneously shoving more money at them. O and Geithner want to nationalize and socialize the economy before any blowback can erupt.

That is my thought as well.

909 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:19:57pm

re: #887 Hengineer

Knox it off!

I'd pan that comment if I could.

910 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:20:03pm

re: #843 quickjustice

At peak, the NYC subway consumes 500 megawatts, and overall peak electricity consumption in NYC is 8800 megawatts. So you're correct: NYC's subway system only consumes five percent (5%) of overall electricity consumption in NYC at peak. My bad! :-(

911 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:20:13pm

re: #839 FurryOldGuyJeans

You mean cheese food made from vegetable oil ain't from cows?!?

I fear any "dairy" product that in reality is parve.

912 grandma  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:20:16pm

Global Warming, or Climate Change, whatever name you want to call the latest religion by, must be the fault of mankind. How else could such knowledgeable men maintain their arrogance, power and egos without having a devil to justify their environmental piety upon? They speak of greenhouse gases, primarily CO2, which every breathing animal on the planet exhales and every living plant produces during their day/night cycle. Then there’s methane, CH4, found in cow pies and probably every other form of fecal matter from every other animal. So maybe the environuts would have all animals and plants cease exhaling and sh*tting in the woods and fields. Maybe they’d put a cap-n-tax on that and limit exhaling and defecating to four hours a day, or else. So maybe they’re correct about the greenhouse gases. Maybe there’s just too much animal and human life on this planet for the planet to support. The planet is finite, after all. Maybe the planet is correcting that condition for us. Maybe we are helping the planet out with our political famines, wars, gangbang killings, drugs, ideological ethnic cleansing, cars, factories, power plants, etc. I don’t know.

Today I went to buy groceries. I was asked if I wanted plastic bags, paper, or did I want to buy canvas sacks to bring back next time. Plastic, I said, what do I care about 4 bags? I got the feeling, though, that I wasn’t being “green” enough. I got to thinking about that and had a brain fart. When my four children were babies, Proctor and Gamble hadn’t yet invented Pampers. I used cloth diapers. Each soiled diaper got cleaned off in the toilet, the waste flushed down and processed by a waste treatment facility, as it should be. It was a lot of work, cleaning off, soaking and washing those diapers. But that’s all we had.

Today, when I see the mommies take a soiled disposable diaper off the baby, wrap up the whole dirty package in the plastic covering, tape it closed, put it in a plastic bag, and then into the garbage can lined with another plastic bag, to go to the landfill, I wonder about this “being green” mentality. But somehow, I should feel guilty about using 4 plastic bags a week, none of which wind up containing human waste. I don’t even have a dog to pick up after and put that waste in a plastic bag and send to a landfill.

So call Grandma nuts, and let the beatings begin. So thanks for listening on this lovely SC evening, and have a nice day.

913 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:21:13pm

re: #891 albusteve

I gotta pan that pun

Dammit. Sorry, just caught up. Need to keep track of my placer.

914 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:21:45pm

re: #906 LudwigVanQuixote

Bush and Obama have gone down the wrong path imho.... both are wrong.... Bush is gone... too late... Obama.... please quit this nonsense.... let the chips fall where they may..... We're all "big boys".....

915 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:21:47pm

re: #907 NYCHardhat

I think you and everyone else saw this coming a year ago.

I am daily surprised at the sheer speed O is using to enact his Socialist takeover. No wonder the man is complaining about being tired after less than 100 days.

916 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:22:10pm

re: #894 JCM

Vacuum cleaners?

Those things are DANGEROUS!

Woman burned by exploding vacuum

Didn't read the article, but wouldn't a vacuum implode?

917 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:22:18pm

re: #914 windhorse

(quit ripping us off)

918 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:22:28pm

I heard that Al Gore left his lights on for Earth Hour.

919 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:22:58pm

re: #915 FurryOldGuyJeans

I am daily surprised at the sheer speed O is using to enact his Socialist takeover. No wonder the man is complaining about being tired after less than 100 days.

I thought he was going to use the old back door and try his stuff in his second term. I guess he realizes he has precious little time before we find out.

920 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:23:04pm

re: #916 Unakite

really..... the thing should have collapsed unceremoniusly.....

921 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:23:18pm

re: #912 grandma

Global Warming, or Climate Change, whatever name you want to call the latest religion by, must be the fault of mankind. How else could such knowledgeable men maintain their arrogance, power and egos without having a devil to justify their environmental piety upon? They speak of greenhouse gases, primarily CO2, which every breathing animal on the planet exhales and every living plant produces during their day/night cycle. Then there’s methane, CH4, found in cow pies and probably every other form of fecal matter from every other animal. So maybe the environuts would have all animals and plants cease exhaling and sh*tting in the woods and fields. Maybe they’d put a cap-n-tax on that and limit exhaling and defecating to four hours a day, or else. So maybe they’re correct about the greenhouse gases. Maybe there’s just too much animal and human life on this planet for the planet to support. The planet is finite, after all. Maybe the planet is correcting that condition for us. Maybe we are helping the planet out with our political famines, wars, gangbang killings, drugs, ideological ethnic cleansing, cars, factories, power plants, etc. I don’t know.

Today I went to buy groceries. I was asked if I wanted plastic bags, paper, or did I want to buy canvas sacks to bring back next time. Plastic, I said, what do I care about 4 bags? I got the feeling, though, that I wasn’t being “green” enough. I got to thinking about that and had a brain fart. When my four children were babies, Proctor and Gamble hadn’t yet invented Pampers. I used cloth diapers. Each soiled diaper got cleaned off in the toilet, the waste flushed down and processed by a waste treatment facility, as it should be. It was a lot of work, cleaning off, soaking and washing those diapers. But that’s all we had.

Today, when I see the mommies take a soiled disposable diaper off the baby, wrap up the whole dirty package in the plastic covering, tape it closed, put it in a plastic bag, and then into the garbage can lined with another plastic bag, to go to the landfill, I wonder about this “being green” mentality. But somehow, I should feel guilty about using 4 plastic bags a week, none of which wind up containing human waste. I don’t even have a dog to pick up after and put that waste in a plastic bag and send to a landfill.

So call Grandma nuts, and let the beatings begin. So thanks for listening on this lovely SC evening, and have a nice day.

No that's ok, true hippies wrap their babies in their old shirts anyway...

922 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:23:19pm

re: #915 FurryOldGuyJeans

I am daily surprised at the sheer speed O is using to enact his Socialist takeover. No wonder the man is complaining about being tired after less than 100 days.

ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS!

(yeah me 2).

923 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:23:20pm

re: #906 LudwigVanQuixote

Here's the reason to "go Madame Dafarge", or better the Red Queen ("Off with their heads!", figuratively speaking) on the Obama Adminstration:

[Link: michellemalkin.com...]

924 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:23:23pm

re: #912 grandma

I don't normally read any post over a paragraph long. Nice.

925 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:23:24pm

ooops (spelling)

926 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:23:59pm

re: #897 LudwigVanQuixote

You are of course correct. The public needs to be educated on how fission reactions work and they need to understand that it is possible to build a reactor that is incapable of melting down with the new ceramics.

You would also need to fight through those members of congress who are wholly bought and paid for by the oil lobbies.

We've been able to make one that can't melt down since the early 1960's.
The book on Project Orion that is mentioned above describes one. It has a fast negative temperature coefficient. They tested it by cutting off the cooling water; it shut down immediately, and did not melt.

927 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:24:01pm

Who has ODS?

928 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:24:19pm

re: #918 Afrocity

I heard that Al Gore left his lights on for Earth Hour.

Why should he be required to do anything that detracts from his opulent lifestyle, he is the High Priest and Profiteer of AGW/ACC after all.

Evening, beautiful lady, how goes your fine Chicago night? :)

{Afrocity}

929 Buster Bunny  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:24:42pm

re: #915 FurryOldGuyJeans

I am daily surprised at the sheer speed O is using to enact his Socialist takeover. No wonder the man is complaining about being tired after less than 100 days.

At the end of this whole 'term' if thats all it is, he's going to make National Socialism in Germany look like a picnic.

930 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:24:59pm

re: #916 Unakite

Didn't read the article, but wouldn't a vacuum implode?

It probably got something flammable inside and a spark from the motor set it off.
We need Mythbusters! Eventually, they'll use a stick of dynamite to blow it up.

931 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:25:02pm

re: #919 NYCHardhat

I thought he was going to use the old back door and try his stuff in his second term. I guess he realizes he has precious little time before we find out.

Yes but he likely is holding back. He knows he needs two terms to get SC appointments that the loon lib really wants.

This is the restrained version.

932 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:25:33pm

re: #919 NYCHardhat

NYC, did you see that you made Daily Kos along with myself and Steve?
Your comment was hilarious.

933 MandyManners  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:25:35pm

re: #909 Unakite

I'd pan that comment if I could.

Boy, you've got some nuggets.

934 formercorpsman  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:25:35pm

re: #904 FurryOldGuyJeans

I have to be brutally honest. Who the hell did not see that coming?

Seriously? I am more pissed by these so-called brilliant executives who swallowed that poison pill, even when their own financial health did not look so bad.

I guess it is due to the fact I am in 2 industries that are reimbursed from government sources, that just because you are paid for services rendered, does not mean the transaction ends there.

935 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:25:52pm
936 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:25:53pm

re: #914 windhorse

Bush and Obama have gone down the wrong path imho.... both are wrong.... Bush is gone... too late... Obama.... please quit this nonsense.... let the chips fall where they may..... We're all "big boys".....

As bad as Bush was concerning government spending, the alternatives, Gore and Kerry, were truly the pit of despair.

937 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:26:06pm

re: #916 Unakite

Didn't read the article, but wouldn't a vacuum implode?

I read the article. The battery exploded. We've seen that before with laptops.

938 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:26:20pm

re: #933 MandyManners

Boy, you've got some nuggets.

welcome mandy

939 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:26:22pm

re: #930 Kosh's Shadow

It probably got something flammable inside and a spark from the motor set it off.
We need Mythbusters! Eventually, they'll use a stick of dynamite to blow it up.

I like Mythbusters.

940 Racer X  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:26:33pm

re: #924 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

I don't normally read any post over a paragraph long. Nice.

Ha! Me neither. Forget a paragraph break and my eyes gloss over.

Grandma is in the right place.

941 quickjustice  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:26:36pm

re: #918 Afrocity

Years ago, I lived a few blocks from Gore in Nashville. That's a big house he's in.

942 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:26:44pm

re: #928 FurryOldGuyJeans

Evening handsome man.

{Furry}

Chicago is fine tonight.

943 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:26:52pm

re: #918 Afrocity

I heard that Al Gore left his lights on for Earth Hour.

Al Gores lights are on, but nobodies home!

944 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:27:11pm

re: #932 Afrocity

NYC, did you see that you made Daily Kos along with myself and Steve?
Your comment was hilarious.

No. What did I do? Link please?

945 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:27:25pm

re: #912 grandma

nice to see you grandma,
you are so right abt. the plastic disposable diapers.
look how easily people reach for those because of personal convenience
and to hell w/ the earth and going green.
those things will be studied by archaeologists in the coming yrs.
if we don't totally suffocate and destroy the planet w/ them.

946 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:27:45pm

re: #933 MandyManners

Boy, you've got some nuggets.

You think I've got nuggets, you should see my veins.

947 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:27:50pm

re: #874 Harry Tuttle

Is this Dyson guy got anything to do with the vacuum cleaner thing?

I'm sorry I really don't know.

I'm guessing no.

To the best of my knowledge, no relation. Certainly not the same guy.

[Link: en.wikipedia.org...]

948 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:28:00pm

re: #931 Harry Tuttle

Yes but he likely is holding back. He knows he needs two terms to get SC appointments that the loon lib really wants.

This is the restrained version.

Restrained version? Holy shit!

949 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:28:11pm

re: #916 Unakite

Didn't read the article, but wouldn't a vacuum implode?

Cordless vac, bad lot of rechargeable batteries.re: #932 Afrocity

NYC, did you see that you made Daily Kos along with myself and Steve?
Your comment was hilarious.

Quoted in Kos....
Your a "made" Lizard!

950 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:28:20pm

re: #821 buzzsawmonkey

It depends on the program and how it is configured. Some most certainly are; some not.

Every right carries a corresponding obligation, and to be effective every right must have a remedy.
If the test for whether a government program is unconstitutional is whether or not it has the effect of redistributing wealth, then one would have difficulty upholding any taxpayer funded program which confers a benefit on only some people.
If on the other hand there is nothing in the US Constitution which prohibits the government from redistributing wealth, then it will be decidedly difficult to successfully attack Obama's leftist agenda on Constitutional grounds.

951 Cognito  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:28:31pm

re: #763 IslandLibertarian

Solar and wind = Human needs?

................begging to be snarked............

You misunderstood the post. It was a response to someone else's assertion.

Snark? Better to be thorough, than fast.

952 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:28:33pm

re: #949 JCM

Quoted in Kos....
Your a "made" Lizard!

Bah... double up responses!

953 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:28:37pm

re: #949 JCM

Quoted in Kos....
Your a "made" Lizard!

Shit yeah!

954 nyc redneck  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:29:06pm

re: #918 Afrocity

I heard that Al Gore left his lights on for Earth Hour.

and the outside flood lights. lol
i heard it on hannity.

955 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:29:19pm

re: #922 Harry Tuttle

ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS! ODS!

(yeah me 2).

bom-bom, o-bam
banana fanna fo fom
me my mo-bama.

956 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:29:27pm

re: #948 NYCHardhat

Restrained version? Holy shit!

Hence all the talk about legalizing weed.

Coincidence?

957 formercorpsman  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:29:41pm

re: #949 JCM

Funny? Funny? What makes me so funny? I'm a funny guy?

958 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:29:47pm

re: #931 Harry Tuttle

Yes but he likely is holding back. He knows he needs two terms to get SC appointments that the loon lib really wants.

This is the restrained version.

SCOTUS Appointments. That would be the true death knell to the Republic.

959 Mirage  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:29:56pm

re: #844 UncleRancher

Ah, the Bill of No Rights. It's a keeper.

960 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:30:05pm

re: #956 Harry Tuttle

Hence all the talk about legalizing weed.

Coincidence?

Make the Wednesday night parties at the White House much more interesting.

961 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:30:19pm

re: #958 FurryOldGuyJeans

SCOTUS Appointments. That would be the true death knell to the Republic.

Mmmmmm. Yep.

962 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:30:34pm

re: #944 NYCHardhat

No. What did I do? Link please?

Daily Kos trashes LGF posters

963 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:30:40pm

re: #939 Unakite

I like Mythbusters.

I checked; they have a couple of submissions about whether vacuuming gunpowder will cause an explosion, so I hope they do it.

964 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:30:53pm

re: #912 grandma

Global Warming, or Climate Change, whatever name you want to call the latest religion by, must be the fault of mankind. How else could such knowledgeable men maintain their arrogance, power and egos without having a devil to justify their environmental piety upon? They speak of greenhouse gases, primarily CO2, which every breathing animal on the planet exhales and every living plant produces during their day/night cycle. Then there’s methane, CH4, found in cow pies and probably every other form of fecal matter from every other animal. So maybe the environuts would have all animals and plants cease exhaling and sh*tting in the woods and fields. Maybe they’d put a cap-n-tax on that and limit exhaling and defecating to four hours a day, or else. So maybe they’re correct about the greenhouse gases. Maybe there’s just too much animal and human life on this planet for the planet to support. The planet is finite, after all. Maybe the planet is correcting that condition for us. Maybe we are helping the planet out with our political famines, wars, gangbang killings, drugs, ideological ethnic cleansing, cars, factories, power plants, etc. I don’t know.

Today I went to buy groceries. I was asked if I wanted plastic bags, paper, or did I want to buy canvas sacks to bring back next time. Plastic, I said, what do I care about 4 bags? I got the feeling, though, that I wasn’t being “green” enough. I got to thinking about that and had a brain fart. When my four children were babies, Proctor and Gamble hadn’t yet invented Pampers. I used cloth diapers. Each soiled diaper got cleaned off in the toilet, the waste flushed down and processed by a waste treatment facility, as it should be. It was a lot of work, cleaning off, soaking and washing those diapers. But that’s all we had.

Today, when I see the mommies take a soiled disposable diaper off the baby, wrap up the whole dirty package in the plastic covering, tape it closed, put it in a plastic bag, and then into the garbage can lined with another plastic bag, to go to the landfill, I wonder about this “being green” mentality. But somehow, I should feel guilty about using 4 plastic bags a week, none of which wind up containing human waste. I don’t even have a dog to pick up after and put that waste in a plastic bag and send to a landfill.

So call Grandma nuts, and let the beatings begin. So thanks for listening on this lovely SC evening, and have a nice day.

So it's all about the shit?

965 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:31:06pm

re: #958 FurryOldGuyJeans

SCOTUS Appointments. That would be the true death knell to the Republic.

SCOTUS obsolete.

Power to the community organizers!

"Prepare to be judged!"
/dredd

966 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:31:15pm

re: #936 FurryOldGuyJeans

I agree..... talk about a couple of knuckleheads..... sorry to say, however, that GW really screwed up on many levels (that we will be paying for dearly for some time).

967 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:31:21pm

re: #824 JCM

The savings is heating/cooling the reservoir during off peak times, paying the lower rates.

When I redo my heating cooling here at home, I'll put in a geothermal heat pump.

My parents built a house with one of those 15 years ago. They were one of the first to do it so it was really expensive....but it's a 4500 sq ft house with one wall almost all windows, and they haven't had a utility bill over $200 a month. They keep the place really cold in the summer too, and it's in a hot summer climate.

968 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:31:32pm

re: #960 JCM

Make the Wednesday night parties at the White House much more interesting.

And a revenue generator. Win win.

969 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:31:35pm

So, I went by the store to get some beer and snacks...18.00 for a 30 PACK of Coors Light. A FREAKIN' 30 PACK!

i got one.

970 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:32:00pm

re: #963 Kosh's Shadow

I checked; they have a couple of submissions about whether vacuuming gunpowder will cause an explosion, so I hope they do it.

That would suck!

971 jdog29  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:32:05pm

The goal of this administration is to create a bigger and sustained crisis to use to centralize power all the while talking very eloquently about how they've been backed into a corner to make the choices they've been dying to make for 50 years.

972 Salem  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:32:18pm

Oh swell. Hannity just praised Dyson. That's not going to make things any better for Dyson.

973 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:32:26pm

re: #932 Afrocity

NYC, did you see that you made Daily Kos along with myself and Steve?
Your comment was hilarious.

Guess I'm too much of a schlub to get noticed over at Kos.

WAH! I want to get noticed by the KosKiddies!

////////

974 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:32:32pm

re: #937 Kosh's Shadow

I read the article. The battery exploded. We've seen that before with laptops.

Thanks. I was trying to catch up and still provide a little light-hearted comment (it's adult beverage time on the east coast).

975 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:32:43pm

re: #969 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

So, I went by the store to get some beer and snacks...18.00 for a 30 PACK of Coors Light. A FREAKIN' 30 PACK!

i got one.

Omega-3 fortified?

976 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:33:46pm

re: #963 Kosh's Shadow

I checked; they have a couple of submissions about whether vacuuming gunpowder will cause an explosion, so I hope they do it.

Cool. They do a lot of neat stuff with gunpowder.

977 Bloodnok  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:33:58pm

re: #969 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

So, I went by the store to get some beer and snacks...18.00 for a 30 PACK of Coors Light. A FREAKIN' 30 PACK!

i got one.

A 30 pack and canned cheese?

Xanadu.

978 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:33:58pm

re: #969 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

So, I went by the store to get some beer and snacks...18.00 for a 30 PACK of Coors Light. A FREAKIN' 30 PACK!

i got one.

What will you do an 2 hours from now when your on your last can?

979 Hengineer  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:34:19pm

ok folks, gonna make my night round and go to bed, i've got the duty tonight

night!

980 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:34:25pm

re: #967 funky chicken

My parents built a house with one of those 15 years ago. They were one of the first to do it so it was really expensive....but it's a 4500 sq ft house with one wall almost all windows, and they haven't had a utility bill over $200 a month. They keep the place really cold in the summer too, and it's in a hot summer climate.

Seattle solar not cost effective effective yet. Wind no go also. A heat pump is the best deal.re: #973 FurryOldGuyJeans

Guess I'm too much of a schlub to get noticed over at Kos.

WAH! I want to get noticed by the KosKiddies!

////////

I know, I'm envious as heck!

981 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:34:39pm

re: #912 grandma


So call Grandma nuts, and let the beatings begin. So thanks for listening on this lovely SC evening, and have a nice day.

Ma'am you are absolutely correct about the overuse of plastic and the "green" hypocrisy of many Americans. However, no-one in the legitimate science community is making global warming up for our paychecks or our egos.

Honestly, have you ever seen the kind of money we make? It isn't much - certainly nothing compared to our education. Let me put it another way, your shiny PhD in pure research, once you get out of school - and you are already really poor from grad school may land you a post doc that makes you as much as 35k a year! after some post docs you may get a professorship that gets you into the sixties.

No for sure you can go into industry and if you patent something or get a consulting gig you can make a little more, but let me tell you - NO ONE is in science for the money.

So we aren't claiming this for the money.

As to the political power, our grants for the last eight years came from an administration that was much less than cordial to science that it did not want to hear - particularly on AGW. No one was helping their careers by rocking that boat.

So I assure you, it wasn't to curry favor with the people in power.

No, the fact is that we have mountains of hard data and very strong mathematical reasons to believe that AGW is happening and that it poses a major problem in the future.

So I assure you it is not a religion.

I agree that the chicken little crowd is politicizing the facts (and making quite a few up) for their own political agendas. But those people are not the scientists themselves. By the same token those people who tell you that there is no problem are equally political shills. They are actually the more dangerous of the two.

As to methane and CO2 and water vapor, it is not a matter of these things being new to the environment, it is a matter of how much our deforestation, destruction of ocean algae, pollution, agriculture and industry have altered the balance.

982 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:34:55pm

re: #975 Harry Tuttle

Omega-3 fortified?

Fortified with Blue Ridge Mountain Spring Water baby!

983 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:35:08pm

I hope everyone who thinks Nils-Axel Mörner should be the spokesman for the anti-AGW side has seen the latest update to my earlier post.

984 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:35:26pm

re: #969 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

So, I went by the store to get some beer and snacks...18.00 for a 30 PACK of Coors Light. A FREAKIN' 30 PACK!

i got one.

You're in the SOUTH. I'm surprised they didn't sell you a shotgun and a pickup truck to go with the beer!

985 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:35:36pm

since when do plants produce CO2?

986 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:35:53pm

re: #969 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

So, I went by the store to get some beer and snacks...18.00 for a 30 PACK of Coors Light. A FREAKIN' 30 PACK!

i got one.

That's why I never liked Coors when I was growing up. Way too overpriced. $18.00 for a 30-pack seems about right to me.

987 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:36:15pm

re: #982 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Fortified with Blue Ridge Mountain Spring Water baby!

As Liberace said, bottoms up!

988 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:36:18pm

re: #985 windhorse

since when do plants produce CO2?

When you burn them for heat?

;-P

989 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:36:21pm

re: #926 Kosh's Shadow

We've been able to make one that can't melt down since the early 1960's.
The book on Project Orion that is mentioned above describes one. It has a fast negative temperature coefficient. They tested it by cutting off the cooling water; it shut down immediately, and did not melt.

Absolutely. There is no reason not to build them in large numbers. At least no physics reason. If we can convince people that clean energy is a good thing and that keeping American dollars in America is a good thing we might make some headway on the economic arguments.

990 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:36:29pm

re: #962 Afrocity

Daily Kos trashes LGF posters

Thank you! I feel so honored for just being short and sweet. Tell me something, I thought calling someone a fucking moron was ultra PC?

991 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:36:53pm

re: #988 JCM

dang..... maybe that's why I am so cold......

992 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:37:03pm

re: #985 windhorse

since when do plants produce CO2?


Auto PLANTS!?!?!

993 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:37:10pm
994 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:37:18pm

re: #972 Salem

Oh swell. Hannity just praised Dyson. That's not going to make things any better for Dyson.

Yes, but I think Dyson is probably old enough not to care.

995 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:37:27pm

re: #978 sattv4u2

What will you do an 2 hours from now when your on your last can?

HOW CAN YOU EAT ALL THOSE HOT DOGS? COORS GOOD FOR COOKING HOT DOGS
DRINKING NOT SO MUCH

996 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:37:39pm

re: #992 sattv4u2

Auto PLANTS!?!?!

COAL FIRED ELECTRICAL PLANTS!

997 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:37:44pm

How does Charles feel about comments on his blog being spread around by a faux lizard on the interwires?

998 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:38:09pm

re: #992 sattv4u2

awe.... that sounds like a buncha' hot air to me......

999 Charles Johnson  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:38:09pm

re: #997 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

How does Charles feel about comments on his blog being spread around by a faux lizard on the interwires?

So what else is new?

1000 Harry Tuttle  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:38:13pm

g-night peeps!

1001 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:38:27pm

re: #992 sattv4u2

POTTED PLANTS at a obama town hall meeting

1002 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:38:41pm

re: #980 JCM

I know, I'm envious as heck!

Hey I did not know my post was on Daily Kos until a fellow lizard told me. I think it is pathetic that they come over to LGF and copy and paste our posts for fodder at their left wing blog. Someone called me trailer trash. They know nothing about me. So I am trailer trash because I said Obama looked like an idiot? HE DID. There was not one un-PC statement on LGF. The entire Kos post was a lie.

1003 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:38:55pm

re: #1001 yochanan

POTTED PLANTS at a obama town hall meeting

His cabinet members are there?

1004 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:39:11pm

re: #977 Bloodnok

A 30 pack and canned cheese?

Xanadu.

Nah. That's at the bottom of a cage of a live Xana.

1005 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:39:42pm

re: #935 buzzsawmonkey

International Order of ODS Fellows

ODS man out

Any more?

I'd say your post is the ODS-on favorite to win.

1006 jamgarr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:39:52pm

Halliburton rant on 24!

1007 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:40:13pm

re: #999 Charles

Howdy, Big Cheese!

1008 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:40:29pm

re: #1006 jamgarr

haliberton is so last term

1009 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:40:35pm

re: #990 NYCHardhat

Thank you! I feel so honored for just being short and sweet. Tell me something, I thought calling someone a fucking moron was ultra PC?

F*ck them. As I said, nothing we said was UN-PC.

1010 dapperdave  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:40:43pm

Congratulations to all of the lizards who were quoted on DKos, that is a badge honor that every lizard should aspire to achieve!

1011 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:40:44pm

re: #997 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

How does Charles feel about comments on his blog being spread around by a faux lizard on the interwires?

I would imagine that happens all the time, we do get a lot of sock puppets and one time trolls.

1012 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:41:02pm

re: #982 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Fortified with Blue Ridge Mountain Spring Water baby!

"Blue Ridge Mountain Spring Water?" The last time I drank coors, it was made in Colorado (please forgive me if I haven't kept up). :)

1013 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:41:46pm

re: #1012 Unakite

EAST COAST! THEY HAVE A BREWERY IN VA NOW!

1014 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:42:00pm

OT, although I'm not sure what the current T is:

Has anyone here seen the movie Gomorrah?

1015 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:42:11pm

re: #987 Harry Tuttle

As Liberace said, bottoms up!

I thought that was how they buried Carry Grant (friends could stop by for a cold one)?

1016 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:42:31pm

re: #1010 dapperdave

Congratulations to all of the lizards who were quoted on DKos, that is a badge honor that every lizard should aspire to achieve!

I want to be quoted on DKos, dammit!

I want to be quoted on DKos! WAH!

1017 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:42:36pm

re: #1010 dapperdave

DKos..... hmmm.... sounds vaguely familiar.... was that a sitcom from the seventies?

1018 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:42:45pm

re: #1014 Occasional Reader

Godzilla vs. Gomorrah?

1019 Killer Tomato  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:42:51pm

Well, I'm pretty happy! My life is being streamlined in ways I never thought possible!
Doesn't matter what I need to do - order a new box of checks, get new brake pads for the car, get my cholesterol checked - the government can do it all for me! One stop shopping!
wheeeeeeeee!

1020 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:43:07pm

re: #985 windhorse

since when do plants produce CO2?

CO2 is a byproduct of respiration.

1021 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:43:20pm

re: #981 LudwigVanQuixote

Well said, and politely too.

1022 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:43:21pm
1023 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:43:31pm

re: #1014 Occasional Reader

OT, although I'm not sure what the current T is:

Has anyone here seen the movie Gomorrah?

No, but I think I got rid of that once with penicillin! (or was that twice?)

1024 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:43:37pm

is KOS arabic for turd?

1025 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:43:38pm

re: #1018 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Godzilla vs. Gomorrah?

No, no, no... Gamera is the friend of all children. Gomorrah is different.

1026 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:43:47pm

re: #1009 Afrocity

F*ck them. As I said, nothing we said was UN-PC.

Damn straight.

1027 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:44:02pm

re: #1020 Spare O'Lake

CO2 is a byproduct of respiration.


I use an underarm roll on for that!

1028 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:44:06pm

re: #1019 Killer Tomato

-here, take this pill.... the koolaid is in the cups on the table.....

1029 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:44:15pm

Gah.... you people are incorrigible.

1030 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:44:15pm

Gomorrah is really neat...
He is filled with turtle meat...
We all love you Gomorraaaaaaaah...

1031 dapperdave  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:44:23pm

re: #1017 windhorse

That was WKRP

1032 Bloodnok  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:44:45pm

re: #1022 buzzsawmonkey

Faith an' Gomorrah is a film about the Irish gay community; is that the one you mean?

Reminds me of local radio host Howie Carr's suggestion for the MA state motto. "Sodom and Begorrah."

1033 jamgarr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:44:51pm

re: #1022 buzzsawmonkey

Faith an' Gomorrah is a film about the Irish gay community; is that the one you mean?


The sequel to Sodom If You Gottem'

1034 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:45:01pm

re: #1013 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

EAST COAST! THEY HAVE A BREWERY IN VA NOW!

Gotta admit, I live in VA, and I remember a long time ago there was some talk about Coors building a brewery in VA. I didn't know that they actually did it.

1035 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:45:24pm

re: #1029 Occasional Reader

Gah.... you people are incorrigible.

Sorry. I'm sorry. You were saying?

1036 jaunte  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:45:31pm

re: #1014 Occasional Reader

OT, although I'm not sure what the current T is:

Has anyone here seen the movie Gomorrah?

Looks interesting. I haven't seen it.
[Link: www.gomorrahmovie.co.uk...]

1037 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:45:41pm

re: #1034 Unakite

Gotta admit, I live in VA, and I remember a long time ago there was some talk about Coors building a brewery in VA. I didn't know that they actually did it.

they need to cook hot dogs in va?

1038 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:45:41pm

re: #1022 buzzsawmonkey

Faith an' Gomorrah is a film about the Irish gay community; is that the one you mean?

No, you're thinking of the gay Irish gang movie, How Are Things in Glock & Gomorrah?.

1039 itellu3times  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:45:54pm

re: #1019 Killer Tomato

Well, I'm pretty happy! My life is being streamlined in ways I never thought possible!
Doesn't matter what I need to do - order a new box of checks, get new brake pads for the car, get my cholesterol checked - the government can do it all for me! One stop shopping!
wheeeeeeeee!

The same guy who delivers the mail can tune up your car and remove your appendix.

1040 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:46:23pm

re: #1029 Occasional Reader

Gah.... you people are incorrigible.

Do I need the laxative or the fiber to correct that?

1041 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:47:01pm

re: #1034 Unakite

Near Elkton (Harrisonburg) Virginia.

1042 Killer Tomato  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:47:12pm

re: #1014 Occasional Reader

OT, although I'm not sure what the current T is:

Has anyone here seen the movie Gomorrah?

I thought the topic was vacuum cleaners?

1043 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:47:20pm

re: #971 jdog29

Not really. The Tea Party plan is actually far more destructive and would take much longer (decades) for the economy to recover. Imagine what would happen if the troubled banks were actually allowed to fail (See top 20 banks graph). I'd guess about 50-60% of the banking power would disappear almost immediately. Other banks would fail and people run to take out their money to safely store it in their mattresses. People who couldn't get thier money out in time would have to wait for the government to send out FDIC checks. Those who weren't covered would simply lose their money. Businesses, who are struggling now because of the limited availability of credit would start to fail as there will be no banks around to even give credit. The surviving banks would probably take at least a decade to build up the infrastructure lostt by the large bank failures. Only after that happens can the economy even begin to start recovering. The Tea Party plan is far more destructive than what Obama's doing.

That's why the Paulians are so big into the Tea Party movement. They want to destroy the financial institutions and go back to the gold standard and abolish the federal reserve, etc. The rest of the Tea party crowd are just suckers being played to advance a dangerous and intentionally destructive policy.

1044 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:47:24pm

re: #1040 FurryOldGuyJeans

Do I need the laxative or the fiber to correct that?

Yeah Barney Frank n' Beans

1045 MandyManners  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:47:40pm

re: #938 Hengineer

I've been back from baseball practice for a little while and I'm at the beginning of a HUMONGOUS sinus attack. The sports complex is in the flattest piece of land around and is a place of convergence for all kinds of winds. But, the good news is that I've taken on the task to set up communications with the parents of the 12 players. This should be interesting because many of them just drop their kids off at the complex even during regular season. I must be insane.

1046 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:47:43pm

re: #1040 FurryOldGuyJeans

Do I need the laxative or the fiber to correct that?

Just think of the song, "Papa got a Bran New Bag".

1047 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:47:49pm

re: #1039 itellu3times

The same guy who delivers the mail can tune up your car and remove your appendix.

and botch them all at the same time

your mail ends up in your neighbors mailbox
he puts the wires on the wrong spark plugs
as he goes for your appendix, he can't find it and says what the hell, while we're here we'll remove this, and that ,,,,,

1048 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:47:59pm
1049 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:48:12pm

re: #1044 Afrocity

Yeah Barney Frank n' Beans

OOOOOOHHHHHHH!

1050 OldLineTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:48:28pm

re: #1029 Occasional Reader

Gah.... you people are incorrigible.

You're the one incorriging them!

1051 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:48:36pm

re: #1018 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Godzilla vs. Gomorrah?

The Lizard King is a Toho property, Gamera belongs to Daiei, created in 1965 to compete against Godzilla and get a piece of the giant monster pie.

1052 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:48:46pm

re: #1044 Afrocity

Yeah Barney Frank n' Beans

someone ALWAYS gets PORKED !

1053 Cheechako  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:48:46pm

...

1054 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:48:51pm

re: #1037 yochanan

they need to cook hot dogs in va?

? sorry, I didn't get that one.

1055 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:48:57pm

re: #1020 Spare O'Lake

okay..... I went through the respiration thing recently (years) as my kids went through middle school..... I didn't remember that CO2 was a result of respiration......

but, since plants take in CO2 and produce O2.... if they puke back a small amount of CO2 into the atmosphere.... isn't the net effect to reduce CO2 (plantwise)?

1056 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:49:11pm

re: #1002 Afrocity

Hey I did not know my post was on Daily Kos until a fellow lizard told me. I think it is pathetic that they come over to LGF and copy and paste our posts for fodder at their left wing blog. Someone called me trailer trash. They know nothing about me. So I am trailer trash because I said Obama looked like an idiot? HE DID. There was not one un-PC statement on LGF. The entire Kos post was a lie.

Even better!

1057 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:49:16pm

re: #1053 Cheechako

...

- - -

1058 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:49:37pm

re: #1044 Afrocity

Yeah Barney Frank n' Beans

That just keeps "blowin' in the wind".

1059 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:49:51pm

re: #1054 Unakite

well the only think coors is good for is cooking hot dogs.

1060 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:49:58pm

re: #1057 sattv4u2

..._

1061 BatGuano  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:49:58pm

re: #1051 CyanSnowHawk

Jim Morrison was the the self styled "lizard king".

1062 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:50:14pm

re: #1054 Unakite

Ahem...meaning...coors light is good only for the liquid in which to boil hot dog wieners.

Silver Bullet? FROM MY COLD (nearly drunk, but not all the way drunk) DEAD FINGERS

1063 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:50:37pm

re: #1060 windhorse

..._

hey ,, don;'t blame ME ,,,, Cheechako started it !

1064 MandyManners  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:50:40pm

re: #946 Unakite

You think I've got nuggets, you should see my veins.

Sounds like a lode to me.

1065 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:50:49pm

re: #1052 sattv4u2

someone ALWAYS gets PORKED !

Oh thats fucked up.

1066 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:50:57pm

So.

I think we can safely say that none of you palookas has seen Gomorrah yet.

I may check it out soon. Will advise.

1067 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:51:00pm

re: #1057 sattv4u2

- - -

--- ... ---

1068 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:51:13pm

re: #1041 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Near Elkton (Harrisonburg) Virginia.

Been there many times (not the brewery). Love camping in the Blue Ridge. Just don't drink Coors. But if I can get Coors for 18.00/30 the next time we go up, I might just switch. :)

1069 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:51:28pm

re: #1062 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Ahem...meaning...coors light is good only for the liquid in which to boil hot dog wieners.

Silver Bullet? FROM MY COLD (nearly drunk, but not all the way drunk) DEAD FINGERS

Make sure your door is locked. Round this time up in your neck of the woods the "ladies of the evening" start knockin'

1070 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:51:42pm

re: #1056 JCM

Even better!

I feel like I have a little bit of a swagger now.

1071 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:51:54pm

re: #1043 Killgore Trout

That's why the Paulians are so big into the Tea Party movement. They want to destroy the financial institutions and go back to the gold standard and abolish the federal reserve, etc. The rest of the Tea party crowd are just suckers being played to advance a dangerous and intentionally destructive policy.

It would be interesting to know how many of these people have more than a week's worth of living expenses in the bank, when they have time to party so much.

1072 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:52:04pm

re: #1048 buzzsawmonkey

I ate a whole bag of coconut brigadoons when I saw that one.

I loved the climactic gangfight scene, when the Dead Rabbits take on the Festive Flamingos.

1073 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:52:14pm

re: #1069 sattv4u2

LOT LIZARDS?

1074 OldLineTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:52:35pm

re: #1066 Occasional Reader

So.

I think we can safely say that none of you palookas has seen Gomorrah yet.

I may check it out soon. Will advise.

Which one of us is a six-foot tall invisible rabbit?

/That is the question, Mr. Bond

1075 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:52:35pm

re: #1067 FurryOldGuyJeans

--- ... ---

-:- "" ;;

1076 Killer Tomato  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:52:36pm

re: #1066 Occasional Reader

LOL
palookas
I love that word!

1077 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:52:37pm

re: #1006 jamgarr

Halliburton rant on 24!

Snort. 24? USA has NCIS re-runs. I like it a lot better.

1078 BatGuano  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:52:45pm

re: #1061 BatGuano

Jim Morrison was the the self styled "lizard king".

But since his death, I guess Charles is the new lizard king.

1079 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:52:58pm

re: #1062 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Ahem...meaning...coors light is good only for the liquid in which to boil hot dog wieners.

Silver Bullet? FROM MY COLD (nearly drunk, but not all the way drunk) DEAD FINGERS

What would you know about them MEAT hot dogs, eh? ;)

1080 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:53:07pm

re: #1058 FurryOldGuyJeans

That just keeps "blowin' in the wind".

Grab Your poles!

1081 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:53:18pm

Gommorah, Gommorah, I luv ya, Gommorah,
Yer only a gay away.

1082 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:53:25pm
1083 CyanSnowHawk  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:53:48pm

re: #1061 BatGuano

Jim Morrison was the the self styled "lizard king".

Pretender to the throne he was.

1084 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:53:50pm

re: #1073 yochanan

LOT LIZARDS?

More like HAVE NOT lizards

As in ,, HAVE NOT brushed their tooth in a month
HAVE NOT seen a shower this week
HAVE NOT met a meth lab they didn't love

1085 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:53:51pm

re: #1065 NYCHardhat

Oh thats fucked up.

How Un-PC of you///

1086 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:54:05pm

re: #1002 Afrocity

Hey I did not know my post was on Daily Kos until a fellow lizard told me. I think it is pathetic that they come over to LGF and copy and paste our posts for fodder at their left wing blog. Someone called me trailer trash. They know nothing about me. So I am trailer trash because I said Obama looked like an idiot? HE DID. There was not one un-PC statement on LGF. The entire Kos post was a lie.

LOL yeah, lots of trailers in Chicago.

1087 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:54:07pm

re: #1078 BatGuano

But since his death, I guess Charles is the new lizard king.

long hair, penchant for obscure poetry.

Yeah.

1088 OldLineTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:54:12pm

Sounds like a whackjob conspiracy theory.

/the rightist conservative loonies are gettin' to ya, me bucko

1089 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:54:12pm

re: #1045 MandyManners

I've been back from baseball practice for a little while and I'm at the beginning of a HUMONGOUS sinus attack. The sports complex is in the flattest piece of land around and is a place of convergence for all kinds of winds. But, the good news is that I've taken on the task to set up communications with the parents of the 12 players. This should be interesting because many of them just drop their kids off at the complex even during regular season. I must be insane.

Hey, we've got two boys playing on four teams. You're the team mom?

1090 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:54:31pm

re: #1069 sattv4u2

Make sure your door is locked. Round this time up in your neck of the woods the "ladies of the evening" start knockin'

Brown Chicken.
Brown Cow.

1091 sattv4u2  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:54:55pm

k Kiddies ,,,,, heading home

FVB ,,, I'll call you in tomorrow

1092 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:55:05pm

re: #1085 Afrocity

How Un-PC of you///

Bad language makes for bad feelings. :(

/////

1093 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:55:35pm

re: #1070 NYCHardhat

I feel like I have a little bit of a swagger now.

I deserve to be upgraded to a better trailer/

1094 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:55:42pm

re: #1079 FurryOldGuyJeans

What would you know about them MEAT hot dogs, eh? ;)

You've never had a "not dog"?

1095 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:55:46pm

re: #1086 funky chicken

LOL yeah, lots of trailers in Chicago.

EXCEPT FOR CONST. & MOVIE TRAILERS THERE AREN'T ANY THAT PEOPLE LIVE IN, INSIDE THE CITY.

1096 Bloodnok  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:56:04pm

re: #1090 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Brown Chicken.
Brown Cow.



Black Cow

1097 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:56:07pm
1098 rawmuse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:56:12pm

re: #1081 Spare O'Lake

Gommorah, Gommorah, I luv ya, Gommorah,
Yer only a gay away.

Spent some time in musical theatre, have you?

1099 OldLineTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:56:35pm

re: #1093 Afrocity

I deserve to be upgraded to a better trailer/

Doublewide!

With skirts!

And a front porch!

1100 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:56:39pm

re: #1093 Afrocity

I deserve to be upgraded to a better trailer/

Absolutely. Especially with your karma to comment ratio. You've earned it. ;)

1101 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:56:43pm

re: #1059 yochanan

well the only think coors is good for is cooking hot dogs.

Believe it or not, that's kind of what I thought you meant. That's why I live in Virginia and didn't even know that had build a brewery here (sorry FBV) :)

1102 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:56:59pm

re: #1070 NYCHardhat

I feel like I have a little bit of a swagger now.

Bob Lee Swagger?

1103 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:57:03pm

re: #1086 funky chicken

LOL yeah, lots of trailers in Chicago.

I do have a canned ham and some maraschino cherries in my fridge.

1104 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:57:28pm

hey man.... free trailers? I want mine.... (elbow-elbow.... gimme that)

1105 Killer Tomato  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:57:42pm

re: #1099 OldLineTexan

You forgot the Christmas lights on the front porch.

1106 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:57:53pm

re: #1093 Afrocity

I deserve to be upgraded to a better trailer/

Make sure you get gold bricks to hold up your better trailer.

1107 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:58:30pm

re: #1102 Occasional Reader

Bob Lee Swagger?

No. Like him.

1108 OldLineTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:58:32pm

re: #1104 windhorse

hey man.... free trailers? I want mine.... (elbow-elbow.... gimme that)

Fine, here's one. With extra formaldehyde.

1109 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:58:40pm

re: #1081 Spare O'Lake

Gommorah, Gommorah, I luv ya, Gommorah,
Yer only a gay away.

Ah, from the score to Arnie/Annie, about a woman who plays a man who plays a woman who plays a man who plays an adorable little orphan...

1110 pink freud  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:58:43pm

re: #1102 Occasional Reader

Oooh.

1111 Killer Tomato  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:59:01pm

Trailers for sale or rent. Rooms to let, fifty cents. No phone, no pool, no pets . I ain't got no cigarettes....

1112 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:59:22pm

re: #1105 Killer Tomato

and with toilet holding American Flag tastefully positioned in front yard...

1113 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:59:33pm

re: #1099 OldLineTexan

Doublewide!

With skirts!

And a front porch!

and the all important malt liquor fountain.

1114 BatGuano  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:59:39pm

re: #1111 Killer Tomato

King of the road!

1115 OldLineTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:59:42pm

re: #1105 Killer Tomato

You forgot the Christmas lights on the front porch.

Nuthin' but the best fer that gal Afrocity! Let's throw in a potted plant lawn and a flock of plastic flamingos.

1116 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:59:50pm

re: #1062 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Ahem...meaning...coors light is good only for the liquid in which to boil hot dog wieners.

Silver Bullet? FROM MY COLD (nearly drunk, but not all the way drunk) DEAD FINGERS

Gotta admit, any beer is good, for the right price. I could get a case of 16-oz Piels in PA for ~$6.00/case (a long time ago). But I was in college and that was all I could afford.

1117 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:59:54pm

re: #1103 Afrocity

I do have a canned ham and some maraschino cherries in my fridge.

Oooh, now that's some EATS right there! ;)

1118 FrogMarch  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 6:59:56pm

The communists are out for blood.

Those who talk of "overthrowing" capitalism are determined to depict it as a system of government in a precise parallel with socialism, when in reality, capitalism is not a system in the ideological sense.

It is, if anything, an anti-system: the aggregation of human behaviour as it goes about fulfilling particular wants and needs.


I like to ask communists if they go to the store to buy milk, food and other provisions. If so, then they are capitalists.

1119 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:17pm

re: #1108 OldLineTexan

I think you must have meant "formalgehyde" (I got me a couch covered in that shit)

1120 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:24pm

re: #1113 Afrocity

and the all important malt liquor fountain.

Ah, the Olde English garden style...

1121 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:26pm
1122 pink freud  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:37pm

re: #1111 Killer Tomato

Trailers for sale or rent. Rooms to let, fifty cents. No phone, no pool, no pets . I ain't got no cigarettes....

Reminder: Get 'em now. 24 hours till your knees buckle and your wallet cries when you purchase.

1123 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:38pm

re: #1064 MandyManners

Sounds like a lode to me.

The MOTHER load.

1124 Killer Tomato  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:46pm

re: #1114 BatGuano

ding ding ding!

1125 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:48pm

re: #1071 Naso Tang

It would be interesting to know how many of these people have more than a week's worth of living expenses in the bank, when they have time to party so much.

I'm wondering about the ratio of Paulians vs gullible conservatives. I suspect the Paulians are outnumbered but they're still manipulating the majority to do their bidding for them. It's quite and impressive coup if you think about it.

1126 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:49pm

re: #1055 windhorse

okay..... I went through the respiration thing recently (years) as my kids went through middle school..... I didn't remember that CO2 was a result of respiration......

but, since plants take in CO2 and produce O2.... if they puke back a small amount of CO2 into the atmosphere.... isn't the net effect to reduce CO2 (plantwise)?

There's yer respiration, and there's yer photosynthesis.
Respiration uses Oxygen and produces CO2, while photosynthesis uses CO2 and produces Oxygen. Depending on the climate and the weather, many plants use more CO2 than they produce, on a net basis.

1127 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:00:54pm

re: #1107 NYCHardhat

IS THAT FROM THE MOVIE "ROADHOUSE"?
i LOVE THAT MOVIE!

1128 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:01:03pm

I lived in a house trailer when my father was stationed at ft benning (the trailer park on the base was very nice.) off base not so much.

1129 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:01:14pm

re: #1111 Killer Tomato

Trailers for sale or rent. Rooms to let, fifty cents. No phone, no pool, no pets . I ain't got no cigarettes....

And yes, we have not bananas, we have no bananas today.

1130 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:01:22pm

re: #1116 Unakite

Gotta admit, any beer is good, for the right price.

Not true.

They'd have to pay me to drink another six of Milwaukee's Best.

1131 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:01:30pm

re: #1127 Afrocity

IS THAT FROM THE MOVIE "ROADHOUSE"?
i LOVE THAT MOVIE!

LMAO!

1132 Dark_Falcon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:02:02pm

re: #1097 buzzsawmonkey

This one is rated "PG."

Maybe, but this thread should be rated NC-17. :D

1133 BatGuano  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:02:13pm

re: #1124 Killer Tomato

ding ding ding!

No applause please. I'm over adored as it is! :)

1134 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:03:03pm

re: #1111 Killer Tomato

Trailers for sale or rent. Rooms to let, fifty cents. No phone, no pool, no pets . I ain't got no cigarettes....

Do they accept section 8 vouchers?

1135 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:03:07pm

re: #1125 Killgore Trout

at the risk of being contrary..... I will acknowledge the Ron Paul phenom.... but I think it represents equal parts from both the Dem and Repub side....

scary in spite of statistics, to me.

1136 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:03:20pm

re: #107 alegrias

* * * *
Obama and Eric Holder may ask us Alexandrian Virginians to "adopt an enemy combatant", you know the old 60s saying, "each one teach one"? And "love the one you're with"?

Naturally I'm thrilled to share my home & possessions with jihadists who wanted only to murder American infidels. NOT.

/sarc

I'm having a very bad image of a sitcom based on this...

All the titles I can think of for it are either racist or extremely disturbing or both.

I think I will stop thinking about this.

1137 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:03:25pm

Afro liked the movie Roadhouse? Oh, Honey. That's one of the worst movies ever.

1138 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:03:36pm

re: #1132 Dark_Falcon

Maybe, but this thread should be rated NC-17. :D

Rated Y: No one admitted, ever.

1139 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:03:43pm

coors doen't even have to change color

and coors light is redundent

1140 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:03:58pm

re: #32 Sharmuta

On this, I could not agree more. AGW is a distraction from very serious problems that need attention now.

This is not to say, however, that I think we shouldn't be good stewards of this planet, but that there are issues more pressing and that will have devastating consequences much more quickly than AGW.

Agreed, Sharmuta. You know, those of us who actually work in the resource industry are often more in tune with the natural environment than all the city-dwelling eco-nuts. We are out there in it. We can see what is really happening in the natural world, and none of us want to destroy that natural world. But we are also aware that Mother Nature is a big girl now, and she can take care of herself without our help, thank you very much.

1141 Bloodnok  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:04:38pm

re: #1130 Occasional Reader

Not true.

They'd have to pay me to drink another six of Milwaukee's Best.

Milwaukee's Best isn't brewed. It's passed.

1142 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:05:40pm

re: #1135 windhorse

at the risk of being contrary..... I will acknowledge the Ron Paul phenom.... but I think it represents equal parts from both the Dem and Repub side....

scary in spite of statistics, to me.

The Tea Parties? I'm pretty sure very few Democrats are attending the Tea parties. It's pretty much just a Republican thing.

1143 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:05:40pm

re: #1137 Sharmuta

Afro liked the movie Roadhouse? Oh, Honey. That's one of the worst movies ever.

WOLVERINES!

Wait, wrong Patrick Swayze movie.

"Nobody puts Baby in a corner."

Yeah. That's the ticket.

1144 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:05:55pm

re: #1130 Occasional Reader

Not true.

They'd have to pay me to drink another six of Milwaukee's Best.

You're right. The only beer that I had that was so bad that I could not finish it was an Iron City. The Beast was the staple when we were on field trips. Fortunately, I can afford a little better now.

1145 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:05:59pm

re: #1141 Bloodnok

I heard that Bart Starr use to pass footballs with the greatest of ease.... hmmmm.... The Packers use to play at Milwaukee County Stadium.... you don't suppose.... - ah, nevermind.....

1146 BatGuano  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:06:15pm

re: #1137 Sharmuta

Afro liked the movie Roadhouse? Oh, Honey. That's one of the worst movies ever.

I liked the movie up to the point where I had to see Patrick Swayze's butt (may he recover from his health problems).

1147 FurryOldGuyJeans  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:06:31pm

re: #1137 Sharmuta

Afro liked the movie Roadhouse? Oh, Honey. That's one of the worst movies ever.

I think I know why she likes Road House.

1148 OldLineTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:07:07pm

re: #1136 SanFranciscoZionist

I'm having a very bad image of a sitcom based on this...

All the titles I can think of for it are either racist or extremely disturbing or both.

I think I will stop thinking about this.

Al Qaeda, Al Qaeda
My Favorite Islamist
Radical for Rent
Welcome Back, Mr. Fatwa
Who Blow Up Da Owl?
Lovebomb
Shari'a and Shari'a Alike
Wings

1149 Killer Tomato  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:07:10pm

re: #1134 Afrocity

Section 8?! Good grief, I should think you'd want to use those in the high rent district. You know, in a mobile home park - not a trailer park!

1150 jamgarr  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:07:10pm

It was a good vehicle for Jeff Healy

1151 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:07:18pm

re: #1142 Killgore Trout

mebbe so.... but I have a friend (and I use that term rather loosely) that feeds me info every day about the Ron Paul movement. He swears there are more Dems in on this.......

(wow, the Ron Paul Movement......)

1152 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:07:49pm

pink flamingos is the worst movie ever made

1153 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:07:52pm

re: #1139 yochanan

coors doen't even have to change color

and coors light is redundent

Hehehehehehehe. What about Kilian's Red? Coors with food coloring. It does change colors (just not taste).

1154 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:08:40pm

re: #1146 BatGuano

I liked the movie up to the point where I had to see Patrick Swayze's butt (may he recover from his health problems).

I have to share this story. I was in FL visiting my auntie and uncle when I saw that film with them, my cousin and grandmother. It was during that scene where I stated quite clearly, "Well- I guess he's got her between a rock and a hard place." It took everyone a few minutes to either recover from the shock or stop laughing.

1155 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:08:48pm

re: #1137 Sharmuta

Afro liked the movie Roadhouse? Oh, Honey. That's one of the worst movies ever.

Sharm, I love "Roadhouse". Sam Elliot and Ben Gazzara, the band was good and a shot of Patrick butt naked. Pluse someone got their throat pulled right out of their neck. I have the DVD that is my fav Swayze movie. I liked it way better than "Dirty Dancing".

1156 Killgore Trout  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:09:02pm

re: #1151 windhorse

There are a few Dems in the Ron Paul thing but not many. The Dems have their own versions of Ron Paul in guys like Nader and Kucinich.

1157 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:09:20pm

re: #1139 yochanan

coors doen't even have to change color

and coors light is redundent

Coors Light actually has less alcohol (and flavor) than distilled water.

1158 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:09:31pm

re: #1153 Unakite

you know that how?

1159 Spare O'Lake  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:09:46pm

re: #1139 yochanan

coors doen't even have to change color

and coors light is redundent

I hear Coors light is pretty good to drink on long drives./

1160 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:10:00pm

re: #1155 Afrocity

Did ya see "Next of Kin"? That was a Chicago Mob/Vs/Kentucky Hillbilly movie. Whoodathunk?

1161 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:10:19pm

re: #1126 Spare O'Lake

There's yer respiration, and there's yer photosynthesis.
Respiration uses Oxygen and produces CO2, while photosynthesis uses CO2 and produces Oxygen. Depending on the climate and the weather, many plants use more CO2 than they produce, on a net basis.

And the biggest carbon sink is ocean algae which has been drastically depleted in the last sixty years. There are many fewer photosynthesizers out there to eat the CO2. Couple that with deforestation and massive industrial output and you begin to see some of the problem on the CO2 front.

However, it is not just CO2. Warmer weather means much more water vapor in the air. Earlier, someone here was going on that 1/10 of a degree change in ocean temperatures could not possibly be a big deal. I pointed out that this is a tremendous amount of extra thermal energy in oceans - what I failed to point out there is that also means a great deal more water vapor in the atmosphere. It is a feed back.

Melting polar caps from these two effects means more warm water and it means less albedo, so there is yet another feedback.

Methane is a terrible greenhouse gas. It gets dismissed as "cow farts" but then again, no one who makes that argument really takes into account how much industrialized agriculture we have or how the poor waste disposal from things like CAFOs contributes to the methane problem. While we are at it, as bogs, like Siberia thaw, many more tons of methane are released and we have yet another feedback loop.

1162 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:10:32pm

re: #1156 Killgore Trout

I believe you (rather than my friend) on this. And, I agree with you (I think) that this is probably the worst thing that could happen to the Repubs right now......

1163 Fat Bastard Vegetarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:10:38pm

re: #1157 Occasional Reader

Coors Light actually has less alcohol (and flavor) than distilled water.

Nah. Read the motto.

"When water just isn't strong enough".

1164 JCM  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:10:57pm

re: #1070 NYCHardhat

I feel like I have a little bit of a swagger now.

You should! I was LMAO when I read the Kos post!

1165 BatGuano  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:11:05pm

re: #1154 Sharmuta

I guess you've always been a s**t disturber. :)

1166 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:11:50pm

re: #1154 Sharmuta

I was on a date when I saw it and I felt so good afterwards that I asked my date if we could see it again.

1167 FrogMarch  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:11:54pm

re: #1151 windhorse

mebbe so.... but I have a friend (and I use that term rather loosely) that feeds me info every day about the Ron Paul movement. He swears there are more Dems in on this.......

(wow, the Ron Paul Movement......)

Ron Paul is fairly popular here in Boulder. Boulder has less than 30% registered republicans. my own personal run-ins with the Ron Paul people here in Boulder has me convinced they are indeed democrats. many are also into "infowars" Alex Jones site. I think Ron's anti-war purism is what draws them in.

1168 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:12:16pm

re: #1148 OldLineTexan

Al Qaeda, Al Qaeda
My Favorite Islamist
Radical for Rent
Welcome Back, Mr. Fatwa
Who Blow Up Da Owl?
Lovebomb
Shari'a and Shari'a Alike
Wings

The Jihadi Bunch
Everybody Loves Semtex
Two and a Half Men (aka "The Work Accident")
Law & Order: Adultress Stoning Unit

1169 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:12:27pm

re: #1114 BatGuano

King of the road!

I know every engineer on every train
All of their children, and all of their names
And every handout in every town
And every lock that ain't locked when no one's around

1170 MandyManners  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:12:50pm

re: #1089 Unakite

Hey, we've got two boys playing on four teams. You're the team mom?

Egads, no! I'm gonna' help the coach and his wife (she works for an AIG subsidiary and she's super-busy right now) improve communication with the other parents. This is in the town in which we live, not in the city in which The Kid attends a Christian academy. The overwhelming majority (99.99) of the players at all levels attend public schools.

1171 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:12:57pm

re: #1160 Fat Bastard Vegetarian

Did ya see "Next of Kin"? That was a Chicago Mob/Vs/Kentucky Hillbilly movie. Whoodathunk?

I loved Next of Kin too.
I also like a movie called "Black Rain" with Andy Garcia, or Hard to Kill.

1172 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:13:40pm

re: #1161 LudwigVanQuixote

Master Blaster make fuel from pigshit.
So, who wants to go into the business of making gas from farm manure?
Maybe we can get Mike Rowe to help start it.

1173 SanFranciscoZionist  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:13:56pm

re: #224 Ojoe

Re Our Lady of Guadalupe to be exact.

Just saw that. Oh goodness me.

1174 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:13:59pm

re: #1167 FrogMarch

this reflects what I hear (emphatically) from my friend, the Democrat....

However, having seen some of the clips on the internet..... ir does look more like foundering Repubs to me....

1175 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:14:03pm

re: #1155 Afrocity

Sharm, I love "Roadhouse". Sam Elliot and Ben Gazzara, the band was good and a shot of Patrick butt naked. Pluse someone got their throat pulled right out of their neck. I have the DVD that is my fav Swayze movie. I liked it way better than "Dirty Dancing".

So- you liked the "between a rock and a hard place" scene?

1176 windhorse  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:14:49pm

Get with the Ron Paul Movement.... it's the shit!

1177 Killer Tomato  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:14:50pm

re: #1170 MandyManners

she works for an AIG subsidiary

Burn the witch!

oh wait, did she get a bonus?

1178 BatGuano  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:14:58pm

re: #1169 Kosh's Shadow

Every word of that song is seared, SEARED, into my brain. You posted my favorite lyrics from the song.

1179 MandyManners  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:14:58pm

re: #1170 MandyManners

SNOTTY BITCH ALERT!

*sigh*

1180 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:15:43pm

re: #1166 Afrocity

I was on a date when I saw it and I felt so good afterwards that I asked my date if we could see it again.

I took a first date to see Schindler's List.

Not exactly the smartest dating move, one would think.

And yet, one would be surprised.

1181 brookly red  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:15:47pm

re: #1093 Afrocity

I deserve to be upgraded to a better trailer/

Hello, I am here from FEMA, how can I help YOU?

1182 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:16:04pm

re: #1175 Sharmuta

Yeah! And the part where Sam Elliot is murdered, but my fav part is how Ben Gazzara drives around the road in a zig zag pattern. It is such a chick flick.

1183 OldLineTexan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:16:12pm

re: #1168 Occasional Reader

The Jihadi Bunch
Everybody Loves Semtex
Two and a Half Men (aka "The Work Accident")
Law & Order: Adultress Stoning Unit

That's My Mohammed!
Infidelia
Pastarama
Seven Brides for One Brother
Robot Jihadi
Spongeboom 'Splodeypants (for the kiddies)

1184 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:16:16pm

re: #1141 Bloodnok

Milwaukee's Best isn't brewed. It's passed.

Bear Whiz beer
Like my daddy said, Son, it's in the water. That's why it's yellow.

1185 Kosh's Shadow  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:16:52pm

re: #1178 BatGuano

Every word of that song is seared, SEARED, into my brain. You posted my favorite lyrics from the song.

I love the song, too; that was from memory.

1186 Afrocity  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:17:19pm

re: #1180 Occasional Reader

Don't worry I had a guy take me to see "Hotel Rwanda" on a date.

1187 FrogMarch  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:17:29pm

re: #1174 windhorse

this reflects what I hear (emphatically) from my friend, the Democrat....

However, having seen some of the clips on the internet..... ir does look more like foundering Repubs to me....

Certainly there are Ron Paul Republicans. But don't be fooled, the left like him too. Even that guy who just kicked the crap out of Gordon Brown. (can't think of his name at the moment)

1188 mikeymom  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:18:51pm

re: #1148 OldLineTexan

Al Qaeda, Al Qaeda
My Favorite Islamist
Radical for Rent
Welcome Back, Mr. Fatwa
Who Blow Up Da Owl?
Lovebomb
Shari'a and Shari'a Alike
Wings


badghad legal
er disaster
amazing jihad
survivor islam

1189 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:19:24pm

re: #1158 yochanan

you know that how?

Kilian's is, or used to be, brewed by Coors.re: #1170 MandyManners

Egads, no! I'm gonna' help the coach and his wife (she works for an AIG subsidiary and she's super-busy right now) improve communication with the other parents. This is in the town in which we live, not in the city in which The Kid attends a Christian academy. The overwhelming majority (99.99) of the players at all levels attend public schools.

That has to be easier than "team mom." maybe not. We're probably no different than anywhere else. Coach and assistant (or two) put in a lot of time and effort, a few parents help when they can, and the rest vanish.

1190 yochanan  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:19:43pm

re: #1186 Afrocity

Don't worry I had a guy take me to see "Hotel Rwanda" on a date.

some date movie afrocity

1191 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:19:47pm

re: #150 buzzsawmonkey

So are all the people now making money off winter sports/tourism too stupid to adapt if this prediction does, over time, come to pass?

"Dive Aspen!"

1192 Occasional Reader  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:19:54pm

re: #1186 Afrocity

Don't worry I had a guy take me to see "Hotel Rwanda" on a date.

Reminds me of the scene from The Naked Gun when Leslie Nielsen and Priscilla Presley are walking arm in arm, laughing uproariously, out of a showing of Platoon.

1193 The Shadow Do  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:21:10pm

re: #1152 yochanan

pink flamingos is the worst movie ever made

Then you didn't see Ghandi or The English Patient

1194 Bobblehead  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:21:22pm

Looks like we're talking about favorite guilty pleasure movies. Anyone remember the old "Hercules" flick with Steve Reeves? I just loved it and all those old dubbed in Italian sword and sandal epics.

1195 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:21:25pm

re: #1179 MandyManners

SNOTTY BITCH ALERT!

*sigh*

I didn't take it that way, but then I'm kind of slow :)

1196 Cheechako  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:21:43pm

re: #1104 windhorse

hey man.... free trailers? I want mine.... (elbow-elbow.... gimme that)

I hear there's lots of free FEMA trailers available.

1197 IslandLibertarian  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:22:12pm

re: #1175 Sharmuta

So- you liked the "between a rock and a hard place" scene?

and so it begins................

1198 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:24:07pm

re: #1189 Unakite

That has to be easier than "team mom." maybe not. We're probably no different than anywhere else. Coach and assistant (or two) put in a lot of time and effort, a few parents help when they can, and the rest vanish.

Whoops! It's getting late and I'm getting drunk (obviously not drinking Coors)! I apologize for responding to two posts at the same time.

1199 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:25:36pm

re: #189 albusteve

photographing polar bears in downtown Calgary will become very popular

You can do that right now. The Calgary Zoo is right downtown.

1200 Wendya  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:26:29pm

re: #5 Hengineer

Considering its on the nightly news and talked about by politicians, I can understand that. Its that they drown out and openly DERIDE man-made global warming skeptics that gets me.

Climate change is a fact. Man made climate change is speculation.

When the AGW Luddites can cough up some solid scientific evidence instead of faulty computer models, I'll sit up and pay attention.

1201 NYCHardhat  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:34:59pm

re: #1137 Sharmuta

Afro liked the movie Roadhouse? Oh, Honey. That's one of the worst movies ever.

Don't talk about the Swayze that way!/

1202 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:38:01pm

re: #930 Kosh's Shadow

It probably got something flammable inside and a spark from the motor set it off.
We need Mythbusters! Eventually, they'll use a stick of dynamite to blow it up.

Kosh -

Only if NBC NEWS gets a hold of it. That is almost all. And YES NBC NEWS, I TOTALLY REMEMBER the Job you did on Chevy Truck Gas Tanks in the 1973-88 generation of C/K 10's, later 1500's. It is a stain on your escutcheon which will NEVER, EVER Wash Away - 'Cause 'all 'y'all STAGED IT!

-S-

1203 Dr. Shalit  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 7:42:50pm

re: #1202 Dr. Shalit

Reply to Self -

AND - Even as a Left - Winger at the time did NOT appreciate it for the following reasons, in either order:

1. I was and AM a Basically Honest Human Being.

2. My Union Affiliation was/is UAW - Hated the Idea of "Brothers" losing hours or jobs over a LIE.

-S-

1204 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:04:47pm
1205 [deleted]  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:11:58pm
1206 Sharmuta  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:13:17pm

re: #1205 Iron Fist

You sly dog, you!

1207 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:15:49pm

re: #538 DistantThunder

Hydrogen looks promising.

Hydrogen burns clean. That is its sole virtue. It's hard to store, hard to transport, and very bulky for its energy content. We also have to make it. Or, if you really want to get pedantic, liberate it from your source compound of choice. And I can guarantee you that it requires more energy input to liberate a ton of hydrogen, than you will get by burning it in a fuel cell.

IMHO, we will never have a hydrogen economy without first having limitless cheap energy from fusion.

1208 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:18:08pm

re: #545 NonNativeTexan

Ok, this may be stupid, (but it has never stopped me before).
I was thinking the problem with solar and wind power is the storing of
the electricity because the power is not consistently produced.
Would it be feasible to build two huge reservoirs, reservoir one would be at a
higher elevation than reservoir two. You could use Francis turbines to generate
electricity using the water pressure of the water flowing from reservoir one
into reservoir two. Then you could use solar and wind power to pump the water
from reservoir two back into reservoir one. What do you think? Kinda of
the wind mill coming full circle.

It's called pumped storage, and it's already being done, mostly by using existing hydroelectric reservoirs.

1209 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:29:40pm

re: #584 JCM

Conservative of energy. It takes as much energy to move the water to the top as you'll get out letting the water back down, if you included loses to inefficiency you use more energy than you can get out.

He's not talking about some kind of perpetual motion machine, simply using wind and/or solar power to pump up (recharge) hydroelectric reservoirs. Perfectly feasible, and it is being done. Yes, there are losses involved, since no energy conversion process can be 100% efficient.

But you absolutely need some sort of storage when your prime source is wind or solar, because those two sources don't necessarily put out when the demand is there. That is the biggest single downside to wind and solar. They seldom match availability with demand.

Coal, hydro, nuclear are quite different. If Aunt Minnie puts a load of laundry in the dryer, you just crank open the floodgate a tad, or turn the wick up a little.

1210 stuiec  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:33:23pm

re: #498 Charles

My point is that focusing on the ancillary nuttiness isn't a valid argument against the specific point on which you disagree with the expert clams. If the self-proclaimed expert is wrong, refuting that doesn't require the laundry list of his nuttiness; if he's right, the other nuttiness doesn't change that. Even eminent and respected scientists can go off the deep end in certain areas (again, Shockley, or James Watson).

1211 stuiec  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:38:04pm

re: #515 Soona'

I'm not buying that logic. It's like saying the Mohammed Atta really was fun at parties and a fabulous personality....it's just that killing of thousands of innocent people......

Not a valid counterexample. It's more like the quaint idea in the Germany of the 1930s that medical tests and treatments developed by Jews were invalid and impermissible because of their inventors' ethnic backgrounds.

But if you're wedded to the Mohammed Atta analogy, my argument is that his family life and sense of humor are not germane to his acknowledged expertise in mass terror attacks, and that the latter deserves to be judged on its own merits without a spurious argument based on his general character.

1212 Unakite  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:38:47pm

re: #1208 Alberta Oil Peon

It's called pumped storage, and it's already being done, mostly by using existing hydroelectric reservoirs.

It;s being done here in Virginia.

1213 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:47:42pm

re: #744 Naso Tang

Many assume neutron = reactor.

A few slow neutrons created by some so far unknown process in a jar aren't going to fuse anything together. It's interesting theoretically, but there is absolutely nothing that suggests how it can be scaled to
create power.

The presence of the slow neutrons in that suggests the possibility that a fusion reaction has taken place. They are the effect, not the cause.

If we can understand what is going on there, maybe we can scale it up. Or maybe not. It's certainly worthy of investigation.

1214 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 8:57:45pm

re: #1213 Alberta Oil Peon

The presence of the slow neutrons in that suggests the possibility that a fusion reaction has taken place. They are the effect, not the cause.

If we can understand what is going on there, maybe we can scale it up. Or maybe not. It's certainly worthy of investigation.

You are absolutely correct that neutrons are the result of a fusion reaction - however, they are usually not so slow. Further, there is no way physically that any chemical - as in driven by electromagnetic interactions, will over come coulomb repulsion enough for the strong force to take over. This is garbage. If they saw a signal at all, it will turn out to be a systematic error.

1215 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:00:27pm

re: #1204 Iron Fist

Completely off topic, but your nick caught my eye. Are you a practicioner of Bagua? Do you know the name of the form you practice? I used to do a fairly easy (for bagua) form. We know some of the theory behind it (accupuncture is useful), but little else. We learned our form from Richard Mooney, and our dojo has one instructor who Rich gave the goahead to start teaching it to other members of the school. Rich is in europe from what I last heard.

So what is your form and and who is your instructor? You don't see bagua around much, at least were I live. People want less subtle forms and technique than bagua has. Everybody wants to be a black belt, but the want the technique made simple, and to do inccapicitating damage that is obvious. My sensei taught that the way to handle multiple opponents was to pick out the loudest, most provokative person in the group and splash his blood all over his compodres. Usually they will decide that discretion is the value they've been looking for, and get away. You want to let them run, although it does open the possibility of one of them retreiving a gun from elsewhere and using it on you.

Coloness! Someday we ought to get all of the LGF martial artists together. It could be a lot of fun.

I need to ask what your style is. I hold a black belt in Kempo and I studied a bit of Wing Chung - but only for a year in college. I have recently started learning some Tai Chi and I have been interested in learning more about bagua too.

1216 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:03:03pm

re: #1200 Wendya

Climate change is a fact. Man made climate change is speculation.

When the AGW Luddites can cough up some solid scientific evidence instead of faulty computer models, I'll sit up and pay attention.

I am not a luddite. It is real.

The flaw in your argument is that a model must be nothing. Precisely how do you crunch systems of differential equations without using computers. When those models give accurate overall trend predictions, what are they still crap? PLease look at some of my earlier linked papers.

1217 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:03:30pm

re: #894 JCM

Vacuum cleaners?

Those things are DANGEROUS!

Woman burned by exploding vacuum

Sucks to be Electrolux right now!

1218 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:06:35pm

re: #1200 Wendya

Climate change is a fact. Man made climate change is speculation.

When the AGW Luddites can cough up some solid scientific evidence instead of faulty computer models, I'll sit up and pay attention.


This is a partial repost. I am putting it here because I think the other thread is dying.

There are many papers like the following one. The bottom line is that when we do the numbers in any reasonable type on modeling we have without human driving factors -CO2 is just one of them, we get vastly different results from what is observed, and from models with those factors. The models with those factors are much closer to reality. In short, by doing this process all over the world again and again, we begin to rule out purely "natural" causes for global climate change.

Attribution of polar warming to human influence

Author(s): Gillett NP (Gillett, Nathan P.)1, Stone DA (Stone, Daithi A.)2,3, Stott PA (Stott, Peter A.)4, Nozawa T (Nozawa, Toru)5, Karpechko AY (Karpechko, Alexey Yu.)1, Hegerl GC (Hegerl, Gabriele C.)6, Wehner MF (Wehner, Michael F.)7, Jones PD (Jones, Philip D.)1
Source: NATURE GEOSCIENCE Volume: 1 Issue: 11 Pages: 750-754 Published: NOV 2008

Abstract: The polar regions have long been expected to warm strongly as a result of anthropogenic climate change, because of the positive feedbacks associated with melting ice and snow(1,2). Several studies have noted a rise in Arctic temperatures over recent decades(2-4), but have not formally attributed the changes to human influence, owing to sparse observations and large natural variability(5,6). Both warming and cooling trends have been observed in Antarctica(7), which the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change Fourth Assessment Report concludes is the only continent where anthropogenic temperature changes have not been detected so far, possibly as a result of insufficient observational coverage(8). Here we use an up-to-date gridded data set of land surface temperatures(9,10) and simulations from four coupled climate models to assess the causes of the observed polar temperature changes. We find that the observed changes in Arctic and Antarctic temperatures are not consistent with internal climate variability or natural climate drivers alone, and are directly attributable to human influence. Our results demonstrate that human activities have already caused significant warming in both polar regions, with likely impacts on polar biology, indigenous communities(2), ice-sheet mass balance and global sea level(11).

1219 Achilles Tang  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:09:06pm

re: #1213 Alberta Oil Peon

The presence of the slow neutrons in that suggests the possibility that a fusion reaction has taken place. They are the effect, not the cause.

If we can understand what is going on there, maybe we can scale it up. Or maybe not. It's certainly worthy of investigation.

I don't think you can assume anything of the sort. It suggests that a fission has occurred, not a fusion, through the input of electrical energy in some random way, not yet understood, if indeed that is the case (we all thought that was so some years ago too).

After all, that occurs naturally and spontaneously all the time. It is called nuclear decay. That it can be triggered in some way so as to increase the statistical rate doesn't mean that it can be done to the level, or energy, required to sustain anything like fusion, and that if it did in that environment, that it would not immediately destroy the initial conditions and stop the process before anything was gained.

I haven't a clue what I'm talking about, but neither does anyone who thinks detecting an unexpected neutron or two means the solution to the world's problems; even potentially.

1220 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:13:08pm

re: #963 Kosh's Shadow

I checked; they have a couple of submissions about whether vacuuming gunpowder will cause an explosion, so I hope they do it.

I believe it would depend entirely upon whether the airstream through the vacuum cleaner also passes through the motor to cool it, as it certainly did (still does?) on some models.

Brush-type universal motors as used in vacuum cleaners throw off a lots of sparks at the commutator, and could easily ignite flammable gases or dust if it were there.

I've always kind of wanted to give an old vacuum cleaner a "Viking Funeral" by letting suck up a little gasoline. (Under rigorously-controlled experimental conditions, of course.)

1221 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:14:18pm

re: #1220 Alberta Oil Peon

I believe it would depend entirely upon whether the airstream through the vacuum cleaner also passes through the motor to cool it, as it certainly did (still does?) on some models.

Brush-type universal motors as used in vacuum cleaners throw off a lots of sparks at the commutator, and could easily ignite flammable gases or dust if it were there.

I've always kind of wanted to give an old vacuum cleaner a "Viking Funeral" by letting suck up a little gasoline. (Under rigorously-controlled experimental conditions, of course.)

That is brilliant... What can I say, what boy doesn't like fire.

1222 Alberta Oil Peon  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:21:54pm

re: #1055 windhorse

okay..... I went through the respiration thing recently (years) as my kids went through middle school..... I didn't remember that CO2 was a result of respiration......

but, since plants take in CO2 and produce O2.... if they puke back a small amount of CO2 into the atmosphere.... isn't the net effect to reduce CO2 (plantwise)?

Absolutely. Plants absorb CO2 from the atmosphere, and they also release a little by "burning" sugars in their cells as do we humans and other animals. But they take in far more CO2 than they put out, because nearly all the bulk of a plant is composed of carbon compounds and water.

1223 stuiec  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:35:53pm

re: #559 lostlakehiker

You can look at the Pacific Coast and Pacific Northwest of the USA and see the evidence of sea level changes in only the last 120,000 years of plus 10 and minus 100 meters from the current sea level. At the height of the last Ice Age, the Farallon Islands were promontories on the California coastline.

Parts of the Oregon coast are rising - the land uplifting at 4mm a year - faster than sea level rising.

1224 funky chicken  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 9:45:42pm

re: #1167 FrogMarch

Ron Paul is fairly popular here in Boulder. Boulder has less than 30% registered republicans. my own personal run-ins with the Ron Paul people here in Boulder has me convinced they are indeed democrats. many are also into "infowars" Alex Jones site. I think Ron's anti-war purism is what draws them in.

They probably can't just go off the democrat reservation entirely, so they end up in the RonPaul/AlexJones camp instead.

shudder

1225 Fierce Guppy  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 11:03:09pm
1226 lostlakehiker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 11:20:41pm

re: #656 CyanSnowHawk

Oil is not going away anytime soon. We have significant reserves that are currently "off-limits" through legislation, not technical know-how. Other alternatives are also available. Algal Oil, oil extracted from algae and compatible with current infrastructure, is a proven concept, and there are companies at this moment doing the work to scale up its production and bring down its cost. Current estimates make it competitive with deep sea drilling in the next five-ten years, faster if demand calls for it.

Algae convert sunlight into energy. They're solar energy collectors, but they're not all that efficient. We're not going to be able to set aside some modest acreage and grow algae and solve our problems. We won't be able to pave Arizona with algae ponds either. The evaporative losses! Any massive solar energy project will have to cover an area comparable to a meaningful patch of Arizona, and that means mirrors by thousands of square miles. We have those thousands of square miles. There is enough sunlight coming in to power a mighty industrial civilization. But we can't do it on the small.

1227 lostlakehiker  Mon, Mar 30, 2009 11:23:56pm

re: #1225 Fierce Guppy

"There's a lot of real scientific evidence that climate change is being caused by human beings; I know it's not popular on the right to say that, but the more I learn about the issue the more I'm leaning toward the idea that there really is a problem."- Charles.

Why is it that this reputable and renowned physicist believes there is no problem but you do?

What do you know that Freeman Dyson does not?

Tony.

Dyson hasn't said that he knows there isn't a problem. He's said that he doesn't think the other scientists have proved beyond reasonable doubt that there is a problem. Dyson would have no problem with what Charles has said.

Have I ever met Dyson? Well, yes.

1228 Fierce Guppy  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 2:39:54am

Jiminy crickets! Did you shake his left hand or his right? Just so you know, I was never going to ask the dull and irrelevant question "Have you ever met Freeman Dyson?".

There is no problem in the area of "Global Warming", or to use more recent politically expedient terminology, "Global Climate Change", that Freeman Dyson does not dismiss as being hardly serious at all. Well, I guess that is how we should take Charle's belief that 1) climate change is caused by human beings and 2) the idea that there's really is a problem. Freeman Dyson would have no problem with this.

Tony.

1229 Pupdawg  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 6:07:37am

re: #13 buzzsawmonkey

Too many people, alas, have too much invested in spooking the sheep to listen to sense.

..and they are attacking our lambs with the hunger and ferocity of rabid wolves in creeps clothing.

1230 [deleted]  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 7:16:23am
1231 [deleted]  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 8:56:02am
1232 Teh Flowah  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 5:14:38pm

re: #719 Soona'

The one thing the greeny weinies and the hippies fail to recognize is the fact that mankind has never controlled or never will control the the Earth's enviroment. What man has become very very good at is adapting to the enviroment.

How can you even say that with a straight face? Man's goal is to be in ultimate control of everything. Humans hate to leave things to chance. Saying "we never will control" the environment, when you have no idea where we'll be 20 years from now, much less 100 years, makes you sound like a luddite. Who, 300 years ago, would have predicted that humans would be able to control the electrons in a way to meet our power needs? Who, 100 years ago would have predicted our domination over the atom? Who are YOU to say that in 50 years, we won't have the computational power to predict weather and climate with such precision that we will be able to control it?

When I look at human history, I see a progression in the level of control we exercise on the things around us. What do you see? A wall? Walls are there to be torn down, and we've been very good at that so far.

"We will never control" is a cheap cop-out for people who don't want to take responsibility for the environment. I'm so terribly glad other people do not imagine such limits on humans. Limits on our ability to wipe out diseases, fly, reach the depths of the ocean, the farthest corners of space. The world would be a more backwards place with more people like you.

1233 Charles Johnson  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 8:50:24pm

re: #1228 Fierce Guppy

I see we have another raving nut in this thread. Sigh.

1234 hopperandadropper  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 9:13:13pm

re: #1218 LudwigVanQuixote

OK, this thread is probably dead but I've been busy. I'll try to make this simple. The "proof" you cite is a paper based on computer models that include some rather large assumptions about the nature of climatic feedback systems. They conclude that no explanation other than human activity will suffice. This is not a demonstration based on actual physical data. It is an argument based on mathematical models of unknown accuracy which include fundamental assumptions of unknown validity. These are not data, they are the results of computer simulations which may or may not have any resemblance to reality.

At least one other link you provided points to observations of temperature over a fairly short time span. For the sake of argument I'll assume these are reasonably accurate measurements. What they demonstrate is that global temperature has been on an upward trend on a time scale of about two centuries. First, this is next to nothing in terms of geological time so a trend over 100 or 200 years is not a big deal. Second, and more importantly, the fact of the upward trend says nothing about what caused it. The first question is whether a change of this magnitude is within the known limits of variability. The answer to that is clearly yes, so it is not necessary to invoke anything more than what's operated in the past in order to explain the current data set. It is also a classic mistake of forecasting to assume that the future is going to look like the past.

It's all very well to sneer at how those who question AGW are stooges of Exxon Mobil and the Saudis, but that argument supposes that those arguing for AGW are objective and disinterested. These folks are heavily vested in their thesis, because that's what keeps the grant money flowing. They've never had it so good, and they want to keep that gravy train going. It's human nature, it's understandable, but it's a long way from a dispassionate quest for truth.

I have quite a bit of experience with the study of complex systems (biological systems, in my case). One thing I've learned is that when you try to explain a complex system in terms of a single variable, you're almost certain to be wrong. If that were not the case we would have cured cancer long ago.

1235 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 11:03:31pm

re: #1234 hopperandadropper

OK, this thread is probably dead but I've been busy. I'll try to make this simple. The "proof" you cite is a paper based on computer models that include some rather large assumptions about the nature of climatic feedback systems. They conclude that no explanation other than human activity will suffice. This is not a demonstration based on actual physical data. It is an argument based on mathematical models of unknown accuracy which include fundamental assumptions of unknown validity. These are not data, they are the results of computer simulations which may or may not have any resemblance to reality.

At least one other link you provided points to observations of temperature over a fairly short time span. For the sake of argument I'll assume these are reasonably accurate measurements. What they demonstrate is that global temperature has been on an upward trend on a time scale of about two centuries. First, this is next to nothing in terms of geological time so a trend over 100 or 200 years is not a big deal. Second, and more importantly, the fact of the upward trend says nothing about what caused it. The first question is whether a change of this magnitude is within the known limits of variability. The answer to that is clearly yes, so it is not necessary to invoke anything more than what's operated in the past in order to explain the current data set. It is also a classic mistake of forecasting to assume that the future is going to look like the past.

It's all very well to sneer at how those who question AGW are stooges of Exxon Mobil and the Saudis, but that argument supposes that those arguing for AGW are objective and disinterested. These folks are heavily vested in their thesis, because that's what keeps the grant money flowing. They've never had it so good, and they want to keep that gravy train going. It's human nature, it's understandable, but it's a long way from a dispassionate quest for truth.

I have quite a bit of experience with the study of complex systems (biological systems, in my case). One thing I've learned is that when you try to explain a complex system in terms of a single variable, you're almost certain to be wrong. If that were not the case we would have cured cancer long ago.

That's all very good because my PhD work and research in physics is complex systems. From your discussion of measuring with a single variable, what you have just demonstrated that you have not read the paper - or for that matter any actual paper in this field. Why don't you look at the model and count the variables that are used in the systems of equations? I am aware that would require actually reading the paper first, but do try it.

You also show that you have not bothered to look at the actual paper by saying that it is not based on actual data. Let me show you the quote from the abstract again Here we use an up-to-date gridded data set of land surface temperatures(9,10)/em> (emphasis mine). What that means is that the paper used the best available realtime data of the polar conditions to feed into and to correlate with the models. The (9 and 10) are the references to the data sets that were used. You would know that if you had read the paper, and you could follow the citations as well.

All you have done is claim that since you are a biologist who does not like AGW, you can automatically assume that a physics paper must be flawed without reading it. Try reading it.

While we are at it, there are hundreds more like it done by other research teams using real data and multivariate modeling. Try reading those. That is what the professionals do. We actually read the literature and work the math. We do not just talk out of our asses.

1236 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 11:15:16pm

re: #1234 hopperandadropper

While we are at it, how can you assume that the assumptions that were made are invalid? You did not read the paper? What did you not like about the assumptions?

I know that my tone is harsh. You are a scientist. You know better.

1237 Almost Killed by Space Hookers  Tue, Mar 31, 2009 11:17:02pm

re: #1234 hopperandadropper

And further more, "AGW keeps the grant money flowing" ? Durning the last administration? That is insane.


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